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11:54 AM
@Tester101 if he can't find a pipe to use as a ground, would a small pot of dirt work as a portable ground? :D diy.stackexchange.com/questions/18175/…
 
@BMitch He could use himself, if he was well grounded (standing in a puddle on a concrete floor, bare foot).
 
12:15 PM
@Tester101 Haha. Or he could put the outlet in the shower and forget about the ground. Everything is grounded in a shower.
 
12:49 PM
0
Q: How to protect cut fingernail

winerdDuring DIY I accidentally cut deep into one of my fingernails (fortunately there was no injury to my finger itself). A big piece of nail could get torn off if I do not protect it somehow. Is there a good practice how to protect it? Is any of the nail beauty tools (that usually women use) useful...

 
great googa mooga
 
@TheEvilGreebo But it happened during home improvement.
 
what's that you say? free flags?
 
lol
I got LOTS of free flags for anyone who merits them! ;)
 
12:54 PM
Anybody else want to flag it, before it's closed?
@TheEvilGreebo See.
@TheEvilGreebo Isn't it common during DIY? Isn't it this forum where members will know and want to know the answer? — winerd 4 mins ago
It happened during home improvement, and so must be on-topic!
 
1:17 PM
HAHA! I just noticed, the question is tagged .
 
1:29 PM
lol
 
funny
 
I was searching Area 51 for a medical proposal, and noticed they had a medical marijuana proposal. Good luck getting enough people to commit to that.
 
The problem with M. Marijuana as a SE is that there is no debate or discussion. It's all "This is a miracle drug that will cure everything!!!"
If you go on any MM forum, give a symptom, the solution is always the same: Roll up a fatty!
 
0
A: Why are “Wire Nuts” not used in the UK?

ishokIt has to do with Oliver Cromwell...On 20 April 1653 he dismissed the Rump Parliament by force, setting up a short-lived nominated assembly known as the Barebones Parliament, before being invited by his fellow leaders to rule as Lord Protector of England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland from 16 Decem...

 
I was just about to share that.
 
1:40 PM
@ChrisCudmore I'll admit I'm somewhat of a believer in it's beneficial affects on lung cancer. I'm not going to go as far as to say it's a cure all, but my father in law was supposed to die years ago and he hasn't croaked yet...
 
Much better than this one.
Which nobody can see, because it's deleted.
 
@Tester101 I seriously need to get 10k everywhere...
 
@waxeagle You misunderstood me. MM does have clear benefits in many cases. It's just that MM advocates view it as a silver bullet.
 
"is it ok to borrow a ground wire from a different circuit?" - "Only if you really plan on paying it back."
 
@ChrisCudmore right, that's the problem
 
1:43 PM
So any serious discussion is drowned out in the noise of blind advocacy.
 
@Tester101 lol
 
You're going to leave that?
Ok. Gone now.
 
Just wanted to make sure the source was properly cited before deleting.
 
@Tester101 what Q was that
n/m i see it
 
good god. Sometimes HTML tables == bad!! goes too far.
0
Q: Uniform CSS table widths display: table-cell

RichardMy data set is essentially a table in a table structure: I would like each record from the database to be represented on two table rows ( since that on one row the page would be too wide ). Originally I started out with nested table approach in html/css but I feel this got really messy - so I s...

 
2:01 PM
I love CSS, but the box model really screwed up when they didn't replace all the layout capabilities of tables. I banged my head against the wall for a long time trying to vertically align two adjacent elements to the bottom so they appeared to be joined to the table below.
In the end, I just put a table around my table and took too aspirin for the headache.
 
They failed significantly on the "Make the common, easy." rule.
If I have a containing div, and then a three column layout inside, I should be able to height:inherit; all three, and have them all grow to the rendered size of the container.
But no, I have to put magic spacing divs in there to make everything grow.
 
2:18 PM
<-- loathes css
 
If someone edits their answer so it's a complete u-turn, should they delete the original and re-post a new one?
 
@NiallC. If they have up-votes, that would be appropriate. Otherwise, the votes were for a different answer.
 
So does this count as a u-turn? diy.stackexchange.com/a/18176/22
I think so, but want a second/third/fourth opinion before I say something
 
I'd say he should have deleted his answer, and added a new one. How many votes up/down did it have before the edit?
 
2:38 PM
It was at +3
 
WOW, really?
 
Can you mods see if there were deleted comments (or are you allowed to say)? His last reply to me was confusing
 
@NiallC. yes they can
they aren't necessarily allowed to share information from them, but they can see them
 
Well @BMitch gave him +1 just for the image, and that didn't change.
@waxeagle We can?
 
@Tester101 yep, it's on the per post mod menu, if there are deleted comments you have an option "show (x) deleted comments"
 
2:48 PM
@NiallC. he didn't delete anything, he's saying "Q: what are you checking in the binary search? A: if you see any weird readings"
I would have pointed out that a dryer was likely on a dedicated circuit, but it seemed irrelevant since I disagreed that you should be checking for a ground/neutral short at all
 
@BMitch That doesn't make sense; how would you check the voltage between two insulated wires?
 
@NiallC. he was originally thinking that the circuit wasn't dedicated, so you would check at the junctions. And the ground isn't insulated anyway.
 
He was just trying to put it into terms programmers would understand.
 
@BMitch OK, now I see.
 
A binary search makes sense when you have a larger circuit with a wiring fault, but unlike in programming, it's difficult to identify the middle of an electrical circuit without the walls opened up. So the standard answer would be to trip the breaker, identify everything on that circuit, and then start testing at every point.
 
3:22 PM
@Tester101 The image shows up in a search for "240V dryer". The answer is now at +4
 
I'm starting to think this question is user error.
I can't understand how he can have 120V L1-N, 240V L1-L2, and 240V L2-N.
 
2
Q: Under what circumstances is 5/8" drywall required?

Matthew PKFrom what I understand the code usually discusses things like fire rating (not specific thickness) as they relate to required material, and also the fastener pattern and what thickness to use versus stud spacing. However, I've also heard that 5/8" is specifically mentioned by dimension for use a...

so the answer appears to be "never"
can somebody answer that so I can accept it?
 
@NiallC. would you feel better if I took away my +1? I also +1'd Shirlock who's at +7 and he ended his answer with "I've got to think about this one a bit more..."
 
@MatthewPK You can answer it, if you want to.
There is nothing wrong with answering your own question.
 
I know, but the answer was given in comments
so, since the active commenters are often here, in chat
I figured one would write up an answer
 
3:28 PM
@bmitch I'm not going to tell you how to vote (unless it's for me!). I posted a comment asking Jeremy to delete his answer.
 
get to work people! @MatthewPK needs an answer.
 
@BMitch should convert his comments into an answer
Damn right!
 
@MatthewPK done
 
there, another answered question :D
 
WTF. I told him to check the voltage against a nearby water pipe. and (s)he says "There isn't a cold pipe in the room except the fitting for the washer.". Huh?! So... you can't use that, because???
Next question will be "How do I check the batteries in my multimeter, with my multimeter?"
 
3:36 PM
@Tester101 Water pipes come in plastic too :)
 
He could check it against the ground screw of any other nearby outlet
 
@MatthewPK Not all outlets are properly wired
(as long as we're listing reasons why something might not work...)
 
Isn't that what he's checking? Whether the ground (problematically) has potential?
 
@MatthewPK Not ground, neutral.
That's why I want him to check against ground.
 
neutral and ground at the outlet should have the same potential.
right?
 
3:45 PM
Should be.
 
yeah so I just read that question and posted a comment
the scenario he's describing is not possible
he must have misread or mis-used the meter
don't blame me, blame Kirchhoff.
 
4:02 PM
@MatthewPK So I'm not going crazy then?
Thought I woke up in Bizzaro world.
 
4:18 PM
Even if we presume that his hot shorts to ground when connected (and his breaker didn't trip/house didn't burn down) we wouldn't expect full potential but some transformation LESS than 240V
@Tester101 excellent comment. If he's doing it across the washer leads that could change everything
 
hola, it's busy in here!
question: Im planning to finish my basement and was considering putting up 1.5" XPS board against the concrete foundation, and then 2x4 studs spaced 1/2" away from the board and batt insulation between the studs. I believe that the XPS board acts as a vapour barrier and I should not put up one on the warm side of the studs - correct?
 
You should ask your question using the "Ask a Question" button, rather than in just
so that answers are persisted
 
in chat or on the site? there are already similar questions but the one I am specifically looking at is unanswered
 
please link to the question you're reading?
 
2
Q: Should I install a vapour barrier if I'm using rigid foam insulation?

PickleI'm re-insulating a room in my house from the inside. I've read that polyisocyanurate (polyiso) rigid foam insulation is the best R-value, so I plan on using that. Details: The house was built in 1955 in Camrose, Alberta, Canada. And the previous wall was insulated with fibreglass batting with...

rigid board along with batts seems preferable to me since that way I don't have to worry about compromising the vapour barrier if I ever run new cables, etc. also keeps all of the possible moisture away from the back of the insulation batts
 
4:22 PM
taped XPS board is a vapor barrier, so you should use unfaced batts between the studs
Personally, I would paint a sealer onto the concrete foundation wall
 
I believe there is already a sealer painted on
 
so ramset the xps boards to the foundation wall, tape the seams and fastener penetrations
frame your wall, insulate with unfaced batts and you're good to go
 
I was just going to glue it on..
 
That'll work too, I bet... so long as the adhesive you use is rated for that use
 
Here is a (possibly) unusual question. Could you use Schluter KERDI on all the walls and floor of a basement, to water proof it (keep water out)?
 
4:24 PM
cool, that's what I needed to know! im getting a plumber to rough in a basement washroom while he is ripping up the rest of my sewer so I just need to know what Im putting against the wall so I can place the flange properly
 
@Tester101 I doubt it because kerdi is not designed for constant water contact (as you would expect with a foundation wall)
@Steven if you're offsetting the framing from the XPS boards I would consider installing some sort of circulating fan for the cavity between the wall and the foundation
 
@Steven I'd seriously consider closed cell spray foam.
 
is it cost comparable to XPS?
do they apply the spray foam first, and then you frame up against that, or is it only applied between the studs?
 
about $3 a square foot. A bit pricy, but well worth it.
Frame up an inch or two away from the walls. Install wiring and plumbing. Call in the contractor to spray.
 
do you need a vapor barrier still?
 
4:30 PM
@ChrisCudmore but he wants to leave a channel behind the framing. Closed cell foam will make this quite difficult. He'd have to use conduit
@Steven no, closed cell foam is a vapor barrier.
 
@MatthewPK Where did you see that?
 
:6194777
@Steven here
 
I have 856sqft of walls needing insulation - that's a lot of money for closed cell! if I do XPS as well as batts I estimate cost to be under $1400
 
lol, the linking is funny. That message was for @ChrisCudmore
 
Yeah. Something's off here.
 
4:33 PM
@ChrisCudmore he said he wants to space the studs off the XPS board.
 
@MatthewPK is that not needed? my understanding was that you still spaced the studs away form the board
 
I thought that was to keep the wood off the barrier.
 
@Steven I'm not sure.
 
Im also not sure how much a fan would help - will need to double check with inspector but I believe I am required to put firestop every 10' between studs and between joists and top plate
 
With spray foam you do, so that they can spray behind.
 
4:36 PM
@Steven I suggested a fan because I thought you were suggesting a cavity to run wires through. I think I misunderstood
 
ok - no cavity for wires, those will go through the studs
(though the space is handy for running wires after-the-fact)
 
What are you thinking for the ceiling?
 
drywall
 
Will you ever need access to the floor above? Plumbing/electrical?
 
I don't want to sacrifice height for a suspended ceiling
@ChrisCudmore I might, but I think I'd rather rip out some drywall then have to look at a suspended ceiling.. I just dislike them!
 
4:38 PM
It's only 3 inches below the studs. But that could be a critical amount of space.
 
there will also be 2 unfinished rooms in the basement so I will still have access under a couple key areas
 
You can get some nice tile. just stay away from the stuff you see in every office.
 
there are a couple plumbing shut-offs that I will install access panels for
 
That's my basement, just finished.
 
those tiles don't look bad actually, what type are they?
 
4:39 PM
The drop doesn't look too bad.
I'd have to check the extras to find out. You can get decent tiles.
 
and 3" you say - that might not be so bad - I will have to add 2x4's to the ceiling to drop it below some plumbing (so that's 3" instead of 1.5")
was it difficult to install yourself?
 
Note the drywall bulk head for duct work.
I didn't do that part.
I just did the flooring and painting.
I didn't have the time.
 
I was thinking "this looks familiar" then I remembered your blog post :)
 
But he used two laser levels for the channel. One clipped to the channel mounted on the wall to give height (z), and another projected in the x and y planes for alignment.
Then he worked from the far wall towards the Z-laser, so he could line up the channel right on the beam.
 
how does cost compare to drywall?
 
4:43 PM
About the same.
IFFFF you're paying for labour.
If you're DIY, then drywall will be cheaper, but take a heck of a long time to get done.
 
I will probably contract out the drywall/mud/tape/sanding
 
Then it's probably a wash price wise.
 
interesting, will definitely need to consider that when its time
 
Explore all options. I was dead set against a drop until he showed me the tiles. I automatically assumed it would look like an office.
 
yea that's basically what I was thinking
 
4:46 PM
Home depot has a good assortment. Stuff that would make an Italian proud.
A bit over the top for me.
 
chris you're in Ontario too right? I looked at HD and didn't see anything I liked
but maybe it was the store/stock at the time
 
Yes. Where are you?
 
Richmond hill
 
I went to the one and 427 and Queensway. They had it at the back.
I work near Steeles and Dufferin. I'll check out if they have any at that location on the way home, and let you know tomorrow.
But get the contractor to buy it. They have better sources.
Also, check out Central Lumber at the Go tracks and Steeles W.
 
ok good to know - I was trying to find some other sources so I could try and price this thing out - for now just using retail prices from homedepot as a worst-case scenario
 
4:50 PM
Send me an email. Chris.Cudmore at g mail
I'll give you my contractor's contacts if you want an estimate.
 
sure that'd be great
 
Ok. I have to produce something at work today. Hate it when that happens.
Later all.
 
I think id like to do the framing and insulation myself as a winter project, but Im not so interested in hauling drywall around
see ya!
 
5:32 PM
wow, it was busy here this morning
 
6:06 PM
@Aaron Looks like the party is over now.
@BMitch took his disco ball and went home.
 
6:24 PM
BTW, you'll all be happy to know that I finally got my balls despite the government's best attempts.
 
@BMitch Did you buy black market balls?
 
@Tester101 No under the table balls for me, my package came in the mail in a small unmarked box.
 
My neighbor gets 11"x14" fairly thin, unmarked packages every month.
 
@BMitch oooh shiny
 
7:33 PM
I'm thinking about changing my username.
20
A: Possibly offensive usernames

yodaI won't get into whether this particular name is offensive or not, but both Shadow Wizard and Rosinante seem to be of the opinion that this is 2012 and not the Victorian era, and so such words should be overlooked. While that stance can be justified in chat/speech/private lives, etc., I believe t...

 
poor @ChrisCudmore is late to dinner
 
@Tester101 Your neighbour still gets his porn through the mail?
 
@TheEvilGreebo You and @Steven even used the same product image. At least @ChrisCudmore was original.
 
nu uh
we used different angles
 
I also like @ChrisCudmore's description better. "It's basically a vibrator that slowly drives the nail into the wood."
Which makes this comment funny.
Honestly I refer to this tool as "my new best friend" now. — The Evil Greebo 7 mins ago
 
7:44 PM
No joke there
I really do
you ever use one? It's awesome. I use it even when I'd have no problem with space for swinging a regular hammer
 
And Steven gets the glory.
I should get one. My kids will have nails driven all over the house for me.
@Tester101 It was my best friend. Unfortunately my wife ran away with it.
 
So you could say, your palm nailer drove your wife away?
 
8:06 PM
Is that supposed to be a rock?
 
@Aaron I swear it looks like an egg
 
we threaten to give our volunteers a rock if they don't learn to swing the hammer
 
@BMitch just spend a few minutes teaching them about moments, torque and leverage and they should be set for life :)
 
It would a shame to use such a beautiful rock for nail hitting
Speaking of fasteners, I need to get a robertson bit and some wood screws, I'm tired of stripping phillips ones
 
8:09 PM
We give them a demo, but there are lots of slow learners. The rock threat speeds up the learning process.
 
@BMitch Where do you apply the rock if they don't learn?
 
Would you like a care package from Canada?
 
and this $#%#$ faucet nut is still driving me nuts
The basin wrench was not successful, as the nut is really crowded in there
 
@NiallC. If they choke up 2 inches from the head of the hammer and try to punch the nails, we go out to the parking lot, bring back a rock, and replace their hammer. We tell them: "If you don't understand leverage and the swinging action, this is all you need."
 
I once went to help a friend only to find him driving nails in with a Nalgene water bottle!
the nail won that fight.
 
8:18 PM
@Steven it would. yikes
 
I should add this to the answer:
I have used the hammer sideways in that scenario as well.
 
as long as you can blame the dog for the damage..
 
8:35 PM
@Steven Nah... That won't hurt the nail.
 
What could possibly go wrong: thinkgeek.com/product/eeee/…
 
It says 8 and up, that's probably perfect
I presume the bits are made to go through balsa only
 
@Aaron you should use Torx screws and bits... superior to both Phillips and Robinsons
 
@Aaron I'd expect so
 
I think my christmas shopping is done!!
 

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