TRPG General Chat

Adeptus

12:21 AM

BESW

[face/palm]

trogdor

lol

BESW

I tried using GM screens a few times; they kept getting in the way.

trogdor

they do seem to have limited use compared to the space they take up

BESW

If I'd had a big table, and room to walk around it so I could get to the map without reaching over the screen, and--no, not even then, because I really liked spreading all my notes out around me and shuffling them about.

For a while in college we met in a dorm kitchen/living area where I could perch on a bar stool at the counter and look over it down onto the coffee table the players gathered around.

user61230

12:36 AM

Heylo!

wax eagle

heya

BESW

Heyo.

@Emrakul What's new?

user61230

1:15 AM

@BESW LARP CAMP.

user61230

And internshipshenanigans + DFRPG. But other than that, not too much!

MadMAxJr

"Lightning Bolt... And You."

user61230

Thyself?

BESW

MadMAxJr

Little Billy Thompson saw some of the older casters trying out various high damage output spells. Billy wanted to be just like the older boys! So he figured he would get a scroll to learn more. HA haaa, Billy, Lightning Bolt takes years of practice and learning with a proper mentor. You could get hurt, or hurt someone else!

2

Campy 1950s reel to reel music

BESW

1:22 AM

@Emrakul I'm excited about my Doctor Who one-shot in FAE for this weekend, in honour of the new series and new Doctor.

(The adventure is designed so it has room to expand into a three-part miniseries.)

Adeptus

@BESW It's sounding really good. If I wasn't busy (and hadn't been Spoil-Lair'd) I'd ask to join in.

BESW

I finally got the plot hashed out (roughly, anyway) last night, after nearly a week of just putting together the PCs.

I still need a little tweaking on a couple of PC aspects, though.

user61230

@MadMAxJr, reminds me of:

user61230

> Ged, listen to me now. Have you ever thought how danger must surround power as shadow does light? This sorcery is not a game we play for pleasure or praise. Think of this: that every word, every act of our Art is said and is done either for good, or for evil. Before you speak or do you must know the price that is to pay!

user61230

@BESW Sweet! Sounds interesting!

user61230

1:29 AM

I plan to read through it tonight, and write things out

BESW

@Emrakul Characters are here

user61230

Yup, got a link to that saved quite shinily in a task list.

BESW

And my plot notes are, as of yet, just conversations in the Spoil-Lair.

Joshua Aslan Smith

@besw I require that you open the session with the original, analog version of the show theme

BESW

Nah. In keeping with my dedicated attempts to keep the era ambivalent, I shall open with this:

►

Joshua Aslan Smith

1:34 AM

golfclap for rockabilly doctor who theme

BESW

Also because Trogdor really likes that version.

Adeptus

►

Why not played on Tesla coils?

BESW

While it looks impressive, it's not as great when purely audio.

Joshua Aslan Smith

hmmm my favorite version

►

The ridiculously metal-sci-fi version of peter davidsons tenure

BESW

You've heard I Am the Doctor, right?

►

mbriand

1:54 AM

So there's this fate setting I'm working on and I'm realizing the magery skill I'm making will end up kind of overpowered since it will have so many potential uses so I'm wondering if anyone has an opinion on splitting a skill like that into for example practical and theoretical magery.

I thought about splitting it into schools or something like that, but that seems complicated and likely to not fit into the setting very well since mages are expected to be mostly generalists.

I guess at this point this would probably make a good question...

BESW

@mbriand Are you familiar with DFRPG's magic system?

mbriand

@BESW No I don't have that book, but I'll have to look into it.

BESW

They have three things which combine to mitigate the power of an extremely versatile approach to magic:

First, every spell inflicts stress on the caster, at least one shift of it.

Second, magic is divided into two skills--one for gathering power and one for controlling it. Fail to gather sufficient power and you can't get strong effects; fail to control the power and the spell will either explode on the environment or you can take massive stress in order to make the spell still work.

mbriand

Yeah that I'm not too sure about I was thinking I could make it so you could kind of bet on a certain success value and if you did not attain it the missing points would turn into stress. For example you'd say I want to try an average fireball and as long as you get average it's free.

BESW

(This means you need to spend more resources--skill points--to be a good caster, and increases the danger of casting in proportion to the power of the effect.)

mbriand

2:02 AM

Oooh gather and control would fit very well in my setting too

BESW

Third, magic is divided into two forms: evocation (quick on-the-fly stuff), which can only use as much power as you can gather in a single roll; and thaumaturgy (longer rituals) which lets you gather power over several rolls (making it easier to control and letting you cram more of it into a single spell) but isn't going to be useful when time is critical.

And as a kind of afterthought, casters need to choose a discipline or theme for their magic, a *mancy: necromancy, pyromancy, etc. You have to spend more Refresh on stunts to get access to more *mancies, and if you can't narratively justify the effect you want as being appropriate to your *mancies, you can't do it at all.

Look in my site profile for the link to Rick Neal's DFRPG essays; they go into some good detail on the system and how/why it works the way it does.

Joshua Aslan Smith

I loved that about DFRPG

pure mortals were just as powerful as magic users, just in different ways

BESW

Well, almost.

Powers (supernatural stunts) got weighted a bit more heavily than regular stunts, and balancing with extra refresh has proved... unpredictable.

Fate Core seems to have abandoned Refresh-based balancing entirely, from what I've seen.

mbriand

Well stunts are pretty great and you can always replace a refresh with a stunt.

BESW

@mbriand In DFRPG, supernatural stunts were more like Core's "extras," and were a little more powerful per Refresh spent on them than regular stunts would give. In exchange for promising never to take a supernatural stunt, a "pure mortal" would get two bonus Refresh at character creation.

That's what I mean by Refresh balancing: Character X gets access to more powerful things he can buy with his Refresh, so Character Y gets more Refresh to make up for it.

It looks good on paper, but in practice it's a really swingy way to balance characters.

The concept worked okay in DFRPG mostly because it reinforced the franchise's narrative theme that power and free will are inversely proportional.

Wizards had power pure mortals couldn't begin to touch, but mortals had more ability to choose what they did because wizards didn't have the Fate points to resist compels.

@Lord_Gareth [wave]

Lord_Gareth

2:32 AM

Word

Lord_Gareth

2:49 AM

And now I bring you all, comedy: "Accidentally just wrote "Anklet of Translactation" on a character sheet"

2

BESW

[squint] Kids these days.

Adeptus

@Lord_Gareth Allows you to instantly teleport milk a short distance away... :P

BESW

@fatma Hi!

fatma

@BESW hi

Lord_Gareth

AH A NEW PERSON

[Revs chainsaw of death]

BESW

3:00 AM

@Adeptus It's an item used commonly by dairy farmers, but it startles the cows unless they're well-trained.

Lord_Gareth

@BESW Eberron.gif

imgur.com/gallery/FI2XOzv <-Oooooh

BESW

RLC on Doctor Who fans.

mbriand

I'm pretty sure nobody thinks rose tyler is the best companion...

I guess this confirms the comic is accurate ;P

Adeptus

Donna > Rose

mbriand

Yes

BESW

3:10 AM

I liked her (as a character, not as a person) quite a lot in Series 1. Less so in Series 2, and then her interminable guest appearances flattened the character into a caricature of herself.

Lord_Gareth

[Recoils from the Who convo, retreats sloooowly to the room that is definitely not a bar]

BESW

(And frankly, I found Donna flat and grating. She's a caricature from the start: her character note is "social class, employment status, geographic origin," and she just won't stop reminding us of it.)

mbriand

Well yes she gets a bit grating fortunately she's not in too many episodes. Main thing I like is she's pretty much the only new doctor who companion that's not in love with the doctor it makes for more interesting dynamics I think.

BESW

Oh, sure. Doctor/companion love plots really have to go; it's why I prefer S1 Rose.

But I'm equally impatient with Doctor Who writers using stereotype humour, and they have a lot less excuse for thinking it's a good idea.

user61230

3:39 AM

Hey, hey, so

user61230

What do you call a wandering nun? A roamin' Catholic!

trogdor

4:10 AM

@BESW I like how you made all the Doctor's aspects capable of being his trouble, and set it so the player chooses the one that will be their trouble

what do we do if no PC's want to be the Doctor though?

BESW

@trogdor Oh, I think Ben will.

trogdor

Ben specifically?

mk

I just thought that particular issue might be a problem if it came up

BESW

But if nobody wants to, I'll just have the Doctor get whisked off by the plot and make it a Doctor-lite episode where he's the guy you have to save.

trogdor

that works

and like I said before, I have 3 different characters that I would be excited to play, in particular, but none of them is the Doctor

as ironic as that is

BESW

Fair enough.

trogdor

4:22 AM

I do like the Doctor, in general

otherwise I wouldn't even have asked

cause it wouldn't be an issue if he was on my list of prefered characters

Magician

5:14 AM

This is both sad and a basis for an interesting modern magic setting:

2

did you know that you can buy magic spells on etsy http://t.co/ayTSzVVWZ5

Tweeted by arealliveghost on August 27, 2014 at 4:53 AM

Metool

Magician

We had a couple of rolls like that last game. Players learned about conceding! Very educational.

Magician

5:41 AM

The Flash poster is cool and all, but all I can think of is "Huh, apparently the Flash operates just like toy wind-up cars. 50 meters forward, 10 back".

BESW

5:55 AM

"Whoop, a car!"
[changes lanes to let it pass]
"Whoop, a car!"
[changes lanes to let it pass]

user61230

6:11 AM

@BESW A few notes that don't really belong as comments in the document

user61230

Or, wait, to the Spoil-Lair!

BESW

Ooh, notes. [runs to read]

user61230

6:42 AM

Japanese band names are the strangest

user61230

"Hybrid Rainbow" by Bump of Chicken

user61230

Yes, the band is named Bump of Chicken.

user61230

Don't ask me what it means. I really don't know. And I've thought about it way too much.

2

BESW

You fool!

Adeptus

Translated to Japanese, it's probably a clever play on words. Or maybe not.

user61230

6:52 AM

I mean... I honestly don't think so? I think it's written (pretty much) as a transliteration

user61230

There are tons of weird band names. Coaltar of the Deepers, Maximum the Hormone, Thee Michelle Gun Experiment...

lisardggY

Well, it's not as if western band names all make sense.

Toad the Wet Sprocket. Godspeed You! Black Emperor. Les Claypool's Frog Brigade

BESW

Squirrel Nut Zippers.

user61230

Wait... Toad the Wet Sprocket? You... you can't be serious...

lisardggY

Toad the Wet Sprocket

Toad the Wet Sprocket is an American alternative rock band formed in 1986. The band consists of vocalist and guitarist Glen Phillips, guitarist Todd Nichols, bassist Dean Dinning, and drummer Randy Guss. They had chart success in the 1990s with singles which included "Walk on the Ocean", "All I Want", "Something's Always Wrong", and "Fall Down" . The band broke up in 1998 to pursue other projects but in 2006 began touring the United States as a band in small-venue, short-run tours each summer. In December 2010, the band announced their official reunion as a full-time working band and started writing...

user61230

6:58 AM

Almighty Lumberjacks of Death

BESW

@Emrakul No, that one makes sense.

lisardggY

This being the internet and all, someone made a list. Of course. brightlightsfilm.com/weirdbandnames/#.U_2BR_kaZog

user61230

@BESW True.

Adeptus

@Emrakul Yes, someone named their band after a fictional band in a Monty Python skit

user61230

Hey, I found Blood Sledge Electric Death Chickens!

BESW

7:00 AM

@lisardggY Rule 34.f, AKA Accountant's Corollary: If it exists, someone has made a list of it.

lisardggY

Heh, I like how a totally obscene band name's website expired and the equally obscene domain name is now used as a content farm with generic content, totally at odds with the site's address.

Link obfuscated to keep the site clean: tinyurl.com/mv69vfo

The generic design and friendly header image also contract nicely with the site name.

Also, and Ars Magica Bundle of Holding is out. I have some of the books there on paper, and most of them on illicitly-gotten PDFs *cough*, but I think this is a good opportunity to make amends and purchase them.

Adeptus

7:20 AM

As I'm unlikely to play it any time in the foreseeable future, I'll stick with the free PDF of an older version (4th?) core rules that I got from the publisher's website

BESW

Ditto. It doesn't look like a game my group is liable to want to play.

Magician

The man problem with it (and other complex games) is that it takes serious commitment to play it. More so than D&D.

You can't just give it a try, and even if you have a GM who knows the system in-and-out, it'd still be a challenge.

Adeptus

7:35 AM

When I first came across it, I loved the concept. But the group spent ages reading the rules, made characters & then only played one session... where I don't remember accomplishing anything.

lisardggY

I've played the last three editions and I think they've gotten better, but it's still a crunchy system.

Moreover, while I love the setting and the magic system, I don't particularly care for most of the other rules, which we tend to ignore.

Metool

8:44 AM

@Mourdos Heyo.

Mourdos

8:59 AM

Heya

Worldbuilding is getting there. But still 47 people to go

How are you this morning?

lisardggY

Not bad.

Mourdos

9:31 AM

Haha. Wow.

4

A: Is there any way to prevent "newbie trap" questions?

It's not just newbies. Some people just can't resist answering a question, even when they have no direct knowledge of the issue at hand. Happens on questions like that more just because it seems accessible and has no answers on it (there's less motivation to answer an already answered question, ...

Dat answer, much bait

Aaron

12:01 PM

Morning

lisardggY

12:18 PM

Endless morning.

Aaron

0

Q: Help me make a plot for a 1on1 Dresden Files campaign :D

My girlfriend, codename Dana :D wants to play a Dresden Files RPG campaign at home, where I GM and she has a character, much like Dresden himself. She is in love with noir movies, especially Sin City movies and comics (yes, this was triggered by our viewing of Sin City 2) and a bit of Watchmen. ...

Phil

Let's VTC that one to death please

how does a reasonably experienced site user even think that is an OK question? O_o

Mourdos

done

Also, VTC is super complicated

doppelgreener

12:33 PM

@Mourdos you'll get used to it

Mourdos

Especially when you are flagging, not VTC

>.>

Me and my lack of 3k

Mourdos

12:55 PM

Just did my first review. Looks like we have a knowledge dungeon world guy joining the community. Even if he fails to spell check and uses far too many commas and 'and's and 'but's after ful lstops.

Aaron

how much rep do you need to review?

Found it. I forgot about that privileges tab on my profile

doppelgreener

1:18 PM

@Aaron 2k for basics, then as many as you need to do the thing you're reviewing

so 2k for suggested edit reviews, 3k for close vote and reopen reviews

BESW

@doppelgreener [poke]

doppelgreener

@BESW [pokes back]

BESW

So, I saw a very irregular player tonight and he's coming this weekend for the Doctor Who game.

He's reserved Sarah Jane.

Aaron

Who is playing the doctor?

BESW

I've got a player who'll do it if I ask, if nobody else rises to the occasion.

Otherwise I can make it a Doctor-lite story by having him get kidnapped early on.

MadMAxJr

2:02 PM

Reading the sidebar.. I'm scared of buying spells of Etsy now.

Scrolls on craigslist. Cheap. No questions asked.

Aaron

One bad thing about the internet. People who only want to dabble in such things have easy access to horrible advice that sounds good. "Oh look I can use this love spell to get the man/woman of my dreams!" But people normally screw them up and cause bad things to happen.

MadMAxJr

Oh. That was scroll of genocide. Whoops. You want refund?

BESW

@Aaron Isn't that a DFRPG plot?

Aaron

@BESW DFRPG? It was the plot of a buffy the vampire slayer episode I think.

They uploaded a book online and a demon was given free reign of all knowledge on the net. Built a robotic body and was then sealed in the body or something.

BESW

Honestly, probably most every post-ebay urban fantasy franchise has done it.

doppelgreener

2:13 PM

@BESW I'm hoping my friend is happy to play; he might actually volunteer for the doctor slot

BESW

Haven't heard back from him yet?

MadMAxJr

I did enjoy D20 Modern Urban Arcana's modern magic twists. Casting magic via email.

doppelgreener

@BESW not yet, he's mulling it over

BESW

I'm torn between "Yey, more players!" and "AUGH, more players!" myself.

...watch, this'll be the week Robbie finally shows up.

doppelgreener

it might even be best for him to be the Doctor if he plays - he knows every character and might feel the need to play them accurately, but if he's an as yet undefined incarnation of the Doctor, he doesn't have much to be accurate to.

wax eagle

2:14 PM

@Aaron and then dated buffy's mom, right?

(or was that a different robot?)

Aaron

@waxeagle That was a different robot lol

MadMAxJr

And I forget the name of it, but there was a great spell that required a gold or platinum tier credit card. For an hour, you could walk through the thickest crowd unhindered, traffic lights would be in your favor, queue lines where you needed to go would be empty. Anything that would inhibit you with a wait time due to other people simply wouldn't be a factor.

wax eagle

been a while since we watchedt hose

@MadMAxJr something tells me that it costs more than the list price

Aaron

@MadMAxJr ... I think that is a spell called "I have money get out of my way"

wax eagle

@Aaron nah, it's called "preying on confirmation biases to steal your identity"

BESW

2:17 PM

The spell has no name. It is simply known as:

MadMAxJr

There were spells that in traditional D&D that were overpowered in modern. D&D? There's a cantrip to clean a small area. Modern? That stuff can get /blood/ out of carpets. That's first level.

BESW

BTW, @Emrakul helped me with some fine-tuning on the Doctor Who characters, but there are still a couple bits (with comments on them) that could use more attention.

MadMAxJr

Sadly d20Modern was built between 3.0 and 3.5 and is just too clunky for me to toss in front of my players these days.

BESW

(Safe for players, as it's just the premade PCs.)

doppelgreener

@BESW i will think on some of this stuff!

Also I'm now picturing a scene where the characters have all but defeated a vampire, and they approach him to stake him and finally destroy him - and the one tasked with obtaining the stake pulls out an adamantium stake. Because adamantium is better, right? Right? It's totally better than wood. (And give it a moment for this to sink in for everyone else in the party.)

'cause of the wooden stake coming up in an answer i just wrote

MadMAxJr

2:34 PM

Come on guys the wood would just rot over time, this is way better.

BESW

@doppelgreener There is a moment in Bunnicula where one of the main characters--who has read far too much horror fiction but isn't especially worldly--attempts to kill a vampire with a particularly spicy cut of beef.

doppelgreener

@BESW hahaha!

@MadMAxJr it's true!

MadMAxJr

I'd just say fill the vampire's chest cavity with a molten heavy metal.

Might not kill him, but he'll have extreme difficulty getting back up.

BESW

Heh.

And it really depends on what kind of vampire you're dealing with.

MadMAxJr

Michael Bay Explosion-pires.

BESW

2:36 PM

If it's the symbolism of the stake that does the trick, or the physical qualities of the object, or...

wax eagle

yeah, because Dracula 2k vamps were harmed by silver...

BESW

Which they did a pretty good job of justifying!

wax eagle

indeed they did

BESW

I liked the treatment of vampires in the BBC miniseries Ultraviolet (unrelated to the film of the same name).

2

doppelgreener

night y'all. ;D

BESW

2:38 PM

"Yeah, some of the lore stuff works and some doesn't. We don't get it, we're not sure they do either, but carry carbon-tipped bullets and forget the crosses."

MadMAxJr

Just to be on the safe side, I'll carry a cross in my left hand and a copy of Twilight in my right hand. One of the two should repel the true vampire.

3

BESW

Joke's on you; they're vampires from The Hunger.

MadMAxJr

Kinda like when my players encounter zombies, they like to ask, "Zombie-zombies, or 28 days later zombies?"

BESW

Man, now I want to watch Dracula vs the Batman again.

Between Penguin as the Renfield, and the vampire rastaJoker, it was brilliant.

MadMAxJr

I really, really miss Mark Hamil's Joker.

BESW

2:47 PM

If the DCAMU doesn't do The Killing Joke, I will be VERY surprised.

MadMAxJr

Sorry, what's that acronym?

BESW

Sorry, DCUAOM.

DC Universe Animated Original Movies.

MadMAxJr

Oooh.

BESW

But as much as I like Hamil's take on the character, I'm glad he's making room for other interpretations. He... kinda dominated the field there.

MadMAxJr

I rather enjoyed The Red Hood.

BESW

2:49 PM

Hamil's said he'll do the Joker again for a Killing Joke film.

MadMAxJr

DiMaggio's Joker wasn't half bad. He could do the laugh.

Discipol

hi all

any dresden files players out there?

MadMAxJr

There's a few who pass through here. Not me though.

Discipol

may i vomit a question i put

that got downvoted to fuck?

MadMAxJr

Sure, just mind the language, that's generally frowned on in here.

Discipol

3:01 PM

-8

Q: How can I make a plot for a 1 on 1 Dresden Files campaign?

My girlfriend, codename Dana, wants to play a Dresden Files RPG campaign at home, where I GM and she has a character, much like Dresden himself. She is in love with noir movies, especially Sin City movies and comics (yes, this was triggered by our viewing of Sin City 2) and a bit of Watchmen. S...

dresden-files campaign-development

thousand pardons

wax eagle

@Discipol no sweat, it can take a question or two to get the hang of things here

Discipol

well its not technically dresden files rpg specific

consider it generic modern fantasy

MadMAxJr

You asked for a list of ideas and usable sources, which generally isn't permitted here.

That's why you got the downvote storm.

wax eagle

I think the concern is more "how do I make X" needs to be "I'm making X and I'm having trouble with Y, I've done QR and S"

MadMAxJr

Generally the administration here is more concerned with questions that have a definitive answer.

However, that question is perfectly fine in here.

Discipol

3:03 PM

sweet :D

perhaps I didn't formulate it right

but my need remains the same, and hopefully I described it clearly.

I don't trust my creativity for such an occasion.

I am more than happy to share the experience with the community if it turns out well.

MadMAxJr

Yes. Unfortunately, I am not a Dresden Files person, but the first thing that comes to mind are some 1940s time travel episodes in the Sci-Fi show 'Eureka'

Sin City is very intense Noir. Perhaps a little excessive. I can't think of a lot of things like that off-hand that would involve supernatural elements.

Discipol

but what about classic noir thing

but with stuff I can add dragons and vampires and undead and whatnot

like the mob could be a vampire coven

MadMAxJr

Plausible idea.

Phil

which city is the campaign being set in?

MadMAxJr

Sounds like Chicago from the question.

Phil

3:10 PM

my mistake

ignore that last question

MadMAxJr

By the mid 1940s, WW2 is ongoing. Conservation of materials for the war effort becomes a big deal. Perhaps the supernatural elements are trying to horde/collect things in the name of the war effort for more nefarious things. Since this is Noir, this would mean the biggest, shadiest warehouse down by the docks.

Another fun theme to explore in the 1940s is the Manhattan Project. Reference information about Enrico Fermi. You can tie all /kinds/ of paranormal and supernatural activity to that.

Fermi did research on plutonium at the University of Chicago in 1944, his team became part of the new Metallurgical Laboratory there.

@Discipol That's the best I can do for you. :)

Grubermensch

3:51 PM

[surfaces]

lisardggY

4:20 PM

@MadMAxJr Ha! At this very moment, my wife is watching a Warehouse 13 episode (which shares a fictional universe with Eureka that isn't so much a time travel episode, than a visit into a 40's noir novel. In black and white, no less.

MadMAxJr

@lisardggY That was a good one. I miss Warehouse 13.

lisardggY

I only watch it sporadically, over her shoulder. It seems nice, though not brilliant.

MadMAxJr

4:31 PM

@lisardggY It gets a little dry with forced humor.

lisardggY

@MadMAxJr My wife says that if they'd gotten Nathan Fillion for the lead role, instead of doing Castle (which, at this point, has nothing but Fillion going for it), it would have been perfect.

MadMAxJr

@lisardggY Not sure if it's still on Netflix, but if you like the ideas of modern day powerful artifacts, try 'The Missing Room', a 3 part short series with a more serious tone.

It's about a hotel room that is separated from reality. All the objects from that room bear powers ranging from mundane to world changing.

lisardggY

@MadMAxJr I saw it a few years ago. It had a great premise and good execution, though the ending was a bit weak, IIRC.

The Lost Room, I Think.

MadMAxJr

Ah, perhaps that was it. I enjoyed it much more.

"I have the cufflinks!" "What do those do?" "I think they keep my blood pressure down."

lisardggY

Yeah, I enjoyed it too. Julianna Margulies was great in it.

Magician

4:40 PM

MR FREEZE: ice bucket challenge MR FREEZE: I nominate…THE PEOPLE OF GOTHAM

Tweeted by malki on August 27, 2014 at 3:49 PM

MadMAxJr

@Magician ... Totally read that in Arnold's voice.

Oxinabox

Heh, I linked my answer abotu what you can afford with zero resources in nWoD to a different question as part of another answer.
This attracted some more views and then someone editted the answer to fix a typo.
This bumped it to front page.
I got +70 rep from it today. That more than doubled its vote count

wax eagle

cool!

wax eagle

5:09 PM

oh hey, the XKCD What If... book comes out Tuesday.

Oxinabox

Please flag: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/46858/…

user61230

Aaaaaand it's gone.

Oxinabox

and it is gone

Jinx

MadMAxJr

That was cute. "But it is a question"

Phil

flagged to death - a horrible way to go

MadMAxJr

5:17 PM

Flagged, downvoted, and closed in a short window.

lisardggY

@MadMAxJr regarding your comment/correction in the WarPriest question - the new hybrid classes were on d20pfsrd before they were on Paizo's official PRD.

wax eagle

it was killed with spam flags, so it skipped closure

MadMAxJr

@lisardggY I thought the book for that was released this month? Maybe I'm out of touch with the releases.

lisardggY

@MadMAxJr Yup. It was up on the site less than a week after its release.

MadMAxJr

I've been happier with d20pfsrd since they do a better job of separating 3rd party content these days.

lisardggY

5:20 PM

Their layout is much easier for me to navigate, personally.

MadMAxJr

One of my newer players had to hear the story of OGL and third party products for the first time. Since I was working for a retailer during the heyday of 3.0 and 3.5, I saw a lot of /terrible/ 3rd party products. I had to explain to her that if you see an ad on d20pfsrd for more content related to the page you're on, it's not automatically usable at my table. (I review on a case by case basis.)

During 3.0, there was a company 'Fast Forward Games' that made distinctive red covered books. Their editing was poor and their rule balance was often fishy. We couldn't get rid of the things even with a 2 for 1 sale.

lisardggY

In my one 3.5 game we had one player who used some rather fishy bard cheese, I think from Mongoose.

Other than that, we never really used any 3pp for our Pathfinder game. Never really felt the need.

MadMAxJr

Ah yes. Mongoose. Because we needed Complete Monk 1, 2, and 3.

lisardggY

As it is, the 1st party content is more than enough for me. I like the iconic core characters.

I don't feel the need for seventeen new subsystems for a dozen new classes. The core classes do a good enough job, mechanics-wise, and any fluff or character concept I want can ride that.

The only non-core subsystem I'm considering getting into is the new Swashbuckler's panache, which is the same as the gunslinger's grit.

Oxinabox

My roleplaying club now have 14.5 campaigns running per week.

MadMAxJr

5:30 PM

I have some degree of trust for Paizo stamped content. 3rd party content gets the 'Pathfinder Compatible' logo, but I'm not sure it gets the same level of scrutiny. Additionally there's a lot of content simply flat out not suitable for my table. Like Ponyfinder. :P

lisardggY

Judging by what I hear from Lord_Gareth, who recently started working as a writer for Pathfinder content provider Dreamscarred Press, there's almost no oversight by Paizo except for compatibiltiy with branding and OGL.

MadMAxJr

Gareth has also admitted he's never played Pathfinder, so I'm unsure how to weigh his opinions.

Aaron

Hey anyone here going to dragoncon?

lisardggY

I'd separate his opinions about the system - which I share your reservations about - with his opinions on the interaction he has with Paizo over his writing.

MadMAxJr

I've seen horrible, horrible things with the 'Pathfinder Compatible' stamp on it. If they're involvement is minimal, I'm wondering if that's because they get a cut from the sales. Don't really know how their branding works.

wax eagle

5:34 PM

@Aaron sadly no

lisardggY

@MadMAxJr Their compatibility FAQs are a bit vague, but I think it's just like being "OGL Compatible". No royalties, no fees.

KRyan

@MadMAxJr I think you are misguided in your trust of Paizo-published content. They apparently mostly hire freelancers and only make a cursory attempt at editing the books. Plus, regardless of how much they do or do not do, they published a book written by one of their employees that included the mask of hyena-raping

lisardggY

paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/compatibility

KRyan

3rd-party books don't get much oversight at all, but even their own books don't seem to get much scrutiny, nor are they very good at evaluating the content in the first place

so it winds up being merely going to companies that you trust

I suggest that Paizo should not be one of them

DSP is better, though I have my qualms with some of their material

@MadMAxJr Pathfinder is almost-identical to 3.5, which means his extensive experience with that system, combined with great familiarity with the text and content of Pathfinder from reading and research, gives him a fairly-solid place to offer opinions from

not perfect, certainly, and he's endeavoring to fix that, but it's definitely an opinion worthy of consideration

more so than some who have a lot of experience playing Pathfinder (e.g. fanboys)

MadMAxJr

Clearly I've provoked you somehow. Not my intent.

KRyan

5:43 PM

@MadMAxJr you haven't and I'm not sure why that is clear?

I did not intend to sound aggressive or heated

I'm merely responding to your statements with my own opinions and the reasonings for them

Mourdos

KRyan doesn't like paizo. He likes shares his extensive opinion whenever the topic comes up :-)

MadMAxJr

@KRyan I have a fair bit of PF experience, wasn't sure if you were trying to associate me with a derogatory use of 'fanboy' or not. Since that's not your intent, I've simply misread it.

It's not a crime to not like Pazio, that's fine.

Mourdos

Oh, I'm using whip of spiders today. I'll let you know how it goes.

Its true, I agree that some of their work is a little shoddy. I mean, have you see Time Shudder? Its a non spell.

KRyan

@MadMAxJr I was saying that there are some with lots of experience whose opinions are not as valuable as Gareth's, despite his lack of experience, for example fanboys

I wasn't saying that any particular person was or was not a fanboy

just that fanboys exist and being a fanboy makes their opinions of less value

@MadMAxJr considering their offensive, unprofessional, and immature behavior, I think it's very difficult to justify not disliking Paizo, regardless of how you feel about Pathfinder.

user61230

6:01 PM

Anybody who doesn't like Paizo should be jailed and slain by bands of murderous hobgoblins in the dead of night, while they cry out to their lich praying mantis overlords.

2

MadMAxJr

So far PF is the only thing on the table my group hasn't had a vocal opponent against. 4E was bashed as an MMO simulator, nobody had the materials for Savage Worlds, and one die hard opponent shoots down all the sci-fi themed stuff I offered up.

user61230

What kinds of games do your group like playing?

Metool

@MadMAxJr Ponyfinder is not suitable for my table, either. Not without extensive alteration, anyway.

MadMAxJr

Individually they all want something a little different.

One wants a system where they can kick in the door, fight the monster, earn a bigger sword, repeat. One wants the opportunity to weave in her personal story into something bigger. One just wants to play unusual classes that fit niche roles. One has the sole requirement 'can be a cat or have a cat'.

The last one in the group just wants to have a few hours each week to sit and play with the other mentioned people.

user61230

Rinse-and-repeat games?

MadMAxJr

6:08 PM

They all have some passing familiarity with d20 based rule-sets. I don't have the time to write up custom stories/worlds much. PF has a bucketload of published adventures, short and long. So far it's worked and the players haven't revolted.

user61230

(Also, my first statement was complete sarcasm, in case that wasn't clear haha)

user61230

Yeah, that makes sense.

user61230

Have you read Robin's Laws, @MadMAxJr?

Phil

@MadMAxJr The core rules for Savage Worlds are dirt cheap if that's an issue

+ there's quick start rules and free one sheets so you can try it without any outlay

Mourdos

@Metool why is that?

Metool

6:15 PM

Because I need to tear out some subsystems and replace them with new ones.

Mourdos

If you let me know exactly what the problems are, I can pass them on.

Metool

Mmmnope. Already posted my changes to the board.

MadMAxJr

@Phil My group tends to pirate things if we get into stuff they don't have and I try to discourage that. I actually gave them an incentive program to actually buy books in the past by offering them $10 if they can show me the receipt for the book of the system we've chosen to play.

Phil

hmmm, tricky indeed

Only the GM really needs the stuff though - are you GMing?

MadMAxJr

@Emrakul Can't say I'm familiar with Robin's laws.

Currently I'm the GM, but we're about to do a hand-off to a new GM. I'm a bit tired after two years.

user61230

6:18 PM

@MadMAxJr Here's a link.

user61230

It's not the cleanest copy, but it's a public copy, so /shrug

user61230

This is probably the most helpful book I've ever read on gamemastery, and talks quite a bit about balancing party and player needs in-game.

MadMAxJr

There was an old book, GameMastering Tips and Secrets that was a collection of essays on DMing. Mostly biased around FUDGE system, but it had some general ideas that were helpful.

Phil

@MadMAxJr that's understandable

MadMAxJr

Oh, this is a Steve Jackson thing.

Heh, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Will read in depth later, thank you.

user61230

6:24 PM

Sure! Hopefully it's useful!

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