George Cummins

@fredsbend "Monogamous plus occasional cheating is still monogamy." That sounds like the start of an intense dinner-table conversation.

The name "survival mode" implies that death is a possibility. If the possibility of death is removed, the game should no longer be considered "survival." It would exist on a plane somewhere between survival and creative, perhaps with a moniker like "gather mode" or (with a nod to invincibility available to certain classes on multiplayer servers) "god mode."

This is definitely a discussion that I want to have. However, given the amount of references that must be given and checked to support such a discussion, would you be willing to conduct it via email, forum or other long-form, asynchronous style? That way we won't feel obligated to give quick answers in favor of correct ones.

@svidgen Yea! We agree on something. ;)

@svidgen Credibility is at the core of the question. The Bible (and people talking about the Bible) say Jesus performed miracles (things which are impossible according to the observable order of things). It would appear that the OP is asking for a way to establish the credibility of the Biblical account. To dismiss it as something that exists primarily in the eye of the beholder is to dismiss hundreds of years of research and study. And (though the discussion of martyrs is in danger of ranging widely off-topic), isn't it less sensible to raise one form of martyrdom above all others?

@svidgen I encourage you to try to find credible non-biblical accounts of that nature. There are many documents of dubious credibility that mention miracle workers both before and after the time of Jesus (Simon Magus, Apollonius). You can even find people that claim the likes of modern-day preachers such as Oral Roberts as miracle workers. As for the willingness of the disciples to die for the cause, there are many people willing to die for many causes (I'm thinking of the 19 firefighters who recently died for the sake of others). That's not necessarily evidence of "truth."

Perhaps others will cite extensive references, but it ultimately boils down to this: the arguments for the miracles come from the Bible, and the arguments against come from observation of the natural world.