TRPG General Chat

I once adjudicated a PC's demise (it really wasn't my fault, I was just the GM) which was directly contributed to by his blacking out while saving people from a burning house, and when he came to he was late for a meeting with the mayor.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

"This dungeon is due in 15 minutes! Then we need to go meet with the mayor about the dragon zoning problem and we're double-booked with sewer duty"

BESW

And I'd like to point out that the player had the PC wander around the city until he FOUND a burning house, so it's not like this was an unanticipated scheduling kerfuffle.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@BESW ...

BESW

He apparently had "volunteer firefighting" penciled in for 10am, and "meeting with mayor" at noon.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@BESW heh.

BESW

7:12 AM

I have never before or since seen a player so hardheadedly dedicated to turning Lawful Good into Lawful Stupid.

(The "contributed to demise" part came from running around town for several hours at one hit point due to SEVERE BURNS and SMOKE INHALATION, at noon, in a desert so dry that currency represents barrels of water instead of gold or silver in a bank.)

He was a cleric, but refused to heal himself.

Maurycy Zarzycki

Is there any RPG system which supports/focuses a non-broken battle system which favors thinking over mindlessly butchering forward, which allows a lot of actions to happen during battle, which does not require to trace myriad of appearing effects at the same time, which is grittier than DnD but not as gritty as The Riddle of Steel, where small things can be tweaked (masterwork weapon is better than normal, and +1 is better than both) and which dosn't take 5 minutes to parse on player's turn.

I think, somewhere in the middle, I forgot what I wanted but went ahead anyway.

BESW

You can break any system that presents multiple choices, to a greater or lesser extent.

You'll also get arguments that D&D is not broken.

Are you including D&D 4e in the general "D&D" statements?

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW No, I should have specified, I've only played 3.5 and that's the version I had in mind.

@BESW Grappling rules are broken for sure.

Just for a note, I am not really keen on finding such a system, I am just wondering if there is a world of RPG systems with more advanced combat mechanics which don't repeat D&D over and over again.

BESW

@MaurycyZarzycki "broken" is subjective enough that it might not be make useful criteria. Can you break it down?

@MaurycyZarzycki That... is a problem.

Makes it a lot less of a Good Question for the site, and more of something to keep in the chat room.

Because if you don't have a situation an answer can improve, the question's value becomes more dilute and the ability of people to provide useful answers tanks.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@MaurycyZarzycki gaarrgh

And the answer is "no."

step 1. how long do you want combats to last

step 2. what kind of actions do you want to predominate combat?

step 3. what do you not want to happen in combat?

BESW

7:24 AM

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Gaarrgh is First Lieutenant of the Bluuffg Brigade, under Commander Gaaakk.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW I am mindlessly repeating what I read on the internet about grappling being broken. Other than that the only two broken grappling experiences I had was: my monk who was pretty much unstoppable one-on-one, and groups of monsters which did the same as that monk but there were more than one of them at the same time.

BESW

I'm not going to argue personally about grapple being broken. Just saying that you will find people who vehemently assert that D&D 3.5 is fine.

Grapple is actually broken in the other way; simple low-level spells and class features, available at higher levels in permanent magic item flavors, make grapple definitionally useless.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@BESW ring of freedom of [detailed pages of rules]

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW You devil's advocate, you.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Hey-ho, everyone.

BESW

7:27 AM

Grapple is complicated to the point that nobody wants to use it just because it takes too long to run. It's easily bypassed, but without a Magic Key to bypass it grapple becomes difficult to argue with.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

We're quite close to talking about the M word, folks :)

BESW

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Nah, I'm thinking about a player's goliath fighter right now.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW We never were min-maxers.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

But yeah, broken is... not a useful word to toss around.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Do you have something against my Mooks with Vow of Puberty? ;)

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

7:28 AM

you want a system that provdies for combat-as-sport in a wonderful and interesting way that lasts for X minutes.

BESW

Guy could destroy enormous golems and toss them around the field, but the instant someone showed up with freedom of movement he sat in the corner and wept.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@MaurycyZarzycki .... only legally.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Finally started my first FATE campaign last night.

Or, umm, tonight, I suppose, for people further west than me.

BESW

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Ooooh. Give us the juicy details, do!

Maurycy Zarzycki

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Hey, grats :)

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:29 AM

Not too many yet. We just did character creation and some familiarity with the system. Ran a simple conflict to see how it goes.

I still have a lot of reading of the rules to go.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW He should've added some points to disarm, he would disarm the rings out of them.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

We're going post-apocalyptic, and I need to see how to model character mutations as Extras.

BESW

@MaurycyZarzycki That would've been useless against the gnome cyborg who implanted a freedom of movement component the instant he saw the goliath mowing through his minions.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Pretty much yes, the X can be between 1 and 40. And now that you put it this way, it sounds like an unreachable, utopic vision.

BESW

@MaurycyZarzycki Which means you should try it in FATE, clearly.

Maurycy Zarzycki

7:31 AM

@BESW Buy a ring with Aura of no Freedom of Movement

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

So far the system seems fun, especially for the combat-averse among the players that finds a system that actually rewards conceding combat early.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@BESW It won't fit a lot of other points I've made in that really big list.

Oh well, got to run an errand.

BESW

@MaurycyZarzycki I know. Tongue firmly in cheek.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Still need to get my head around the actual combat procedure. Do I choose a skill to defend every time I get attacked? Do I do it immediately when attacked, or do I go around the table, get the players' actions ,then resolve all attacks/advantages/actions?

But I see how the mechanics can get really fast, with practice.

BESW

Defending skills are determined by attacking skills.

Defenses are made as part of the attack action.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:34 AM

If I get attacked with Fight, do I get to choose whether to defend with Athletics? With Fight? With Physique, for some characters/creatures?

BESW

Depends on the setting; some are more particular than others.

I believe Athletics is the default physical defense, though sometimes another skill just makes more sense, or a stunt is taken to let another skill stand in.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Our sample encounter was with a giant mutant-lizard. I chose to roll his Physique as defense, since it represents his scaly skin.

BESW

Makes sense. Perhaps he should've gotten a stunt to define that.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Maybe. I didn't really build a full character sheet for the lizard.

BESW

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I've found that making them up as I go along is fun.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:37 AM

@BESW Yeah, I don't see myself preparing much in advance.

BESW

"It makes sense that he'd have this..."

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

We only got halfway through char creation - High Concept and Trouble - and now they're at home working on their First Adventure, then I'll switch those around for the Crossed Paths.

BESW

Basically give him an FP budget based on how nasty I want him to be.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Those are excellent mechanics for character creation. I love'em/.

BESW

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I've encouraged people to use them in other systems as well, just for the RP potential.

Oh, @AvnerShahar-Kashtan, I'll be passing through your city next week to and from Haifa. Hi.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:46 AM

@BESW Oh, cool. What are you doing in our little neck of the desert?

BESW

Baha'i international convention.

All the National Spiritual Assemblies of the world get together in Haifa every five years to elect the international body, the Universal House of Justice.

I was elected to the NSA for the Mariana Islands this year, and it's one of the every-five-years years.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@BESW Very nice. Have you been to the Baha'i center in Haifa before? The gardens are lovely.

BESW

I went on pilgrimage ten years ago.

I'm excited to see the changes; for one thing, the prison in Acre wasn't really open to Baha'is at the time but now it is.

(I keep trying to spell it Akka, because that's how the older texts spelled it.)

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

The Hebrew pronunciation is "Akko", so that's pretty close.

BESW

I've seen that too, but it doesn't seem to be as common in English.

But yeah, the Terraces are pretty astonishing.

I'm eager to see the Shrine of the Báb with its new roof tiles.

(I'm told that some of the locals think it's solid gold.)

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:54 AM

I don't think non-Baha'i are allowed in. I think the terraces are all that are open.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan About this fighting, didn't it work that depending on how you defend? Blocking would be Fight and dodging would be Athletics?

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@MaurycyZarzycki That's what I thought. I'm just worried it will make combat a bit more awkward when you use a different skill to defend with every round.

BESW

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan There are default skills for types of fighting, and if it just makes more sense for something else to work you can deploy the Silver Rule.

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I'm not sure; I thought that visitors could circumambulate it, though.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@BESW That we can, I think. Haven't been there in yearas.

BESW

The Shrine at Bajhi, now that's probably a lot tighter.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:59 AM

@BESW Yeah, even with the added thinking about what to defend with every time, it's still a lot more streamlined than, say, Pathfinder.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I think in most cases you would use the better skill unless in some circumstances (not being able to move disallows dodging, not being able to use your arms disallows blocks)

BESW

And I know the pilgrim groups are MUCH bigger than they used to be.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Less modifiers to each roll. Smaller range of possible numbers.

Fun.

BESW

@MaurycyZarzycki Defending and blocking is a lot literal than that in FATE.

There's a stunt which lets you use Conviction for physical blocks without supernatural ability.

It's flavored as praying and talking, using the strength of your faith to prevent people from striking you.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@BESW That actually feels a bit like D&D4e, where every class has about the same attacks/powers, only tied to a different ability score, which makes ability scores completely interchangable.

Except for CON.

BESW

8:02 AM

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Largely, yes. Skills have default uses, but one purpose for stunts is to allow a different skill to be used in limited circumstances.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Because conning is an art

BESW

The Seventh Doctor provides an example.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@MaurycyZarzycki I tried creating a CON-based D&D4 character a while back. My first (and only) 4e game. It, well, sucked.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan And once again I am proved I suck at puns ;)

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@MaurycyZarzycki Ah, no. I got the pun. I appreciated the pun. And I moved on. :)

BESW

8:05 AM

You can do Con-heavy 4e PCs now, but they have to fit a handful of particular niches.

Maurycy Zarzycki

I'd like to try 4e but as a player

BESW

The only 4e game I got to run a PC in was Dark Sun, and I just couldn't get into any character.

My favorite was a wolf warlord.

I also played a young woman who'd gone into a monastery to learn to control her temper... and instead learned to channel it into fire attacks.

Maurycy Zarzycki

My very first RPG game was in 3.5 and I played a female halfling thief who believed she can talk to items.

BESW

And a shaman from an obscure god-cult that worshipped a single deity composed of whatever scraps of scripture and legend they'd managed to find. Ee-yoo-ahn was a mysterious god whose moods and pleasures changed with the wind (at least, that's the only explanation they could come up with for all the conflicting doctrines they were trying to reconcile).

Its symbol was a combination of Pelor's sun, Vecna's eye, and Ioun's eye symbol.

"Ee-yoo-ahn teaches that we must be tolerant of those we crush without mercy."

Wow, FATE dice KS is getting the camelspit funded out of it.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

8:20 AM

?

Maurycy Zarzycki

What is so special about their dice?

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

I was just wondering whether to get some fate dice.

Oh, I see. Nice. kickstarter.com/projects/evilhat/…

BESW

Unfortunately, the international bit is pretty cruel.

I'm amazed they were able to provide any options at all though.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Yeah, I just noticed that.

BESW

They think I qualify as domestic.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

8:25 AM

I wonder if any of the (few) local gaming stores have Fudge dice.

BESW

8 hours ago, by BESW

I sent in a little note asking if Guam would be international for the dice KS, and I immediately got back "If the US postal service considers it international, it's international -- I believe that's the method we'll be using. Let's at least pretend it counts as US. We'll work it out. :)"

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I doubt it; one of the big reasons that they're doing this KS is that the supply is so terribly outstripped by demand.

There just aren't a lot of people making Fudge dice.

And the Core kickstarter seems to have depleted the world's Fudge supplies.

My FLGS didn't even know what Fudge dice were.

Of course, my FLGS is run by an octogenarian prepper who runs the store at a loss just so he has a reason to get out of bed every morning, because that's all that keeps him alive.

His words, not mine.

(I had never before met an actual Real Life Quirky NPC.)

Worth a shot, though, and you can ask them to carry the dice once they ship.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Most of my FLGS are closed, these days. Though there's one not too far that's still making do, mostly by selling toys and collectibles - and Munchkin expansions - along with RPGs.

BESW

My island has one FLGS, and a handful of TCG holes-in-the-wall.

And yes, the FLGS is largely an M:tG shop by volume.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Ok, I think you acronymmed me out.

Maurycy Zarzycki

The Fudge dice are pretty pricey here, 25 PLN ($8) per set of four dice.

Not to mention that 25 PLN for us is worth/means more than $8 for US people

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

8:34 AM

What's TCG?

BESW

trading card game

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Ah.

I have to say, though, that after enjoying a huge boom in the early 00's, M:tG seems to have been pushed to a small sideline here.

BESW

It's still big here.

BESW

9:03 AM

@JonathanHobbs Yo.

doppelgreener

@BESW Hi!

BESW

What is, in the native parlance, "new"?

doppelgreener

It's raining and I'm hungry and I saw someone say something I cannot even fathom and this person constantly baffles me in this manner to the point I am not even going to respond

I am going to go eat :D

now then, awaaaayyyy!

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

9:45 AM

Yes, that is, indeed, "new".

And by "new", I mean "old", and by "old", I mean "odd".

StuperUser

10:09 AM

@BESW hey! how's it going?

Are questions about looking for games in particular locations on topic or is that "too localised"? I get the impression that game shops in the US run a lot of games (PF Society, DnD Playtests etc), but there isn't that kind of culture that I've found so far London.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@StuperUser waaay too localized

45

Q: Where can I find other RPG players?

I'd really like to learn how to play pen-and-paper RPGs. I know that it takes a few players to actually sit down and play, but I'm not at all sure where to find more gamers. How do I find existing groups to join? Or, are there any resources online that may help me find existing RPG groups or pl...

social

is... basically the only one we allow

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

We don't get those here in Israel either. The best way I can think of here is to go to gaming conventions to play one-shot games, or look for specific gaming clubs/societies that have active forums or Facebook groups and start polling for games there.

StuperUser

@BrianBallsun-Stanton That is awesome, NearbyGamers looks useful.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@StuperUser isn't search awesome?

StuperUser

@BrianBallsun-Stanton My google fu is weak today. I feel shame as a minor action.

4

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

10:18 AM

@StuperUser ::points to the search bar in the site:: It... actually works :) rpg.stackexchange.com/search?q=

Also, shame is a move action.

:p

BESW

Whups, lost power for an hour or so.

@BrianBallsun-Stanton I'm pretty sure there's a Self-Loathing variant for the Deprecatist class that makes shame a minor action.

Maybe he took the multiclass feat.

@StuperUser One of my players who moved to Tenessee seemed to have success with a combination of online tools like that, and posting Group Wanted signs in his FLGS.

My area isn't quite so vibrant; so far as I can tell, gaming groups are few and insular.

The insularity is probably partly because a large portion of the gaming community is transient (military), and also because when you only have a few groups in an area they tend to either merge or polarize.

(online tools generally fail to have any entries for Guam, and the ones that exist are years old.)

Maurycy Zarzycki

Maybe try also posting on local equivalents of sites like gumtree?

BESW

@BrianBallsun-Stanton If anything, the search function works too well. Am I missing something, or is there not a way to filter for only questions?

@MaurycyZarzycki I imagine that Craigslist-type requests for role-playing groups to join could result in... traumatic... responses.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@BESW oooh, that's overpowered.

@BESW isquesthttp://rpg.stackexchange.com/search?q=is%3Aquestion+group+find Yes.

BESW

@BrianBallsun-Stanton What's that when it's a link?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

10:32 AM

A way to search questions of finding groups

is:question is a lovely operator in the search tips

BESW

Ahah.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

anyone for ten kilowords of light reading?

Aether

@StuperUser You might want to check on Meet Up, or searching "roleplaying London" threw up some promising results.

StuperUser

10:57 AM

@all good ideas thanks, will give those a try @BESW: I assume FLGS is Favourite Local Game Store), Meetup's pretty good, I've used that before for other groups.

BESW

@StuperUser "Friendly," but yes.

@StuperUser Also, as a casual response to your "users new to RPGs" question, I'd like to say that I love having new blood.

Questions from new players have a tendency to remind us that our assumptions and experiences are often less universal than we think, and bring us new ways of looking at things.

StuperUser

11:15 AM

@BESW Yeah, of all the SEs, RPG SE really impressed the community spirit on me. I asked that Q since I didn't want to be generating noise and know how to welcome new members when I'm more familiar with RPGs and the community. I saw the potential for new users being new to RPGs, since that's where I'm coming from.

Also, according to Chris Perkins, shame is a free action forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/147623/… ;p

BESW

@StuperUser Now that is overpowered.

Maybe in paragon levels shame can be an immediate reaction, but a free action? That's a daily, or a level 30 feature.

@StuperUser The vision of an SE as a community of citizens is definitely one of the reasons I decided to stick around.

BESW

12:28 PM

Well played, Evil Hat. Your Atomic Robo Dice have seduced my players into adding to my pledge for their own sets.

BESW

12:39 PM

I saw that.

Undreren

12:52 PM

Hello everyone

BESW

Hey.

Undreren

What are you up to?

BESW

Shelling out money to Evil Hat.

Undreren

Hehe, OK then ;)

I've been thinking about designing a "2d6"

Just for fun.

BESW

?

Undreren

1:00 PM

a 36 sided die with the numbers 2 to 12 on it

BESW

Sounds roly-poly.

Undreren

with the same probabilities of each result as when rolling 2d6

roly-poly?

BESW

Like it'll be more ball-like than is good for itself and wind up under couches.

Undreren

lol

Yeah, probably will ;)

But it could be made as a "log" die

BESW

So it'd only roll off the table in two directions?

Undreren

1:03 PM

lol

gmdice.com/7-piece-set-of-swirly-crystal-rpg-dice-yellow

BESW

I am familiar with log dice.

Undreren

ok :)

BESW

But it doesn't matter what shape you make the thing; at a certain point adding more sides becomes an exercise in the nature of a curve.

Undreren

I know :) And I don't care :)

BESW

Maybe you can sell a corral to go with it.

Undreren

1:05 PM

corral?

BESW

Something to pen it in, like a box or a set of walls.

catsmeatshop.blogspot.co.uk/2011/10/womens-work.html

Undreren

ahh

have to go

later!

BESW

ttfn

C. Ross

1:31 PM

morning all

BESW

Hafa.

C. Ross

@BESW huh?

BESW

Local greeting here. "Hafa adai," roughly "What's up?"

C. Ross

ah, where is here?

BESW

Guam.

C. Ross

1:36 PM

ah, cool

well, work

very exciting application documentation

BESW

Wooo!

C. Ross

@BESW are you a native to Guam?

BESW

@C.Ross Born and raised, but not by blood; my parents are from the mainland States.

C. Ross

@BESW cool

BESW

So I'm Guamanian, but not Chamorro.

[profile diving] NC, eh? Local?

C. Ross

1:44 PM

@BESW yeah, 5th+ generation

BESW

I went to college near Myrtle Beach SC. Got some relatives who moved into the area a couple decades ago.

And my mother recently finished an MFA in Charlotte.

C. Ross

@BESW cool

BESW

I'm actually currently running a DFRPG campaign set in a fictionalized version of the area I went to college.

C. Ross

@BESW that's popular

the local game shop did that with Charlotte

BESW

None of the other players have been there, so I get to use it as source material without having to stick too close.

C. Ross

1:46 PM

it's amazing how many different ideas of the same city people can have

@BESW yeah, that can be an advantage

I just read Storm Front last week

mixed feelings about it

BESW

Myrtle Beach and environs is fun to play with because everything interesting is from outside; nobody has ever lived there or wanted to live there for more than a generation or two until it became a tourist town.

C. Ross

@BESW definitely

BESW

The place is surrounded by centuries of history and conflict, but that particular area was mucky swamp that not even the Native Americans wanted anything to do with.

@C.Ross Yeah, definitely an Early Author work.

C. Ross

@BESW ah, so the writing gets better?

BESW

Somewhat. He's not a virtuoso of his craft, but by rights the things he's doing in the books should bomb spectacularly.

Phil

1:49 PM

Yeah, I'm only three books in, and they've got measurably better with each one

BESW

It's just too silly and it's taking itself too seriously. But it works. Somehow.

Phil

Apparently the interesting overarching plots start in book three, and book seven is when it gets really, really good.

BESW

I'm a fan of the first handful of books, when they were serialized with a bit of plot arc but before it gets into full Whedon Syndrome.

@Phil Oh, it starts in book one, it just gets obvious later on.

Phil

heh, not heard it called that before :o)

BESW

And around book seven is when you either settle down for the ride or you get off the train.

Phil

1:51 PM

fair enough

I really liked the story in the third one, but having read the three back to back I'm taking a break before going any further

BESW

I got a little tired of what starts to feel like yanking Dresden around just for the sake of making him miserable--by the author. If it were just the villains, sure.

Phil

Hmm, well I guess that's something I accept because of the general tone he's going for

BESW

I've read all the books to date (and most of the short stories). He's got interesting ideas but... the writing's not quite quality enough to keep me engaged as Dresden gets pummeled for the sake of... drama? character development? Butcher's amusement?

C. Ross

@BESW yeah, that gets old, but it seems to be really common in modern serials

BESW

Whedon Syndrome: at first the series is engaging on multiple levels, with a number of different kinds of stories and methods for generating tension and drama.

C. Ross

1:54 PM

I think I might be ready to pick up Wheel of Time again sometime, now that it's (almost?) finished

BESW

But at some point, the series becomes repetitive, and this is the repetition: fan-popular character X gets something that makes them happy. Then it is taken away in the most traumatic fashion possible.

@C.Ross Hurf. Wheel of Time.... had promise?

I think he took the reviews that said "It's like Tolkien, but with women!" too seriously.

C. Ross

@BESW shrugs I got 2 books in, and then my friends told me it was 11 books on and still going

BESW

Couldn't keep track of all the extra characters he kept adding (especially but not only the women), until they became flat cutouts from the same stencil. The one that sniffs, the one that pulls her braid...

C. Ross

I'm not going to sink that much time into something that's not going to finish

BESW

Also, the sheer number of people and plots turned it into a terrible slog.

rinkworks.com/bookaminute/b/jordan.winters.shtml

C. Ross

1:57 PM

@BESW eh, maybe I won't pick it back up

Currently reading Heilein's Red Planet

BESW

rinkworks.com/bookaminute/b/jordan.newspring.shtml

Heinlein?

C. Ross

@BESW classic SF, most famous for Starship Troopers (which I haven't read yet)

Robert A. Heinlein

Robert Anson Heinlein ( ; July 7, 1907 – May 8, 1988) was an American science fiction writer. Often called the "dean of science fiction writers", he was one of the most influential and controversial authors of the genre in his time. He set a standard for scientific and engineering plausibility, and helped to raise the genre's standards of literary quality. He was one of the first science fiction writers to break into mainstream magazines such as The Saturday Evening Post in the late 1940s. He was one of the best-selling science fiction novelists for many decades. He, Isaac Asimov, and ...

BESW

I'm familiar with him. Just checking due to erratic spelling.

Phil

Been meaning to read Starship Troopers for a while.

BESW

Not really a guy whose work I've enjoyed, but I've read a couple of them for due diligence.

I'm currently going back to some light reading that originally inspired my GMing style.

Right now, The Enchanted Forest Chronicles.

Poster child for treating even the most minor NPC as an individual with motives and character.

The last few years I've been more on a classic mystery novel kick; Campion, Lovejoy, Fandorin.

Great for RPG characters, not so great for RPG plots. Too much authorial orchestration to make them work.

Phil

2:10 PM

I don't read nearly as much as I probably should. I just don't find I have the time.

C. Ross

@BESW that's always a temptation in games, to have a plot that only works if the PC's cooperate

BESW

@C.Ross Luckily my first group quickly beat any hope of that out of me.

The few times I've tried it since, I wrote myself into a corner and realized what I was doing.

I prefer to create settings with people who have motives and plans and backup plans, and let my players run rampant.

Like a lopsided bowling ball flopping its way through a game of chess.

C. Ross

lol

BESW

It's what they're going to do anyway, I might as well roll with it.

C. Ross

oddly enough, one of my favorite games had a linear plot

but the DM told us that up front and we all bought in

BESW

2:18 PM

Linear plots can work, but they need a framework and player buy-in.

C. Ross

and it had the simple pull to draw us all in. Something bad is going to happen that's going to destroy your village, go stop it

BESW

My most recent campaign (D&D 4e) had all the PCs working for the black ops division of a lawful good nation.

C. Ross

@BESW interesting

BESW

It provided reason for them to work together, a handy way for me to feed them plot and equipment, and a structure for PC shenanigans to be condoned by authority.

One of my players described it as Mission: Impossible (if you are discovered, we will claim no association with you) meets Blackwater.

I set it in the distant past of the PoL setting, during the war between the dragonborn and tiefling empires. The party worked for the dragonborns.

Hence the linear nature of the campaign: being history, some elements of the campaign were inevitable.

We turned it into a combination of "I was there" and "That was the good outcome."

(The Far Realm got involved, thanks to the blind ambition of Acererak.)

Aether

@CRoss I haven't read Wheel of Time, but I am a big fan of Brandon Sanderson, and have heard good things about the way he finished the series.

Of course, you could always check out his other books instead. Warbreaker is available as a free download on his website. :)

StuperUser

3:34 PM

@Phil @BESW @C.Ross if you're looking at space marine stories check out en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Forever_War too. Great allegory for the Vietnam War. Best SF book I read in my university years.

Apparently there's a board game for it too.

C. Ross

@StuperUser it's on the (vague mental) list

Oblivious Sage

4:04 PM

@StuperUser John Scalzi's Old Man's War arc is also good en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Scalzi#Old_Man.27s_War_universe

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

4:32 PM

Hey-ho.

@ObliviousSage I read The Old Man's War a while back. I was of two minds about it. It was fun and enjoyable and very readable, but seemed to be mostly a slight modernized homage to Starship Troopers.

Phil

@StuperUser Cool, thanks for the tip :o)

Oblivious Sage

@Avner: Yeah. It gets more original in the other 2/3 books where they go more into the political aspect of things. I say 2/3 because the 4th book is basically a retelling of the 3rd book from a different perspective.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

4:56 PM

@ObliviousSage I didn't even know there were 4 books out. I think I knew about the 3rd.

Aether

5:10 PM

@BESW docs.google.com/document/d/…

Novian

5:54 PM

Sigh my dm ruled that if I wanted Greater Luminous Armor permanencied on myself id have to take the sacrafice cost as permanent damage(Or at least until I no longer benefit from the spell itself.) even if i wasnt the caster.

ah D&D Rule 0 is cruel.

Maurycy Zarzycki

7:42 PM

Is FAE going to be OGL?

Aether

8:09 PM

According to our own fate tag wiki, yes.

Oblivious Sage

why is it sometimes called FAE and sometimes called FAE?

Novian

Hmm, It seems I need some 3.5 e advice. I have a Character build that uses an ability that allows him to attack enemies he moves by with a single attack. using said ability also would provoke AoO's by the boatload. Besides Mobility what Else can i do to mitigate Attack of Opportunities?

wait this sounds like a Question.

Maurycy Zarzycki

@ObliviousSage If you meant to ask why it is sometimes called FAE and sometimes FATE the reason is that FAE is Fate Accelerated - a much more simplified version of FATE

Though saying it is simplified doesn't really give it justice, it's simplified and modified to accelerated getting into the game

Oblivious Sage

ahhhhh, thanks for clarifying that @MaurycyZarzycki

@Novian: tumbling is always entertaining, or perform(dance) if you happen to be a Dervish

Novian

@ObliviousSage I do not belive Tumbling is allowed during this particular technique.

I will check.

movement is part of the ability so I do not think you can tumble..

that and I barely have the skill points to support many skills.

2+int is bad.

It doesnt say you cant so you might be able to tumble.

Oblivious Sage

8:32 PM

@Novian: been a while since i played any 3.5, so you should probably ask @KRyan, whether you can use tumble with move & attack abilities

The Oracle

1

Q: Time to burninate the [mechanics] tag

The original discussion of the mechanics tag had many votes against it and no votes for it. Unless there are new arguments to keep it, we should burninate the tag now. We have 161 questions tagged with it at the moment, and none usefully that I can see.

support tags

Aether

9:00 PM

@ObliviousSage To make it explicit, FAE stands for FATE Accelerated Edition.

And yes, it's a little confusing, especially when typos get involved.

KRyan

@Novian it has a huge duration, just cast it normally and use the (super-cheap for the effect) rod of bodily restoration to fix yourself up afterwards

@Novian Tumbling is a valid part of any movement that does not explicitly deny you from using it

LitheOhm

10:40 PM

@Novian KRyan has it correct. Movement may be part of the ability but tumble can be part of that movement, usually.

@BESW very nice way of handling that, I shall remember that one. I've tried "history" campaigns and there are some traps. Mostly wrestling with those rails

BESW

@LitheOhm Yeah, even with party buy-in the trick is to make them still feel like they matter.

LitheOhm

@C.Ross didn't he write Stranger In a Strange Land?

@BESW definitely

BESW

@LitheOhm Yes.

LitheOhm

good book.

BESW

I leveraged several major strategies: focus on events that weren't recorded, assume some events weren't remembered accurately, and make the party the cause of the events as remembered (because it would've been worse otherwise).

LitheOhm

10:46 PM

I dig the "that was the good outcome" especially

BESW

Example: in the history I was using, an enemy city "mysteriously exploded" at the end of the war. Nobody took credit for it, nobody could explain it.

LitheOhm

extraplanar evil gate destroyed?

BESW

So in my campaign I used it for the grand finale. Due to 25 levels' worth of plot culminating up to it --including several choices the players made which seemed less important at the time but I used them to further the plot-- the Far Realm ripped open a Way above the city.

LitheOhm

cool

BESW

As Allabar, Opener of the Way (doorman for the Far Realm god-equivalents, and a creature with god-level power himself) stuck his tentacles through (that's all he could fit until the Way widened), the warring physics of the two multiverses turned the city to ice and glass.

LitheOhm

10:50 PM

25 levels, man. Most games I've played last less than a linear fifteen

BESW

The closing of the Way (which was accomplished Care Bear Stare style with a repurposed Feelings Canon designed to give an entire oncoming army the feeling of being tortured) shattered the city, while simultaneously returning it to its original components.

LitheOhm

lol

BESW

You can't just fight a moon-sized nondimensional tentacle monster.

Oblivious Sage

"original components"? like, exotic matter from the Planck epoch?

BESW

No, like back to the way it was before it was turned to ice and glass.

LitheOhm

10:56 PM

yeah. Elder Evils has some stuff like that. One of them you don't fight, you just keep them from waking up

BESW