[grid-deduction] Puzzle Solving

let's list out all the possible pentos that can go on the W's friend

we know P can go there, in Bubbler's orientation:
-xx
xxx

T can also go there, pointing upwards.

one more

could N go there too?

4:07 AM

technically yes, and the only way we know it doesn't is by what amounted to an extensive case-bash. so I'm including it

right. so our options for that W-friend spot are N, P, T.

if W friend is N, what is the top set of dots?

if W-friend is N, then the top set of dots has to be P.

What about if W friend is T?

if W-friend is T, then it's tricky, i think top set has to be P there too because N would cause an ocean problem.

4:09 AM

yep

therefore, what can we say about the P?

if W-friend is either N or T, the top set of dots is forced to be P. alternatively, W-friend could be P itself.

those are the only two possible scenarios.

is there another conclusion we can draw?

nowhere else can have P

right. P must go there

now let's look at the two diagonal dots in bottom triangle

what pento can they be?

well, we know they're not P, with the P-deduction.

U could fit there if it was pointing downwards.

4:12 AM

ah drat N-I fits

N can't work because Ocean Problems.

^^

who is that agreeing with?

N does fit there

oh... yeah

4:14 AM

and since U fits as well, my planned deduction doesn't work

if the ocean goes upwards it would be fine for N to be there

so we're stuck again

NO WAIT HANG ON. I have something.

i have a Thing. hang on

I think I have a thing too, but I'll wait

that right ocean. it's cut off to the right side because of the Z placement, correct? and therefore must connect downwards to connect to the other ocean?

it HAS to connect downwards?

yep

so there needs to be a gap in the two pentos we place there to allow ocean to pass downwards?

4:17 AM

it could swerve a bit on the way

yep

okay, and we know the vertical three-dot spot is either L or I, because piece bank

right?

not L

*V

sorry

yes

then yes

4:19 AM

so it's either V or I, and then the other pento has to permit an ocean gap

right

so if it's I, let's say

the other pento we know isn't a P, and it can't go right and bump up against the I, so it's not U either

it must therefore be N in that scenario

true

so we have an N-I scenario as one possibility for that bottom triangle.

now, let's say it's V.

in that scenario, the other pento can be a U, because that would no longer bump the I piece, and it can't be N horizontal because it would close the necessary ocean path. so it would have to be U vertical.

*U blah

so that's the U-V scenario.

you can edit your own messages

4:23 AM

so we have N-I scenario and U-V scenario

those are the two options, correct?

right

in the N-I scenario, the N has now been used up, so the top piece must be P.

meaning the W-friend is T.

this is getting pretty far into the future

that's a long road towards case bashing though

i'm case bashing again aren't i

4:24 AM

so now can I slightly reveal My Thing?

yes, i think we are just case bashing in desperation at this point.

I got something simpler

where can V go in the large area?

only one place, plausibly.

can you draw it?

4:26 AM

i think i got something simpler than whatever this is

would have to go here

and then what happens with the W's friend?

this is true

we had established that W's friend must be P, N, or T. now it can't be an N because adjacency issue, and it can't be P anymore because oceans? so T?

doesn't T also block oceans?

4:28 AM

in this scenario, it could be T there and P on top, which would be fine for oceans?

i think?

oceans coming up from bottom?

bobble is right

ahhh

it would block the oceans coming up, yeah

so V doesn't go there

then where does it go?

and thus can only go in the three-spot

that was MUCH easier than my Thing :p

oops

4:30 AM

for the record, my Thing was that the U can only go in bottom triangle

thank you, Bubbler

but that has the same result, so all's good

and now it must be U, yeah

so now we've got this

now let's do a pento-counting deduction

yeah - I, N, P, T are our last four pentos, and we have two concrete spots and two must-touch-these-dots-in-some-combination spots

4:33 AM

as in, you have only four pentos left

and you have quite a few dots lying around

ahh, i see. i need to cover those five floating dots with only two pentos

this means one has to cover two and the other has to cover three?

yep, since no way to cover 4 with one pento

and we know P is not one of those, and I is one of those

T and N could go in either area as of yet

so it's I, and either T or N

remember, one must cover 3 dots

T can cover 3 dots in one spot, it looks like

I can't cover more than 2

N can cover only 2 as well

4:36 AM

well, W's friend can still reach one of the dots

oh, crap, that's true. W's friend messes this up

but if it does I don't think you can pair up the remaining dots nicely?

yeah, the remaining two dots must be T again, which you can't fit

so therefore I think i can place the T, since it's the only pento that can cover 3 dots and it can only do so in one spot.

right

4:38 AM

yay!

that pretty much finishes everything

(actually I had an intuitive answer yesterday and it bugged me for 24 hours)

ta-daaa

such is the fate of the Grid-Deduction Society member

you shall have times when you think of nothing but grid-deductioning

that was the longest, most grueling Statue Park i have ever done

and times when it interferes with your life

but you will press on, knowing that there must be a way to solve it

and then you shall glory in the final logical solution

can I get an "amen"? :P

4:40 AM

Amen to that

Amen

This is the Way

so are you up to trying 34?

oh god, look at #34

isn't it beautiful

4:44 AM

what in the actual hell

i most definitely didn't have to restart this one twice

no siree

i'm gonna just try to vibe my way to victory, don't give me any hints yet

it will totally be fine

i'm sure i will not regret this decision

there will be no global deductions at all

no window-smashing

super easy

no faltering in flight

4:45 AM

pure 100% vibes

i'm doing a Pro Gamer move

no puzzle can stop me

33 was a fluke

a time-space anomaly that has since been dealt with

my powers have evolved since that time five seconds ago

the usual term is "space-time"

not "time-space"

:p

but i'm not talking about spacetime

then what are you talking about?

4:48 AM

I'm talking about an anomaly along the dimensions of time and space

y- ...

ok

i give up

time and space are being considered separately

spacetime is them compounded together

but i said space-time (note the hyphen)

but space-time = spacetime to me

also time-space sounds cooler

fight me, i dare you

i shall die on this hill

pulls out phaser

it's set to vaporize

(aka "maximum setting")

4:51 AM

ices merrybot

haha you're out now

i can just phaser the ice

phasers the ice

there we go

it's an icer

i am unstoppable

not ice

same difference

4:52 AM

ICER = the SHIELD version of a phaser

yes

aims le phaser

and it sounds cooler, so i shoot first

fires le phaser

but i already iced you

bobble lied

4:53 AM

you're knocked out

I just got a global deduction

gasp

ices Bubbler before this news gets out

@bobble i am immune to the icers ... apparently

phasers bobble while i can

raises energy shield

it is too late, i have already fired

4:55 AM

in later seasons Coulson gets an energy shield with the SHIELD logo

it's awesome

an energy SHIELD?

He says something along the lines of "I thought it would be cool for the director of SHIELD to have a SHIELD"

oops that's a mild spoiler

eh it's one you could guess anyhow

anyway

tosses you a phaser for use in combat

I just got three global deductions in a row

see how nice i am

4:57 AM

i hope y'all don't mind that we're co-opting the grid-deduction chat for role playing

y- ... oops

uhh

perhaps we ought to do this somewhere else?

or not at all?

eh i'm fine stopping

... alright then

runs and hides

aw matt you're still my friend

i nearly vaporized you

4:59 AM

but you didn't and that's what counts

... thanks. ...... <3

you may take my phaser if you wish to do so

you can keep it

[this is ... slightly awkward]

i'm reading SU's meta in another tab

and?

5:05 AM

so not feeling awkward

?

this puzzle is going surprisingly okay so far

but it's going wacky towards the end

i'm annotating very heavily

there's a big global deduction i'm working on but it is requiring very weird mental acrobatics

5:29 AM

okay, i am stuck :p

can i have a hint on the second global deduction?

where are you?

keep in mind that there are inevitable variations on the solve path

true, yeah - this is where i'm at

you used S instead of N

you're just gonna have to deal with it

heathen

5:31 AM

i can choose to spurn the autocratic shackles in my personal documents

'tis not a crime

hold on, currently getting distracted by Ford vs Ferrari

@Bubbler, care to step in?

oh wait

X

X?

where does it go

OH YEAH, X

Thank you, that was it

you got it while I had a brief connection issue

and then you can place another piece right away, which is similar to X

5:37 AM

hm

ahhh, F?

correct

:D

and now i can place T?

I don't think so

but now it can only go in one spot

because a T can have three-in-a-row in two ways

5:41 AM

it can poke out from edge dots

oh, yeah. oops

I couldn't place any of the remaining pieces until I determined a dozen more ocean cells

or two dozens

lord almighty, i can try

5:56 AM

i could only find a couple more ocean spots, will have to continue looking tomorrow - getting sleepy

i must sleep as well

good night Bubbler buddy and Bobble buddy :)

g'night, friends

Omega Krypton

Shhhhh!

11:16 PM

a ping for @Sciborg - i have finished with the thank-yous

I've gotta cook first but then we shall do some Puzzling :D

i shall do my own puzzling then

11:41 PM

Okay, Statue Park time

are you currently stuck?

We just placed X and F, and now Bubbler said there are more ocean deductions i need to make

but i could only find one or two

well some useless (?) ocean deductions would be spots where no piece can reach

that was one of the oceans i placed, yeah. but beyond that i'm not sure where else to go

so far we are here

bobble thinking noises

11:44 PM

Bubbler says there are like a dozen, so i'm guessing there's a big deduction that revolves around placing a bunch of oceans

i see an island deduction

which will lead to ocean deductions

okay, hm

consider this: there are three pentos that have 4 dots in a row

yup - I, L, Y

where can they go?

11:46 PM

left, right (one of which must be I because can't go any other places) and that spot in the middle

ah, i gotcha

can you place an island?

yup, i can place an island

and oceans

yay!

so now that puts us here

can you place more islands with "need to fit a pento" logic?

11:49 PM

potentially, let me see

so we know where I, L, and Y have to go, which means we've got N, P, T, U, V, Z for the other six places

i think there are currently a few places N can go

what i see is local logic, not global

ah, oops

hm

just literally "if this spot is ocean, then five islands can't fit"

but the I piece could go up or down in those two spots

there are two spaces up and down where the remaining two dots would go

i'm not looking at potential I-piece spots

11:53 PM

ahh, wait, i see. you mean literally "the five dots in a pento would not fit if this spot was ocean" kind of logic

i was misunderstanding, sorry

sorry miscommunication

so that's the kind of logic i am looking for, hm

ahhh, i see one

bottom right?

that's one

and yup, right-middle is another one

awesome

yay!

11:56 PM

that's a really weird and creative deduction, i like it :p

this puzzle is full of those

now we're here

i'm trying to think of more stuff, there must be more oceans to place