The Nineteenth Byte

Adám

12:02 AM

@ASCII-only Very nice that it explains how it processes (p&~w)|(p&q) into pq + p~w but the correct result is p .

ASCII-only

@Adám wait it is?

Adám

@ASCII-only Sorry, typos. It makes (p&~q) | (p&q) → pq + p~q when it should give p .

ASCII-only

@Adám hmm so it sometimes needs to factorize. would you ever need to do it multiple times?

Adám

@ASCII-only I don't know. Your code is clearly very clever while mine is dumb brute forcing.

ASCII-only

mine isn't clever, it just applies the laws

Adám

12:11 AM

@ASCII-only How does it know which law to apply next?

ASCII-only

@Adám it doesn't, it just applies whichever law it can

Adám

@ASCII-only And if two can be applied?

ASCII-only

@Adám whichever one is earlier in the code >_>

also it does it left to right

Adám

@ASCII-only prs + pr~s + ps~r stays as is (so does it in mine), while clearly the first term can just be removed.

@ASCII-only Shouldn't it rather split whenever it has a choice and pursue all branches and in the end compare the results to see which leaf is simplest?

@ASCII-only Btw, I have an idea to tackle the prs + pr~s + ps~r → pr~s + ps~r case, but it won't be for tonight.

ASCII-only

maybe. but isn't that really similar to bruteforcing

well, at least it will significantly slow it down

and let's just say my code is not the most efficient

Adám

12:18 AM

@ASCII-only You're trying to solve an NP-hard problem…

ASCII-only

@Adám well, not exactly, it's not meant to always fully simplify, just whenever it's pretty obvious

Adám

@ASCII-only Could you add ∧ and ∨ for AND and OR?

ASCII-only

@Adám It always had those

Adám

13 hours ago, by ASCII-only

@Adám and is &, up arrow thing or . (or nothing at all), or is |, down arrow thing or +

ASCII-only

> up arrow thing

i guess that's really unclear

Adám

12:23 AM

@ASCII-only Oh.

@ASCII-only So much for me hand-translating…

ASCII-only

@ASCII-only it's more meant to help people working it out by hand I guess?

@Adám Is it still equally hard with K-maps?

Adám

@ASCII-only I don't know.

ETHproductions

Hey, I've just been learning about K-maps in uni

ASCII-only

well, there's this

ETHproductions

that too

are you trying to implement those algorithmically or something?

ASCII-only

12:31 AM

Not really

Adám

@ASCII-only Btw, prs + pr~s + ps~r (which both of our programs currently stop at) can be golfed (is it simplified?) to p(r+s)

ASCII-only

@Adám So the simplest form would be pr + ps then? I think simplified usually means anything that doesn't and a term with or

Adám

@ASCII-only yes, if we have p and r, then s doesn't matter, and if we have p and s, then r doesn't matter.

ASCII-only

i guess it was a stupid question, of course it's simpler than pr~s + ps~r

ETHproductions

The "p implies q" test can be shortened quite a bit too, to q + ~p

Adám

12:42 AM

@ETHproductions Yup. My code "fails" by returning ((~p)∧(~q)) ∨ ((~p)∧q) ∨ (p∧q)

ASCII-only

prs + pr~s + ps~r
pr + ps~r
p(r + s~r) // so you can't simplify like this :/

prs + pr~s + ps~r
prs + pr~s + prs + ps~r
pr + ps

the computer would probably need to brute force that though

Zacharý

What language is this?

boolean algebra

I heard code though

@Zacharý where

12:47 AM

@Adám Here

Οurous

They have boolean algebra simplifiers

ASCII-only

47 mins ago, by Adám

https://tio.run/##hVVBaxtHFL7rV8xtrCIjK720XkIITSGGUkNbaCDkMNqdlaeZnVntzNoWpjrk4MrGaxJCj4XSJFTNpZTQHgKhkJ8yf8R5b2YjaaW1sxfLO@9973vf@@Yty@V2MmFSj66u3OyXRJjcnT79Ro9ETPhxXkSHrDCRZUPJI3f5695@ZIuSR4rzhCeRUImJmJSREVkOETEz3HSIDwSYHXLd46rfyM72EMITAiD8WKhRh2AtSMO6bvaXq@YAdLf3xeBLd/Ef/mzm82NbsNhilkB@RLGsrv79/bv39n901WtEbK8udcykMJzYA551CDQBlW@581euevH@74Gr3tz6zJ39sQGAuRC8HetsqIkXJhA/cdWlq972KOC46l/68/u5O30OoRvZxoiRIpzFB0RYQ3INL4ZCWoHsvYQe4hJ1uEY7fshkySxHKqRWfXcvJTu33Wze9y9a80TqyadMGqCNTz1x0Ip@pRUomojYCq0ooTt0kTcuhQXGhZxAna8hGWq52Z@tlVbqoFc2yvzASqvBcBMoMaCNtI0yNxooE8dgn4KbUloTymBBKONp9de0/5iWgtS8ID@VxuL…

Zacharý

I'm going to take a blind guess at APL ...

nailed it

Οurous

"Blind Guess"

Adám

Anecdote: In high-school, we were not allowed to bring our graphing calculators to math tests, but we were allowed to bring them to chemistry tests if they had nothing stored on them. I asked if I could bring it to my philosophy test. They laughed at the ridiculous idea; sure, why not? For for the questions asking to evaluate truthiness of some huge convoluted logic statement, I replaced "and" with * and "not" with 1- and "or" with 1-(1-a)*(1-b). Then I used vectorising to get the answer…

Zacharý

12:48 AM

I did it before I saw what the link was to

Vectorizing, the most wonderful thing ever on a calculator.

ASCII-only

I wonder if it would make a nice fastest-code (probably not since there's already an algorithm >_>)

@Adám vectorising?

Zacharý

APL-ing

1 2+3 4 => 4 6

Οurous

@Zacharý Adám wrote it. That's almost good enough for me to start betting limbs on it being APL.

Zacharý

J's a thing though

I wouldn't bet limbs on it

I'd bet crap tons of money though :p

Οurous

@Zacharý almost

Zacharý

12:50 AM

Yep

Adám

@ASCII-only Yeah, just like in my APL code. The TI calculator would pair up corresponding elements when using arithmetic operations (- and * in this case) on lists. So I just defined each variable so that they would make a truth table, and did the math. If all was 1, then the answer was True, else it was False.

ASCII-only

@Adám oh, nice

@Adám did your calculator have an = symbol

Zacharý

@Adám TI-Basic is amazing

Adám

@ASCII-only Yeah, that saved me a lot of time during the test.

Zacharý

I've actually programmed Wireworld, GoL, and a symbolic quadratic formula calculator in TI-BASIC.

Adám

12:52 AM

@ASCII-only Yes I think so, but that wouldn't vectorise, it would look whether the two lists were identical.

Zacharý

L_1 - L_2 = 0

If I had my calculator with me, I'd test L_1 = L_2 right now

Adám

@Zacharý I made a graphical Mandelbrot set plotter. I would start it in the evening on fresh batteries, and in the morning it would be done, but I couldn't tell until I switched batteries…

Zacharý

How long ago was this? I've done langton's ant as well. But the Symbolic Quadratic Equation Solver "SQES" (pronounced as "squeeze"?) was one of the two most useful things I've done in TIBASIC, the other being Euler's method

ASCII-only

@Adám wait can a calculator even burn batterise that quickly

@Zacharý symbolic?

Adám

@Zacharý I also made a car racing game which my classmates would play during class. Once, in the middle of a Swedish class, I think, someone exclaimed "high score!" from the back row. This was before smartphones and all that.

ASCII-only

12:55 AM

The most ~~useful~~ useless thing I did (CASIO BASIC) was a calendar

Zacharý

@ASCII-only Yes. Quadratic formula numeric would be useless and too easy

Adám

@ASCII-only Non-stop full-throttle overnight. Yeah, that did it on my TI-86.

Zacharý

Dang. TI-BASIC is a gateway drug ... to APL. Or is it the otherway around?

Οurous

@Zacharý Programming is a gateway drug to programming

Zacharý

I'm going to actually find my calculator rn, as I need it for a stats test on Friday.

Neil

12:58 AM

@ASCII-only -vl outputs a byte count which differs from the OP's byte count. I didn't actually check to see which was right.

although speaking of -vl...

Adám

@Zacharý Actually, I couldn't afford a graphing calculator. My math teacher gave me his, with the reason that I could do more good with it than he could, after I found that the max y value of y=ˣ√x is for x=e. (Shameless boasting)

Zacharý

Confirmed: List = List outputs List

Neil

@ASCII-only why doesn't this parse? tio.run/…

Adám

@Zacharý so it does vectorise? Cool.

Zacharý

@Adám Which class was this in?

If teachers made deals like that now, I'd probably be getting gifts better than a textbook on polynomials. (Shameless bragging)

user202729

1:02 AM

Floating point approximation of e? Beware of numerical coincidence.

Adám

@Zacharý A bit hard to compare across countries. It was probably in the first year of "high-school" which came after 9 years of regular school, beginning at age 7.

ASCII-only

@Neil 1. I'm an idiot, 2. default doesn't support ending with ; yet >_>

Zacharý

Calculus in 8th grade is better (of course on my own time)

Neil

@ASCII-only ... which reminds me, else doesn't work after ; either

Zacharý

Oh, Sophomore to Junior year if it's 9+7=16. o_o

Adám

1:05 AM

@Zacharý In the final year (3rd) I wrote a paper on the possibilities of improving mathematical notation (a.k.a. APL). It was delayed well beyond the end of the school year because they couldn't find a teacher who felt qualified to judge it.

ASCII-only

> wrote a paper

Zacharý

Well. They might consider it literally ripping off APL if it was close enough

My schedule next year is hell

Neil

most interesting thing I did with a programmable calculator was to approximate the Normal distribution

Adám

For my paper as part of the philosophy course, I wrote a small paper on extending Boolean algebra to include fuzziness:

7

Q: Implement Multiplicative Fuzzy Logic

Inspired by this excellent challenge (from which the bulk of this text is blatantly duct-taped) – and my highschool philosophy project... I define the following operators: Fuzzy Conjunction a ×F b is a × b Fuzzy Division a ÷F b is a ÷ b Fuzzy Negation –F b is 1 – b Fuzzy Disjunction a +F b i...

Zacharý

4 off-campus courses, oh joy. Half of my year is not even in high school next year

ASCII-only

1:07 AM

@Zacharý better?

Adám

@Zacharý What? I brought APL (by name) as an example of how notation could be improved.

Zacharý

If you discarded order of operations, it's APL, no beating around the bush there

Adám

@Zacharý I don't understand. What is APL?

Zacharý

I'm not really APLe to comprehend this right now :p

Adám

My linear algebra teacher was completely flabbergasted when I suggested multiplying two matrices element-by-element just as with +.

@Zacharý Please don't start!

Zacharý

1:12 AM

@Adám Was this in pre-uni/pre-college/equivalent-in-denmark ? O_O

ASCII-only

@Adám wait wat

Zacharý

@Adám That's understandable. Let's have a circled times be element-wise.

Adám

@Zacharý It was in the last year (3rd) of "high-school" (i.e. just before going to university/college) where we were allowed to take the first university level linear algebra course.

Zacharý

Ah. I'm taking Calc III and ODE instead. In all honesty, I should've done Linear Algebra and Calc III, that way I don't have 3 off campus courses in one semester...

Adám

@ASCII-only In APL, all arithmetic functions go element-by-element. To do matrix multiplication, you write +.× since it is the same as dot-product (hence the dot) and is a conjunction of additions and multiplications. APL allows you to conjoin any functions dot-product-style.

@Zacharý ODE?

Zacharý

1:16 AM

Ordinary Differential Equations

moonheart08

Which is better: printf or cout

(In your opinion, no practicality needed :P)

Zacharý

Hell, if French 4 is unavailable, I'll try to add Linear Algebra.

ASCII-only

@Zacharý wait wat...

Anonymous

@moonheart08 cout

moonheart08

printf > all

Zacharý

1:17 AM

@moonheart08 Golf-wise: prinf because backwards compatibility is a thing

Anonymous

cout<<foo; is shorter than printf("%d",foo);

Zacharý

IMPORTS

Adám

@Zacharý We had DiffEqs in an optional final high-school course. LA was uni-level. All calculus was mandatory. But then again, the high-school had many "lines" and I went on the mathematical-scientific line with focus on nature sciences.

Zacharý

INCLUDES

Anonymous

No need to yell

Zacharý

1:18 AM

Caps lock

Adám

@Mego Hi Mego. Feeling blue?

4

Zacharý

@Adám My messed-up country would never do anything that good.

Adám

@Zacharý What? Have multiple lines or offer those courses?

Pavel

cout is one of very few C++ standard library features I use.

moonheart08

printf feels more natural to me

Anonymous

1:19 AM

If you're using it multiple times, cout will have a byte advantage over printf, even with the longer include. Also it's C++, so you have to include stdio.h (or cstdio) to use printf. Also #include<bits/stdc++.h> is a thing, which saves bytes in the long run if you need other stdlib/STL stuff.

Zacharý

@Adám Require Calculus. Have multiple lines. And offer those courses (normally). I'm literally the only 11th grader in Calculus.

Anonymous

@Adám Da ba dee da ba die

Pavel

@Zacharý Where is this? At my school it's considered perfectly normal to take Calculus in 10th grade.

user202729

cout because it's C++.

Zacharý

@Pavel In the tradition-littered sh I mean sticks

Pavel

1:23 AM

I use cout for output, but scanf for input. Explain me, all ye who who argue about C vs C++.

Zacharý

There's another guy that might be able to take Calc in 10th grade, from what I've heard. He took Geometry in 8th grade w/o moving (VERY weird for my school, I achieved my courses by taking Alg II+PreCal in the same year), and then he might be able to take Calculus as a sophomore by doing Alg II and PreCal in the same year (since 8th and 9th grade have year-long courses and 10th-12th have semester, he might actually be forced to)

Anonymous

@Pavel You stared into the abyss of Brain-Flak and haven't been the same since

4

user202729

@MartinEnder [SKS] I think at best, not using the template can save at most 3~4 bytes, not "half of the program".

Zacharý

But of course, somehow Maryville still manages to hold on for dear life to any claims it has to fame.

@Pavel The seniors graduate at a different date then the rest of my school: so I'll be ALONE in a room for ~6 days, half of them studying for an AP test.

Pavel

Mostly I'm bothered by cin determining what the type of data being read is, rather than it being explicitely specified.

user202729

1:27 AM

Use a cast. std::cin >> (int&) a;

(but you don't want to do std::cin >> *reinterpret_cast<int&>(&a))

Anonymous

@Pavel That's because int a; scanf("%d"); is redundant. No need to state that it's an int twice.

Pavel

Yeah, but even languages with stronger type systems than C++ still provide seperate methods for reading strings and numbers. In C++, anything can act as an int or void * or even something else. It just irks me.

Zacharý

That's because C is a thing

Come to D, we have std.variant :p

Pavel

I'd rather stay in C# land and accept the memory overhead.

Zacharý

I just realized a perfect pun

THE ADÁM'S APL!

2

ASCII-only

1:32 AM

@Pavel well, it's because there exist people that like using bad casting hacks

Anonymous

@Zacharý You mean std::variant?

Zacharý

@Mego We had it before you.

user202729

@Mego No, that's C++.

Zacharý

@user202729 We know

user202729

@Pavel What do you want to say...? How can you read either a string and an number to a variable?

Zacharý

1:33 AM

He's saying that C++ has it as well

Anonymous

@user202729 We've been talking about C++

Pavel

@user202729 Huh?

Zacharý

Come to D: we have dynamic arrays and associative arrays without having to import anything

user202729

... okay. But that's redundant. In Jelly you need 0 bytes to read input.

Pavel

C#, for example, has a Console.Read (int) and a Console.ReadLine (string). C++ just figures it out from where you're reading too.

Zacharý

1:35 AM

And a by-far golfier template system

user202729

Someone has to make the C++-golfed language.

Pavel

@Zacharý That's not saying much

user202729

(we have shortC, but nothing for C++)

Zacharý

T id(T)(T a){return a;}

Anonymous

@Pavel Technically Console.Read reads a single character. That's closer to getchar in C.

Zacharý

1:36 AM

^THAT is D's template system

Pavel

@Mego Sorry, I haven't read ints from the console in a while¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Zacharý

D WOULD actually make for a good golfy C++, at least in terms of its import syntax, templates, etc. Except one horrible thing: there're no macros

Pavel

@Zacharý How does it know T is a template type and not a class named T?

Zacharý

It could be either.

That's the beauty

Pavel

uhhh

explain

Anonymous

1:38 AM

> Explicit is better than implicit.

Pavel

Also ^

Zacharý

Well. Template types aren't really a thing that's used often. For std::vector<int>, D has int[]

So it might just assume it's a type/class, but I don't know

D has the makings of a good golfing language gone wrong

Pavel

What does it have for Dictionary<k, v>?

Zacharý

v[k]

If dictionary maps k=>v

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Pavel

1:40 AM

key => value, so yes

Zacharý

Oh. (Qwerp-)Derp

And int a[2][3] could be either int[3][2] a or int a[2][3] in D. And the former opens up some golfing opportunities: int[3][2]a

Pavel

C# has int[2,3]

Zacharý

And functions are types without needing to import anything! (And delegate, I never really know the difference`

@Pavel But C# also has Java-esque boiler-plate

If D added macros and didn't have pointless restrictions for the sake of style, it would be one good language for golfing

Pavel

@Zacharý Good thing we can completely disregard that boilerplate when golfing and submit a function

Zacharý

@Pavel Oh yeah, forgot about that

. instead of :: for namespaces, import instead of #include, string included by default, no semicolons needed after classes/structs, .... But of course, && and || can't be mixed for some reason, you're pretty much forced to use break in a switch statement, type-casts are longer.

D is basically a failed-golf-C++.

Pavel

1:47 AM

@Zacharý In C#, the difference between a delegate and method is that if a class has a method, and you have multiple objects of that class, the instructions for that method are at the same address in memory for all of them. If you use a delegate instead, each new object will allocate the set of instructions on the heap.

D might have a similar thing

Zacharý

If I remember correctly its something w/ scope?

Pavel

@Zacharý *type-casts are actually meaningful, instead of letting you implicitely coerce anything to anything else

Also, no #include for char *

Zacharý

We don't have to end in "\0" :p

Pavel

The \0 is implicit in string literals

Zacharý

And cent is a thing: 128-bit numbers if they ever get implemented.

Pavel

1:50 AM

C# has a 128-bit type called decimal

Zacharý

uint instead of unsigned

128-bit integers.

Oh, I didn't know this until just now: D has arrow notation

Does anyone know how to pronounce the last nameGuerinot? Is it French (I think so, but I'm not sure)

ETHproductions

random guess: "gware-i-no"

(i as in pin)

quartata

@Pavel I don't know what @Zacharý is talking about, you declare it

Zacharý

@Pavel IDK honestly.

quartata

template Foo(T) { void f(T param) { ... } }

About as explicit as it gets

Zacharý

2:11 AM

C#?

Template types? Would that be something like template in D? I don't know

Οurous

@Zacharý I won't be surprised either way, but do you know D and not know any of C#/C/C++?

Adám

@NewMainPosts Ninja'd ¯\_(⍨)_/¯

Zacharý

@Οurous I know enough to get by in C#/C++. I actually mostly code in Python and JavaScript.

I just don't know the specifics of either language really well

Ørjan Johansen

@ETHproductions If it's French, there should be no w. The u there means the g is hard.

ETHproductions

@ØrjanJohansen oh ok, thanks. so more like "gar-i-no" or "gair-i-no"?

Zacharý

2:17 AM

@ØrjanJohansen That's what I thought. As long as I don't call her "Goo-errrr----ayyyyy----nohhhhht"

Ørjan Johansen

gair is probably the closest way to write that in English.

user202729

@NewMetaPosts Can't your messages be more descriptive? (the ~~question~~ announcement title or something) (and avoid onebox too)

Anonymous

@user202729 That's the format that the feeds get posted in. Mods can edit the messages afterwards, but it would be time-consuming to do that for every feed message. Also the oneboxes are a feature.

user202729

At least if it's on the starboard...

Pavel

@Zacharý T func<T>(T a) => foo

user202729

2:21 AM

(it's a known problem that there is no onebox on the starboard)

Zacharý

@quartata What language is this?

Anonymous

@user202729 That's by design

Anonymous

Oneboxes on the starboard would take up an ungoatly amount of room

Zacharý

Congratulations on moderator-hood (?) @DJMcMayhem and @Mego

Anonymous

@Zacharý Thanks :)

user202729

2:24 AM

No more congratulations mod messages please. They flooded the starboard already.

Dennis

Because the stuff that is usually on the starboard is so useful...

user202729

@Dennis ... Ok, it's not.

Anonymous

@Dennis I find the log of the feed bots' consumption of butter especially compelling

user202729

Regarding this , I suggest the OP (Martin) posting an answer and move the arguments from the question there.

Zacharý

I just wanted to do it when they were both present

user202729

2:26 AM

11 hours ago, by NieDzejkob

the question contains arguments itself...

Pavel

@Dennis But frequently quite interesting.

user202729

Anyone VTC this please?

(or correct me)

DJMcMayhem

@Zacharý Thank-ya

Zacharý

ya-welcome

Anonymous

DJMcModhem

5

Zacharý

2:37 AM

I should've seen that one

M(eg)od

Mod+Mod+Mod. 3 mods in one room

What's the REMAINDER of the mods left?
Seriously though, who are the other mods?

ETHproductions

Doorknob is also in here

Martin is not

user202729

Now Alex is no longer considered a mod (starboard ->)

Anonymous

The current PPCG mods (in order of election date, then alphabetical order) are: Doorknob, Martin, Dennis, Alex (for now), DJ, and myself

Zacharý

But is Doorknob active? Or ... nah. No puns, too much risk

user202729

So... we have 5 mods.

Zacharý

2:41 AM

5,5

5.5

ETHproductions

So 4/5.5 mods in the room at the moment

Anonymous

@user202729 Alex still has his diamond. SE hasn't taken it away yet

Zacharý

That' s why he's a 1/2 mod

But that will be modified soon.

:p

Οurous

Alex the 'alf a bee?

Zacharý

Or as the modern greeks call it: iiiiii /s

quartata

2:54 AM

@Zacharý D

Were we talking about something else?

Zacharý

@quartata How did you get D out of that?

I read "'alf a bee" as "alphabee"<="alphabet"

So I mocked the Modern Greek language with its variety of /i/ sounds

Pavel

@Zacharý I think he was replying about your "What language is that" query.

Zacharý

AHHHH. I wasn't thinking the explicit template thing would come up

quartata

Well they were complaining about it being implicit

Zacharý

It's both

quartata

2:58 AM

I guess it wasn't clear it goes inside a template

The other thing is still void f(T)(T t) { ... }

if you prefer that

Zacharý

I prefer the latter, it makes more sense to me: it feels like a type is an implicit or explicit parameter.

quartata

the benefit of explicit templates is that you can then make aliases out of specialized versions even if it's just a function and not a class

although I guess you could do that with a using in C++ too? Not sure...

Zacharý

@quartata Yep.

@quartata Obviously somewhat. C++ has macros

#define V vector<int>

And maybe typedef too

quartata

Oh sure but that's cheating :P

You can do a typedef for classes but not a function

If you have a template on that

Zacharý

I'm just glad D isn't as dead as I first thought it was.

ASCII-only

3:03 AM

@Zacharý He's active, just not here

quartata

but yeah you could do template <typename T> void f(T t) { ... } .... #define specializedF f<int>

Zacharý

Probably just the fact that the TZs don't want to work together

quartata

It would be a nice surprise for anyone working with it though

preprocessor trap

Zacharý

Yep ... IT'S A TRAP

Pavel

@quartata So how does D determine if it's a template type or a class named T?

user202729

3:12 AM

... And now there are 5 4.5 mods here.

Alex A.

Police raid

7

Zacharý

All teh modz

Anonymous

@AlexA. hits the deck

HyperNeutrino

deck hits you right back

Ørjan Johansen

3:35 AM

Seriously, the edits to that natural sort challenge just made it worse.

HyperNeutrino

I agree

lol this site is interesting. sometimes I post an answer and instantly get 5 upvotes. today I just posted 5 answers within half an hour and got 0. nobody understands how voting works :P

user202729

Known issues.

HyperNeutrino

the main problem might be that most of the answers are probably not verifiable because the challenge to which they were posted is closed

ETHproductions

yeah, I don't tend to browse closed challenges

Anonymous

4:10 AM

24t9d72kcs873my15o9hr1pu-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/… (no onebox because it's tall)

Pavel

@Mego I see the C# one, and a simillar one at i.redd.it/ygatitymd5001.jpg, but I just don't get it.

Anonymous

@Pavel The C# one in the one I posted is a reference to how Visual Studio/Roslyn/whatever complains about style usage - it doesn't like it when people don't use CamelCase.

Anonymous

The second comic is more bashing on languages with less basis in objective reality

ASCII-only

@Mego well you can configure it

Pavel

4:34 AM

@ASCII-only Still, if you set the highest warning level, the compiler itself will throw warnings if your naming conventions are wrong. This isn't configurable, you just have to supress the warning.

Downgoat

What should happen in this case: print(UInt(Int(-5)))

ASCII-only

@Pavel *if you enable all warnings

including the ones for naming conventions, which in this case you wouldn't be using

plus, way too many of the warnings are basically useless

@Downgoat error

you can't convert negative int to uint

Downgoat

yeah but runtime error is very high overhead

ASCII-only

@Downgoat yeah well it's better to runtime error than to ignore

Downgoat

I was thinking of just doing like (~(1 << 31)) & n

quartata

4:42 AM

@Downgoat only in the exception case, so who cares

Although the behavior most people would expect is underflow

Pavel

@Downgoat C# has a checked mode. If you have a block marked as checked, math operations inside of it will be checked for integer overflow and cause an error. In unchecked mode, the operation will overflow.

You could do something like that

quartata

Cython also has this

also a jump on overflow is not so bad

if that's what you're concerned about

Pavel

toggl.com/freelance-email-generator

Downgoat

5:00 AM

I was thinking of jump on overflow but I'm not sure on the overhead on using that for every arithmetic expression

perhaps just for debug builds

Pavel

Why not have checked mode?

Downgoat

because imo that's a design cop out

Pavel

Giving the developer more choices isn't a cop-out

Downgoat

you also get a lot of choices in assembly

Pavel

You don't have to specify checked or unchecked. Those are just additional options.

Downgoat

5:04 AM

what's the default?

Pavel

Defaults to unchecked, but the Debug configuration sets the -checked flag.

Downgoat

ok that makes sense

will maybe add an @unchecked annotation

Pavel

I just finally got around to setting visual studio to dark theme

It's so nice

Pavel

5:34 AM

csharp> 1/0
(1,2): error CS0020: Division by constant zero
csharp> var a = 1
csharp> a/0
System.DivideByZeroException: Attempted to divide by zero.
  at <InteractiveExpressionClass>.Host (System.Object& $retval) [0x00000] in <d5b19e6974334b03bc7f0b28ff331027>:0
  at Mono.CSharp.Evaluator.Evaluate (System.String input, System.Object& result, System.Boolean& result_set) [0x00038] in <3229a1e52ca447dba8e01e11d8e65893>:0
  at Mono.CSharpShell.Evaluate (System.String input) [0x00000] in <eb86265ea9984342a932021c0489eb9d>:0

goddammit C#

New Main Posts

5:54 AM

0

Q: Shell Glob Golfing

This task is to output the shortest path to a file, after glob expansion. What is shell globbing? In most shells, you can use the * character in a path to represent any characters at the position. For example, If directory foo contains files bar baz and asdf, then foo/b* will expand to foo/bar f...

code-golf string file-system

user202729

@Pavel Oh yes, can there be hidden files not starting with .?

Pavel

@user202729 No hidden files or dotfiles, that sounds pretty clear to me.

user202729

Sorry, I read it as "no hidden files with filenames starting with .."

... wait a minute. That's a wrong assumption (in both Windows and Linux), and you can deduce anything from False.

quartata

@Downgoat it's really not. You have to choose between performance and safety in this case, offer both

@Mego @DJMcMayhem want to destroy your first user?

2

user202729

What's wrong with unregistered?

Pavel

6:00 AM

@user202729 Look at their answers

@user202729 I'm not understanding your problem

user202729

... Oh, I was looking at the question tab.

quartata

Don't forget to suspend first, then destroy

Pavel

Why's that?

user202729

Jan 27 at 3:02, by Dennis

In any case, you should use flags to get our attention, not chat pings.

quartata

disables account creation

@user202729 everyone and their dog has already flagged it R/A, I was just having some fun

although to be fair one needs a post to flag...

user202729

6:04 AM

Therefore you can't flag someone for weird avatar image.

quartata

Kinda bugs me I have to say this every time: don't use DVs on spam or R/A

if you had flagged as R/A it would be gone by now

6 flags deletes the post

it has 5 currently

Pavel

They're gone

quartata

Only 1 is

Other is still alive at -9 after 30 minutes

now it's gone

Pavel

Caching? Both were gone before I posted

user202729

(DV is delete vote in this case, not downvote)

I suggest using VTD.

quartata

6:17 AM

No. Don't.

Pavel

Vote to Down :P

quartata

You will piss off a lot of mods and Charcoalers that way. Red flags deal heavier punishments, trigger SpamRam, and take the same amount if the post was autoflagged

user202729

I meant I suggest using VTD instead of DV for VoteToDelete.

quartata

oh, sorry

yeah you're right

too late to edit

user202729

(meta here)

Martin Ender

7:47 AM

@user202729 I don't actually feel strongly about any of the options.

@user202729 did I actually say you could save half the program? (Can't easily dig up the bounty post on mobile.) I wouldn't think so, but I'd expect that the potential savings grow as the program does. Even the template itself is 7 bytes long.

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