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2:10 AM
What to do with $e^x(\cos y + i \sin y)=e^{-x}(\cos (-y) + i \sin (-y))$?
 
@NaCl what do you want to do?
 
@DHMO I want to solve that equation
 
so $e^{x+iy}=e^{-x-iy}$
 
@NaCl well, use Euler's formula
 
just write $e^{2z}=1$ so $2z$ is an integer multiple of $2\pi i$
 
2:12 AM
...what?
 
@NaCl Euler's formula: $\Huge e^{\color{purple}i\color{green}\theta} \equiv \cos(\color{green}\theta)+\color{purple}i\sin(\color{green}\theta)$
 
The stuff in parens on the LHS is equal to $e^{iy}$
And the RHS, $e^{i(-y)}$
 
@DHMO I'm more confused about @arctictern $e^{2z}=1$
 
@NaCl that is $z=x+iy$
 
@NaCl $e^z = e^{-z}$ is equivalent to $e^{2z}=1$
 
2:16 AM
yeah multiply each side by $e^z$ and apply power rules
 
@robjohn hi!
 
oh, I see. $\frac{e^z}{e^{-z}}=\frac{e^z}{\frac{1}{e^z}}=e^z \cdot e^z=e^{2z}=1$
 
@NaCl yep
be aware that $e^z$ and $\ln(z)$ for $z\in\Bbb C$ are multifunctions
 
e^z is not multivalued
 
@arctictern it is
 
2:20 AM
So I basically have to solve $\cos 2y+i\sin 2y=0$
 
@NaCl nope
 
@DHMO no, it isn't
 
@NaCl it should be $e^{2x}(\cos 2y+i\sin 2y)=1$
@arctictern yes, it is
 
oh, yeah
And how'd you that!?
 
@DHMO no, exp(z) has one and only one value for every possible complex number z. perhaps you're thinking about exp(z) not being a one-to-one function (i.e. there are different complex numbers z,w for which exp(z)=exp(w)).
 
2:23 AM
$e^x(\cos y+i\sin y)=e^{-x}(\cos(-y)+i\sin(-y))$
$e^x(\cos y+i\sin y)=e^{-x}(\cos(y)+i\sin(y))^{-1}$
$e^{2x}(\cos y+i\sin y)^2=1$
$e^{2x}(\cos 2y+i\sin 2y)=1$
In mathematics, de Moivre's formula (also known as de Moivre's theorem and de Moivre's identity), named after Abraham de Moivre, states that for any complex number (and, in particular, for any real number) x and integer n it holds that ( cos ⁡ ( x ) + i sin ⁡ ( x ) ) n = cos ⁡ ( n ...
@arctictern you are right. I was thinking about the multifunction $z^w$
@NaCl or you can just convert $\cos y+i\sin y$ to $e^{iy}$
 
@DHMO hey there. How are things going?
 
@robjohn fine
 
@DHMO I meant, how do you actually get $x$ and $y$ now?
 
@NaCl so we have $e^{2(x+iy)}=1$ as indicated before
 
yes
 
2:25 AM
let's convert it to $e^{2z}=1$
 
$x=0$ and $y=0$ is obvious, but I doubt thats the only solution
 
Are you familiar with Argand diagram?
 
No
 
people also call it Argand plane
 
@Kaj: So glad to see you. Let me know if you'd like to talk sometime!
 
2:27 AM
(it also extends to the other quadrants)
 
Hey @Ted
Life's been pretty rough recently
 
hi @TedShifrin finished reviewing linear algebra
 
So $e^{(2(r\sin\phi+i r\cos\phi))}=1$
 
and stared reading your chapter on projective geometry
 
I worried when you disappeared and didn't answer my FB message. Seriously, let me know if I can help in any way, @Kaj.
Ok, meow ... :)
 
2:28 AM
@NaCl yes
so $e^{(2r)\sin\phi+i(2r)\cos\phi}=1$
radius = $2r$, angle = $\phi$
 
So it should reduce to $\sin\phi=-\cos\phi$
 
no....
 
Why not?
 
why would it?
maybe you could let me finish
I could also introduce many approaches for you
 
@DHMO to make $e^\text{something}=1$
 
2:30 AM
That means a lot though @Ted. My sincere apologies for being distant. I've been trying to get back into things on here posting and whatnot.
 
@TedShifrin so an affine subspace of $\mathbb{R}^n$ is just a "linear" object, like a plane, line, point, cube, etc. etc. which need not contain the zero vector?
 
@NaCl you forgot the $i$, and can I finish?
 
...ok
 
thank you
so $e^{(2r)\sin\phi+i(2r)\cos\phi}=1$
radius = $2r$, angle = $\phi$
 
No apology needed, Kaj. I just want you to know I'm in your corner :)
 
2:31 AM
and we know that $1$ is at $(1,0)$ (in polar notation)
meaning radius = 1, angle = 0
 
uh yes
 
(any multiple of $2\pi$ can be added to the angle also)
 
that is, the solution to a linear system of $k \leq n$ variables
 
so $2r=1$ and $\phi=2n\pi$
 
that doesnt have to be homogeneous
or am i wrong
 
2:33 AM
Right, meow. Basically, an affine space is a vector space with no origin.
 
and an affine motion is kind of like a linear transformation, except that it "translates" elements of the vector space?
 
Right ...
There's no origin to preserve.
 
ok :)
 
@NaCl right, let me start again
we have $e^{2z}=1$
$e^{2z}=1\times e^{2ni\pi}$
We express $1$ as polar form $re^{i\theta}$, where $r=1$ and $\theta=2n\pi$ as stated above
therefore $2z=2ni\pi$ and $z=ni\pi$
problem?
 
I'm impressed
 
2:38 AM
@NaCl now onto the second approach, ok?
 
ok
 
so we have $e^{2x}(\cos 2y+i\sin 2y)=1$
 
"This guy looks like a serious player" a comment on one of your Ramsey Theory lecture videos - @KajHansen
 
LOL @meow-mix
 
$(e^{2x}\cos2y)+i(e^{2x}\sin2y)=1+0i$
$\begin{cases}e^{2x}\cos2y&=&1\\e^{2x}\sin2y&=&0\end{cases}$
 
2:41 AM
Kaj did a good job :)
 
since $e^{2x}$ cannot be $0$, we have $\sin2y=0$
 
I wish I'd produced a few more of those. I wasn't done, but got bogged down in coursework at the time.
 
$2y=2n\pi$, $y=n\pi$
 
oh so you may seperate imaginary and real parts
 
$\cos2y=1$, $e^{2x}=1$, $x=0$.
@NaCl yes, provided that $x,y\in\Bbb R$
 
2:42 AM
And got distracted with other stuff. They were time-consuming to plan and produce. Always done in one take.
 
i love teaching people
 
That is handy
 
You can't blame me that time, Kaj :)
 
Nope, the blame shifted to others in the department
 
i want to teach people for a living
 
2:42 AM
I'd hate to be universally guilty :)
 
@NaCl now onto the third approach
ok?
 
there is more?
 
@meow-mix, I'd really enjoy that as well. One of my "dream jobs" is to teach high schoolers math the way I think it should be taught. There are all sorts of problems with intro math education.
 
@TedShifrin watched some of your LA lectures. your handwriting is superb :)
 
@NaCl there are 300 proofs of the Pythagorean theorem
 
2:44 AM
Unfortunately, I'm very turned off by the huge bureaucracy of the whole thing.
 
wtf
 
I hope there's more use than that, @meow.
 
of course
lol
 
Kaj, I'm working with young kids who spend hours adding on their fingers instead of thinking about what the new concepts are. Very depressing.
 
I'd want autonomy that's just plain unattainable the way K-12 education is set up in the country right now :/
That's really cool @Ted. Details?
 
2:45 AM
@NaCl ok?
 
ok
 
Common core is good, but I'm fighting helpers in the library and parents who can only do the old algorithms and din't understand adding/subtracting by regrouping or compensating. But when the kids can't do basic arithmetic, it's all sorta pointless.
 
why is mixed fraction notation still a thing???
 
so, the complex log definition is:
Let $z=r e^{i\theta}$.
Then $\ln(z)=\ln(r)+i\theta+2ni\pi$
therefore $\ln(1)=\ln(1)+i(0)+2ni\pi=2ni\pi$
$e^{2z}=1 \iff 2z=2ni\pi \iff z=ni\pi$
$\blacksquare$
 
Mixed fractions are ok @meow-mix. It's a lot easier to visualize "27 and one-fourth" on the fly than it is to visualize "109 fourths"
 
2:48 AM
@NaCl problem?
 
Esp. for practical purposes. I'd use a mixed fraction to tell a hardware store employee how many 2x4's I need, e.g.
 
@DHMO No, that was the shortest way, I guess
 
Autonomy is a mixed bag when most teachers might choose to do only one quarter of what's needed.
 
heh
 
Gnight Mike.
 
2:50 AM
Yeah, I could see that being a problem @Ted
 
Plus, Kaj, you'd teach as if all the students were as motivated/talented as you :)
 
@DHMO Thank you so much
 
you are welcome
 
In some sense, I think my "dream" is taking that for granted, lol
 
It be very wrong ...
 
2:52 AM
I don't know how successful I'd be at motivating the unmotivated
 
My success definitely diminished the last years ...
 
Are you familiar with GHP @Ted ?
 
Yes, but not personally.
 
I could see myself enjoying working with GHP'ers
 
Sure.
 
2:54 AM
I heard you taught topology from a distance last year?
 
LOL, 2 great students, yeah.
Writing for 'em for grad school, of course.
We got through a bunch of beginning alg top, too.
But now I'm truly retired :)
 
I'm surprised you elected for topology. What'd you focus on? IIRC, you aren't the biggest fan of all the separation axioms and such. Finding obscure counterexamples, etc.
A smallish fraction of Pete's class felt like re-writing Steen & Seebach :P
 
Not so ridiculous, no. They wanted topology cuz the class was canceled. And they were good enough that we went very fast. They did some Munkres exercises no student had ever done before with me.
Remember I'm more geometric, after all :)
 
Indeed!
Someday, I'll get around to writing "Geometry: An Algebraic Approach"
 
So Glad to see you. LOL ... Send me a catch-up email sometime!
There is plenty of algebra in advanced dff geo :)
 
3:00 AM
Will do @Ted
 
@DHMO The solution seems to be wrong... Isn't $\cos z=\frac{1}{2}\cdot(e^x(\cos y+i\sin y)-e^{-x}(\cos(-y)+i\sin(-y))=0$
$\Leftrightarrow e^x(\cos y+i\sin y)-e^{-x}(\cos(-y)+i\sin(-y)=0$
$\Leftrightarrow e^x(\cos y+i\sin y)=e^{-x}(\cos(-y)+i\sin(-y))$
$\Leftrightarrow e^z=e^{-z}$?
 
$e^{z}=e^{-z}$
$\iff e^{2z}=1$
 
Yes, and thus we get $x=0$ and $y=n\pi$
 
yes
so we are in agreement
 
But $n=0$ would give $\cos(0+0i)=0$
 
3:04 AM
no, $\cos(0+0i)=1$
 
Yes, thats the contradiction
 
where is the contradiction?
 
I start with $\cos z=0$
Since $z=0+0i$ gives 1 for $cos(0+0i)$ that can't be a solution
 
why would you start with $\cos z=0$?
 
...I see my error
Thanks
I said $\cos z=\frac{1}{2}(e^z-e^{-z})$, which isn't true
 
3:10 AM
@NaCl right, $\cos z = \dfrac12(e^{iz}+e^{-iz})$
 
Yep (sadly)
 
@NaCl: You had hyperbolic sin.
 
@TedShifrin I got the definition of it, yes, but we did not talk more about it
 
hi @TedShifrin
 
@NaCl: I meant the formula you just wrote.
hi Karim.
 
3:15 AM
...what?
oh
$\sinh z=\frac{1}{2}(e^z-e^{-z})$?
 
Yes.
 
okay :D
 
@TedShifrin what does the following notation in your book mean: $\lambda\; \mathrm{Id}$?
 
$\lambda$ times the identity matrix
 
oh
that makes sense :P
 
3:17 AM
@TedShifrin last day we were talking about tensor products in differential geometry
 
Sorry :)
 
we are getting to differential forms
 
Finally :)
 
testing $\mathrm{Id} \ \operatorname{Id}$
 
@TedShifrin somebody sent a complaint to department head now prof is preparing for lectures and everything is clear now
 
3:17 AM
wow, the former is so much easier
I've been killing my fingers with \operatorname for so long
 
@Kaj: even \text is easier :)
 
I hate prof who are lazy
 
You hate me, Karim?
 
Is there any difference at all between the three? Even with spacing?
 
Presumably operatorname spaces appropriately,
 
3:19 AM
no @TedShifrin just prof who don't prepare for class and just come unprepared and lecture badly.
@TedShifrin your lecture were very well organized
 
That's cuz I knew what I was doing. Still lazy :)
 
haha
 
@Kaj, if you're curious, I can send you the topology exams. There were some good questions.
 
I would be actually @Ted. I enjoyed topology a good bit; that'd be a good refresher I'm sure
 
$\cos z=0\Leftrightarrow e^{iz}-e^{-iz}=0\Leftrightarrow e^{2iz}=1$, right? @DHMO
 
3:24 AM
khansen3@uga.edu
 
Ah, ok.
 
@TedShifrin you know as I am reading now allufi it is actually one of my favorite books with yours as well.
 
I have never looked at Aluffi. Glad you're learning well.
 
$e^{2i(x+iy)}=e^{2ix-2y}=e^{-2y}(\cos 2x + i\sin 2x)=1$
 
@Kaj: sent
 
3:27 AM
Thanks!
 
But that leads again to $n\pi$, just that $x=n\pi$ now and not $y$
 
@NaCl you have confused $\cos$ again
$\cos z = \dfrac{e^{iz}{\Huge\color{purple}+}e^{-iz}}2$
 
"-.-
thank you
 
LOL @huge purple
 
I wish I'd be less error-prone
$z=n\pi-\frac{\pi}{2}$ finally
 
3:43 AM
so, matrix multiplication is kind of like "composition" of linear transformations?
 
I just learned about young diagram
 
@NaCl we are trying to solve $\cos z=0$?
 
they are cool way to organize a partition.
yeah @meow-mix
 
@DHMO I did solve it now thanks to your great help
 
a matrix correspond to a linear transformation
 
3:44 AM
@NaCl nice
 
so multiplication of matrices corresponds to composition of linear transformation.
 
And for $\cosh$ it's $\frac{3\pi n}{2}i$
Thank you very much @DHMO, really! :)
 
@NaCl you mean $\cosh z=0$?
 
yep
i checked using wolframalpha :D
 
ok
 
3:54 AM
Hello!!
I want to calculate the limsup and liminf for the sequence $a_n=(-1)^{\frac{n(n+1)}{2}\sqrt[n]{1+\frac{1}{n}}$.
I tried to find the lim a_{2k} and lim a_{2k-1} but I find anything... Could you give me a hint?
 
$a_n=(-1)^{\frac{n(n+1)}{2}\sqrt[n]{1+\frac{1}{n}}}$
@MaryStar what is the domain of $a_n$?
 
so the projective group $\mathrm{Proj}(1)$ is a set of equivalence classes over the general linear group $\mathrm{GL}(2,\mathbb{R})$ whose equivalence class is "can be transformed from one to the other via only scalar multiplication"?
am i right?
 
@MaryStar the thing is $\sqrt[n]{1+\dfrac1n}$ is not an integer, so $a_n$ is complex, and how do you find limsup and liminf for complex sequence?
 
@DHMO Why is this not an integer?
 
@MaryStar e.g. when $n=2$, it becomes $\sqrt{\dfrac32}$
which is obviously not an integer
 
4:00 AM
@meow: The point is that $A$ and $5A$ give the same action on $\Bbb P^1$. BTW, you need to work lots of exercises.
 
@DHMO But this is real, or not?
 
@MaryStar this is real
but $-1$ is negative
negative to real is complex
(unless integer)
 
@TedShifrin yes, i know. its just late, im tired, and i just want to skim through it
 
i suspect there's a typo in MaryStar's. Not everything in the exponent.
 
@TedShifrin you say elements of $\mathrm{Proj}(1)$ are transformations, but aren't they equivalence classes?
 
4:04 AM
@MaryStar what is your original question?
 
Yes, but everything in an equiv class acts identically, so we call them all one transformation.
 
$(-1)^{n(n+1)/2}$ has a period of $4$ by the way
 
i really need to take notes on this, but i cba this late
 
Look ahead to some of the neat theorems, meow.
 
LOL i really think the name "meow-mix" removes any seriousness from our conversation
its as if you just meowed at the end of the sentence
i'll change that right now.
 
4:10 AM
@DHMO And how can we find the limsup and liminf of a complex sequence?
 
Makes no sense, Mary.
 
@MaryStar that was a rhetorical question, meaning we cannot
Are you sure that your problem is typeset correctly?
 
LOL @meow ... I think the name is fine.
 
alrighty then, whatever you say :)
 
How to partition $\Bbb R$ into two disjoint everywhere-dense sets?
 
4:11 AM
I think only $n(n+1)/2$ is the exponent.
Easy, DHMO.
 
@TedShifrin for example?
oh, I forgot to mention uncountable
 
Start with $\Bbb Q$.
Oh.
 
Is $e^e$ an integer?
 
@DHMO
 
@MaryStar thanks for clarifying
so $a_n = \left((-1)^{\frac{n(n+1)}2}\right)\cdot\sqrt[n]{1+\dfrac1n}$
 
4:20 AM
@Ted thanks again for the book, i really appreciate it :)
 
@MaryStar do you know the limsup and liminf of $b_n=\sqrt[n]{1+\dfrac1n}$?
 
@DHMO you can partition reals according to the asymptotics of the number of 0s and 1s in their binary expansions. since we're talking asymptotics, both parts will include a real with any given initial segment of binary digits.
 
@arctictern I don't understand
 
for instance, one part could be reals where ratio of 0s to 1s converges to 1/2, and the other part is the complement
 
@arctictern why is that set uncountable?
 
4:23 AM
one can e.g. pick an arbitrary sequence of 01s and 10s, which is infinitely many choices between two options
 
and why are they dense?
 
@DHMO The limit is 1, or not? So, limsup=liminf=1, right?
 
> both parts will include a real with any given initial segment of binary digits.
 
Hi tern
 
hello
 
4:25 AM
@MaryStar then what about $a_n$?
can you explore the values of $c_n=(-1)^{n(n+1)/2}$?
 
What up peeps
2
 
Sure @meow
 
A set being a vector subspace of $\mathbb R^4$ with dim=2 the same as it being a generator of $\mathbb R^2$?
 
@arctictern oh, thanks
 
@BernardMeurer what does "being a generator of R^2" mean?
 
4:29 AM
^
 
@arctictern Hmm, maybe I'm translaring the term wrong. It means that the linear expansion of the set forms $\mathbb R^2$
 
@arctictern so $\lim\limits_{n\to\infty}\dfrac{2^n-1}{2^{2n}-1}=0$
 
@BernardMeurer do you mean it spans $\mathbb{R}^2$?
 
@DHMO We cannot, right? That'e why we cannot compute the limsup and liminf?
 
@BernardMeurer it means there will be a basis consisting of two vectors of which every other element is a unique linear combination
 
4:31 AM
@meow-mix Maybe
 
@MaryStar we can. it has a period 4
 
@BernardMeurer in that case
 
R^2 consists of 2-tuples whereas R^4 consits of 4-tuples, so technically there is no element of R^4 that is an element of R^2. unless you identify R^2 with the set of 4-tuples which have last two coordinates 0, but then a 2-dimensional subspace of R^4 may not be related at all to this copy of R^2 existing within R^4
 
@meow-mix Yes, spans is the term I was looking for I believe :)
 
being a subspace of dimension 2 does not imply its $\mathbb{R}^2$
for example
the subspace whose basis is $\mathbf{e}_2$ and $\mathbf{e}_3$
is a dimension 2 subspace of $\mathbb{R}^4$, but isnt equal to $\mathbb{R}^2$
 
4:33 AM
@meow-mix The linear expansion of that will from a plane on $\mathbb R^4$, thus it will span $\mathbb R^2$, right?
 
well aplane on $\mathbb{R}^4$ isnt always $\Bbb R^2$
 
@arctictern I meant span, sorry for bad terminology :)
 
There are many 2-dimensional subspaces of $\Bbb R^4$.
 
let's consider R^3 instead. you realize there is more than one plane existing in 3D right? they can't all be called R^2, only at most one of them can, in which case the other planes are not called R^2.
also, we say linear combination instead of expansion
 
anyways
i'm tired
 
4:37 AM
@arctictern there are infinitely many planes in $\mathbb R^3$, no?
 
good night
 
@meow-mix See ya later
 
Je suis revenu
 
@BernardMeurer that's what I said, there are infinitely many planes in R^3
 
Night meow!
 
4:38 AM
I just don't see how a plane on $\mathbb R^4$ is not isomorphic to $\mathbb R^2$
 
Re-bonsoir, Kaj!
 
it is isomorphic to R^2, that doesn't mean it's called R^2
 
@arctictern I didn't say it's called $\mathbb R^2$ I said it spanned it
 
it doesn't span R^2
 
wat
How can it be isomorphic and not span it?
O.o
 
4:40 AM
Take meow's example. The span of {(0,1,0,0),(0,0,1,0)} is the set of all vectors of the form (0,a,b,0). But every element of R^2 is of the form (a,b). Or, if you identify R^2 with a subspace of R^4 in the usual way, R^2 refers to the vectors of the form (a,b,0,0). Therefore, the span of {(0,1,0,0),(0,0,1,0)} does not equal R^2, i.e. {(0,1,0,0),(0,0,1,0)} does not span R^2.
 
hey @arctictern
 
hey
 
Can we discuss quickly why $A_nZ_{S_n}(\sigma) = S_n$ ?
why $A_n$ has index 2 implies that ?
 
If $Z$ is not a subset of $A_n$ then $Z$ contains an odd element and the identity so $A_n Z$ contains both right cosets of $A_n$
 
oh I see
yeah ok that makes sense we get the two different right coset which generate whole $S_n$
 
4:48 AM
we get the two right cosets
(which are the same subsets as the two left cosets)
 
okay cool.
that is a cool proof.
 
5:06 AM
Nanananananana batman
Yay, alternating groups!
 
Yay indeed. They're so simple.
 
 
2 hours later…
6:52 AM
@DHMO @NaCl hi
 
sup
 
What kind of mathematical relation are we using?@NaCl
 
if 10 apples fit in one grocery bag, then 20 apples fit in two grocery bags
 
Alright,thanks
 
"Cross-multiplication" should fit as well
 
7:03 AM
"if one mole of @NaCl is dissolved in one mole of @DHMO"
 
@DHMO any mathematicial relation or just what arctin said
 
i'm just messing around
 
I lol'd
 
Anyone know how to add link in profile?in about me
I figured out myself ^
 
7:27 AM
@NaCl still awake?
 
Yeah
 
haha, i slept. felt good
 
is $\zeta(x)-\frac{1}{1-x}$ holomorphic everywhere? I proved $\lim_{x\to 1^+}\left(\zeta(x)-\frac{1}{1-x}\right)=\gamma$, and if that is true for x as a complex variable then the singularity should be removable
 
@arctictern if it takes 5 minutes to cook an egg, how long does it take to cook 6 eggs?
 
I cook my eggs in parallel
 
7:31 AM
^
meh, i'm not allowed to smoke. can't yet say if i miss it :/
 
@Null after all it depends
@Null 5 minutes if you have six different boiler
 
yeah just mentioned it to point out that the rule of 3 doesn't always make perfect sense.
 
7:49 AM
@Sophie That's correct.
 
that's cool
 

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