English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

user19161

12:01 AM

@Cerberus Boo! I did not know they have holy water in Hades.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

2:23 AM

wow it's quiet in here

Cerberus

2:37 AM

Look who's talking.

Robusto

3:26 AM

►

Nice save, Pat!

Robusto

3:53 AM

0

Q: What does " Dark Emotions" means?

I have read a poem . In this poem , I am not very sure the meaning of "Dark Emotions" . The poet have written like that - "Dark Emotions were torn ever so deep". Please help me .

meaning

I'm afraid there is no help for you. Sorry.

Cerberus

@Robusto Who wouldn't have said n?

I mean, come on.

Robusto

@Cerberus That has to be a fake. But a funny one.

Cerberus

Well, why fake?

I know it is a taboo word in America, but it must lie on the tip of everyone's tongue.

Robusto

I mean, it's the kind of thing that would never have seen air in the U.S.

Cerberus

No? Why not? If he actually said "n"?

Robusto

4:00 AM

Trust me, it would never have been aired.

Cerberus

You wouldn't believe the countless obscene and racist things people say in similar Dutch shows.

There are huge compilations on YT.

Robusto

Well, yeah, but they also have nude hookers in the windows in the red light district in Cheeseland too.

Cerberus

►

You know the last word they say.

Even though he pronounces it in a way that is incomprehensible to me.

Robusto

They allowed the word? What was the discussion about?

Cerberus

They were discussing whether it was in the dictionary, and the "jury" had to explain what it was in a way suitable for children. Then it was allowed.

But this would probably pass in America as well?

Robusto

4:08 AM

@Cerberus Really? And what kind of cumshots, pray tell, are "suitable for children"?

@Cerberus Maybe on a cable show. Not on network TV.

Cerberus

"A climax in a film for adults", something like that.

OK, this was public television.

Robusto

Well, bedtime. CU.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

4:45 AM

@Cerberus Yeah Americans are squeamish about language on TV. And nudity. But violence is never a problem.

Cerberus

Hmm I wonder why.

How is that in C?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus Less squeamish about language and nudity, more squeamish about violence. But there are so few Canadian gameshows that I can't say for sure what would happen if the contestants used words like cumshot or nigger.

Cerberus

Haha too bad.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus Because America is descended from Puritans.

Cerberus

And Canada isn't?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

4:54 AM

@Cerberus no, not really.

Cerberus

I don't know much about the first Canadian settlers.

OK, that explains something.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I'm over-stating things, of course, as is my duty as a Canadian discussing American shortcomings. But I wonder sometimes how much of the puritan heritage still remains.

However overall, American attitudes towards sex and nudity are relatively lax compared to European attitudes. Example: nude beaches are rare.

Cerberus

Huh?

They are rare because everybody is naked at American beaches?

Theseus! And Icarus!

I presume.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus No, because nobody is naked

@Cerberus yes (or maybe Daedalus)

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Then how is that lax? I don't get it.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

5:01 AM

@Cerberus whoops lax is the opposite of what I meant

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 They are working together.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Ah, I feared it was one of your absurd positions, hehe.

So I asked questions to determine your exact meaning.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus My positions are never absurd. My typing is occasionally wrong. :p

Cerberus

no comment!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I guess Theseus is the guy in the bottom, with the shield? I didn't notice him at first

Cerberus

But it is already an hour over my intended bed time.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yes, he killed the Minotaur.

On Crete, in the Kingdom of Minos.

Who also held Daedalus prisoner, because he was just a great inventor and engineer.

D. had also built the labyrinth, I believe.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

5:05 AM

More pics at at this link flickr.com/photos/74louloute/6836512419/in/photostream

Cerberus

But he wanted to escape from the island and take his son with him, so he made wings.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Daedalus built the labyrinth, right? Wasn't he exiled there because he killed someone on the mainland?

Cerberus

I don't think so.

No, he was just held prisoner.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Oh, and btw, the Greek myths are full of the strangest sex I've ever heard of. Like Zeus turning himself into a bull and then getting a woman pregnant. Or Theseus being the son of TWO gods because his mother had sex with both of them.

hm wikipedia contradicts my minotaur origin story memory. And my "daedalus was exiled" memory.

Unfortunately I no longer have my old book of Greek myths to blame.

Cerberus

Hmm you're right, there is also a story about Daedalus' being banished from Athens. But that is not why he was on Crete: Minos didn't want him to leave because he could betray the secret of the labyrinth.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Not to mention the fact that Minos had a statue of a bull constructed so that his wife could mate with it.

Because she was so cursed by Zeus.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

5:13 AM

So following the links in Wikepedia suggests that there ARE versions of the story where Zeus is the Minotaur's dad, but that those legends may be later retellings of the older legend where the Minotaur's mom was hypnotized into having sex with a regular bull.

either way: W T F.

I guess her Facebook "relationship status" would be "It's complicated."

Cerberus

Oh, wait, he built a cow, in which Pasiphaë would then supposedly take place to mate with the bull?

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yeah of most myths there were several versions.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

> To punish Minos, Aphrodite made Pasiphaë, Minos' wife, fall deeply in love with the bull from the sea, the Cretan Bull. Pasiphaë had the archetypal craftsman Daedalus make a hollow wooden cow, and climbed inside it in order to copulate with the white bull.

Cerberus

Exactly.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

> The myth of Poseidon sending the bull (which seduced Minos' wife) may simply be an earlier version of the myth of Zeus seducing Europa

Cerberus

Now I think this bit defeats pretty much all other weird sex scenes in mythology.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

5:16 AM

It was nice of Aphrodite to punish MINOS by tricking his WIFE into having sex with an animal.

Cerberus

Well, I'm sure Minos didn't like it.

Would you?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Well, no, but why did A- have to be so mean to Pasiphae? It wasn't HER fault, but she had her free-will taken away and was made to have sex with an animal.

Cerberus

Well, she was under Minos' command.

The Gods rarely care about people that they do not have a special affection for. They are little more than animals.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Yeah... well, it's all a bit weird.

and I must be off to bed. It's frickin' late.

cya later

(hi @simchona bye @simchona)

Cerberus

Bai!

I'm off too.

Hi@Sim!

I should reaaaaly go to bed, later!

Matt Эллен

10:20 AM

Cheese and pickle sandwich, sweet
it was last night when we first met
right then I wanted you to eat
but for lunch you shall be et.

"Please don't!" I hear your mortal cry
but sandwich, dear, you know the deal.
Your life is short, I cannot lie
your only function: my next meal.

Oh honourable sandwich true!
Your form it is a pure delight.
There is none tastier than you,
so please don't put up a fight.

With you devoured my work is done
I relished our final moments
You are gone but for your crumbs

2

@kit ^^^

user19161

10:39 AM

@MattЭллен Nice poem!

Matt Эллен

thanks :)

Matt Эллен

11:02 AM

I agree with FumbleFingers, this is GR

0

Q: The Bible, the Bible, or the bible?

Just to be clear I am referring to the Christian holy book. Which one of The Bible, the Bible, or the bible is most appropriate in the following sentence: "He invokes __ in the very last section of his book".

capitalization proper-nouns

user19161

@Cerberus Humans might be better than gods, just like animals are sometimes better than humans.

user19161

@MattЭллен I think there is subtlety there. It might be permissible not to capitalize it.

Matt Эллен

not when talking about the specific bible in the question

user19161

@MattЭллен I know, that is what I am thinking.

user19161

If one is referring to the religious text, it is usually Bible. If one is referring to any one of millions of copies of it, it is bible.

Matt Эллен

11:09 AM

unless you're JSBangs, in which case I don't think he capitalises anything

user19161

Having said that, because the Bible is everywhere, it has become so common that perhaps even in the first case we can use bible. I am not sure.

user19161

In any case the second sense is close to the first and is definitely written as bible.

user19161

So I will remain silent on this question.

user19161

But certainly hell is often not capitalized. Even in the bibles it is usually not capitalized which is why I was upset when I got many downvotes for saying so.

user19161

10

Q: Should “Hell” be capitalized?

I am of the belief that Hell should be capitalized because real or not, it is the name of a place, and thus a proper noun. It should be capitalized correct? I have seen it written without capitalization plenty of times, but I suspect that most of those were just due to laziness or illiteracy (it...

capitalization proper-nouns

user19161

11:13 AM

If you don't believe me go check your bibles.

Matt Эллен

I prefer bibbles

they sound nicer

user19161

You can check NIV, ESV, NASV, NASB, KJV and then come back to downvote me, downvoters! shakes fist

user19161

Also check the texts of other religions if you want. shakes fist again

user19161

Now I am thinking, should Unicorn be capitalized. They might be everywhere, but only those who Believe can see them, it's true.

Matt Эллен

if you don't capitalise Unicorn, they might stab you

user19161

11:21 AM

Now I am thinking what Robusto was thinking when he mentioned farting.

Matt Эллен

if you bring up farting, you're not getting laid? I don't see how that's relevant.

user19161

Especially when there might be farting while getting laid.

user19161

So you can fart during or after but not before.

user19161

OK i have just edited hell answer to add a link. Now let the flame wars begin.

user19161

I have made 9 edits, one more and it will become wiki mode.

Matt Эллен

11:32 AM

I find that an annoying constraint

just because an answer gets a lot of edits, it shouldn't have to be wiki'd

user19161

It is to prevent people from bumping to gain points.

Matt Эллен

there is that, but such trivial edits should be blocked from bumps in the first place

user19161

But what is trivial or nontrivial? That is the question.

user19161

And even if it is bumped people cannot vote for the same post twice, so actually it is not unfair.

user19161

So really there is no problem with bumping.

Matt Эллен

11:35 AM

yeah, but it will bump down newer stuff from the front page, so draw visitors' attention away

user19161

Note that when I checked CALD, it says hell also Hell, and bible usually Bible, so it seems both are permissible. But usually is different from also, so I won't answer the bible question even though I linked to it in hell answer.

user19161

@MattЭллен They can always go to questions, new.

Matt Эллен

@JasperLoy but that's not the landing page - it's not what they can do, it's when they're initially presented with that causes the problem

user19161

@MattЭллен Packaging is the issue as discussed yesterday!

Matt Эллен

@JasperLoy not exactly...

but that argument got boring fast, so there's no point going back!

user19161

11:39 AM

@MattЭллен There should be a new tab for new posts, that is new answers will bump but not editing answers.

user19161

I am prepared to be downvoted on Hell question, after all it is Hell!

user19161

It is quite fun to watch the flame wars begin again!

Matt Эллен

har har. flame wars over hell

user19161

Oh John Lawler is a retired linguistics prof, no wonder his answers are usually very deep.

user19161

2

Q: What does the phrase "none too dissimilar" mean?

I have heard the phrase none too dissimilar used many times. Based on context, it seems to mean similar, or perhaps very similar. Does none too dissimilar have a different meaning that I am missing? Example: The book and the movie were none too dissimilar.

meaning phrases common-expressions

user19161

11:47 AM

For example this one in which he even brings in logical symbols. Of course we use similar ones in mathematical logic.

user19161

Actually, mathematical logic is rather similar to computer science or linguistics or philosophy logic.

user19161

They are all logical after all.

Matt Эллен

hmm, but he is wrong. it is clear what is meant by "none too dissimilar"

all his words mean nothing if he can't grasp that

user19161

Well, I did not think about that answer. But that one certainly looked deep.

user19161

It looked so deep that I could not resist clicking upvote!

Matt Эллен

11:53 AM

if he had his way all flowery prose would be gone from the world. DO NOT WANT

"they're not that different" oh how pedestrian! How dull. "they're none too dissimilar" now you've zhoozhed it up a bit

user19161

The other JL here is Jonathan Leffler. It seems that JL is very common for names.

Matt Эллен

well, three data points don't a trend make

user19161

@MattЭллен Three you mean.

Matt Эллен

oh! :D how foolish of me

user19161

Indeed. QED.

Matt Эллен

12:00 PM

there are at least 3 MEs, including me

Cerberus

12:17 PM

Morn.

Matt Эллен

What ho, hell hound!

Cerberus

Ho, ho!

It's cold. Why?

We have another week of hellish cold ahead here. You?

Matt Эллен

Those blasted weathermen. They're at it again

Robusto

@Cerberus Because you use the metric system. Learn to use the number 32.

Cerberus

Yeah! All their fault.

@Robusto Hmm does that help?

I suppose it wouldn't be below freezing...

Matt Эллен

12:21 PM

It seems like we'll be cold too, although not as cold as last week

Cerberus

People are ice-skating on the canals.

That doesn't happen every year.

Robusto

@Cerberus Well, this is just anecdotal, but we are having a very mild winter.

Matt Эллен

oh, except on saturday, when everyone dies

Cerberus

@Robusto That's just anecdotal? I can't believe it, there must be more to it.

I suppose you're not that much better off.

Robusto

See? Much higher temps.

Cerberus

12:24 PM

Where are the temperatures?

Matt Эллен

Cerberus

I see only silly Fs.

@MattЭллен Haha, how is this possible?

Matt Эллен

we disagree again, doggy

Cerberus

Who was right last time?

Robusto

The point is, much better than your stupid C's.

Matt Эллен

12:25 PM

@Cerberus I don't know. we must not pray to the right gods

@Cerberus I might have been you, but I'm not confirming anything!

Cerberus

Story of my life.

@Robusto F is used for guilders anyway.

Matt Эллен

@Cerberus how so? does everyone steal credit for your good works?

Cerberus

@MattЭллен By the way, what's up with your weird wind speeds??

RegDwight Ѭſ道

...and the Descriptive Title of the Day Award goes to...

Cerberus

@MattЭллен They just deny me my rights, or, rather, my right.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

12:26 PM

0

Q: Difference between run into, come upon & come across

Afaik, these phrasal verbs have a similar meaning (please correct me if not): run into come upon come across Are there any nuances to choose between them? For example, I might be wrong but I mostly see run into used for meeting a person unexpectedly.