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7:51 PM
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Q: Existence of probability distributions/measures and mathematical expectations in some functional spaces

Fabrice PautotPlease see my questions: What's the probability distribution of a deterministic signal? (functional integrals in probability theory) Is there a Bayesian theory of deterministic signal? Prequel and motivation for my previous question for the rationale and motivation underlying those unusual qu...

 
@ Liviu. Stochastic processes are just collections of usual (= non-functional) r.v. indexed by the time. Here, I have only one "r.v." $f$ but it is quite unusual because it is defined on a functional space. I'm aware of only two kinds of functional integrals: Wiener measure and Feynman path integral, but they look quite different from the hypothetical functional integrals I'm considering here. I guess you were talking about Wiener measure, isn't it?
 
I don't think I understand your question. What exactly do you mean by a "probability distribution" and what exactly would it mean for it to be "uniform"? One common interpretation of "uniform" in vector spaces is "translation invariant", but there is no translation invariant probability measure on any vector space, not even on $\mathbb{R}$. Maybe you just want a translation invariant measure, i.e. a Lebesgue measure, but it's well known that there is no Lebesgue measure on infinite-dimensional spaces.
In some sense asking about $\mathbb{R}^\mathbb{R}$ is particularly problematic because its topology and measurable structure are really nasty. Most interesting examples of probability measures on function spaces live on Polish vector spaces.
Also, surely you must know that, for example, a continuous stochastic process induces a probability measure (sometimes called its distribution or law) on the space of continuous paths? That is what Liviu is talking about.
 
@ Nate. Many thanks for your comments. In some extent, you are the first to answer my question: starting from some practical problems (see the questions), I fell, at least formally, on some nasty functional integrals over sets like ${\mathbb{R}^\mathbb{R}}$ or ${\left( {{\mathbb{R}^d}} \right)^{{\mathbb{R}^d}}}$ or event the set of all subsets of all Cartesian powers of $\mathbb{R}$. So my question was: are those functional probability distributions and integrals well known or crazy? It seems like they are really crazy. But without them it is not possible to solve many interesting problems...
Please, please don't put the question on hold: it's not homework, it's not chat, it's not about MO, these are well defined, serious, important mathematical questions about the existence of some unusual (=functional) mathematical objects arising from a collision between dynamical system theory and Bayesian probability theory. Please refer to both companion questions and please provide me with some tips on how to improve my question. Or just answer it please!
Title and questions much improved, I hope. Please make it live.
Hello Nate. Please check my question again, I did my best to improve it. I see no vector spaces here, only functions and sets of them.
I don't see stochastic processes here too.
 
8:10 PM
I can tell you those spaces are interesting too!
What do I want? First, I'd like to get the "mean image" of some x0 in R under all functions in R^R. Any idea?
 
R^R is certainly a vector space
I'm afraid that I don't know what you mean by the "mean image". I suspect that once you have given a precise statement of what kind of mathematical object you are looking for, and precisely what properties it should satisfy, the answer will be "no such object exists". But for now, the question is still too vague to answer, at least for me.
 
Can you explain please? I know about finite dimensional vector spaces and Hilbert spaces
 
R^R is the set of all functions from R to R. It is a vector space under pointwise addition and scalar multiplication.
But I have to say I think this is part of the reason why the question was closed as "not research level" - people may be concerned that they may spend a lot of time writing a high-level answer, only to find that you don't have the background to read it.
 
Do you know about my background?
I can be recommended by Ecole Normale Superieure in Paris
and many professors (e.g. Prof Anderson, Cambridge university, etc.)
Cambridge UK!
I'm rather a serious boy!
I graduated Ecole Centrale in France, number 3 best Grande Ecole in science
I ask my questions precisely because I fear nobody can answer them!
I mean I might have fallen on some unidentified mathematical objects.
But I'm not sure!!!
I'm waiting for somebody to tell me: yes, this is Mister X theory, introduces a long time ago. Your "functional mean image" is in fact know as "sdfjlsjfdl".
I just know about a very little bit about Wiener abstract measure and Feynman path integrals. But in my understanding, they are different kind of functional integrals
Have you received my email Nate? Thunderbird refused to copy my sendbox
If my question is so basic, it should be easy to answer it.
If nobody can answer my well-defined questions, they might be not so basic.
Isn't it?
It seems to me that my "functional mean image" is perfectly well defined, at least formally.
It is obviously perfectly well-defined for a finite number of functions f1,...,fn!!!!
I'm just asking what happens when we take the average over all such functions.
whose set is well defined
Yes it is a basic question!
... that should have a basic answer
I'm considering the function x0 --> functional mean image (x0)
from R to R
Could it be the identity function?
Are those functional mean image new or not?
images
I'm 42. I've been spending the last 20 years of my life reading good boys such as Pascal, Descartes, Leibniz, Bernoulli, Laplace, Maxwell, Poincaré, Russell, Keynes, Borel, Kolmogorov, Shannon, Jaynes and many others...
I NEED SOME HELP please. Don't live me alone with those functional beasts!
I don't know much about abstract measure theory or something.
No doubt my question can be trivial in the proper branch of mathematics
Which one is it, I'd like to know please
Any mathematician out there?
At least my question has now 3 upvotes and 1 favorite!!!
Not so bad!
Henri Poincaré is my master and hero
never correctly translated into English, too bad
 
9:31 PM
my "functional mean image" arises in a violent collision between dynamical system theory (phase space, initial condition, state-space equation, output equation and Bayesian probability theory
all that comes from an attempt to fix classical cross-correlations functions for deterministic signals
Because crosscorrelation and covariance don't make much sense for deterministic signals: they are invariant by permutation of the time points!
so that we loose the time!
They functional probability distribution I wrote for a deterministic signal should not be invariant by permutation of the time points (= i.i.d. if you are a frequentist or De Finetti-exchangeable otherwise)
The sorry
$p\left[ {s\left( 1 \right),s\left( 2 \right),...,s\left( M \right)} \right] = \int\limits_{{\mathbb{R}^\Gamma }} {\int\limits_{{\Gamma ^\Gamma }} {\int\limits_\Gamma  {{\text{D}}g{\text{D}}f{{\text{d}}^d}{z_1}\prod\limits_{m = 1}^M {\delta \left\{ {g\left[ {{f^{m - 1}}\left( {{z_1}} \right)} \right] - s\left( m \right)} \right\}p\left( {{z_1},f,g} \right)} } } } $
is the/my marginal prior probability distribution for M samples from a discrete-time deterministic signal
How to send LaTeX on this chat Nate?
Anyway I hope you'll answer me..................
 
10:07 PM
What is this "functional mean image"? that is the question
 
10:49 PM
Does your measure theory in vector spaces work for my functional space R^R? Yes or not?
I DO understand that's not Lebesgue (and Borel, one of my masters) or translation-invariant measures. Don't think its Wiener nor Feynman too.
R^R is really the starting point. Then you have the set of all subsets of all Cartesian powers of R.
 
11:11 PM
I DO understand that a functional space can be equipped with a vector space structure but I don't see how it helps in my problem
 
11:30 PM
at school, I had lessons not so far away from your research interests: singularities of PDE in angular domains, hydrodynamical instabilities, stuff like this
don't remember anything but much Sobolev
 

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