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Ben
12:00 AM
WIS and INT
I dunno... personally I always favour WIS
 
Given that outside of combat Link's main activity is solving puzzles, I think he needs a strong Int.
 
Ben
Ok. Good point.
 
I'd call that a 14 for now, room for flexibility if we need it.
 
Ben
And Navi is always telling him where to go next, so WIS isn't that important
 
Wis is...I dunno. I've slowly come to realise that I have no idea what Wis really represents.
 
Ben
12:02 AM
INT is knowing it's going to rain, WIS is kbowing to bring an umbrella
 
Maybe call it a 12?
@Ben Lol.
 
Ben
So WIS is knowing what to do in certain situations basically
@Miniman Yeah I always liked that one :P
 
Cha is actually the easiest, for me - Link barely talks, can't get anyone to listen to him without doing them a favour first, and is always taking orders from everyone.
So I'd definitely call that an 8.
 
Ben
@Miniman That is Link in a nutshell (light applause)
ok so total so far...
22
 
Yep. 5 points left over, so right now we have: Str 10, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 8.
 
Ben
12:04 AM
so we can make CON a 14
wait... 13
 
Wait, no, I was right the first time @.@
 
Ben
Yay! We can maths! [high 5]
 
@Ben \o boo-yah!
Ok, so that looks like a reasonable array, actually.
I'd call Link a half-elf, so that brings him up to Str 10, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 8.
 
Ben
Yeah I'm actually pretty happy with that :)
@Miniman Hm... I was asking about that before, and a lot of people were saying that Link is actually a human...
 
@Ben Weeeellll, Hylians are like humans, but with pointed ears, right?
 
Ben
12:08 AM
Yeah. But that doesn't mean he's in any way elvish. It's just a physical feature
 
@Ben True, true. And I don't like the Cha 10 or the Darkvision, so let's go with human. Variant human, cos regular human is garbage.
 
Ben
hear hear :P
So +1 to 2 or +2 to dex?
 
@Ben Not sure about the starting feat...I'll leave that for now. He's clearly a fighter, and I think his starting skills from fighter are probably Athletics and Acrobatics.
@Ben +1 to Dex and Con, I think.
 
Ben
Sound.
 
Given his fighting style, I'd say his Fighting Style is probably Dueling.
 
Ben
12:13 AM
2 seconds...
 
When the time comes, I'm pretty sure he'll be a Battlemaster Fighter.
 
Ben
I was thinking perhaps Protection would be his fighting style?
And would duelling be affected by having a shield?
 
@Ben Nah, it still works.
@Ben Am I forgetting a time when he actually used his shield to protect someone else?
 
Ben
Well... the intro to the Shadow Boss in OoT comes to mind
 
@Ben Oh yeah, didn't think of that. It's up to you, I guess.
 
Ben
12:17 AM
It is true that it didn't happen often...
But that's likely because no one was ever attacked cos all the monsters were outside of the towns...
 
We don't have to agree here, we can finish building him and each have this particular choice different in our heads :)
I'd say he has a custom background and starting equipment.
The 3 skills (2 from his background, 1 from variant human) in no particular order I think are Stealth, Investigation, and Perception.
Animal Handling would be nice, but I think playing Epona's Song gave him a bonus there, it might not be something he's good at normally.
Although there were all those Cuccos...
And I have NO idea about his tool proficiencies or languages.
 
Ben
Sorry bout that, got distracted
 
@Miniman @Ben Mathematically speaking, rolling for stats has a greater chance of ruining all your hopes and dreams than the standard array.
 
Ben
Stealth and Investigation..? Why so?
4d6
 
 
Ben
12:27 AM
...not so bad
 
Possible feat choices: Athlete, Charger, Defensive Duelist, Dungeon Delver, Mounted Combat (although I feel like he didn't learn that till later), Shield Master.
 
Ben
@doppelgreener I was honestly hoping that would be 4 1's haha
Ok, ok, hold up a sec lol.
 
@Ben Sorry, didn't want to lose the list I was writing. Stealth - he does a fair bit of sneaking around, pretty successfully. Hyrule Castle, getting to the Forest Temple, Gerudo Fortress.
@Ben Sorry, I'm too keen :P
 
Ben
Lol you are getting right into it haha
 
@Ben Investigation is just kind of the main dungeon skill, if you see what I mean.
 
Ben
12:29 AM
@Miniman Yeah.. that's true. Ok I'll pay that
Ah yes.. true also. Alright moving on haha
What is Defensive Duelist?
 
@Ben Use your reaction to add your proficiency bonus to your AC. Basically represents blocking an attack with your sword.
 
Ben
How often do you get a reaction?
(just fuzzy on the rules there)
 
@Ben 1 per round, or 1 every 6 seconds.
 
Ben
Oh ok. And (dumb question - but just to clarify) that is different to a Bonus Action?
 
@Ben Yep. Bonus action is an extra action on your turn, reaction is a special thing you do when the trigger happens, can be on your turn but generally isn't.
 
Ben
12:36 AM
Ok cool.
Also add to that list: Dungeon Delver?
I figure that would be highly appropriate cos... well.. Link spends 90% of his time in caves :P
Oh, wait... you already did haha
In that case I think it'd be a toss up between Defensive Duelist and Dungeon Delver...
Duelist is incredibly useful, but Delver is so appropriate...
I'm going to go with Delver.
 
Sorry, got distracted. I'm cool with Delver, it's super thematic even if it isn't the most useful feat in the list.
 
Ben
It all depends on how much time you spend in caves haha
Stealth is dex based yeah?
 
Yeah.
 
Ben
and what about athletics/acrobatics - str/dex?
I always get them confused
 
@Ben Yeah, exactly.
In that order, I mean.
 
Ben
12:49 AM
ah excellent
We only get the one feat to start with don't we..?
Ok, gotta head off for a bit... be back in half an hour/hour
 
@Ben Me too lol.
@Ben And yep.
 
Ben
1:37 AM
I hath returned
 
Ben
Couldnot be more appropriate
 
(context: this girl's having a conversation with steven universe and they're saying a lot of shakespearean english like haveth and wanteth and thanketh youeth for fun)
 
Ben
Fun-eth
 
@Ben I have to go eat here in two shakes myself
but once I get back, mind if we do Disney's evil prince in 5e?
 
1:42 AM
two shakeths?
 
(note -- I'm not really familiar with the char -- just kind of popped in my head as an idea)
 
2:05 AM
@Ben I hath returned as welleth :P
 
Ben
Ok, sorry about that had a bit of a hiccup with this laptop
Borrowing a mates - IT. IS. HORRENDOUS
It-eth, is-eth horrendous
As for @Shalvenay sure, but I think I'll wait and see when @Miniman gets back and finish off Link first ;)
Ugh. Can't open my PHB pdf :(
 
2:21 AM
@Ben sure thing, I have a few hours :)
 
Ben
2:34 AM
Which Prince were you thinking ?
 
@Ben Open it in the browser!
 
Ben
True...
 
@Ben oh wait, it's the one from Frozen I'm thinking of :)
 
Ben
Oh right haha. Really? Wasn't expecting that haha
 
@Ben Back, sorry about that.
 
Ben
2:42 AM
All g.
Ok so we just chose Link's Feat, I think next was to look at his starting gear?
 
I think Link is finished at this point, isn't he? Other than languages and tools, which don't translate particularly well to Zelda.
 
Ben
Yeah true.
 
@Ben Sorry, I posted that before I saw your message.
Starting equipment is pretty much just his clothes, though, right?
 
Ben
Maybe Druidic? Is that a language? Cos he does speak to... wel... everything
 
Everything else he finds as he goes, I think.
 
2:44 AM
@Ben druidic is a language -- I'd be more inclined to give him something closer to Animal language or Sylvan though
 
@Ben Hmmm, interesting point. He does talk to animals a lot.
@Shalvenay Yeah, I was thinking Sylvan might be the way to go, too.
 
(the NWN server I'm on rolls all three of those into one language -- druids and rangers get Animal Language, and that's all for class language proficiencies)
 
Ben
So Common and Sylvan?
 
@Ben Sounds good!
 
about right
 
2:46 AM
For tool proficiencies, they're not official, but I feel like fishing rod and shovel are the tools Link uses the most :)
 
Ben
Could not be more appropriate
 
@Ben I guess that's everything then?
 
Ben
As for equipment - Leather armour (at least), The sword - Longsword would be appropriate? And a shield
 
@Ben Sword and shield he both has to find in game, though - he never starts with them.
 
Ben
Cos this is "Adult Link" we're building I'd say he would at least have that kid of stuff
 
2:48 AM
Leather armour makes sense.
 
Ben
kind*
 
@Ben Oh! I assumed we were just building Link in general lol.
 
Ben
Yeah, true haha
I keep just referring to OoT cos that was my first LoZ game haha
But would you really create a character that has all these skills, and then not give hjim the equipment to use them with?
 
@Ben Heh, mine was Link's Awakening.
@Ben That's how the games work, right? He always gets them pretty quickly, but there's at least a small part where you have to go find them.
And I have to admit, I always kinda enjoyed the bits before you get a sword - they force you to play very differently.
 
Ben
Indeed... but this is DnD we're talking about... you gotta rely on the DM to give you these opportunities
True...
 
2:51 AM
@Ben yeah, like the mistake I made at my 2e table when I started my mage with 1 spell in his book
 
Ben
Very true...
 
@Ben I mean, the DM kinda has to be on board for this to really work.
 
Ben
I guess he would be open to that. I mean, after I showed him my Green Power Ranger character, he's been trying to kill off my current character just so I can play him hahaha
 
@Ben I'm sure he SAYS that's the reason...
 
Ben
Hahaha... He is a Vet (DMed for over 30 years) so his tactics are very different :P
The only thing we need now is his background. Traits and Feature etc.
 
2:55 AM
@Ben It'd have to be pretty custom, I think.
If it's OoT Link, he was abandoned as a child and raised by a tree in a forest full of other kids who are actually a different species.
I'm not sure any of the existing backgrounds really cover it too well :D
 
Ben
Ooooh... yeah... "Pick a Link" haha
OH! I could come up with my own variation!
Another Incarnation in Hylian History!
Yes!
Basic features: Doesn't talk... wants to help EVERYONE...
Hmm... one more...
 
@Ben OCD?
 
Ben
Hmm... yeah? I was just thinking something to do with his incessant need to search for things in bushes and pots... You reckon that would cover it?
 
@Ben I think so - also covers his desperate need to hold the record for every shooting game, fishing competition, bomb throwing gallery...
 
Ben
Yes. Agreed
OH! Alignment!
 
3:11 AM
@Ben Let's face it, any normal D&D character would have given up after the first 5 tries and said "To hell with your stupid minigame, give me the prize or I'll kill you, burn your shop to ash, and take everything anyway!"
@Ben I think Chaotic Good?
 
Ben
Chaotic... really? Why Chaotic?
Wait... no yeah I suppose
 
@Ben Sneaking into the Royal Palace? Stealing stuff?
 
Ben
He does like to break stuff too
 
Stealing everything, now that I think about it.
@Ben Yeah, he's got a streak for vandalism.
 
Ben
Well... not everything. He does pay for stuff at the shops :P
 
3:13 AM
@Ben Not in every game...
(In Link's Awakening you can steal stuff, although everyone calls you THIEF for the rest of your life.)
And the shopkeeper will kill you next time he sees you.
 
Ben
Well...
That's a reaction and a half
 
@Ben I mean, one of the items costs almost as much money as it's actually possible to possess, so it's kind of understandable.
Also, given the way he kills you the shopkeeper is clearly an uber-powerful wizard guy, and we all know what they're like.
 
Ben
Yeah geez... Haha. Almost like the armour set in Twilight Princess
Would you say his desire to help everyone would be a bond or an ideal?
The other would have to do with defeating Ganon... Lol
 
@Ben Bond, I think. Ideals are usually a bit more philosophical and less specific.
 
Ben
Ok, no I think Ganon would be the Bond, and "helping humanity" would be the Ideal
Yeah?
Defeating Ganon*
 
3:24 AM
Sounds good to me.
 
Ben
Awesome :)
Ok, so I think all I have left is the "Feature" - what would you reckon that would be about...?
 
@Ben Feature: Fairy Companion.
 
Ben
Yeah I was thinking that haha.
And this fairy companion always seems to know where to go, or who to talk to next..? Or is that a bit over the top?
 
@Ben Depends on the campaign, really.
 
Ben
Maybe talk to the DM and he can control when the "Hey! Listen!" trigger is ;)
 
3:32 AM
@Ben Yeah. I'd make it something like "The fairy companion will occasionally provide helpful tidbits of advice."
Then it's up to the DM to decide when he wants to help you along.
 
Ben
That's it. Perfect :)
 
@Ben ;)
 
Ben
Awesome. Just need to flash it up a bit (I've basically just got everything written down like notes) and then he's done - Link: DM Assistance required
So @Shalvenay have you done any preliminary stuff for you Prince?
 
@Ben sadly, no :)
 
Ben
Ah no worries. @Miniman you wanna get in on this? We're making Hans from Frozen
 
3:46 AM
@Ben Incidentally, did that help with the whole point buy thing? (Since that was where this originally started.)
@Ben I'll observe, but I know nothing about the character, so don't expect me to say much of anything :P
 
Ben
Yes it did. I think I'll use that in practice on this next one
Ok. Well on another note do you reckon this should be oved to another chat?
:/ my "m" appears to be malfunctioning
 
@Ben At this point, it might be the polite thing to do.

 Genesis

Creation! PCs, NPCs, worlds, etc. (This means more than just r...
As a possible spot for it.
 
sure thing
 
@Miniman yeah if you are making a character that is the perfect room
well, in this case Ben is but wtv
I mean more in a general sense
 
Ben
I am..?
 
3:52 AM
isn't that what you are doing?
generating stats and such
 
Ben
Yeah... As it was suggested this was just a basic practice for understand the point:cost system, but we kind of got carried away
 
I see nothing wrong with it
I made like, half a dozen characters I never intended to do anything with in the Genesis room, nothing wrong with whatever reason you have for it
I was just mentioning that Miniman's suggestion of room seemed pretty spot on
 
Ben
Oh right, yeah no I was referring to making it in here lol
But I agree haha
 
4:32 AM
**Cool stuff:** [Bundle of Holding](http://bundleofholding.com "buy RPGs cheap in bulk, support charities & indie designers!");
[Interface Zero 2.0](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/821979583/interface-zero-fate-edition "a cyberpunk/sci-fi game setting designed for Fate Core");
[Bring Back MST3K!](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/mst3k/bringbackmst3k/ "Kickstart up to 12 new episodes of Mystery Science Theater");
[Mindjammer RPG](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/328469751/mindjammer-the-roleplaying-game "Transhuman Science-Fiction Roleplaying in the Universe of the Far Future!");
(Ping @Magician for Mindjammer.)
 
4:43 AM
Also, remember that the Cool Stuff pin content is dependent on you! If there's something you think should go in the pin, mention it in chat with a ping to me.
2
Without your input, it's only going to have stuff that I come across, and that's a very narrow slice of the RPG landscape.
 
We could put that on an Uncle Sam poster.
 
Cool Stuff Needs You?
 
We want YOU! to supply us with Cool RPG Stuff.
@BESW That version too!
 
5:24 AM
Hmm. [pokes typography]
 
Ben
We just made Hanz from Frozen as a DnD character
Does that count?
 
Context is the Cool Stuff pin.
 
5:49 AM
@BESW Oh, wow. I am impressed. Handsome work there. :)
 
Thank you.
 
6:13 AM
@BESW XDXDXDXDXDXD
 
 
4 hours later…
9:58 AM
1
Q: Did I really asked how to get around Healers Armor limitations?

EpeedefeuI am a bit confused about what to do with my question Optimizing Torso/Body slot when restricted to light armor, no metal with high WIS. I was expecting the answerers to suggest cool items existing in the books for the torso/body slot with specific properties that you can't get with the standard...

 
 
1 hour later…
11:00 AM
Ooh, I just got an undownvote.
 
huh
was it something you had changed something on?
 
No activity on it at all for the last 11 days.
 
how odd
 
@John Hi!
 
11:21 AM
Oh hey! Just peeking :)
Was searching for some roll-for-shoes info, on how people play, how/where to play online, etc.
I saw in your profile you also have some experience with this mini system?
Anyway, I created a roll20 game. There are two players already, need one or two more to get going..
@BESW
@BESW is roll-for-shoes a game that's played here in chat?
 
11:45 AM
it has been played here before, though
I think it was in a different room
 
We have a room for it (currently frozen), or it can be played in The Back Room.

 Roll For Shoes Chat

A chat for OOC chat in a RFS game
 
12:10 PM
@John Yes! Sorry, was away doing work.
I've run RFS several times in chat here, as have other people. I've also used it over Skype and face-to-face.
It's quickly becoming one of my favourite systems to use when introducing someone to RPGs.
 
12:22 PM
@John Do you have any specific questions or concerns?
 
12:41 PM
@BESW Np, same here :)
Ok cool!
Nah, just curious. And if you plan to run some in the future, let me know!
 

 Stack Exchange plays RPGs

A room for people interested in playing RPGs with other Stack ...
 
Oh, one thing about the system... If one fails, but uses xp to gain a skill, would the skill be about what you were trying to do? Or would it be a "No, but ..." skill?
 
Ah, that's a detail a lot of people miss: new skills are always derived from "What happened to you." Not "What you tried to do," or "What you did," though those are often very similar in action.
So failing to defend against an attack might result in a skill like Steel Plate in My Skull 3 or Falling Down 3 depending on the narrative of the failure.
Although I have seen negative skills: a player wanted his PC to be pessimistic and incapable, so his skills are all flavoured as incapacities: Can't find a door 2 means that when you fail, you find a door.
 
Lol ok. And is a "fail skill" more up to the GM to decide? Or would you let the player describe how he wants to fail (and thus what skill he gains)?
 
Roll For Shoes doesn't give any suggestions re: who narrates what. Generally I tend to have players narrate their failures while I narrate their successes, but I switch it up however feels right per action.
I do think players should always be the ones who choose their skills.
 
12:48 PM
Ok, nice.
 
One of the wonderful things about RFS is that it's very un-intrusive regarding play style and exactly how to play out action resolutions.
So I can bring all sorts of different techniques to play in the same game as appropriate.
Makes it a great tool for modelling play philosophies like Failing Forward, Zooming Actions, and Only If Interesting.
 
Yes, I like that, but it's difficult to not get in the habits of board gaming (I'm pretty new to all things rpg, except for pc games but that doesn't count)
 
If you're at a point in your GMing career when you feel like it'd be good to have a system that does some of the heavy lifting in terms of playstyle, you might want to look for some other systems to supplement your sessions.
 
1:06 PM
Nice post on learning rpg through rfs! Some good tips and advice there.
I'm in a 5e one-shots/sandbox kind of adventure. It's good fun, but the rules can sometimes be in the way of the rp. But I guess that really depends on the GM and players, and the fact that it's pretty new for some.
 
I spent quite a lot of time in D&D, but eventually found other systems that better support the sorts of stories and games I'm interested in.
You've seen my profile, so you know the systems I've tried and the ones that I've stuck with.
...Since I wrote that answer, I ran a nine-player game of RFS where about half the players were totally new to RPGs and none of them had ever played RFS before.
 
Yea.. I already came by FAE in my search, and it looks promising.
Cool.. Yea I really like the "sure, grab a chair, so this and that is going on, what would you like to do" -- rfs offers.
 
FAE is the other system I've used a lot in chat play.
@John For that feeling, at varying levels of crunchiness and with different themes and playstyles, you may also like Lasers & Feelings, Lady Blackbird, and Cthulhu Dark.
...and Great Ork Gods.
None of them are quite as "get up and go" as RFS, but they're the systems I've used, or plan to use, in those "let's just start playing something quick and short" moments.
 
I think the only ones we have not actually used is Lasers & Feelings
 
Good morning
 
1:17 PM
Hi
 
I've read Lady Blackbird rules and saw part of a Youtube actual session on it. Seems really nice, but indeed requires some more player involvement in the background story.

And yes, I've seen Lasers & Feelings, but I'm not really into SF genre, but then there's the fantasy hack of it: https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1399757_10153515641450234_511368157_o.jpg
 
Cute, I hadn't seen that.
 
Then there's also Risus for fast plays, and Everyone is John. So I have still some choices to make and experiments to do in chat & my local board game group :)
 
You're welcome to try out my Doctor Who pre-made PCs for FAE.
Nine classic-era companions and a generic Doctor, designed for play by groups only passingly familiar with the franchise. The blanks get filled in as needed during play, rather than beforehand.
 
Nice!
 
1:33 PM
Yeah, they were fun to make. The "partially blank sheet at the start of play" concept is one which Fate does very well with.
And, of course, Fate's extreme consequences are perfect for Doctor Who: when the Doctor or another Time Lord would normally perish, simply switch sheets with someone and have them change one of the character aspects so that the regenerated Doctor has a modified personality and is played by a new "actor."
 
I was thinking of Risus as a "step up" from RfS. But it's still a bit silly. I'll have a better look at Fate/FAE..
 
Fate can handle a wide variety of playstyles, so long as it's about PCs who are competent, dramatic, and proactive. Stepping outside that trio of qualities gets tricky.
 
Oh, nice. Is that like the buy-off in Lady Blackbird?
It's so much better than using a d&d daily spell...
 
Kind of. In Fate, when a PC takes a lot of stress they get "taken out" (lose the conflict) unless they take a "consequence." A consequence is a lasting but not permanent negative thing; the nastier and more long-lasting it is, the more stress you mitigate when you get it.
 
Good for some nice character development or plot twist...
 
1:42 PM
Normally you've got a 2-stress slot (mild, lasts a couple of scenes), a 4-stress slot (moderate, lasts a couple of sessions), and a 6-stress slot (severe, lasts for a whole adventure) for consequences.
But there's also the option of changing one of your permanent character aspects: something central to your character's identity changes forever, and you can absorb eight stress with that.
 
6-slot being losing a hand?
 
@John In a setting other than Star Wars, probably.
But consequences aren't necessarily physical.
One of my players had her PC get tossed around by a robot... so she gained Robophobia.
 
:)
 
There was some nice discussion on consequences for Superheros somewhere.
 
1:47 PM
… and yet I think it's something I stumbled upon independent of you mentioning it.
 
Well, I'm not the sole font of Fate knowledge here.
Just the chattiest.
 
Not that that's a bad thing.
I do appreciate it, even though I'm not playing Fate at the moment.
(I do need to get myself a regular game again…)
 
This week, I'm trying to figure out how to make sure a conflict's outcome will change the "landscape" of the narrative. That seems to be the key to keeping them from becoming slogs.
 
So you have something at stakes which is essentially a significant decision?
Or do you mean landscape in even bigger terms?
 
Well, something needs to change in the story because the conflict happened.
 
1:54 PM
Need to go, ttfn
 
ttfn
I'm just gonna have to experiment, I think.
This next session they'll have their spoiler get spoilered by spoilers. So should be interesting, at least.
 
2:11 PM
 
2:26 PM
@BESW [resisting urge so strongly to mouse over the links]
 
@doppelgreener Spoiler 1: You get snuggled, Spoiler 2: by a giant fluffy teddybear, Spoiler 3: almost to death.
 
[moustaches] [shaved] [aliens]
 
@Tashio wow
this is gonna be the greatest session
@John this is also an excellent alternative
 
 
1 hour later…
3:44 PM
1
Q: A design update is coming!

Stéphane MartinMost of the changes won’t be visible; these tweaks go along with recent updates that were made to Stack Overflow: We are moving the site's CSS to a newly refactored LESS system, so that it's easier for us to fix SE network CSS bugs globally and launch new features in the future. We are updating...

 
 
3 hours later…
6:59 PM
@aaron great Xibitz meme
 
@JoshuaAslanSmith It popped in my head cause of what @BESW said
 
yep saw that
and now I wait for an errant new user to come and bombard me with their wayward opinions
 
@JoshuaAslanSmith For what?
 
last time a dude really wanted to vent about how clerics got the short end of the stick in 5e
which I really had to resist just laughing because its the 2nd most powerful class (and very close to wizards)
and I was like how about the balance with the non casters or the 1.4 or 1/2 caster progression classes
 
00:00 - 20:0021:00 - 00:00

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