The Town Hall - 2014-08-05

« first day (6 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (3287 days later) »

6:49 AM

@FEichinger What's up?

6 hours later…

12:35 PM

@Gilles Nevermind, was just about that suggested edit last night.

1 hour later…

1:36 PM

Moderators is starting to mellow out huh?

@Malachi looks like it

29 questions since friday, and 100 questions from Private Beta start until friday

hope it doesn't die, I think this is going to be a good resource

0

A: Does adding ability to upvote/downvote posts cause users posting less?

The correlation between number of posts, and voting, probably doesn't exist. There are always people that read the posts but don't respond, they have always had an opinion whether or not they agree with the post or not, they just didn't want to post "Yes, I agree" to these posts because that wo...

going to have to start pimping good answers and good questions to keep us active in our voting in here

@Malachi It's a question that really needs to be answered with user retention studies.

(user retention because the impact on the userbase based on voting behaviour is (and this is an assumption of mine that could also turn out to be wrong) probably also a factor for user posting behaviour.)

2:03 PM

@FEichinger agreed, but until then I think it is something that needed to be said that there are more than those factors that the OP suggests that go into the Voting Behavior and the posting behavior. wouldn't you agree? maybe they are seeing the sleepers start voting whereas before they just read the posts.

1 hour later…

3:28 PM

@AirThomas - thanks for working through that in comments with me

I think we found a clear dividing line that is both as inclusive as we want it to be but also clearly able to be applied to situations

hey @Andy - I made an edit to your question on guest blog posters and pulled my close vote because I think if we clarify that one of the expectations is that you are looking for a blog poster that will also interact with the community, then it becomes safely on topic

it seemed like it was in line with your original intent of the question since you were primarily concerned about the community development side of things from it

@Malachi an initial die out is to be expected

the early flurry is getting a starter base of questions

that can't last indefinately

@Malachi I also didn't upvote that answer because it really is just speculation which the user could do on their own (and already has)

effectively, they are saying "I think this is happening, is there evidence to confirm or deny it" and all your answer does is say "I don't think this is happening". Even though I am pretty sure I agree with you, it doesn't really answer the request for hard evidence on the matter

but, I also didn't downvote it either

@Malachi yeah, and that was why I didn't downvote

then the question should be closed because I don't think that there can be good evidence to the fact that anything is happening, you can't find that evidence unless someone gives you full rein of their database to check these things....

right?

well, he isn't asking about his specific case

he's asking about studies of similar systems

though I'm not sure such data exists

because not a lot of large sites have made that change mid-existance

> After ability to up/downvote posts was added on a forum, I've gotten the impression that users are posting less. I'm not sure if it's just a hunch or a fact, and the platform doesn't provide statistics to confirm it, so I'd like to ask if this has been studied/observed.

I would say that is a specific case, and wants to verify against another specific case..

I suppose if someone could definitively determine it hadn't been studied then "no, it hasn't been studied, here is why" would be a valid response

@Malachi right

he has a case, but he isn't asking about his case, he's saying he thinks he is observing something in his case and wants to know if studies of other cases have proven his theory out

how about the specific case that I am one of those people lurking in the shadows, and will vote if I can

3:41 PM

anecdotal evidence doesn't really help other than to expose your own bias

not on stack exchange but other forums

that is experience not anecdotal evidence

yeah, but your bias is that that is how you think, so it is how you expect others to think

a single individual's experience is anecdotal evidence regardless of who it is

unless the question is about that specific person rather than a group of "all people"

or a group of "moderators"?

"users"?

all your experience says reliably is what your views are

which is what most of the site's answers are based on, (nothing to back that up, just seems that way)

3:43 PM

because if I were to do the same thing, I would say that people think lotteries and gambling are stupid and that both the republican and democratic parties should go away

but that is so SOOO far from reality

right, but this guy was looking for specific studies or systematic observations. If you had your own forum that had gone through the transition, then the personal observation of what happened to the community you were involved in would be valid

because it is observed behavior of people (general) on the internet

but sample size matters

and that's why I used the most general way to describe what he possibly can observe when something new gets implemented in any community @AJHenderson

@Braiam yeah, I liked the way you answered it, I would have personally preferred if it said "Two other possibilities" rather than "two possibilities", but I thought it was well reasoned out and you never said specifically that you think he is wrong, just offered alternate explanations.

I guess I mostly just didn't like the line "The correlation between number of posts, and voting, probably doesn't exist." in Malachi's post without any support beyond personal experience. I'm more accepting of people putting personal theories out there on their own experience than saying they think another theory is likely wrong based only on their personal experience

unless their personal experience involves a community as a whole that they observed going counter to it

and your post is also more clear that you are discussing theories on what could be happening

@AJHenderson Thanks for the edit

where as Malachi's is written more "matter of factly"

when it is really a theory

@Andy np, I tried to come up with a better way to work it in since it was a bit of a run on, but I think it generally improves the question and the quality of potential results since really, having a guest poster that will actually be part of the community is also important

AJ Henderson has been automatically appointed as owner of this room. (What does this mean?)

3:56 PM

@StackExchange interesting

2

@AJHenderson Very interesting. Not only did I not know that that existed ... nor did I know that you were the most prolific user here. Go figure.

Also: Evening, folks.

@AJHenderson This is indeed also the issue I have with that answer.

The question is looking for studies on the matter, analyzing multiple attributes that may or may not be affected by that change - and how they relate to what the asker wants to know: Does this mean fewer posts overall?

4:11 PM

@FEichinger yeah, I didn't realize either of those either

4:42 PM

@FEichinger guten morgen :P

2 hours later…

6:27 PM

We have now entered public beta!

15

NICE

I was just about to ask,

> You've earned the "Beta" badge (Actively participated in the private beta).

@Malachi looks like i missed it :(

@MattGiltaji you didn't ask any questions

The Beta badge is awarded once the private beta ends, with unspecified requirements. Rule of thumb: ~10 posts, 200 rep, something like that.

6:43 PM

@FEichinger interesting, thanks

I got it w/1Q, 4A and a dozen comments

(^data point)

7:02 PM

YAY moderators.stackexchange.com/users/current?tab=badges

@AJHenderson stop talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@Braiam technically I'm typing ;)

if I talked aloud while typing, that might be a little creepy

it is kind of funny that it will give ownership to someone who already can do anything owner can do though

rise hand so he's given ownership (so he can do evil)

Room owners abusing SE mods in the mods.SE room.

2

@FEichinger now my head hurts

thanks

@AJHenderson Teeheehee.

7:13 PM

it would be kind of funny to setup a bot to just automatically give everyone room owner upon joining the channel

not like room owner can do anything particularly meaningful anyway

@AJHenderson Actually, not funny.

The sad thing is that with that, any of the owners could put the room in gallery mode to silence a single person, without too much work.

@FEichinger so make two bots that readd each other

then someone couldn't remove them both

unless they were faster than the bot

@AJHenderson Coordinated effort?

and if they made it gallery but everyone that joins is owner, then they would still be able to talk

the topic could become a mess though

What was the dogma ... "Anything that can be abused will be abused"?

7:16 PM

and pinning would go crazy

@AJHenderson They could remove a single person, which is easier than adding the whole room.

@FEichinger yeah, I'm not seriously suggesting it

I know. I'm just pointing out the sad state of affairs that leads to it never actually being a good idea. :(

more just the irony if everyone in the mod room was a room owner

Yes, irony tends to be ironic.

7:19 PM

and I can think of some users that I would then be terrified to have join the room

@FEichinger I have no idea what you mean

(this is why I shouldn't stop what I'm writing half way through a sentance)

@AJHenderson SHAME ON YOU! SHAME. ON. YOU.

I could always play the "I'm disabled" card :)

(I do actually have a writing disability where I tend to change sentence flow between the beginning and the end if it drops out of short term memory, but normally it doesn't show when I'm typing)

Editing is still evil!

.... must resist urge to change "evil" to "genius"

@FEichinger YES

7:26 PM

@AJHenderson MOD ABUUUUUSE!

If you become pro-tem mod ... would that be mod-mod-abuse?

@FEichinger who watches the watchers watching the watchers watching

7:38 PM

@AJHenderson Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major Major

@Braiam Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo

@Braiam Why did you say his name 4.33 times?

or is it 3.25 times

I almost bought a new copy last week, but I ended up getting something else, because libraries.

@FEichinger I don't have 200 rep, and I don't think I have 10 posts. unless it's Meta and site combined?

@Malachi rule of thumb - it could be a lot of other factors as well.

Yeah - how big are your thumbs?

2

7:47 PM

@AirThomas I think the original xbox controller was the best controller ever made... I'll let you be the judge

... pcmasterrace >_>

I only have an incredibly vague image in my mind of that controller

@AirThomas penny-arcade.com/comic/2002/03/25

@AirThomas and yeah, I should clarify that as best console controller ever made. I still much prefer my keyboard and mouse or my full blown joystick depending on what I'm playing

except for stealth games (like MGS and Spliter Cell) or fighting/adventure games (Prince of Persia). For those I do use a 360 controller on my PC

user image

Mujahid مجاهد

Interesting, I just saw that according to "overview" I only posted about 79 messages in here, I recall last time I saw it it was over 100

actually, and I can be very mistaken, this room had (as I recall) more then 2372 all time messages

is someone deleting messages?

or is there something else I am not aware of?

(it doesn't really matter anyway, not over all :) )

8:09 PM

@Mujahidمجاهد oh wow....

I really DO talk a lot (or at least use multiple lines for saying things)

though I suppose ~400 lines in a week isn't super talkative

Mujahid مجاهد

:)

@AJHenderson Yes, it is.

@FEichinger I'm used to IRC. Around 4.7 lines an hour is slow.

Mujahid مجاهد

the longest I have spoken in chat (continuously) was for 9 hours, when Caleb and I had were debating each other (not sure you could even call it a debate), but I am unsure exactly how many messages I posted, and how that contributed to the number I posted that week

@AJHenderson IRC lines are also usually a fraction of the words of SE chat lines.

8:23 PM

yes

in IRC people tends to use the Enter as punctuation sign....

but I came from an IRC background

here you try that every line is a sentence... in theory

Yes

In

Theory

Sometimes

We

Also

Go

Overboard

With

Our

Crap

Here

how did you not end up rate limited

(or did you?)

8:27 PM

Chat rate limiting is just a few seconds of delay.

didn't realize I was in the other room that long

9:08 PM

@AJHenderson I idle in a couple IRC rooms that get more like 4.7 lines a week these days

super variable

@AirThomas fair point. That's like #Opers on the IRC network I run a server on. It used to be busy, now you can count the messages per month on two hands if not one

the network itself still has around 600 users, but only a few rooms still get any kind of real activity

but UnrealIRCd takes like 0 server resources

so I leave it running

2 hours later…

10:45 PM

@AJHenderson are you talking about me here moderators.stackexchange.com/q/2/57 ?

:)

oh man I can't cast reopen votes anymore... or see the review queue

That's what happens when public beta bumps the rep requirements.

my score got all messed up, one of my questions was deleted I think

If your score got "all messed up", it's not just a question being deleted.

@Malachi well now maybe I am ;)

@FEichinger well I lost some rep, rather than gained some, so I must have had enough up votes on it for something, or maybe I lost an answer to deletion as well?

10:58 PM

For starters, check your "recently deleted posts".

Secondly, a post with a score >= 3 won't be deleted. And, as far as I recall it, we had no posts that were controversial enough to both stay below score 3 and generate a large amount of reputation.

it wasn't deleted. surprised it's still there though. there is no answer on it yet

@FEichinger *won't have its reputation reversed ... not "won't be deleted".

I should probably get some sleep.

we were discussing leaving the question there and then deleting after private weren't we?

some of them anyway.

I think this one especially actually moderators.stackexchange.com/q/427/57

should wait a little way in to public probably. Want to get the views of public beta was the idea of leaving them through private

right. I will leave them then (both of them)

TTQW

11:33 PM

hopefully this answer of mine is better than my other questions and answers. I am outta here

0

A: Should moderators interfere in market transactions?

Going slightly outside of the Moderation point of view, or maybe not, a game that I play regularly has implemented a way to keep prices inside of a certain range, this limits the prices but still allow for slightly higher priced items to be sold. It's a hard line to draw in the sand. You shoul...

@FEichinger I am outta votes, that is a good answer too though!

later

stop answering all the questions, darn it!

lol

@Braiam that is a good thing though right?

@Malachi no for me, no

@Braiam There's no harm in multiple answers. A lot of the questions we have right now can be answered with multiple approaches but currently only address one, or a few of them.

Looking for questions missing points of view matching yours is difficult though

11:59 PM

@FEichinger I know, but that means that I have to read all those Q/A's

>:(

« first day (6 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (3287 days later) »

Transcript for

Aug '145

The Town Hall

General discussion for the Community Building Q/A site at comm...

join this room
about this room

00:00

06:00

12:00

18:00

all times are UTC

site design / logo © 2024 Stack Exchange Inc; legal

mobile