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4:00 PM
Perfect timing. I was just about to leave for lunch :)
i have good news 'n bad news
the good news is that we're launching the site earlier than planned. 12:30-1pm-ish EST, instead of 4pm
(so that's really soon!)
the bad news is.. THERE IS NO BAD NEWS HAHAHAA
thought you were going to tell us it's not going to be a lion - it's gonna be a kitteh
4:02 PM
@RoryAlsop kitten rulez !
So, for the pedantics in the room cough @Iszi are we talking EST or EDT?
so yeah, we're launching the site as soon as the core team dev gets online. should be any min now
@ScottPack @Jin said EST
@Jin Yay - I'd best finish up this 'we're graduating today' post then, eh
yeah i need to draft up my usual "new design launched, grats etc etc"
i wasn't able to find any good captcha images that i can use legally. or something that's not super lame
so i created my own
4:05 PM
you can't beat a good original picture:-)
I feel like it's staring at me.
it is...
Although, I suppose I don't have much room to talk
presumably this one is called GZK? or maybe JCN?
@ScottPack "I'm afraid I can't let you post that question, Scott."
oh i wasn't able to get the blog theme converted. but that's on my to-dos today.
4:07 PM
Oo, power's back on. I should go home and make sure everything that should be running is.
i tweaked the header area quite a bit from the original mockup i posted
but the overall look 'n feel is the same
i just tightened up the spacing. in the original mockup i posted, the header was a bit too tall.
sounds good
sneak mini launch:
@StackSecurity, The Stack Exchange network
622 tweets, 100 followers, following 0 users
@Jin heh - shhhh, we're hunting wabbits.....with a lion!
wonder if @RobertCartaino et al are preparing for any google+ goodness in addition to the current crop of social media hooks
4:23 PM
i'm not sure
to be honest i don't know what i'll be using G+ for
@RoryAlsop btw in your graduation post, could you mention the privilege change? I'm sure that will be asked a lot. happens with every site launch.
@Jin yeah - is there a boilerplate one I could crib from? I'll go and google just now
@Jin I couldn't find a use for Buzz when that came out, but I can see some advantages of G+ around broadcast-type comms to selected groups of folks
i know robert answered it before.. lemme look
all i can find is this mso post:
Q: Can we grandfather in rep abilities as sites leave beta?

yossarianAs Stack Exchange sites are beginning to graduate from beta, they are moving out of the beta rep benchmarks for abilities. This means that almost all users lose some of their abilities. Not a big deal on an individual level, but it also means that the community loses some of its policing abilitie...

google points me at a blogoverflow post, but the ocntent in it is incorrect
oh, and now meta is offline
just came up with a big skull for me
because... we're building :)
no worries - I'll try and find the content
4:30 PM
and... we're live
Looks grand!
i'll be checking the site today for minor css and other styling bugs
i already spot some but nothing show stopper yet
okay - will have the blog post up in 5 minutes, just tweaking that extra content
and then will ping a link out to my tweeps
btw, refresh this chatroom
And we'll all give it a good hammering to see if anything breaks:-) Easiest to let you know by post in here?
@Jin - query from earlier - will there be a nice button on the front page to get to the blog? let's make it as easy as possible.
I also really like the colour scheme for meta
4:39 PM
Sweet! We has liftoff!
i'll be make a post on meta
basically, if you find any glitches on the site, just post on meta, tag the post with "design" and "bug"
I'm liking the favicon.
my post is live
@Jin will do
@Jin - How do we test the error/captcha/etc. pages?
posted on July 12, 2011 by roryalsop

After 242 days in Beta, we now have over 3000 users and an active community of security professionals, hobbyists and specialists providing input, answers, moderation, blog posts and their own time to make the site a global success. Congratulations to all the members – your effort has paid off, and today we joined 27 other [...]

4:44 PM
@RoryAlsop I wish I could upvote a blog post..
@Jin LOL - thanks
Oh hai @Hendrik
@Iszi by making mistakes, mebbe?
@RoryAlsop Oh, you Mr Funny Man, you is...
@Jin - The faded gray of the "upload..." button in chat seems sort of... not right... thoughts?
refresh the chat
do a hard refresh
oh nm
@balpha can you take a look at it?
btw, thanks to @balpha for the chat room theming
@Jin You see what I mean, then?
4:48 PM
I have it in Red
@RoryAlsop - While you're typing...
@rory no it's when you type a message, the upload button turns disabled look
oh - I see what you mean
yep - hadn't noticed as I use enter to send the message
Only it's sort of "mentally disabled" as opposed to "physically handicapped".
@Iszi I love political correctness
4:49 PM
@RoryAlsop Same, but for me the button is kinda bottom-center.
tweet is out to ma tweeples
Hard to miss the change, and it sticks out a bit.
Yaaaayyyyy, out of beta. (I guess i am a bit late).
Let's rejoice !
Hey, we got our announcement re-tweeted by @howtogeek!
just launched and fully public: Q&A for Information Security professionals http://t.co/gGSbrHT
4:51 PM
(That could raise interest:-)
Hrm... the One-Box doesn't seem to reflect re-tweet-ed-ness.
I am going to celebrate the graduation by having lunch (for I am hungry)
@ThomasPornin I had the pleasant surprise of coming into this after lunch! Whee!
I am celebrating with scones - just baked by my middle daughter
with jam and cream
@Jin - Any chance we could get a logo wallpaper, when it's finalized?
4:53 PM
@Iszi sure.
That just looks like it'd be one bad-ass wallpaper for my work PC.
@Jin - the mobile version works well too
just playing with it now
@RoryAlsop right now the mobile theme is using Stack Exchange official colors
but once we get the mobile theme ironed out more, I'll be theming it per SE site
if you see any mobile related bugs, report them to: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/98215/…
@Jin - I like how you fixed the highlighting of the "Ask Question" link. Nicely done.
@Iszi yeah i think i'm gonna make all site's Ask Question link stand out more
4:55 PM
@Jin Might be just me, but the main site's favicon seems to still be Sketchy.
I'mma try browser reload. BRB.
Nope, still sketchy.
go to that url and do a hard refresh
Hrm... wonder why I had to do that?
Chrome is soo bad at not updating favicons
@Jin I'm running FF 5
i'm using ff4
4:57 PM
And the chat room favicon updated pretty well.
@Jin Oh, so we're using the same browser then. ;-)
And I'm back. Power's back up, but still no intertubes.
Looks fantastic @Jin!
@ScottPack How long did that fan of yours last?
@Jin - the mobile one seems to use the lion in the shield icon, but the colours are not security.se colours
The font on the user info bar (name, badges, review, etc) looks a bit wonky on ff4 on fedora 14.
@Iszi Dunno, it was dead when I got home.
Holy crap! Just saw the new Meta theme. SWEET!
that one hasn't been updated
it's used on the accounts page.
@Jin - Is Meta supposed to have a custom favicon also?
hard refresh that
Better. Thanks.
@Jin - Should we post a Q&A to our Meta for the favicon thing?
5:03 PM
@Iszi i will be making a post, the official "new design launched, grats etc"
in it, i'll mention how to load the new favicons
its' a very common FAQ when a new site launches
@Jin Thanks
Wow - I just spent most of a good hour trying to et logged back in to chat. Even restarted my browser (usually only once every few weeks). Damn!
hey guys, seriously thanks for your help throughout this design process. i'm happy for you guys that the site is graduated!
@nealmcb I just had a DNS fail dropout for about 5 mins. Very odd
@Jin Thank you for the awesome design, and for listening to our input!
5:04 PM
was just hunting down DNS records to pop them in manually when it all just automajically worked
@Iszi btw the lion in the header image has fangs.. but they're too small to be visible :(
@nealmcb When I posted the message above yours, it complained that I needed to log in. After a retry it just worked.
May have been some combination of needing to tell my google chrome "notscripts" script to Allow "stackauth.com", and clearing cookies.
@Jin Yeah, I'm trying to figure out how to view the image directly so I can enlarge it and stuff. Did you give the lion some clear-eyes, too?
woohoo!! congrats!!
5:06 PM
@Iszi meta lion has clear eyes
@RebeccaChernoff Cheers @Rebecca
It feels disconcerting to not have access to chat when combating a problem, especially a problem with getting in to chat!!
@Jin Sentences you never expect to hear
@Jin Guess the eyes on Main are just too small to notice the red.
@Iszi yeah. i tried diff shades of red too
5:08 PM
@Jin - should I pop a post on meta re getting a "go to Blog" button on the main Sec.SE page
@RoryAlsop sure. feel free to put up a site message
<offtopic> does anyone else think our shortened site name sounds kinda cool, or is it just me...
(hint say out loud SEC.SE)
@RoryAlsop Shame on you! Take that over to The Comms Room where it belongs.
@Jin Was meaning more of a permanent button on our front page...
5:10 PM
@Jin I think @RoryAlsop is suggesting we have a "blog" link somewhere alongside the "chat" and "meta" links.
@RoryAlsop hm i think we'll have the "blog" link looking to the security blog instead of stackexchanges.
but meanwhile what you can do is create a promotional ad banner
so it will appear on the sidebar sometimes. not a solution you were looking for though
if you want to get a lot of eyeballs fast, i suggest use the system message box
@Jin That is what I meant - just the security blog. But yes, for now I'll use a system message
@RoryAlsop i think the new blog post is great for the sys msg today. it'd explain the new look too
@RoryAlsop i think 80%+ of the users probably weren't even aware of the new design change, since they don't visit meta often
Hey, the Tron lines are still there! Wow. I just barely noticed them!
@Iszi yeah i faded them out some. it was competing with the logo
5:19 PM
Q: IT Security SE Logo Wallpaper

IsziJust wanted to post here, to officially request something that was mentioned in chat: An IT Security StackExchange wallpaper. I think the main site's "banner logo" (including: lion, shield, starburst, wings, "Tron lines", banner) would look great against its current backdrop color, as a full-s...

Just so @Jin doesn't forget. ;-) Also, so everyone has an easy-ish place to find them when they're available.
@RoryAlsop, the community promotion ads that Jin mentioned: blog.stackoverflow.com/2011/05/community-promotion-ads
@RebeccaChernoff is there a promo ad thread on meta.security?
@Jin Here's an example of the poor header fonts. I'm guessing it's a font incompatibility: i.imgur.com/iB8VF.png
@ScottPack which font? you mean for question titles?
@Jin The main header, where it lists myname, badges, review, meta, etc
5:26 PM
@ScottPack hmm the font stack is Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif
@Jin not yet, but there could be if I hear a peep of a request. (;
Too bad flag weight can't go toward privileges like casting close votes.
@RebeccaChernoff how does that work then?
@RebeccaChernoff peep?
@ScottPack what OS are you on?
5:27 PM
@Jin Fedora 14
@RoryAlsop which part?
I'm just reading @Robert's community promotion post, and I don't quite see how it works with regard to promoting the site/blog
This is odd. Could be just me, but it seems random posts in @StackSecurity are still marked with the "sketchy" logo.
@StackSecurity, The Stack Exchange network
622 tweets, 101 followers, following 0 users
@ScottPack ok i put in a fix. it will use arial
@Iszi i think that's just a twitter glitch
@RoryAlsop you could create a promotion ad for the blog
5:31 PM
@RebeccaChernoff Ahh - am getting a better idea by reading the ones already there on Ubuntu etc
@Jin Same. Not overly concerned. Just noting the oddity.
@Iszi it's odd indeed.
@Rebecca Can you please create a promo ad thread for us - peep
Can't wait for that wallpaper, 'cause I'm totally going to use it at work!
@Jin I suppose it's also possible I don't have one of those fonts installed. I'll look into it
5:32 PM
PEEP! q:
@ScottPack yeah i just checked, you don't have verdana.. but it should fall back to a nice sans-serif font on your OS though
@Jin Does that show up in the logs, or did you just check to see if verdana is installed by default on this distro? The 3rd option creeps me out a bit :)
Stop hacking the security folks, @Jin. >_<
@ScottPack i just googled for web safe fonts to make sure if verdana is one of them
it is web safe for windows and mac, but not unix
5:34 PM
i don't know which one your OS ended up picking. but i put arial after verdana. so you'll pick up Arial for sure.
all OSes have Arial
At least we don't have to reasonably deal with web safe colou?rs anymore
@ScottPack or design for dialup users..
or design in 600x800
@Jin Don't you still have to do that, for the netbook audience?
@Jin Cool, thanks. All too often I end up feeling like the special case when these kinds of things come up. I try really hard to convince myself that a reasonable portion of our user base is probably using a linux. :)
@Iszi no. netbooks can handle 1024px res
5:36 PM
@Jin About 3 years ago one of my friends had to put in a dial-up safe version of their web site. Poor guy.
@ScottPack did it open up a portal that allowed him to travel back in time to 1995?
Oh. Been so long since I've worked at anything less than 1280x1024, that the netbooks feel like 600x800.
@Iszi all of our sites are designed for minimum 1024px res
@Jin Unfortunately, not.
this is the new captcha page btw: security.stackexchange.com/captcha
5:40 PM
I see the 404 is still nice and lazy.
oh i haven't not done the 404 image :)
i ran out of time.
so please post more 404 image suggestions in the design thread
Ugh! I just thought of a langoleer, except the head is our fancy new lion.
Shit. I'm not sure I'll be able to sleep tonight :(
@Jin RE: "popular resolutions" - I don't do web/app design, so I'm not intimately familiar with what's "popular" these days.
As far as I'm concerned, 1680x1050 is the only true resolution
1024×1024, 1280×800, 1280×1024, 1440×900, 1680×1050, 1920×1080, 1920×1200
i'm surprised they don't have wallpaper size for mobile
5:46 PM
Sorry, @Jin, you have about 6 too many in there.
@ScottPack ha
i use 2560x1440 on both of my monitors
Who the heck has a 1:1 aspect ratio? 1024x1024? Never heard of it!
I'm actually running at 1920x1080 and 1680x1050 on mine. I don't much care for the discrepancy, but that's what happens when you buy off state contracts. One quarter they decide to standardize on 23", every other time it's 22". WTG guys.
@ScottPack i used to have a smaller dell monitor as my side monitor. the discrepancy drove me nuts since i do a lot of graphics stuff.
also different gamma drove me crazy too
@Jin I'll bet. Thankfully I'm mostly dealing with data processing and the like, so I can reasonably treat them as entirely different work spaces. Different gammas would drive me absolutely nuts, though.
5:52 PM
@Jin I have identical monitors - same exact model - and I can't seem to match color settings between the two. I feel your pain.
ohhh themed chat :P
@Mvy Welcome to the party.
OOhh it's nice all over security :P
For a while I had two VP930s and a VP912. Two absolutely GORGEOUS displays...and the 912.
Welcome back @Mvy
@Mvy Thanks for catching up. ;-P
5:53 PM
hey hey :D
Ohh favicon of meta is wrong
Q: Protecting your self from a malcious VPN.

RookI am connecting to a VPN server that has been compromised and is under the complete control of an attacker. The virtual network its self contains numerous attackers waiting for a new target. What steps should be taken to protect myself in this hostile environment?

...umm... don't connect?
@Mvy do a hard refresh
@Mvy @Jin posted a workaround for that earlier. Hang on...
Sometimes I really wish you could ignore a user
@Mvy - Go here, then hard-refresh: cdn.sstatic.net/securitymeta/img/favicon.ico
aaahhh better :P
Maybe we should just put the resolution in a script and run imagick on them?
(for wallpaper)
for the wallpaper, i think an easy solution would be to create the logo in the center, and people can pad extra spacing to fill out whatever res they want
@ScottPack Presume you're referring to a certain chess piece/avian creature?
Trusted user are 20k?????
5:59 PM
yes. it's the official cut off used on all graudated sites
@Mvy Welcome to the world of the Graduated SE sites.
Oh well no, that standard. As SO. I misread :P
10k is for mod tools :P
Is there an official tweet about graduation? or we are waiting for blog post?
@Iszi I don't know what you're talking about.
@Mvy - Blog post is up, and tweets have gone out from some mods, @JeffAtwood, and others.
just launched and fully public: Q&A for Information Security professionals http://t.co/gGSbrHT
6:01 PM
And not from stacksecurity??
@stackSecurity is just a bot
Ah crap, I forgot to hook up blogs to twitter accounts after I made sure gaming's tweet worked.
@Mvy Yeah, we'll be relying on mods a little more for a while. I just counted 11 users with vote-to-close rights (3 of which are diamonds)
@RebeccaChernoff WTG
6:02 PM
@ScottPack There's always flagging.
@Mvy Go
@Iszi Yeah, it's rather unfortunate, but they'll be more flagging for a while as we build up our repped user pool again.
@Mvy WT = Way To, not What The
Ah, yes, that :)
6:04 PM
I've managed to teach my 2 year old to use that phrase, btw. It's really adorable to hear her say it.
@ScottPack Like I said, I wish flag weights could count toward privs like close votes.
@Iszi Instead of just a badge? Yeah. I think it will cause the flags to be more visible to mods, though I don't really know.
There was some kind of proposition on meta for this
@ScottPack Pretty sure flags are plenty visible to mods. But, where's the real incentive for us to flag?
Q: Consider flag weight as well as reputation for earning moderation tools

Won'tUsers who have shown they are responsible wielders of moderator flags should be able to access moderator tools at lower reputation levels.

6:07 PM
Q: What kind of nefarious deeds can IP address Spoofing be used for?

I found this article, which seems pretty good but was written in 2003 so I'm not sure how up to date it is. Can IP address spoofing still be used for: Denial of Service attacks Man in the middle attacks Are there other types of attacks this can be used for?

@Mvy Seems there's no response from SEI on that thread. :-(
that question is "untagged"
causing the hover to be blank
@Jin I think it got migrated?
hmm maybe we should put in a check so untagged, migrated questions don't get tag hover box
I'm fair positive it got migrated
6:08 PM
it is migrated
@Iszi I'll flag it for discussion – Marc Gravell♦ May 20 at 9:48
@Mvy Sorry.... That's another issue that hasn't been handled yet, if it ever will be - distinguishing SEI from regular diamond mods.
Feel free to start anew, or I don't know. But I agree :P
I know there was a thread on that, I just can't find it.
What? Must have 10 seconds between searches? What if you just can't get your terms right?
Earlier I spent 10 minutes trying to figure out why 'graphiz' wasn't available on el5. Fun fact: There's actually a 'v' in there.
6:17 PM
Oh by the way @RebeccaChernoff nobody thought of creating an official twitter list with all SE twitter accounts?
I think that SE main account is following all of them. It should be easy to do it.
On @StackExchange I think?
IIRC we can follow the timeline of each list. So we could see all SE notifications
wihout being obliged to follow all sites
Humm @Jin I think you should change the profile description. It's really dark don't you think?
Well all my chat rooms have closed again... :S
Hopefully the rejoin favorite is here to save the day :P
Hm. I think I just screwed myself. I installed the corefonts package (to get verdana) and now chat's all fixed width.
what is default font of chat?
oh verdana :P
since css.body says it :P
@Jin The list is missing (at least) 1366x768 which is becoming quite common
My netbook is a 800x480 and that's quite painful with today's Web
6:32 PM
@ThomasPornin What's that? A double-wide?
@Iszi It's 16:9 ratio
@ThomasPornin Indeed. That's what my x100e uses.
@Mvy When I ruffled about the non-web-safeness he added Arial to the stack. I had just forgotten what Arial looked like.
I think the MacBook Air uses it
also, that's what netbook tend to do when they go over 1024x600
That's what I noticed as well. It looked like, at least a year ago, all the cheap 10.1" and lower used 1024x600, and the nicer ones used 1366x768
I miss the 4:3 aspect ratio
6:35 PM
I miss my Super VGA!
it was the butter back in the day..
@ThomasPornin I don't. Still have it at work.
I think it was a good ratio for a portable system
Now only the iPad has it
I'll add the "top ten" to my wallpaper request thread.
so... at the risk of being lynched here...
Are Macs more secure than PCs?
I use Macs, and i just have the basic firewall up. is that enough?
Security is about configurations not systems
6:37 PM
@Jin No. But MacOS may be deemed more secure than Windows (under the right light, that is),
well not always about systems :P
I am of the opinion that no, properly configured, modern operating system is any more secure than any other.
@ThomasPornin I just assumed because Apple market share is still tiny compared to Windows, therefore not enough hackers are interested in hacking them. not necessarily more secure.
Apple has always fallen back on the, "We're not a big enough market share for kids to hack on." as their most compelling reason for that statement.
For the best network security measure, please refer to my logo proposition :P
6:38 PM
However, the recent MacDefender issues should demonstrate that something is changing.
@ScottPack Ah, there may be some technicality around the "modern" term
@ThomasPornin I purposely use grey language whenever possible :)
@ScottPack i heard the analogy where Macs are like houses on a remote farm with front door open, and windows are like steelbared apts in the urban ghetto
The worst security issue is still the same : users
Just wrote any malware you want on any system you want and send a mail : Hey I found this very cool picture: check it out!
And there you are :P
@Jin I used to have an Alpha running FreeBSD as home server
It was so secure that even me had trouble running code on it
6:41 PM
Sad that 1024x768 is still #1.
@Iszi Eeeeek
The most obvious issue that I see with Mac is that there is no real centralized management. So even if your company is managing desktops, what tools that do exist for OSX is pretty piss poor.
eyes bleeding
@Jin How are we defining "PC"? Strictly speaking, a Mac is a PC.
I mean, I had to write a shell script that captured and parsed output in order to do automatic updates
6:43 PM
@Iszi i guess i mean Windows
@Iszi Just stop right there. I used to fight that battle back in the 90s. It's not worth it.
I never understood when, and why Windows became "PCs"
@ScottPack Even going a step narrower, "PC" still includes Linux/Unix/etc.
because technically, as @Iszi said, Apple is also a "personal computer"
Like PC = Personal Computer?
6:44 PM
@Jin Exactly.
@Iszi Yeah, it's pretty silly. I try to actually use Mac/Windows/Linux in order to get away from that.
A PC is a piece of hardware. Mac/Windows/Linux/etc. are software.
Here, let me go find some more hair, the one you're working with is getting awfully thin.
Security Stack Exchange graduated today!: After 242 days in Beta, we now have over 3000 users and an active comm... http://bit.ly/q4nJCB
6:46 PM
@RebeccaChernoff Sweet!
I forgot to change it to title only, but in the future it'll just be the title and link.
@RebeccaChernoff you took over the bot
nah, 1 minute ago via twitterfeed
Man, that blog theme looks nyasty
@ScottPack won't be that way for long :)
6:47 PM
hey hey: use protocols to your advantage :P
@ScottPack and gasp... how quickly you turn your back on Sketchy!
@Jin If being American has taught me anything, it's turn your back on the past as soon as possible. There's only bad news back there :)
@ScottPack the Team America theme song is playing in my head right now..
@Mvy - Updated the wallpaper question with your resolution.
6:58 PM
@Iszi comment deleted :P

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