@user 170039 - I was not aware that you are unable to see the deleted answers. I think they are very relevant to the question. Answers like "can multiplication be defined without addition?" and the one about Peano's Axioms are exactly on point.

I have not mastered PM. I only reached the point where I can recognize PM's an extremely valuable source of intellectual stimuli. Take this answer of yours for example, I think you are right on point, because mathematics first and foremost is about the art of implication.

That was the answer to Peano's Axioms.

See you next time.

Notice that, in this answer about Peano's Axioms, PM's symbols are exactly the same as those used by modern textbooks. There is absolutely no reason to delete this one.

@GeorgeChen, Interesting that I've never seen you demanding explanations for upvotes, or votes to reopen; why single out downvotes and votes to close for condemnation regarding if they are not explicitly explained?

@amWhy, Upvotes are self-explanatory; if they agree with you, there is no need to repeat what you've said. Down-votes can be for all kinds of reasons.

Chat room evidence has shown that some people called for down votes to negate upvotes so that they can cast delete votes; this kind of downvotes were persecution motivated, and unless the down-voter left an explanation, it was equivalent to backstabbing.

@GeorgeChen Just as upvotes might be cast only to negate downvotes, and upvotes can be "because I like you and want you to be my friend." So, downvotes are just as self-explanatory as upvotes; you ask that downvoters and upvoters explain their votes, or you have no case.

@amWhy - I don't know which part of the world you are from. There seems to be culture differences here. Down votes and delete votes put people down; people here don't do that.

It is definitely scandalous to call for down vote for the purpose of delete. Since my answers were up voted, some people see value in them, therefore it should not be deleted.

No, I don't think they put people down; rather, they indicate that a particular question or answer is problematic. You, I believe, are invested in taking them personally. That's unfortunate.

@amWhy - Downvote puts people down. If you don't feel it, you it has some thing to do with your part of the world. if you really think it necessary to down vote someone, it is better to give an explanation, otherwise malice cannot be ruled out.

I do not use downvotes for the sole purpose of deletion. Whether it's a question or an answer. I think you have a rather overzealous need to see the world in only black and white. (All good or all bad, what is right and what is wrong, I'm right, and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. Open your mind and grow up.

Again, it is unsportsmanlike to down-vote and delete others while remaining anonymous themselves. Which part of the world are you from?

No, I don't like to receive downvotes or close votes. When I do receive them, I feel badly. But that doesn't mean the folks who cast the votes set out to hurt me. Corrections, folks pointing out errors, etc., aren't attempts to hurt a person, but actually improve them, if they so choose to take the challenge. It is okay to be upset about downvotes. No way around that. But I also get upset when it snows outside, because then I have to snow. You need to learn to live with disappointment, ..

It seems that there are common ethos in my world do not apply to your world. We don't recklessly put people down. We lavish compliments on people, and compliments are well-taken.

and in particular, in your case, you need to hold in check your ego, and remain available for reality checks on your perceptions of your contributions, and others perception of them. The further you are unaligned with the reality, the more it will hurt when you are told you are in error, or .....

hi

@amWhy - I am really curious which part of the world you are from. There indeed seems to be a culture difference.

Can you tell me which continent?

@GeorgeChen See, you are already, given a short exchange here, dividing the world into your world and into my world. I have more in common with you than you think, and if you decide to reject any and all I say because you have decided we are from two different worlds, that's your loss, not mine. I can only try to remain open; but If I am shut out by anyone, I have done all I can do.

@TheGreatDuck Hello!

@amWhy - In my world, criticisms are sandwiched in compliments. Depending on personal relation, you can go direct sometimes. But down-vote and delete without explanation is backstabbing. Backstabbing is scandal. Don't you agree?

Can you tell me which country you are from?

Are we allowed to edit deleted questions?

@TheGreatDuck Yours? or rather "one's own"? No problem

either

thanks

mind taking a gander at this then

math.stackexchange.com/questions/2499002/…

@GeorgeChen I am not determined nor confined to the continent I was born in, the countries I've lived in, the color of my skin, my gender, the color of my eyes, etc. Why do you believe that you cannot know me or speak with me without knowing such things?

@amWhy to be fair, it is sometimes nice to know where the person is that you are talking to, if only so when you discuss things you know their geographic perspective. I.E. where they literally are located relative to the subject.

I dont personally care but some might

as for last name, that could be cause he wants to look you up

@amWhy aren't you a professor? Perhaps he's checking your credentials. XD

@TheGreatDuck I agree, when folks aren't hindered by assumptions about other cultures, or races, etc, it's not a problem. But I am more reticent with folks who I know have spoken words which any reasonable person would consider biased (that's the nicest way I can put it) in ways for which I will remain cautious, in this case.

@amWhy - the fact that you can't feel the off-putting effects of down-votes makes me wonder what your culture background is. You do agree that there are culture differences between peoples, don't you?

@TheGreatDuck The software prevents you from editing self-deleted questions, see here: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/178760/…

@MartinSleziak our own. when I go to edit mine it pops up saying it isnt allowed but yet still lets me

@GeorgeChen George go back and read what I've said. In no way is it a "fact" that I "can't feel the off-putting effects of down-votes". Please don't cast assumptions upon me which are not true.

"No, I don't like to receive downvotes or close votes. When I do receive them, I feel badly. "

amWhy - I feel bad when I realized that I accidentally put someone down. You don't seem to feel bad at all.

You seem to enjoy it.

You can feel bad for yourself when receiving down votes, but you don't seem to feel back for others when you down voting them.

@GeorgeChen you are taking downvotes too seriously

@GeorgeChen Again, you are attributing feelings to me that I do not have. I do feel badly for others, but I feel worse when I let learners down in allowing false premises (often their own) unchecked; In that respect I insist askers participate in their education (sharing their work, responding to questions in the comments), and when I see problems or misguided and unhelpful answers, I feel badly for the asker, because they may be mislead.

Some people upvoted others and left no comment because they don't want to look like they wanted to be reciprocated. That is called chivalry; I totally understand that kind of nobility of spirit.

@amWhy - Again, a comment goes along way. Down-votes without explanation cannot rule out malice. There is the culture differences here. Don't you see other people's hard work deserve respect?

@amWhy - can you tell us your culture background?

In this part of the world, we don't recklessly put people down.

@TheGreatDuck - Some people called for down-votes to negate upvoted answers so that they can delete. This kind of conspiracy is scandalous.

@GeorgeChen lol

You are addressing nothing I am saying and fail to respond to my most recent comments. This is not a conversation. This is you talking to yourself, not addressing what I have said, repeating yourself as you have been doing since you posted on meta, even as I try to address what you are saying. I cannot in good conscience continue this way, unilaterally. Share your own culture, country, name, continent before expecting others to do as you demand.

that doesnt even work

having upvoted answers and therefore being unable to delete means that they were upvoted period

ever

not that their current rep is positive

@GeorgeChen And some people called for up-votes to negate downvoted answers to please the answerer. This kind of conspiracy is scandalous.

@amWhy - See, there is the cultural difference: We are very generous with compliments. We raise people to heavens with compliments, and we don't think it is scandalous to lavish praise on people.

@amWhy - Again, don't you think if it is unsportsmanlike to down-vote and delete others while remaining anonymous yourself?

There is the cultural difference.

Can you do me a favour?

@GeorgeChen are you dense. They are employing sarcasm to prove a point.

I'm simply ignoring George Chen in the chat rooms. Perhaps he needs to admit the only downvotes or deletions he's concerned with are those of the answers he's written. He cares only for himself. That doesn't sound like he knows the culture he is claiming.

@GeorgeChen I know where they are from and it is not relevant. Stop trying to be a creep.

@amWhy honestly, he comes across as someone who might retaliate in real life.

@GeorgeChen she tells people plenty of things. We just dont tell jerks personal information. If you persist in this, you will be reported.

@TheGreatDuck - We don't recklessly refer other people as jerks.

We do have cultural differences here.

@GeorgeChen that wasnt reckless

@TheGreatDuck - It is reckless and insulting. If you can't feel it, that must have some thing to do with cultural differences.

no it is because you are objectively being uncivil.

@GeorgeChen don't ask for personal info of another person if it's kinda clear they're not sharing it

@TheGreatDuck - We don't recklessly make accusations to put others down.

@GeorgeChen even if it is clearly true?

@amWhy on the other hand, that's kinda rude too

everybody should just chill here

@Riker you dont have the whole context here

@TheGreat Don't you think it is unsportsmanlike to down-vote and delete others while remaining anonymous themselves?

@TheGreatDuck doesn't really matter, rude words are rude

it isnt rude

she is merely saying that is disengaging

george chen if i understand correctly made a post on meta saying that people MUST leave comments when downvoting or they are being rude and insensitive and then insisted to ask for AmWhy's last name and location.

specifically because she downvoted and closed his post

and claimed that she had "cultural differences" and that she was being insensitive to his culture or some garbage

@Riker we are asked to ignore users, and not engage when it is clear we've hit a wall. Better to let a user know what's up is better than ignoring, but not saying so, and letting them get madder and madder because they continue, and aren't answered. I have held the high-ground in not getting engaged in conversation that is going no where.

and I took the high ground of not ignoring such a user and letting them continue unobserved but flagged them when they got snarky with me

I've answered only your needless comment, and have remained "chill" throughout. Don't tell me to not ignore, when I am told to ignore such instances.

^^^exactly

@Riker is there something (other than ignoring) which was rude on AmWhy's part?

Perhaps it would have been better if I had simply stopped at "I am now ignoring user..." Period. I can understand that, @Riker.

I think I (or we?) have flagged enough of Mr. Chen's comment, that he is temperarily suspended for an hour.

@JohnMa it was not seen by the mods

@TheGreatDuck Not everything are handled by the mods anyway (but the flagging does attracted some mod from other SE sites to join this). If the mods want to see the comments, I guess they have the power to see deleted comments.

Please disperse. This room is now closed.

The starboard on the right is almost entirely full of vitriol and unnecessary rude comments about your fellow users. Be Nice - that is not a choice, that is a rule, and not following it will land you all in hot water.