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01:33
0
Q: Should we allow character comparison here?

xjshiyaShould we allow comparison of anime characters here? For example, "Which character is better? Character X or Character Y?" Like, Light Yagami (Death Note) VS. Lelouch Vi Britannia Others might ask something like that or put them (characters that are being compared) into a situation where t...

 
7 hours later…
08:37
0
Q: Should we allow the first person writing?

TartoriAs i observed Madara Uchiha used in many questions about Madara the first person. Like "stated that I had indeed transplanted" It is referred to Madara and not to himself (I guess he isn't Madara in "real life"). Should we allow the first person as character in questions or answers? It could get...

 
2 hours later…
10:47
1
Q: Creating too many rules

SF.As I read the meta page, I see increasing number of "Should we allow...?" questions. We're in a phase when we are creating rules about the site. The natural reaction is that we see a question which arises our doubt - seems poorly written, barely on topic, common knowledge, not specific enough - ...

 
6 hours later…
16:28
Pffft that tobi, thinking he can boss me around
17:26
I like the string of meta questions posted to chat... it does sortof reinforce SFs question :)
I'm still struggling with meta.anime.stackexchange.com/questions/150, honestly...
My instincts are towards objectively factual questions... but then I would basically have to reject half of the front page of questions. So I suspect that instinct is a leftover from SO and japanese.SE
Naruto is out, btw. For those who're interested
@jkerian Problem is, this is a manga site
17:44
@Alenanno You won't nominate me so to not give Madara any power? :P
@MadaraUchiha Exactly! lol But actually you said you wanted to self-nominate no? I can't deny you that pleasure. :P
@Alenanno Heh, sure :)
@MadaraUchiha :D Plus I just nominated two. I can't nominate everyone! ... Or can I?
nominates all users
that would make the voting... complicated
lol
Yeah
2
Q: Pro-Tempore Moderator Nominations

AlenannoWell, we've been a week into Private Beta. According to the Moderator Pro Tempore, the SE Team will pick up (usually 3) users to become Moderators more or less a week into Public Beta, until we graduate, so let's start with nominations. After graduation there will be actual elections where users ...

Thanks, butterfly. U_U
xD
@MadaraUchiha Link meta too in your nomination, like I did.
:P
Without the sup... :P (I removed it). :D
@Alenanno Done :)
-_-
17:58
It's too small!
:P
lol
@MadaraUchiha You can rollback if you prefer.
:D
Nah, it's fine
Good luck! :)
And if you win, don't use Rinnegan or Sharingan, thanks.
Especially don't use it for winning! :P
@Alenanno Can I use Uni?
@MadaraUchiha Uni?
Maybe it's
something I don't know yet?
lol
My unicorn of course!
18:02
Ah XD
lmao
18:38
hey there!
@Alenanno I've cast my votes!
@JNat Are you going to nominate yourself?
Not sure
the other candidates are very good
Try it!
:P
18:42
especially in accumulated rep in other se sites
Well, when you're sure.
The last word is SE's
So...
Votes, rep are all help, but the SE Team will decide.
I am a rather new user
maybe the community will prefer more experienced users
but I am still making up my mind! =D
What do you think about this?
@MadaraUchiha?
(Click on the time indication)
@Alenanno Yeah?
Look above. :P
18:48
@Alenanno Agree
I don't think it is a duplicate
Rinne Tensei is even more limited than Edo tensei in this case
Because you need an actual body to channel the soul back into
Ah no... Wait, perhaps it's not a dupe...
It's a different technique.
If you look at the answers you'll notice they're quite different
I added spoilers. I would have hated it if someone told me that death.
18:52
@Alenanno It's not a duplicate. The question is asking about two separate methods for bringing the user back. Even if the answers are identical that doesn't mean the questions are identical. At best it means they are related.
@Alenanno indeed
@Wipqozn Yes, I agree it's not a dupe now. :)
@JNat It's perhaps the saddest one along with that of ... Well, you know the Immortals Saga. (Don't say the name.)
lol
@Alenanno agreed
but today's manga chapter also brought about another unexpected and rather dramatic death
Ok. Don't say it. T_T
it was a sad moment...
I won't
I hate spoilers myself
18:55
I better be careful about it.
never fear
Ok, see you in 3 months! Bye! disappears lol
:P
lol
@Alenanno Maybe the older question's title should also be changed? I don't really know what constitutes spoilers because I've never read or watched Naruto.
True.
18:56
@LoganM agreed
Done.
The comments under my answer carry spoilers though.
If I was a mod I would've bombarded it.
lol
@JNat Oh, today's chapter os out? reads it
@Wipqozn it is
Best/worst episode title for spoilers: (your favorite character here) dies! A sad moment!
2
@Alenanno You do know you can hide all questions with a specific tag, correct?
19:01
@Wipqozn They are not hidden. They're grayed out.
But yes I know. :P
@Alenanno There's a hide ignore tags button in your profile, that will actually hide them.
And that fake title I wrote was meant to be a title for an Anime Episode, not an SE question.
I know.
Then I fail to see why you asked me that question...
@JNat It felt a bit anti-climatic imo :/
19:03
@Alenanno I thought you didn't realize that character died, and that question spoiled it for you.
@Wipqozn Ah, no, I added the spoilers for other people. I did know about his death. :)
But I would've hated it if it was me.
Has he died in the anime yet?
I don't follow the anime at all, so I have no idea where it is.
Yes.
Wait, yes, I remember watching one of the fights which take place after.
The Anime is after Naruto trains with Killer Bee... Right there.
19:07
@Krazer It was. But still quite sad
@Alenanno the anime is after Naruto and Bee pass the Raikage and the Hokage. No?
@JNat Yes, now there is a filler.
So it's paused.
I think they should have made a big pause before the war
rather than several small ones mid-war
hm, spoilers are going to be a real pain for us to deal with, more so than any other site. Normally I'd say hide tags for a series you're not up to date on, but since the anime is often behind the manga that just isn't practical.
please DO NOT WORRY ABOUT SPOILERS.
2
19:11
Oh, that was unexpected.
@Alenanno lol
@Alenanno shog9 is always lurking.
your primary concern right now should be getting good, accurate information out there, NOT GOING OUT OF YOUR WAY TO OBSCURE IT
5
I'll be back
@Shog9 I agree 110%, which is exactly what I've been saying on meta. However, the hide tag feature has always been a good method for users to avoid spoilers. since the anime is always behind that just isn't going to work.
19:13
@Shog9 Shog, it's not like we're hiding everything. Just the "John Smith died" parts. I don't think that's going to ruin us.
@Alenanno the problem is that it could result in several identical titles.
4
Q: Why wasn't this character brought back with Edo Tensei?

MCeleyWas it ever explained why From my understanding, the summoner only needs a good bit of genetic material to bring someone back and

I agree we shouldn't be creating a spoiler-site though.
@Alenanno Sure, hiding small, tangential details is ok. Writing generic questions to obscure the topic isn't ok.
@Wipqozn The titles I created were still related to Naruto only. For example
> Why wasn't this character revived by Nagato?
@Alenanno The problem is that if someone asked the same question about a few more characters, and we did the same thing with the title, we'd have multiple questions with the same title floating around.
19:16
@Shog9 Ok that was not a major spoiler after all.
@Alenanno imo, that was not a spoiler at all
@Wipqozn Meh. If you're super-concerned about spoilers, hide the tag or just don't open the questions. Stay out of chat. Stay off The Internet. Otherwise, don't worry about it.
@JNat True. I just got overconcerned.
@Wipqozn I'm not expecting more titles of that sort. But if the problem arises, we can always find solutions, if needed.
@Alenanno And that's really what I'm worried about, that folks get so paranoid they turn Q&A into some sort of weird mad libs.
@Shog9 WE've had some really terrible titles on Arqade due to this.
19:19
I know
@Shog9 It's not about being paranoid. It really sucks to have deaths being spoiled if you're following a series. Even in normal series or movies. At least deaths should be spoiler-protected.
@Shog9 The thing about spoilers, is that they cause "irreversible" damage
mad libs?
If we don't solve the problem early, we may cause "damage" to people.
@MadaraUchiha No, they don't. People just think they do, so they get all twisted up about it and make everything worse as a result.
19:21
@Shog9 I know I wouldn't want to be told things that happened very later in the series if I haven't reached there yet
Xeo
Xeo
@Shog9 Wait, how do spoilers not cause irreversible damage?
@Shog9 Do you agree that at least deaths should be hidden?
@Xeo You're confusing imagined damage with actual damage.
@MadaraUchiha So don't read them. This isn't your co-workers standing by your cube talking about a series you haven't finished yet, it's stuff you have to seek out, open, and read.
@Alenanno No
If it's in the title, there's nothing to seek.
It's right there in the open.
19:23
@Alenanno I agree
@Shog9 Not when it's titles
Xeo
Xeo
Maybe we should just put the tags on ignore for all the series that we haven't watched yet.
@Shog9 I'm mostly referring to spoilers in titles. I did exactly this for A Song of Ice and Fire over at SFF until I was caught up. The special problem we face is that since an anime is almost always behind the manga it's going to result in anyone just watching the anime needing to avoid participating answering questions until the series is over. It would be nice if we could come up with a method to allow anime users to still take part in the site.
@Alenanno @MadaraUchiha @JNat hide tags.
@Xeo lol, that'd be a pretty long list for some of us :)
19:24
@Wipqozn Eh? No. Everybody has the right to answer questions without having anything ruined.
@Wipqozn I am as far ahead as you can be in naruto. So it is not a problem for me.
I just hate being spoiled
so I try to spare others that damage (to the story)
@Alenanno Yes, but making title vague and confusing hurts the entire site.
@Alenanno agreed
@Alenanno How is it possible to answer a question about a spoiler if you haven't see the relevant part yourself anyway?
@JNat That's great, I do the same, but good titles are more important than ruining a series for someone.
Xeo
Xeo
19:26
@Wipqozn Erm.
@Wipqozn I don't think I agree with that
@Mysticial I have answered a question about an Anime I didn't care about. :P
Xeo
Xeo
Don't mind if I disagree there.
@Mysticial In the other cases, I didn't read.
@Wipqozn something in the middle perhaps
19:26
@Wipqozn Then we should find a way to make it searchable but without spoiling anything. Can we find a compromise?
@JNat You can have a good title without including spoilers, and if you can, you Should. But in situations where you can only get a good title by including a spoiler you should include the spoiler.
Xeo
Xeo
Can't we just have actual spoiler titles? You can see it's a spoiler and the tag says which series. (Note: I just joined the discussion and did not read the backlog, so no idea if this was already discussed.)
@Alenanno I still think it's a pretty rare situation. I can't think of too many cases where you'd be able to answer a plot question involving a spoiler without actually knowing that part of the plot itself.
@Wipqozn Ok there I agree with you.
@Wipqozn I understand
19:28
@Xeo What do you mean by "Spoiler titles"?
Xeo
Xeo
Well, just like the >! in posts, it's hidden by default.
No, that would be too much, I'm afraid...
@Xeo Ah, okay.
I actually think that some spoilers are needed in title in order for SEO.
No
Just make your titles not spoilerous
19:29
@MadaraUchiha I agree
It's not that complicated, not difficult
Sure it might spoil it for some when the question gets bumped to the homepage. But SE is about largely search engine traffic right?
And if a title is spoilerous, you have editors to unspoilerify it
@MadaraUchiha If it's still good. A good title with spoilers should always be used in place of a bad title without spoilers.
Xeo
Xeo
@Mysticial Yeah, people searching for a discussion on a spoiler are more likely to find it if the spoiler is included in the title.
19:29
@Wipqozn That I agree.
@Xeo Exactly...
Xeo
Xeo
That doesn't change my opinion that we should have spoiler titles, where the title and the question excerpt is hidden, while the tags are not.
@Xeo That would be too much. It would make the site a whole spoiler-hide-thing.
@Alenanno I'm assuming he meant make part of the title a spoiler.
@Alenanno unless questions regarding every first episode of a series... lol
19:31
lol
i.e. "Why wasn't <hidden> revived with the Edo TEsnsi?"
It would be a pretty drastic technical change to add spoiler hiding boxes to titles.
@Wipqozn can you even do that?
@Mysticial Yes.
I'd prefer regular titles with good phrasing.
19:32
@JNat No, he's saying we should.
ok
If the dev team is already choking on unicode tags. I suppose spoiler titles are gonna be a mess.
If you need to make a title horrible just for the sake of not spoiling, it's not worth it.
And definitely not for a single site which has just started.
@MadaraUchiha Exactly. Our biggest problem is going to be deciding when we cross that line.
4
Q: Why wasn't this character brought back with Edo Tensei?

MCeleyWas it ever explained why From my understanding, the summoner only needs a good bit of genetic material to bring someone back and

This title is borderline imo.
19:34
Maybe we should have a FAQ entry about it
But it's certainly not terrible.
Warning! This site contains spoilers!
@Wipqozn TBH, I actually think that title is close to unsearchable unless the character's name is in the title.
Check the Spoiler discussions on Scifi SE.
@Mysticial If you dump the original title it will turn up this question as the first reslt, which is why I think it's borderline. Remember, google and the site search the body and the title/.
The main problem with that title is if we a get a few users asking the same thing about different characters.
19:36
@Alenanno At first glance, it seems largely unresolved there too.
Whether you like it or not, some people will get spoiled
@Mysticial But we can use the same experience. :P
I have to go now, though. I'll see you later.
If I only just began to watch Hellsing, and a question about the Hellsing ending arrives, I will get spoiled
About question titles
@MadaraUchiha It may be wise to make a meta detailing how to make spoiler-free titles (and proper spoiler mark down use), and knowing when you should include spoilers, and then link to it in the FAQ.
The line should be crossed when there's a hard limit that can be passed, such as the case where an ongoing series has both manga and anime running parallelly.
19:37
We have a few metas about spoilers floating around, but we should try to take all the information and put them all into one meta.
For instance, a question's title can ask Why Jirayia wasn't revived with Edo Tensei, because that event (where Edo Tensei was used), already happened in the anime
@MadaraUchiha The difference between manga and anime is the unique problem we face. On other sites the "hide tags" feature is the ideal solution for users to avoid spoilers for a series they're not up to date on. This solution is less than ideal for us though, since anime only users will always be behind.
Let's take a look at what situations would it benefit, hurt the reader:
1. If the show is currently airing, and has just finished. You can expect *many* people to have not watched that final "spoiler" episode.
2. If the show is very old, you can expect the vast majority of the people who care have seen it all the way through.

In the case of 1, spoilers in titles are potentially damaging. In the case of 2, spoilers are probably fine because the only people likely stumble on the question are those actively searching for it.
@MadaraUchiha This would require us to go back and edit old titles though.
@Wipqozn It wouldn't.
19:40
@Wipqozn Which may or may not be a good thing. If there's a better alternative, let's hear it.
If you're asking about an Anime event, of an ongoing series, there's little spoiler potential
@MadaraUchiha It would. Next week a new episode will come out for Naruto, and that line for "anime spoilers" is going to move up a bit. Any questions about the anime which are now behind the line will need to be edited.
@Wipqozn In other words, if we take this approach, we need to filter out "hot" shows.
@Mysticial If a show is old and finished we don't have a problem. Users can just hide all tags for that show.
@Wipqozn True. But it will require action on the user's part. So it may be a rough entry for new users. We can add it to the FAQ - but of course, nobody reads it anyway.
19:44
@Mysticial I fully support adding such an entry in the FAQ. However, we're not going to come up with any solution to help users avoid spoilers that doesn't require action on the users part.
@Wipqozn That's very true.
Look, anything that creates a shitty post or a shitty title is something you have to avoid. There's no guarantee that someone's gonna go back and fix it after it's no longer "current", and even if they did you're just "spoiling" it for folks who aren't watching / reading the stuff the day it comes out.
You either want to create a site full of information that's gonna be helpful to folks in perpetuity, or you're on the wrong site.
The only solution would be to never have spoilers in titles,but as we've already discussed, that's not always going to work.
@Shog9 That's correct.
@Wipqozn And I think it will rarely work as well. A question without a searchable title is as good as a dead question - unless it happens to be the most upvoted one on the site.
19:46
I'd argue we should add an entry to the FAQ
And that I know all too well from Stack Overflow.
And possibly even as a popup, to signal people about the spoilerish nature of the site
@Mysticial I know, that's what I said. Good title with spoilers > bad title without spoilers.
We can't do much more.
@Mysticial But there are situations where we can have a good title without spoilers. In those situations we should use said title.
19:47
@Wipqozn True. For those we don't have the problem anyway.
@Wipqozn Indeed, we should. However, educating new users won't be as easy.
As you said, "nobody reads the FAQ"
@MadaraUchiha Educating new users is never easy.
@MadaraUchiha I think you're confusing me with someone else :P
Because if user sees spoilers due to not reading the FAQ that's their own fault.
@Wipqozn As someone said :D
@Wipqozn Sure
I'm always in favor of "stinging" new users in order for them to learn
@Wipqozn Which is probably fine. Once they realize that they can hide tags, then they will. But the only issue is how to communicate to a new user that (s)he can hide tags.
Be it with downvotes, or spoilers, read the FAQ before you enter the site, or "suffer the consequences"
19:49
@Shog9 Can we edit the "How to Ask a Question" page to be specific to Animes.SE?
@Mysticial In the FAQ.
Like I said, if a user doesn't read the FAQ it's their own fault.
@Wipqozn Yeah, that's the job of the Pro-Tempo team, IIRC.
@Wipqozn We could make it even more obnoxious than the FAQ. Once a new user has used the site for "long enough", we can do a banner, "Seeing too many spoilers? Hide the tags for the shows you are currently watching!"
I know the average internet user doesn't read the FAQ on a site, and they get away with it, but we're Stack Exchange. We're supposed to have a higher standard for our user base than other places on the internet. With that in mind, I don't think expecting/requiring users to read the FAQ is too much.
@Mysticial So long as it doesn't require intervention on behalf of the SE team, I'm fine with that.
@Wipqozn And most people learn the hard way on SO. Which is fine - a lot of them get question-banned after a while.
Which reminds me... @Shog9: Can we edit the email our site sends to new users after they've been here for so long?
Because if we can edit the how to ask and the new user email that gives us two additional ways to communicate with users. The "how to ask" could include a brief paragraph on spoiler mark down, and to strive for a good title above all else, with a link to a more detailed meta on how to make good titles without spoilers, when you have no other choice, et cetera. The new user email could let us inform users about the hide tag feature, sine we could include a paragraph about how to use it.
19:54
@Wipqozn I don't think I ever got a new user email when I joined SO - or any of the other sites.
Speaking in ideals again, our 2k+ users should be active enough that we can catch bad titles and fix them quick enough so that it won't be a huge problem.
@Mysticial I got one on Arqade, but it may have just been because my shell is really shiny and I made an awesome answer.
@Wipqozn 2k+ you mean.
Oh, right. I'm thinking of closing privs.
@Wipqozn Same for the moderators we elect.
But yes. We need active 2K+
Do <2k users maintain editing privs throughout the beta?
19:57
@Wipqozn yes
Okay, good.
Hello
is it 500?
@Alenanno 'morning
By the way, we're on public beta now! :D
3
19:58
I need to find a way to get to 500 asap.
Everybody can edit. The difference is who can do it without suggesting and those who can suggest only.
Nope, I don't have editing privs.
I don't watch a lot of the long-running popular shows to be able to answer the popular questions.
@Alenanno Yeah, we're referring to the editing privilege.
@Mysticial I have a similiar problem. I haven't been an active anime watcher in a few years. I still read NAruto/Bleach, but nothing else is currently on my plate.
Yeah... the series to watch appears to be Naruto, if you want quite a bit of rep... hehe
19:59
Anime SE is Public!
All I've been able to do is to snipe questions about new shows - for which there are few questions about.
0
A: Are people aware of who Naruto's parents are?

Madara UchihaYes. After their names were revealed, it seems as if "suddenly" everyone knew about it. Even Gai, and even the Raikage mentioned his parents without them being mentioned earlier. That leads me to believe that people knew, and it was part of the taboo not to speak of it (or Kishimoto still hadn't...

@MadaraUchiha I think that was just a plot hole :P
3 mins ago, by Madara Uchiha
By the way, we're on public beta now! :D
=)
@Shog9 Ok I agree. But I don't think we should just get a "who cares" attitude. If the title is good without spoilers, then this should be the preferred choice. If the title can't help but have spoilers to be good, then I'm fine with it having spoilers.
@MadaraUchiha Ah didn't see that. :P
@Shog9 So how well did we do as a private beta? (in comparison to other sites)
20:02
@Alenanno =D
190+ users/questions doesn't really mean much without a comparison
@Mysticial That. I'm also interested to know, @Shog9
7
Anime & Mangaanime.stackexchange.com

Beta Q&A site for anime & manga fans.

Currently in public beta.

I wish I could have participated more though... Wasn't expecting questions in my shows to be so rare.
We'll have more questions with the site being public. :)
20:04
@Alenanno Your first concern should be writing a good title. If you do that and then realize there's a spoiler in it which doesn't need to be there for the title to still be good, ok, remove it. But always, always err on the side of having a good, specific, accurate title. If that means spoilers, oh well.
@Wipqozn which one?
@Wipqozn no
@Mysticial You did pretty well. There are some stats on the sidebar of the front page now.
Something like 80 questions/week is our bare minimum; if you can't hit that, you're not getting out of beta. Beyond that, quality seems reasonable, and you've all been good about talking out problems on your meta.
@Shog9 And in chat...
I donno, post-bot was giving you a run for your money...
;-P
:)
@Shog9 How is "avid" user defined?
@Mysticial put your mouse cursor over it, and it'll tell you
@Shog9 ahahaha I fail...
20:09
ah, so we made it into public beta? :)
Yep!
Have you guys met Uni, my unicorn?
Here's a picture of him in our backyard:
How many sites actually fail private beta?
I saw the email on my phone after a nap. it's probably the first email I've received since the private beta email (a week or so ago?) that isn't spammy. I almost missed it because I was about to give up on email.
@MadaraUchiha looool
20:11
@atlantiza lol... Have you seen the Mod nominations?
@Alenanno I just got online so I haven't checked much since this morning
@JNat I feed him with Nazi enriched plutonium, Sir Mittens is a Hashi clone I made for laughs.
@Alenanno I thought you said you didn't want to be mod on another site? :P
@MadaraUchiha sir mittens! awesome choice
20:15
@JNat =)
@atlantiza Actually someone else nominated me. And I said I would let others first before me and that I would step up if I was needed (or chosen).
:P
And I need the power for world domination, so I nominated myself :)
were rep requirements for certain privileges updated already? I used to be able to see up/downvote count on questions/answers but now it says i need 750 rep (~260 more than I currently have)
@atlantiza Yeah, we also can't CV anymore.
20:20
Yes. It's been raised.
@Mysticial well, I can in about 6 rep haha...
I was just looking through the sample questions from area51. a lot of them are really bad despite having "a lot" of votes.
"What are good anime cartoons to start with in [genre]?" well, that one only has 2 votes, but still
20:30
@atlantiza This is par for the course on Area51, sadly. The laziest, most generic stuff floats to the top.
@Shog9 maybe I'm spoiled because japanese culture was the first proposal I followed and it has a lot of good questions... area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/34330 if anybody wants to see
@atlantiza I just assumed they were crap in a language I couldn't read.
(I know, I know, lotsa english there)
that leaving-the-room sleigh animation gets me every time
@Wipqozn No, that can't be edited
20:42
@Shog9 What can be edited?
@MadaraUchiha something along the lines of questions, answers, tag wikis...
@atlantiza I mean in the FAQ, smarty pants.
well I think nothing right now, but I could be wrong. which is why I said what I did. :)
JLU's faq still looks completely vanilla to me despite the fact it's been in public beta for 567 days
@MadaraUchiha the top section of the FAQ, the various places that describe the "audience" for the site (where it says "anime and manga fans" right now) and (if need be) the little block of text that appears above an answer the first few times you post an answer on the site.
and, yeah, the stuff atl notes
@atlantiza kick off a discussion about it
it's up to the moderators to edit it, but they won't unless there's a clear need
@Shog9 regarding jlu or what? it doesn't bother me anymore... I don't even know who the mods are there
20:49
@atlantiza Dave and YOU
Amanda appears to have resigned
@jkerian so same as always... are they still active?
@atlantiza Join me in JLU chat if you want to chat about this...
(we probably shouldn't get into administrivia for a different site, in here)
@jkerian nah it's fine like I said it's not of too much concern to me since I barely visit jlu for now. I need to go make lunch anyway... I keep procrastinating...
haha...
So anyway
Are we (relatively) clear about the spoiler issue?
20:52
I actually did request to change the beginning of the FAQ over there, to a list of links to my "official-ish FAQ" meta-posts
.. but that got ignored, and I don't honestly think it's needed
01:00 - 21:0021:00 - 00:00

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