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3:36 PM
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Thank you very much @Deusovi
 
No problem! Why the new room, though?
 
I wanted to test how mathjax works in chatrooms
 
WARNING  
Humn was doing some fancy stuff earlier that could be used to highlight words in codenames
 
Those are HTML entities, not Mathjax.
And Mathjax doesn't work in chatrooms.
 
Not at all?
 
3:39 PM
Nope.
The best way to do this might be with an image - maybe a bot of some sort? I'm no programmer, though.
 
I see. Well I will find out how to make it work hopefully
Is there a clever link regarding bots?
(I happen to be a programmer)
 
A clever link?
 
Where I could learn about SE's bots
 
(Well, I guess you could consider me a programmer. I'm not a good one, though.)
 
(Psst don't tell anyone)
OK the first idea would be a simple set of rows
words words and more words
words words and more words
words words and more words
words words and more words
Now how can we highlight certain words?
 
3:46 PM
@Deusovi Aren't you in comp sci??
 
@n_palum Are you studying? If you were you would know that one doesn't study to know things
 
Wha?
 
One does study in order to learn how much there is that they don't know
 
I don't think that's always the case.
 
Yes, you could go for a PhD which allows you to show others how much they don't know
<p style="color: #000000; background-color: #ffffff">Text color: black, background-color: white</p>
So html doesn't work either
words words and more words
words words and more words
words words and more words
words words and more words
 
3:50 PM
I'm studying to learn about things I want to learn about. I'm not doing it for the purpose of finding out how little I know. That is already apparent to me just from living
Not even sure that HTML was valid anyway.
 
I came to see what you were up to :P and I'm interested in this game xD
 
Do you know the game?
 
I'll look into playing around with stuff, what are you aiming to do
I played it once a while ago, may need some brush up
 
In principle we have a grid of words of which some should be highlighted either blue or red
Now we're looking for a way to make that work based on chat
Links are blue, we could use that
words words woorrrrds
 
3:54 PM
Eh that'll probably annoy people, accidentally clicking
 
You shouldn't need clicking for this game I think
We could link to an image that says "Don't click the words you fool"
words words woorrrrds
words [words](http://#) woorrrrds
and a new line?
aha
So links only work in single lines.
 
Yeah they're finicky
It's the same as embolden and italicize
 
Why do they do this to us
Deus was mentioning a bot
Any idea who we could make our own bot?
[tags] spogjs
[how do I make a tag]
 
Because chat wasn't made to be a super modifiable thing
 
Do you know how to make tags?
 
4:03 PM
 
Magician
Teach me oh master
 
[ tag : riddle ]
 
Remove all spaces
 
Alright, thanks a lot
 
4:05 PM
and replace the riddle with whatever tag
 
Splendid
[tag:myBum][tag:myBum][tag:myBum]
[tag:myBum][tag:myBum][tag:myBum]
Not again
So we would have to send line after line
____ ____
No tabs
 
That'd definitely be something to pin for copy and pasting or something
 
Right, good thinking
abcdef
ghghgh
psorjgpe
We could make a meta post containing the game. That way we could use Mathjax
but that's not what meta was made for
 
No, but I believe we are making a Contact meta post to fully explain the game along with the in house rules and norms
 
The thing is, codenames need a different board every game
Like a chessboard with randomly coloured squares
<pre>jfjffj</pre>
ggg
what is this?
Ah code
No background color it seems, dayum
 
4:17 PM
Yup.
I think Deus planned on just using an off site thing
 
With the given tools that sounds reasonable
SE could give away some server space and we could write out own app
 
That's unlikely
 
4:40 PM
So what do we do?
 
Instead of using colors why not just use bold, italics and strikethoughs?
 
Possible
But those only work in single lines
Which bugs me tbh
 
you could probably use too to get 4 "colors"
why does that matter?
words,words,wordswords
words,wrods,wrodswords
 
Do you know the game?
 
nope
 
4:44 PM
There's a grid of words and after each round you need to highlight around 1 to 4 words
So one would have to repost all the lines without anyone else interfering
It's possible, yes
The games uses colours red and blue. We could use tags and links
 
That'd probably be easier to do in say, Excel or something
 
Yeah - we could use Google Sheets to do it
 
my thoughts
 
that seems... less than ideal though
 
We could use sheets for the game plan?
The game plan only certain players are allowed to see
 
4:46 PM
I say it's far more ideal than trying to use chat for it. sounds to me like chat is ill suited for this
 
we'd use chat for giving and discussing clues
 
and Sheets on the side?
 
Yeah
 
Sounds reasonable, well, more so anyhow
Granted, I've no idea how to play :P
 
either that, or someone would have to update an image and post it occasionally, which is also not too difficult
you'd just need to know how to use the bucket tool in your favorite image editor
 
4:48 PM
true
 
Right, we could link a dummy grid
 
Or, use an off site thing that already runs codenames
 
I think for color fill and grid combo excel would be better
 
Just a thought
 
This site seems viable
 
4:50 PM
Yes, that's what I'd use to generate the grids
the basic idea of the game is this:
People split into two teams, red and blue. Each team has a "spymaster".
The spymasters are the only ones who know the secret assignments - some of the cards are "red spies", some are "blue spies", some are "civilians", and one is the "assassin".
 
This sounds like mafia
 
(Similar theming, not at all similar gameplay.)
 
Ohh I enjoy mafia/secret hitler/werewolf any of those variations
 
Sid
So, this is a new game?
 
secret hitler? lol
 
4:52 PM
@Sid No not yet
 
we're currently figuring out how to play it online best
@dcfyj It's a social deduction game. It's actually pretty good
 
It is :P
 
The site I found seems viable (like I said), the only issue I'm seeing with it is that there's an easily clickable spymaster button
 
I play a bunch of stuff on table top simulator
 
Anyway, back to rules explanation: The spymasters try to get their teammates to guess the words on their side. Your team wins if you guess your color before the opponents guess their color.
 
4:53 PM
@Deusovi I take it it's a similar vein to mafia?
@Deusovi So like catchphrase-ish?
Or password?
 
So how do they get their teammates to guess the right words? Well, they take turns giving clues. However, these clues must take the form WORD (NUMBER). "Word" is a single word that can relate to any number of the words on the board. (It can't directly be any of them.) "Number" is the number of clues it relates to.
The teammates get NUMBER+1 guesses. Once they use all of those up, guess one that's not on their team, or pass instead of guessing, then it's the other team's turn to get a clue from their spymaster.
 
hmm
Have you looked at the site I linked?
 
Kind of like taboo too
 
Yeah. I've used it before.
 
Is there a way to hide the spymaster button?
 
4:57 PM
I played over Discord - we played it by getting the spymasters to agree on a seed (which goes in the box), not telling the other players, then screenshotting the grid.
We'd update every once in a while with a screenshot of the new grid state.
 
Ah, that would work pretty well
I take it once a word is colored everyone knowns what it is?
 
Yes.
 
That'd be a little harder to organize. Considering time zones and whatnot as I imagine most of us at work can't really get on discord :P
 
Discord is just another chat medium though
 
After you guess, the spymaster marks off the word with the correct color - red, blue, white, or black. (White is "neutral", ie not either of the teams' words. Black is the assassin.)
Oh, right. There's one card called the assassin. If either team ever guesses it, they instantly lose.
 
4:58 PM
The site uses yellow and darkish gray apparently
lol, ouch
So make sure your clues don't relate to it
 
Oh you just meant discord for the chat feature, not the voice chat
 
It's maddening when you're the spymaster and you confidently give the clue "Water, 4" for ATLANTIS, RIVER, VAPOR, and TOWER, and then you check the grid and see that FISH is the assassin
 
lol
 
Or you see it beforehand and have to somehow plan around it
 
It's something I'd have to see first methinks
 
5:01 PM
You get to see the full grid before giving the clues, of course.
But a lot of the time, you're so focused on including a lot of your words that you don't think about excluding the other team's words or the assassin.
 
@Deusovi Considering you can see the colors, I'd hope so lol
 
Haha
 
So Animal for this grid would be 5 then (the seed I have is 800)
 
If you were the blue team, you might give the clue [ANIMAL 3], hoping your team would guess DINOSAUR/CRANE/LION and not HORSE
or you might find some other word that rules out horse
 
I was thinking tail relates to animal too
 
5:05 PM
as the blue spymaster, I'd give the clue CONSTRUCTION 3 for CRANE, DRILL, RACKET
they most likely wouldn't get RACKET because it's too tenuous, but it's possible
and that wouldn't overlap with any of the non-blue-team words
 
So there'd be a few teams?
 
red team would have it harsh with game and card I think lol
@n_palum just 2
 
Two teams: red and blue.
 
What's yellow again?
 
That means you need minimum four players.
 
5:07 PM
@n_palum think of it as mafia with a trigger happy alien in the middle
 
Yellow is "neutral". Guessing it stops your guesses (like guessing the opponent's team's words) but it doesn't help or harm you
 
(The trigger happy alien being the black word :P)
 
Oo
 
@dcfyj yup - they'd have to use something like DICE or MARBLES to get GAME/BOX or GAME/ROUND
I'd go for the former, so you could do PLANET, 3 to get ROUND/SATELLITE/STAR (hopefully)
there's a lot of trust in your teammates, hoping that they'll understand what you mean with very little information - in that sense it's similar to Contact, I think
 
@Deusovi That might get you drill (in my mind)
 
5:12 PM
So there will be advantages among players who understand others tendencies in Contact
 
Possibly scientist as well
 
@dcfyj Scientist might be an acceptable hit to take towards the beginning of the game. If I'd thought of drill though, it might make me more hesitant to give that as a clue
(remember, if you guess one of the opponents' words, it ends your turn AND gets them closer to having all of their words revealed first)
 
So nintendo(3) would be a good clue for red then
 
...Unless your teammates happen to know that Nintendo originally manufactured playing cards.
 
lol, did they really?
 
5:16 PM
Yep.
But your teammates still might not guess it, since they don't know if you know that
 
Yeah, I was going for box/switch/game
 
MARIO 4 might be even better (for SWITCH/GAME/BOX/STAR), but I'd hold off on that one until after the other team got DINOSAUR
 
and racket (mario tennis)
 
CLUB too - there was also Mario Golf - but ideally your teammates would assume that you were looking for more immediate connections, or pass when they felt too unsure about one of them
in practice... it sometimes happens
and sometimes after the game is over you point out what you obviously meant and they slap themselves
 
tail could relate to mario too (tanuki suit)
 
5:20 PM
or you point out what you obviously meant or they stare dumbfounded because they'd never heard of a reference you assumed everyone knew
 
lol
 
I've had both happen to me on both sides
my best clue ever was MOSES 7 for PASS, PART, TABLET, POOL, BEACH, MARCH, REVOLUTION
I was really proud of that one
 
I probably wouldn't immediately think of pass or pool or beach, and I doubt I'd think of revolution
 
sure, not immediately, but there are only a few words on the board, so looking through all of those would give you something
 
All these word association things are making me think of Funny Farm...
 
5:23 PM
My best one was TWICE for ALIEN and KANGAROO
 
my teammate only got 3 or 4 the first round, but had mentioned some when talking to herself (to give me more feedback on the clue)
 
Those were the last two left for my team
 
@incesterror21 that makes no sense...
 
so I gave it a second time to essentially say "keep going, you're on the right track"
 
@dcfyj Doesn't it? Do you know Alien?
 
5:24 PM
unfortunately, the other team's non-spymaster had joked with her about Moses having a BELT (just to taunt her, as teams sometimes do)
 
If your referring to the film series I've not seen them, but I know there are far more than 2 films
 
and she had jokingly agreed "oh yeah, I should pick BELT then"
she took my re-clue as confirming BELT. it was the assassin
 
LOL
 
@Deusovi In your version of the game, how many times is a player allowed to guess each round?
 
Moses wasn't particularly known for having a belt though
@incesterror21 #+1
 
5:26 PM
@incesterror21 It's always "clue number + 1".
 
Alright. One time I said CLUE 7 although I only hinted at 1 word. But doing so I could allow my mate to use all the previous clues and target 5 words at once
 
And you're not allowed to cheat and use that to your advantage - the clue number must be how many words your clue relates to.
 
I think that does only work with people you know well
 
Ah, that would be cheating
but there is a way to do that
 
Have the word relate strongly with one word and not so much with the others?
 
5:28 PM
Instead of giving the number, you have two more options: say "zero" or "unlimited". Both give your teammates as many guesses as they want until they pass or guess wrong, but they don't get the number of cards your clue relates to
 
zero gives only 1 guess no?
 
nope!
it's an exception to the n+1 rule
 
ah ok
so 0 = unlimited then, so really only 1 more option
 
in that case you're not giving a clue to your own cards, you're giving a clue to point away from dangerous cards
yeah, they're functionally identical, but they tell your team different things about what you want the corresponding clue to do
 
"what on the black card is" 0
 
5:30 PM
So 0 is to point to the assassin and be like "don't touch it!"
 
"unlimited" is "hey, you're on the right track but they're ahead, here's the clue for the last one or two cards"
 
Negative hinting so to speak
 
0 is "you're talking about the assassin too much and I'm panicking"
yeah, a negative hint
 
lol
 
you can use 0 to say "your other trains of thought are fine, but not this one / these two"
 
5:32 PM
either way 0 is don't touch this
 
yup
 
Sid
So.. I could give a clue like SPORT(2) for Tennis. And hope they guess, Football, baseball and basketball?
 
You have a grid with words on it
 
@Sid No, not quite. You have specific words that are "yours"
here's what the grid looks like
click "spymaster" in the top right
 
Change the seed to 800 and you'll see what we were talking about earlier
 
5:33 PM
Not sure how you prevent others from opening it and using the spymaster
 
@Deusovi (the seed is random every time that link is clicked)
 
We're working on that
 
(I know, just wanted to give a general example of a grid)
 
Is it just honor system like Contact
 
@n_palum the seed is random, so the sypmasters can agree more secret if need be
 
5:34 PM
Both spymasters know which words are which.
But yeah, they can find some other way to communicate a seed
 
Like what we were talking about in TSL that one time :P
 
Sid
Okay...
 
We're losing sid, what's confusing?
 
@dcfyj What, Diffie-Hellmann key exchange? That's probably a bit much
 
Telnet would be awesome!
 
5:35 PM
@Deusovi true, but it's effective :P
Nifty, I just got a refund from the hospital ^^
 
Lol
 
Sid
I clicked on that Spymaster. It turned all the words in to groups of Red, Yellow and Blue color
 
We are very sorry Mr dcfyj. Here, have your liver back.
 
@Sid Except 1 grey/black one
 
Sid
Yep. Apparently, it is SPACE in that group of words. So, that grey thing is spy?
 
5:40 PM
The grey is the assassin
instant death for the team that guesses it
 
Russian double agent who tries to kill you
 
Here, it's probably best to explain by example
 
Trigger happy alien :P
 
Say you saw this grid.
I'm the blue team spymaster, and you're on the blue team. It's our turn. I say "Europe, 3".
 
TRAIN!
 
5:42 PM
My immediate guesses are london and france
 
This means "Three of these words are ours. They relate to Europe somehow."
 
Possibly robin as my 3rd
 
You get four guesses (from the number 3 I said, plus one extra)
So you guess London first. The board is updated:
You guess France. It's updated again:
 
I'd say OLIVE for the 3rd
 
I think robin is likelier. Robin Hood
 
5:44 PM
Olive is Greece for me
 
I understood your relation, I just think robin is a stronger one :P
 
Sure, let's say you pick "Robin".
 
boo
 
Oh no! It's not blue. This means your turn is immediately over.
But it's yellow, so it's neutral - it doesn't help the other team.
 
Could've been trip too...
@Deusovi alright red spymaster, your turn :P
 
5:46 PM
Now, the other team does the same thing. They say "eating, two", and guess HAND (which is correct) and OLIVE (which is incorrect).
 
Sid
food could be FORK
 
So now you know three things.
 
Next time I'll pick Deusovi. Is always blue!
 
Yeah, I probably would've gone for fork
lol
 
One: One of the blue words is related to Europe somehow.
Two: "Fork" is probably the other team's word.
Three: The other spymaster is an idiot for giving the clue "eating".
 
5:48 PM
lol ok
 
And now I give another clue - say, "Tennis, 2".
 
Sid
NET
GAME
 
Glove or game...
 
NET is one of our words.
GAME is one of our words.
But you have one more guess! You get three guesses, since I said 2. (You always add one.)
 
glove
 
5:50 PM
So, you can try to guess another word, or you can pass.
GLOVE is a neutral word.
 
lol, me and my neutrals
 
Anyway, the game continues like this until one of the teams reveals all of their words OR one of them hits the assassin.
Make sense?
 
Sid
Hm. Understood
 
If we have 4 we can try it out, no?
 
On that last guess, instead of looking for something to do with tennis, you can also look for the "Europe" word that you missed last time
 
5:51 PM
true
 
or you could've done that first, and then gone to tennis things
 
I think that + this chat could work
 
I'm supposed to be working right now. Just got distracted by an explanation
 
lol, ok
 
Same but I just finished a bunch of stuff and pushed work to Git :P
 
Sid
5:53 PM
So, the blue spymaster knows all blue words and red one knows all red
 
The only issues I see are that screenshotting can be cumbersome, and agreeing on the seed
@Sid Both know all the words - the blues, the reds, the neutrals, and the assassin.
 
@Sid No, they both know all the words
@Deusovi Could just do 1 screenshot per round, just tell them if they got it right or not
 
So a spymaster might give a clue that leads to three blues and a neutral, but they could change their mind if it were three blues and a red.
 
(By round I mean each teams' set of guesses)
 
Also, "right" does not necessarily mean "related to the clue" - you can always hit one of your own words by chance
 
5:55 PM
true
 
so after "net" and "game" you can be pretty sure that you're done with "tennis" (since I said "tennis, 2") but not 100% sure
What if I was thinking of all the FORCE you need to hit a tennis ball? Then one of those might've been an accident
(...Of course, I was thinking of "net" and "game" there. But it's possible that I wouldn't be, and you wouldn't be certain.)
 
And people tend to introduce their hints with "ok this is probably hard" and sth like that...which is not very good
 
yeah, but it's still a pretty casual game
there's actually a winner and a loser, so it's not as casual as Contact, but it's not high-stakes or anything
@Sid: This is what the spymaster sees
 
You're 3rd europe was trip then
 
Blue has one more than red here - that's because blue goes first. One team has 9 and goes first; the other team has 8. And it's random which one.
Yep, it was. (Though that was intentionally not the best clue because I wanted to show how your turn would end)
 
5:58 PM
Why not make them even and lower (or raise) the amount of yellow?
 
Because then the team that goes first has an advantage.
 
I guess?
 
I don't get that either because the second team has less words to choose from. So in a way it's fair
 
They do, but not much
 
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