hey can anyone help me out with debugging 18 errors in my overleaf document?

it's for a friend and the diagram renders exactly how we want it but we are unsure where all these errors are coming from

so basically just for our sanity

@JackTigerLam you can look at the full log to get a better idea where issues might come from. Also, you can contact Overleaf support, if you send them your project ID they can directly take a look at your project and help you fix errors. I'm not sure how you want us to help you...

@JackTigerLam if you get errors it doesn't matter if tex recovers enough to produce a pdf: the output is unreliable. You should always resolve errors.

there are 9 undefined control sequences, 1 environment description undefined, 2 paperwidth too shorts

those are all the red errors

@JackTigerLam Then you should identify those (that's what the log is for) and replace them by known commands. Start with the first one (all errors after the first do not have to be reliable).

they don't correspond to any actual lines in my document

line 1084 is not a line that exists in my document

i only have about 300 lines

@JackTigerLam Do you input or include files? You should probably look at the context of those errors given in the log. Then you'll be able to find them easily.

there are no input files of significant technical relevance

@JackTigerLam you input a class, packages, and more files. The line number can refer to any one of them.

quack

@PauloCereda Have you posted the video with the quack-dinner scene?

@CarLaTeX not yet :)

@PauloCereda You should, it'll be a blockbuster

@CarLaTeX ooh :)

@JosephWright @DavidCarlisle did an amazing QA for your talk!

@PauloCereda Cool

@JosephWright I looked a bit through the color code during the weekend. I'm wondering a bit about "stroke" and "fill" colors. Currently setting these colors is in l3draw. Wouldn't it make more sense to move this to l3colors to have an uniform interface? E.g. pgf has commands like \def\pgfsys@color@cmyk@fill#1#2#3#4{\pgfsysprotocol@literal{#1 #2 #3 #4 k}}

@UlrikeFischer My original thinking was that the stroke/fill split makes sense only in a drawing, whereas 'color stuff' applies more generally. If you move into l3color, how do you detail where the stroke and fill apply? I was aiming for the idea that they are never used outside of a drawing, as then you get into what general constructs are strokes

@UlrikeFischer By the way, I'm likely to be busy writing a few things this week, so color will likely have to wait

@UlrikeFischer I do see the point as I've no way of integrating spot colors properly into l3draw at present

@UlrikeFischer All of this is in l33xperimental as there is still stuff to work through: change is quite possible

@JosephWright yes, but I was looking from the perspective of an external package like pgf. If it wants to make use of the new color structure and use e.g. myred or myspot for filling it is odd not to have a \color command to get it. (But it is not pressing, I was only musing a bit about it).

@UlrikeFischer My original conception was that l3draw is supposed to provide a reliable base layer on which any higher-level 'drawing' can be constructed, so one could imagine a TikZ-to-l3draw interface where the document commands would still be TikZ

@UlrikeFischer We can certainly look to move: probably I have to bit the bullet and detail stroke versus non-stroke in l3color. It would make some internals clearer.

@UlrikeFischer Would you be happy with having the existing \draw_color_... commands move to \color_select_....?

@UlrikeFischer, @DavidCarlisle Deadline for TUG proceedings is ... short

@JosephWright then better concentrate on this and let color wait ;-)

@JosephWright it's worse than short, it's bit[3]. :)

@JackTigerLam it is probably one of the packages you are using, you can tell from the log which file is open (work back from the error to the unclosed open parenthesis (/usr/local/texlive/sone/package.sty

@UlrikeFischer Sure

@JosephWright slightly weird being given video and audio access half way through the talk to take answers at the end:-)

@UlrikeFischer Moving a few commands is esy, though :)

@DavidCarlisle Sorry about that: hopefully internet now properly fixed!

@DavidCarlisle What did you get asked?

@JosephWright it was fine really, although the questions were not really stuff I know about like how to teach latex to teenagers. Of the three of us in this house M is a teenager J is a teacher and I know nothing:-)

@JosephWright yes, but deciding if the concept is right is more difficult. It sounds logical and better to me to have them in the color module, but imho it would be better to have a second opinion, also you know l3draw better.

@UlrikeFischer I can sketch something out and we can then discuss more widely

ooh the dino bloke is here

@jokerdino hi mr. dinosaur

@JosephWright ah I see the youtube recordings have gone and zoom ones not appeared yet.

@DavidCarlisle Indeed

@DavidCarlisle Had hoped to watch a couple today :(

@JosephWright yesterdays are still there, @jokerdino may like the pandoc one youtube.com/watch?v=-Y_OYhoHOb8&t=14s

@JosephWright want to learn some fun, backstage stories? :)

@MarcelKrüger Would this be metaposty enough?

outputtemplate:="duck.mps";
beginfig(1);

% head
fill fullcircle xscaled 50 yscaled 62.5 shifted (90, 150) withcolor (0.926,0.828,0.145);

% body
fill (70.6943,132.3527) .. controls (58.5353,130.2274) and (39.1604,108.2324) .. (59.6228,88.6598) .. controls (80.1344,69.0872) and (186.8462,82.1851) .. (135.1951,145.8956) .. controls (91.7006,122.5166) and (106.6274,143.9181) .. (70.6943,132.3527) -- cycle withcolor (0.926,0.828,0.145);

% right eye
fill fullcircle xscaled 8.93 yscaled 12.5 rotated -20 shifted (86.5, 154) withcolor white;

@samcarter_left_tex.se ooh a metaduck

@PauloCereda :D

@DavidCarlisle thank you kindly

@PauloCereda hello

@jokerdino pandoc authors keynote starts 8:48:00 or thereabouts

@DavidCarlisle ooh is there a panda?

@PauloCereda no nor ducks, sadly there was vim though

@DavidCarlisle ooh

> UK charts: Animal Crossing: New Horizon climbs to No.2 and Paper Mario slips to No.4

@samcarter_left_tex.se ^^ my talk seems to be working :)

@PauloCereda Do you get a gratification?

@samcarter_left_tex.se no... :(

@PauloCereda too bad!

@samcarter_left_tex.se will you get a Nintendo Switch too? :) <3

@manooooh a Spanish button: fersdt.github.io/learnlatex.github.io/es/lesson-03

@DavidCarlisle ooh can I sing Spanish eyes?

@PauloCereda no

@DavidCarlisle oh

@PauloCereda Does it have minesweeper ?

@samcarter_left_tex.se nintendo.com/games/detail/minesweeper-genius-switch

I got my bag back today, with my id card -- I'm a person again ;-)

@PauloCereda "Game file size: 219 MB " Whut? Must be much more complicate than what I remember back from my windows days

@UlrikeFischer Yeah!

@samcarter_left_tex.se my phone is working too and currently reminds me of all the stuff I missed last week.

@UlrikeFischer phew

@UlrikeFischer ups, I hope you did not miss anything important

@samcarter_left_tex.se no, I was at the tug meeting ;-)

@UlrikeFischer WOOOOOOO

@UlrikeFischer You couldn't miss that with everybody here talking about little else

@samcarter_left_tex.se did you watch the trailer? :)

@PauloCereda can't right now, a work meeting is about to start

@samcarter_left_tex.se oopsie. :) Check the trailer later, is a bit different than the traditional minesweeper. :)

@PauloCereda will do

@samcarter_left_tex.se and there's always Minecraft, in which @DavidCarlisle is our resident expert. :)

@JosephWright anything I can help with on a learnlatex paper?

@DavidCarlisle how about a document with just an hyperref link to learnlatex.org? That would be straight to the point. :)

@PauloCereda tugboat has a dead tree version

@DavidCarlisle ooh where's that Swedish girl to cry havoc on TUGBoat

@DavidCarlisle I'd appreciate any thoughts/input: at the moment, I was not imagining writing more than one or two sides

@DavidCarlisle Section titles? 'Background'/'Existing sites', 'Other languages', 'Structure', 'Content', 'Online compiling', 'Future'?

@JosephWright "How to help and contribute"

@PauloCereda Ah, true

@DavidCarlisle, @PauloCereda Should we write in on Overleaf ;) (Semi-serious: might be fast)

@JosephWright I will attack you with a banana

What did everyone think of 'MiniLaTeX'? (Not of course miniltx ;), @DavidCarlisle)

I've got the talk on YouTube now

@JosephWright will poke you in one minute

@UlrikeFischer Looking at that l3draw question, we could happily move the l3draw color commands to be \color_select:n, \color_select_stroke:n and \color_select_fill:n (assuming we are happy that 'fill' is a good-enough name for non-stroke color)

@JosephWright not entirely unreasonable and what I (and in a way Frank) was trying to suggest that Bill Hammond used instead of SGML, all he really needs SGML for is a custom parser from a defined subset of latex to a defined document tree, and these days there are other ways to do that.

@JosephWright it seems a bit variable Some people have uploaded directly but for the main conference I get:

@DavidCarlisle I thought it was pretty good, too

@JosephWright I think fill is fine. pgf is using it too (\def\pgfsys@color@gray@fill), and the pdf reference uses sometimes fill, sometimes nonstroking.

@DavidCarlisle Great

@UlrikeFischer Cool

@JosephWright as someone with a functional programming background interesting that the two latex-to-something parsers on that day were written in elm and haskell with the former being some kind of slimmed down web oriented grandchild of the latter.

@DavidCarlisle Which was the Haskell one?

@DavidCarlisle I take it Elm is quite old?

@DavidCarlisle ooh elm

@JosephWright on the contrary

@JosephWright pandoc

@DavidCarlisle Ah

@PauloCereda Oh, right, I was thinking Pine Is Not Elm ...

@JosephWright ooh

@PauloCereda i used Pine for a long time .

@JosephWright pining for the fjords? :)

Did anyone ask about the HINT project and most importantly what primitives adds that are new?

Ah, Frank did

@JosephWright yes as you probably saw he seemed a bit vague on the idea of backend-specific macros so will come back to us on that for graphicx support

@DavidCarlisle Yes, got that: we will want at least one marker to tell us that it's HINT

@DavidCarlisle More engines to cover!

@DavidCarlisle I tried to ask about color (because I thought that would give an idea about how they use specials) but got only the answer from Martin Sievers that it is not supported yet.

@JosephWright I suspect missing primitives more likely to be an issue than extra ones, if it doesn't have enough to support expl3

@DavidCarlisle I'd sort-of picked that up too: he's likely started from e-TeX or even just TeX90

@UlrikeFischer I guess 'no specials at all'

@JosephWright everybody is special

:)

@JosephWright I suspected this (he spoke about missing support for hyperlinks)

@PauloCereda but some are more special than others

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@DavidCarlisle on the menu?

@PauloCereda What did they do to minesweeper? That's blaspheme!

@samcarter_left_tex.se oh no

@samcarter_left_tex.se I have this game: youtube.com/watch?v=5c9QZFeVrRY

@JosephWright fewer people trying more documents since your talk:

Mon Jul 27 13:42:49 UTC 2020
  Number of distinct users:     4
  Number of document requests:  85
  Number of documents returned: 66
  Number of unique user agents: 4
Sun Jul 26 23:59:23 UTC 2020
  Number of distinct users:     5
  Number of document requests:  67
  Number of documents returned: 53
  Number of unique user agents: 4
Sat Jul 25 23:49:12 UTC 2020
  Number of distinct users:     27
  Number of document requests:  85
  Number of documents returned: 73
  Number of unique user agents: 21

@DavidCarlisle That's probably a good sign: we need to move up Google I guess to really get take-up

@JosephWright yes (I added a link in the latex wikibook link page the other day)

@DavidCarlisle Oooh: where do I look?

@DavidCarlisle You mean the big list of books?

@JosephWright big list of tutorials en.wikibooks.org/wiki/LaTeX/Links I added it after the faq, didn't dare re-organise the whole list not being a regular there. I also changed the faq to use texfaq.org address.

@DavidCarlisle Fair enough: present but not promoted

@DavidCarlisle Extra lanaguages should help

@JosephWright google (probably) doesn't so much care about the words surrounding the link, a link from a popular page is a link even if it says "this tutorial is rubbish" :-)

^^ mouseover :)

@JosephWright latex-project.org seems to be first hit for "latex typesetting" do you think we could justify a news posting there?

@DavidCarlisle I was thinking once we have the design done, if FMi is happy

@DavidCarlisle I think the Google graph is going in the right direction

@DavidCarlisle, @PauloCereda I've started on the article :)

@JosephWright oh no :)

@PauloCereda Do you want to be on the author list? I was not completely joking about Overleaf, though perhaps just email or GitHub would be as-easy

@JosephWright wanna co-write another one? :)

Probably I should have a GitHub repo on the learnlatex.org set up for articles

@JosephWright if I can be of any assistance, beam me up, Scottie.

@JosephWright can try overleaf if you want

@DavidCarlisle I think I'll go for GitHub: I'll draft something then do an initial commit: we can then have all of the paperwork for the site in one place

@JosephWright OK sounds more normal

josephwright created a repository learnlatex/articles 2 minutes ago

@DavidCarlisle ^^ UH-OH

@JosephWright @PauloCereda ¡¡¡ fersdt.github.io/learnlatex.github.io/es !!!

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@DavidCarlisle Oooh

@JosephWright -- If I remember correctly, he said explicitly \epsilon-TeX.

@YoanTournade hi, nice talk:-)

Thanks @DavidCarlisle! :) I was lurking around learnlatex.org to see what has been done. This seems to be going well!

@YoanTournade yes it's coming along, as you will have seen currently I'm using my own back end so neither yours nor latexonline.cc but both were very valuable in getting the site running and showing it could be done.

you’ve been automatically subscribed

OH NO

@PauloCereda s/subscribed/blamed/

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@DavidCarlisle that's Ulrike's spot, isn't it?

@PauloCereda as long as it's not me or Joseph, doesn't matter too much

@DavidCarlisle wait, then it is really me to get the blame.

@PauloCereda I have been suscribed too ...

@DavidCarlisle, @PauloCereda, @UlrikeFischer I'd hope to check in a first draft in the next half an hour or so

Using LaTeX for my day-job, using pdflatex-dev :)

@DavidCarlisle I've checking in work-in-progress: perhaps you might cover the online systems part (rope in @PauloCereda if you have to)

My city entered the red stage. :(

@PauloCereda Bloody hell

@JosephWright quite, we are in panic.

I want to define all expectations like this $\mathbb{E}\left[ \cdot \right]$

However, the following command: \newcommand{\expect}[1]{\mathbb{\left[#1\right]}} does not do what I want

it wraps the expectation symbol with []

which is not what I want

Guys, look how happy @JosephWright is in this photo :)

lol

@UlrikeFischer I've taken a look at the color business: pretty sure I can move things, but I'll do it in a branch to be safe. Likely to be tomorrow now as the need for a TUG article was pressing

@JosephWright should I do anything for the article?

@UlrikeFischer If you want :)

@UlrikeFischer I'd appreciate any input: I've written it pretty quickly (and hope @DavidCarlisle will do the rest)

@UlrikeFischer Now I remember where the fun is with color: I'll mail

@JosephWright I looked at it, and apart from a "the" too much before Nicola I didn't see anything wrong. Imho it has (as your talk) the right "speed" and detail level.

@JosephWright oh and you should mention japanese in the language section.

@UlrikeFischer Ah, right, yes

@UlrikeFischer see email

I want to write a blog post too ...

@JosephWright always the backends. We should go for @MarcelKrüger's plan ;-).

@JosephWright I made a start on the server bit but have a conf call for an hour now will check something in later

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright I can help David soon, I might have to build something for TUG 2020...

@JosephWright added something feel free to chop it around ...

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright added something as well

@PauloCereda so git told me:-)

@DavidCarlisle oh :)

@DavidCarlisle ohh

We love LaTeX!

miau and quack and ohh :)

@manooooh Oh, a cat *-*

@PhelypeOleinik yup! It's not mine unfortunately