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8:11 AM
good morning
8:50 AM
@Raphink Hello
@JosephWright: Is there any way to bring this meta question to SE's attention: meta.tex.stackexchange.com/q/844/86 It's a bit scandalous that this hasn't received any acknowledgement from the SE lot. The linked question on meta.SO has no evidence of one of the overlords seeing it either.
@AndrewStacey Not really sure there is :-(
9:19 AM
and another "good morning"
Where are my manners??? Good morning, all.
@AndrewStacey You could always try sending an email to [email protected], I suppose.
9:49 AM
@TorbjornT Good idea. I've just done that. The email address that I used suggests that the TeX moderators will get a copy.
@JosephWright (and anyone else): How long do we usually wait before closing a question where the questioner hasn't responded to comments asking for clarification? I'm thinking of tex.stackexchange.com/q/27930/86
@AndrewStacey I'd close it with a comment that the person should ask a new question with more information in the question.
@Patrick That's certainly what I'd do - especially regarding the comment. I was more thinking of how long to wait before doing so.
@AndrewStacey I forgot to say that I'd close it now. 10 days should be enough with an urgent problem. There is almost no additional work for the OP to open another question.
10:05 AM
Morning all!
@Patrick Sounds reasonable to me. I've voted accordingly and left a comment. Just needs a few more votes ...
@PauloCereda Good afternoon.
@AndrewStacey uh-oh. Sorry, I forgot it's past noon in Norway. :-)
I just wrote some new feature for adjustbox 10 days ago and now see that Herbert Voß has written something like this in Die TeXnische Komödie 3/2001.
"It's just gone noon, half-past monsoon, on the banks of the river Nile. Here comes the boat, only half afloat, barely reaching the last half-mile." (Or something like that)
10:36 AM
@MartinScharrer It seems to me that the following question does not deal with hiding some parts during typesetting, but rather to strip off the unwanted lines at submission time.
Q: Including only the parts of a document corresponding to a conditional expression

Faheem MithaSuppose I have a LaTeX document, which uses a conditional. Ie. \ifdefined\submit [....] \else [....] \fi So, if we have, say, defined \def\submit{} then the first part of the conditional is parsed (or whatever the right term is), otherwise the second part is. Is there some way with...

Good morning all!
@egreg Morning! :-)
@egreg I guess you could do a beamer-frame-gobbling trick which examines lines for an \ifsubmit and toggles between writing them to a file or not writing them to a file.
@AndrewStacey Would it be worthy the time spent to write such a driver?
10:52 AM
@egreg I'd say an emphatic "No!". This really ought to be done by a perl script.
@AndrewStacey Just as I wrote in my comment. :)
11:20 AM
@egreg Exactly. Since the answers are leaning towards the "hiding" interpretation, I've added just such a script.
11:51 AM
@egreg Ah, thanks. I misunderstood the question.
@egreg: BTW, I just saw your article in the Die TeXnische Komödie, 3/2011. I didn't know that you also do German publications.
@MartinScharrer It's the translation of the TUGboat paper. Heiko Oberdiek did the translation: my German ends nearly at "Wo ist die Bahnhof, bitte?"
@egreg I almost thought that much.
@egreg: Ah, now: I overlooked the footnote which exactly stated that.
@egreg: It would be nice to link to both articles in the following thread:
Q: How to install "vanilla" TeXLive on Debian or Ubuntu?

DimaDebian and Ubuntu have very good texlive packaging. But I'd like to use tlmgr to have a more fine-grained control about upgrades and which packages I want to be installed. So how do I install "vanilla" TeXLive on Debian/Ubuntu? Also how do I make dpkg aware that I have TeXLive installed?

@egreg At least, your German is way better than mine. I only know "Ich trinke Wasser" and "Ich heiße Paulo". Well, I will not die of thirst. :-)
I wonder how difficult it is to make Debian/Ubuntu packages from the LaTeX packages on CTAN or directly from the TeXLive packages.
If this could be automated then there would be finally some current version for Ubuntu, besides installing the native version I mean.
Etiquette question: on this question, tex.stackexchange.com/q/29082/86, an answer to another question sufficed. I didn't think that the actual questions were duplicates, and thought that for "housekeeping" it would be good to have the code in both places, so I copied the code over (it was my answer on the original one). How does this sit with everyone? It is okay etiquette? Or am I clearly just angling for double rep for half the work!
12:12 PM
@MartinScharrer Done (as community wiki)
@PauloCereda What's "Wasser"? I thought that the only permissible phrase was "Ich trinke Bier". :)
@egreg Thanks a lot. CW wasn't really necessary. It's TeXLive 2011 not 2010, isn't it?
@egreg :-) Better would be "Ein Bier bitte".
@MartinScharrer It shouldn't be too difficult for a Unix guru to prepare a script along those lines. I'm not; but all the tests done tell me that it works.
@MartinScharrer It's 2010 in the TUGboat and ArsTeXnica versions. I'll add a better caveat.
@egreg Ah, I see.
@egreg I never really build a Ubuntu package myself. I had a script once but I wasn't sure if the result was really a correct package.
@MartinScharrer I was thinking to an automated script that could either connect to a predownloaded ISO image or to the network installation. Maybe it could be distributed as a Debian/RedHat/whatever package, but only on unofficial servers.
@MartinScharrer Crazy idea: what if you create a Makefile with a proper install target (finding the local tree, copying the files) and use the checkinstall app to generate the deb file based on the Makefile?
@egreg They didn't teach me "Bier", only "Wasser". Worse, they taught me "Mineralwasser". :-P
12:30 PM
@PauloCereda You get "Mineralwasser" in Germany when you order "Wasser" in an restaurant.
@PauloCereda: Ohne oder mit Gas?
I like that you get free tap water in many other countries.
@PauloCereda I would like to have the same layout as the official packages so people could change easily.
My next step towards a proper river detection algorithm: stackoverflow.com/questions/7496747/linear-regression-factor
@Raphink Oh. I only know "mit". :-P
@PauloCereda, @MartinScharrer: as a not, I've added "install" targets to my package Makefiles.
12:33 PM
@Raphink Me too, but they use custom code, not the install tool.
@PauloCereda Paraphrasing Bela Lugosi in Dracula: "I never drink water". The original line, as everybody knows, was "I never drinkā€¦ wine".
12:45 PM
@egreg haha! I love that line! I have that movie in my collection, I never get tired of watching it. :-)
@egreg: It's fun how brazilians communicate with foreigners without knowing their languages. There's a funny story about a guy who was bitten by a dog, a tourist's dog. The guy said to the owner (probably an american): "Your dog nhac-nhac my leg!", where "nhac-nhac" is some sort of onomatopoeic sound of a dog bite. :-)
Anyone is good with stats here?
or knows how to apply MSE and RMSD ...
@egreg: speaking of Bela Lugosi, I heard somewhere that he didn't know how to speak English when he was chosen to star Dracula. He learned the phonetic of the words and how he should pronounce them in a phrase.
1:01 PM
@PauloCereda I really don't know, but according to Wikipedia he staged on a Broadway play in 1922, five years earlier than his first Dracula, again a Broadway play. The movie was shot in 1931. He had been in the US for ten years, at the time.
To bring this back to typography, what do people think about the layout on this page: mathsnotes.math.ntnu.no/mathsnotes/show/… (don't worry, no horrible pop-ups). To make it vaguely TeX-related, I should say that the original version of that is pure TeX (with the margin notes as footnotes).
@egreg The OP on the question you just answered on hyphenation has proposed an edit to your answer. You might want to check it out...
@AlanMunn Thank you; I rejected the edit and explained why in a comment.
@AndrewStacey Did you think to make the side notes appear only when hovering over the corresponding text?
@egreg For a more advanced course, or a less technical proof, then I would consider that. Also, I tend to prefer only CSS solutions (rather than Javascript) so I'd need to find a way to do that that wasn't too distracting (if you look at the "contents" at the top of the page then that has a box that appears/disappears but the rest of the text jumps around as it does so.).
@AndrewStacey You could do the same for the side notes; I find those gaps in the main text distracting.
1:18 PM
@egreg I agree, but I'd like to do so in a way that the main text didn't "jump" when the new stuff was revealed. So I need to limit the width of the main text whilst allowing the margin notes to be in the margin. I need to look up some stuff in CSS to see if this is possible.
1:29 PM
@AndrewStacey Very nice layout. I know you said you prefer to stick with CSS solutions, but I see your page as a great potential and useful showcase of a "JS website tour" concept. Something like this one: tympanus.net/Development/WebsiteTour
@PauloCereda I partly prefer CSS simply because I understand it better! Also, JS solutions require deeper coding (since the pages are automatically generated).
@AndrewStacey Agreed. Sometimes you end up with a complex structure.
@PauloCereda Ah, but "the shortest path between two truths in the real line passes through the complex plane"
@AndrewStacey Oh. There's always a catch. :-P
yeah, an 8th silver badge :-)
@PauloCereda No palindromic reps today?
1:46 PM
@Raphink I almost forgot! Let me check.
Palindrome-related news: egreg's in base 12, Herbert's in base 34, Stefan's in base 21, Raphink's in base 20, Andrey's in base 17, and Seamus' in base 32.
and yours?
Mine failed miserably. :-)
2:10 PM
We could call "depth of a river" instead of "badness of a river". =)
3:05 PM
@lockstep you changed your mind on tex.stackexchange.com/questions/4507/… ?
3:26 PM
@PauloCereda we could, not sure if that would be very self-explanatory though
TeX users are more used to badness I think ;-)
like: the badness of Microsoft Office for example
@Raphink Honour to whom honour is due. :-)
Well, I think the thread on river badness shows my code is not yet fully reliable ;-)
This MSE thingy has been getting my brains painful lately
3:43 PM
I'd love to find someone who knows more about this kind of things
1 hour later…
4:44 PM
@Patrick: Do you happen to know how to calculate an MSE for a linear regression ? ;-)
4:57 PM
@Raphink No, sorry. I am a computer scientist but luckily stay away from all non-trivial formulae
5:25 PM
@Patrick: same here ;-)
1 hour later…
6:55 PM
@egreg, and @PauloCereda, and anyone else interested. How about the click-to-reveal comments at: mathsnotes.math.ntnu.no/mathsnotes/show/Sandbox
7:13 PM
@JosephWright are you a member of TUG?
@RebeccaChernoff Yes
Ok. Was looking at the meta thread about TUG memberships and noticed you had commented but not posted so I figured that was the case. Just wanted to make sure as a mod you had the opportunity. (:
looks like we've got 6/8.
@RebeccaChernoff I'm with @StefanKottwitz in wanting new people to join TUG as a result of the support
@RebeccaChernoff I'm not currently a TUG member, but I was waiting to see if there are others with more need. I wouldn't mind having one of the memberships, though.
@AlanMunn Put your name down (or I will :-)
7:26 PM
@JosephWright Ok. Done. Feel free to add anything!
@RebeccaChernoff Any thoughts on the following
Q: Accepted answer checkmark color

Ken BloomI just asked this question at meta.programmers.stackexchange.com when I realized I have the same problem over here as well. When I ask a question (and every answer has a check mark next to it for me to select one as my accepted answer), it's very hard for me to tell the difference between the ch...

8:16 PM
rep cap :(
@Raphink Three in a row!
Can you actually see that somewhere?
8:38 PM
@AndrewStacey Very nice idea. I prefer to click in the comment to reveal it, I'm not a big fan of hover. :-)
@PauloCereda Best of both worlds, then. You can either click or hover.
@AndrewStacey I like it. :-)
@JosephWright How do you see rep cap?
New blog post for you all to enjoy.
(Originally written in TeX, pictures via TikZ)
@Raphink It's the line at 200 rep across the graph
8:53 PM
@JosephWright ah ok, I wasn't looking at the graph. Thanks :-)
Seamus could be the 8th member.
@PauloCereda Good choice
@PauloCereda He's already in TUG (he's a joint member via UK-TUG)
Of course, he might still go for it
@JosephWright Ah, I see.
We can still ask. @SeamusBradley, do you want the 8th TUG membership slot?
8:56 PM
I wonder if @frabjous is already a member of TUG or if he'd like
Another great addition. :-)
and I thought and hoped @lockstep considered
we'll see :-) there's time
@JosephWright could it be worth a post on the UK-TUG blog?
@StefanKottwitz Perhaps, although I tend to keep anything 'unofficial' to my own own (too many blogs to manage!)
I mean the general topic of SE joining the TUG, perhaps on occasion when also the new 8 members are clear
So ... ;-)
@Joseph is there a UK-TUG journal ?
9:10 PM
@StefanKottwitz Technically yes, but our current editor is stepping down next month, and finding content is pretty hard (as most English-language stuff goes to TUGboat)
@JosephWright I don't remember the name in the moment
@StefanKottwitz Baskerville
Now I remember
@JosephWright Is there a chance of an issue this year?
@StefanKottwitz As I said, our editor is stepping down at our AGM in about 1 months time: I very much doubt it.
@JosephWright Ok! If somebody of TeX.SE could contribute. let us know ;-)
9:20 PM
@StefanKottwitz UK-TUG is a small organisation (unlike say DANTE), and so getting help for anything is something of a challenge. For example, I know that we are loosing 2 committee members at least at the AGM, and I suspect they'll not be replaced.
I may have to lean on some of the people who help with LaTeX training, but then they are all ex-committee members anyway
I understand
@StefanKottwitz Our main aims are (1) training and (2) supporting projects where we can. There's also the CTAN node in Cambridge to worry about, for example when the hardware needs replacing (we paid for the current system some years ago).
2 hours later…
11:35 PM
@StefanKottwitz I guess you convinced him :-)

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