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12:00 AM
I can't do this on my iPad.
 
I'm writing down what it means for the $(p-1,q+1)$-part of $du$ to be $0$ (which is of course implied by it being $(p,q)$)
 
So you're saying that the formula for $du$ is wrong.
 
i'm not saying anything.
 
Let me as precise as possible. $u$ is an $r-1$-form such that $du=\varphi$. In particular, $du$ is of pure bidegree $(p,q)$. We have decomposed $u=\sum_{i=0}^{r-1}u^{i,r-1-i}$, where $u^{i,r-1-i}$ is the $(i,r-1-i)$ component of $u$. Then, we calculate $\varphi=du=\partial u+\overline{\partial}u=\sum_{i=0}^{r-1}\partial u^{i,r-1-i}+\sum_{i=0}^{r-1}\overline{\partial} u^{i,r-1-i}$. Now, $\partial u^{i,r-1-i}$ is an $(i+1,r-1-i)$-form and $\overline{\partial}u^{i,r-1-i}$ is an $(i,r-i)$-form. Thus, the $(r,s)$-part of $du$ is given by $\partial u^{r-1,s}+\overline{\partial}u^{r,s-1}$. Since
 
12:18 AM
@TedShifrin: I have extracted the code to take a parametrization of a surface and return a function that returns the curvature. Mwahahaha
 
alright, second attempt: prove that a row of the cayley table of a group $G$ has no identical element.
Let the set $U = \{x_1, ..., x_n\}$ be a permutation of the group $G$ with $n$ non-identical elements, let $g \in G$ be an element of the group, and let the set $V = \{y_1, ..., y_k\}$ be s.t. it's ith element satisfies $y_i = gx_i$ for $U$'s ith element. By definition of a group, $g$ is invertible, and therefore there is a one to one correspondence between $V$ and $U$. Therefore, all elements of $U$ are non-identical.
 
OK, @Thor, I see your point. We have to work our way all the way down/up the line and see what the telescoping must tell us by the end.
@shintuku: A set is not a permutation of a group.
 
I tried some sort of telescoping, but it didn't work out
but I'll try again
 
You want to say that the ordered set $\{gx_i\}$ is a permutation of the ordered set $\{x_i\}$. That is, multiplication by $g\in G$ gives a bijection $G\to G$. Why do you keep going around and around this? @shintuku
 
i am in math hell, and am attempting to master proofwork. that way no graduate student will be able to make fun of me for memorizing
 
12:27 AM
But writing twelve sentences with sloppy words is not good.
 
yes, i am still in the stage where i am vulnerable to their sarcastic remarks on memorizing, but i declare, i shall overcome
 
Prove once and for all that multiplication by $g$ is injective (why?), hence surjective (why?). Stop writing convoluted notation and making up too many extraneous letters.
 
it helps to think in terms of ted's function (multiplication by g, maybe you should give it a name) and not lists.
if i recall, fraleigh's algebra does this proof in terms of lists. it's not a very great proof.
 
@Thor I don't know what book you're taking this from, but what comes after the comma at the bottom you showed us?
 
I have never in my life looked at the multiplication table of a group in seriousness
my algebra professor was good and remarked very early on in our algebra lecture that one should never bother looking at multiplication tables even though they technically capture all information about a group
 
12:35 AM
Well, the real problem with Cayley tables is that one needs some way of getting around checking associativity!!!
 
@Ted after comes a quotation of the del and delbar-Poincaré lemmata and the rest is pretty clear
 
So if you don't have something easy or a permutation representation, this can be a bear.
 
I'm actually pretty convinced the claim in the bottom row is just wrong
but I think I just saw the light on how to fix it
 
Yeah, they're doing what I did at first and assuming the non-obvious slots of $u^{i,j}$ are all $0$ to start with.
I honestly have only done the $\partial\bar\partial$ lemma in the global compact setting.
How do you fix it?
 
I don't think you get that $u^{p-1,q}$ is $\overline{\partial}$-closed, hence $\overline{\partial}$-exact, but you can inductively get that it is the sum of a $\overline{\partial}$-exact and a $\partial$-exact term, which suffices to exhibit $\partial u^{p-1,q}$, the term appearing in $\alpha$, as $\partial\overline{\partial}$-exact
inductively applying the $\overline{\partial}$-Poincaré lemma starting from $\overline{\partial}u^{0,r-1}=0$
 
12:38 AM
You certainly will have to use $\partial\bar\partial = -\bar\partial\partial$ at some point.
 
oh yeah, that I use all the time like I breathe air
 
Cigarette-smoke-filled air, no doubt.
 
I'm not Balarka!
 
That's what you say.
Yes, I think you're right. That's sort of the telescoping I had in mind when I made that remark. So $u^{0,r-1} = \bar\partial\eta$, and then we use what I just said to regroup at the next level and proceed.
 
yeah, exactly
 
12:40 AM
Yes, this seems right.
 
I'm too lazy to come up with a counter-example, but I very much feel like the implicit simplification in the proof is an error
 
Seems like you can just start by making the term you were bothered by a specific non-zero form.
 
i read an article in the AMM or something once about checking associativity using cayley tables. some way of organizing it. it was clever but still not any more helpful than, i don't know, literally anything else.
 
it was taken from Wells' Differential Analysis on Complex Manifolds btw
 
I had a short article, too, leslie, but it is gone with retirement.
Wells was notoriously careful. First edition or second?
 
12:48 AM
it appears to have been RP burn's article in the mathematical gazette.
 
Oh, Burn wrote a beautiful little book on groups and frieze and wallpaper pattern classification.
I had a different note from someone.
 
Third, even
 
I'm surprised.
 
Third attempt: prove that no element of the row of a group $G$'s caley table is identical.
Let $g$ be an element of the group $G = \{x_i\}$ with $n$ elements, let the function $g: G \to G$ be s.t. $g(x) = gx$, and let the elements of the row of a cayley table be contained by $\{g(x_i)\}$. By definition of a group, there is an inverse element $g^{-1}$ that satisfies $g^{-1}gx = x$, and therefore, $g^{-1}g(x) = x$, i.e., $g(x)$ is invertible. Therefore $g(x)$ is bijective, and each element of $\{g(x_i)\}$ has a unique correspondent in $\{x_i\}$ and vice-versa, so no element in $\{g(x_i)\}$ is
 
second time in two months I've found a gap/error in a book by someone notoriously precise, I think I'll become paranoid at this rate
maybe if all else fails, I can consider a career as proofreader
 
12:56 AM
You just keep ignoring my suggestions — which I have repeated. @shintuku You write unreadable stuff and make it as complicated as possible. So I resign.
This is more than proofreading, @Thor.
 
argh I'm sorry I tried to apply what you said on $\{x_i\}, \{gx_i\}$
 
I was doing that for you. Read what I suggested after that.
 
yeah, injectivity and surjectivity comes from the invertibility of $g(x)$
 
Using the same letter for a group element and a function isn't good style.
 
it was more than that with the thing in Hirsch, when I spent an entire afternoon coming up with a counter-example
will not bother with trying to find a counter-example for this one
 
12:59 AM
So state and prove that. Directly. Then without any notation, you're done.
 
$G=\{x_1,\dots,x_n\}$, much shorter to write
 
But we don't even need to index or name things.
 
yeah
the multiplication table is such an unwieldy concept, don't bother with it
 
if two elements of a row were equal you would have $xa = xb$ for some distinct $a,b$.
 
No need to do contradiction once we prove that $\phi$, $\phi(x)=gx$, is a bijection. Before anything about tables.
 
1:06 AM
whoah, no need to bring greek letters into this. what's wrong with f? we haven't even used f yet. [kidding]
i'm going to use [kidding] now when i'm kidding.
 
Fourth attempt, we shall vanquish
Let $g$ be an element of the group $\{x_i\}$. The elements of the row of a cayley table are contained by $\{gx_i\}$. By the definition of a group, $g$ is invertible. Therefore, $\{x_i\} \to \{gx_i\}$ is a bijection, so no element of $\{gx_i\}$ is identical.
 
wasnt that the same as the last one?
Here is a cool one I used to like: prove every finite cancelative semigroup is a group
 
the indices! they blind my eyes!
 
although now I just like to think of groups as the thing that's behind any sort of associative surjective action
 
the notation $\{x_i\} \to \{g x_i\}$ makes no sense.
 
1:09 AM
The English “no element is identical” is horrendously wrong.
 
and semigroups as the thing that's behind any associative action that can botch up things and isn't reversible
 
@TedShifrin G is isomorphic, but H isn't
 
i just had a stroke. thanks, thor.
 
That's on the mathoverflow joke request question
 
Mine only gave you a mini-stroke?
 
1:11 AM
heretorelax, that's not bad as a blurry take on the vibe of it all. if you think in terms of group actions vs. semigroup actions you get the same kind of thing. semigroup orbits can crash into each other and become the same thing. group orbits don't and end up looking like groups.
 
glad to be of service
 
when i say 'looking like' i don't mean to imply that i've ever drawn a picture.
 
Proofreader and stroke inducer!
 
@HereToRelax yeah, I think I've gotten this from somewhere on MO
 
I think of a semigroup action as me trying to fix some furniture
when I end up messing everything up
 
1:12 AM
@copper.hat isn't $\{x_i\} \to \{gx_i\}$ just: whatever map does this?
 
{x_i} is already pretty badly formed notation.
 
and a group action is a rubiks cube
 
it just gets worse from there.
no offense. people use it all the time, i'm just saying. it's like sharp knives.
i understood how to solve a rubiks cube for about two weeks. i put a lot of time into it. not solving it by hand, but understanding how you could solve it. it's not that hard once you read enough about it. but it's intricate.
 
@shintuku you can write that the map $f:G \to G$ defined by $f(x) = g \cdot x$ is a bjiection, but just writing $G \to G$ does not provide any information.
 
right
 
1:15 AM
shintoku, i have a neck tattoo that i would like to share with you. it says, in a black letter font, "We wish to show that f is injective. This means that for x, y in G we must show that if f(x) = f(y), then x = y. To that end, fix x and y in G. If f(x) = f(y), then from the definition of f we have __. But then __. But then __."
i had it done in prison when i was doing 5-10 for some financial crimes.
later i wished i could have rewritten the prose a little bit, but it was a tattoo.
kind of like a comment on here when you wait a few seconds too long, except moreso. and done in prison.
shintUku, i'm sorry. my eyesight is not great.
 
@shintuku ignore @leslietownes
 
that's my forehead tattoo.
 
lol
 
when i walk into the federal courthouse in santa ana the security guards are always surprised to see me coming in the front door.
 
off to collect my dinner from the cheesesteak shop
 
1:21 AM
mmm.
 
so, i don't know much about prison, but didn't anyone there ask whether since group multiplication is invertible by definition of a group, we could skip the proof of injectivity?
 
"group multiplication is invertible" is already kind of a goofy mishmash of terms.
group multiplication is a binary operation, invertible is a property of an element of a group.
i'm just tweaking the language here, i think it generally helps. and no, we can't skip the proof of anything. we aren't physicists.
or, god forbid, engineers.
you're definitely focused on the right idea but the words aren't coming out in the right order
my dad had a masters degree in english education and he relentlessly corrected my grammar throughout childhood. which i don't think was educational orthodoxy. but it caused me to focus a lot on language.
to that end, what function are we skipping the proof of injectivity of?
domain, codomain, and rule, please. otherwise, do not pass go and do not collect whatever it is now with inflation
 
1:59 AM
Fifth attempt. Show that the elements of a row $R$ of a cayley table contain an element of a group $G$ exactly once.
Let $g$ be an element of a group $G$. By definition of a group, $g$ is invertible, so group multiplication by $g$ is bijective. An element $r$ of the row $R$ of a cayley table is an image of group multiplication by $g$. Therefore, by bijectivity, an element of $G$ appears in $R$ exactly once. $\blacksquare$
is this it
wow, the statement and the beginning makes no sense
 
Much better. But you should prove that $\phi$ (multiplication by $g$ on the left) is in fact bijective.
No, the first sentence should be ... "Each row contains every element of $G$ exactly once."
You definitely need to prove injectivity and surjectivity, but this should come separate from any discussion of the Cayley table itself.
 
this is it folks, maybe
i would like to thank my parents and ted shifrin
 
2:22 AM
@shintuku do not be afraid to use extra words to clarify.
tufte's 'maximise data to ink ratio' is an example of a principle taken to a ludicrous extreme.
 
is that a trap
it sure looks like a trap
 
for example, i would explicitly define the function corresponding to multiplication by $g$.
 
2:41 AM
@TedShifrin: I found out that the reason the edge was so ragged in the green/red image was because the PlotPoints was not increased. I tried 100 and the edge was still ragged, but sawtooth-like. I am rendering again at $400$.
 
2:55 AM
Oh, I should check to see if Mathematica has finished or crashed.
Still running. I think that maximization is just too much for it.
@robjohn Rendering with such a yuge PlotPoints will slow it down significantly. I'm guessing you have a much more powerful processor than I have.
 
3:11 AM
@robjohn over at physics they told me I was wrong to apply your strategy. Maybe I left out too many details in describing my problems haphazardly in short bursts through the week.
0
Q: Am I doing this right? Finding the time derivative of expectation value of momentum

Andrew MicallefI am currently working through the problems in Griffiths Intro to Quantum mechanics, with the goal of hopefully understanding how magnets work. At the moment I am a little stuck on one of the early problems in the first chapter. And I would like a Hint about how to proceed. The problem is to solv...

Or maybe I should not ask physics questions in maths....I swear my intention is to get my head around the maths though
 
I already told you that you needed to use the Schrödinger equation, differentiating under the integral sign.
But certainly what you wrote is nonsense, as it's the sum of the integrals of $\Psi(\Psi^*)'$ and $\Psi'\Psi^*$ that is the integral of $(|\Psi|^2)'$.
 
@TedShifrin Yeah, I know, I hadn't forgotten about that, I was actually mid way through doing that when I wrote that question. I had seen robjohns strategy and thought it was a shortcut
 
Are you saying those two integrals are equal? No, one is the conjugate of the other.
 
3:27 AM
for a uniqueness proof, e.g. suppose $gx = h$, and suppose $gy = h$ implies $x=y$, which completes the proof, is it implicitly assumed $x$ and $y$ initially pertain to different sets?
 
Huh?
Pertain? Different sets?
 
hm, yeah that was ambiguous
 
shin when you prove that a function is injective by showing that f(x) = f(y) implies x = y, you do not initially assume anything about x and y other than that they are in the domain of f and that f(x) = f(y)
 
Not ambiguous. Poor.
 
there are other ways of arranging the logic but it's probably helpful to stick to this one subject
 
3:36 AM
What is $\Psi^*$, an adjoint?
 
i think just complex conjugate. i haven't been following.
 
i still do not get why this is not (informally at least) an application of Leibniz.
 
You say Leibniz, but you mean differentiation under the integral?
Leibniz usually refers to a combination of that and variable limits of integration.
 
Leibniz gets added to the list of things that refer to too many things. hello, gauss's theorem.
 
I suggested that at least twice cuz Schrödinger.
 
3:40 AM
I just mean interchange of differentiation and integration here. Informally, of course.
 
Leibniz is also product rule (derivation).
 
it's also the notation i prefer least for derivatives. $\Psi'$ is not leibniz.
 
Right, not standard use, as I said.
 
burn your $\langle$s
working on my pcness
 
Hey!
 
3:44 AM
howdy
 
Horses
 
Any fun math going on?
 
Hi Demonark
I never am fun.
 
there is in the dark math room
where you can interchange any two operations without any rigour police present
 
Hahaha, perhaps interesting is the better word then?
 
3:49 AM
there is the inconsistent logic room where just about anything is true
 
That does make it easier to get publications
 
@leslietownes what I'm having a hard time with is the status of the symbols $x,y$ before we get to $x=y$. So say, with group multiplication, $f: G \to G$, $f(x) = gx$. Suppose $f(x) = f(y)$, then $gx = gy$, and by cancelation, $x = y$. We begin knowing only that $x, y$ are elements of $\text{dom} f$, and then we learn that they are the same element.
 
even the excluded middle are welcome
@shintuku that looks fine. what is wrong with that?
 
So actually, our initial supposition is wrong: they were never distinct elements to begin with
 
you are not initially supposing anything other than $x,y \in G$.
(and $f(x)=f(y)$, of course.)
 
3:55 AM
aren't we saying that the element $x$ and the element $y$ are in $G$, which implies there are two of them?
 
no. you could have picked the same two with different labels.
if it tell you i have picked numbers $m,n $ from $1,....,6$ does that imply that they are different?
 
no, of course, you may have picked $1$ twice
 
So when I write pick $x,y \in G$, the same applies.
I should write $x\in G$, $y\in G$, but i am lazy
 
and $x,y \in G$ means: we pick two variables in $G$, not necessarily two elements of $G$, since we could even fail to pick an element in $G$, no?
 
you have lost me.
If I write $x \in G$, $y \in G$ it means that $x$ is in $G$ and $y$ is in $G$. Nothing less, nothing more. No equality implied. However the possibility of not picking an element is hot here.
 
4:01 AM
Could anyone help with set intersection ? :math.stackexchange.com/questions/4105337/…
It's unlike any arbitrary set intersection problem I've encountered
 
say e.g. $x \in G$, isn't it not an element in $G$, but any element in $G$, so wouldn't it behave differently than a single element in $G$?
 
i am truly lost.
 
sorry it's due to my confusion
suppose we say $G = \{1, 2, 3\}$, and we say $x \in G$, $x$ could be either $1, 2, 3$
 
yes.
but once an element is selected it remains the same in the ensuing context.
it like if i am doing some trick and ask you to select a number in $G=\{1,...,6\}$. You pick a number and it must remain fixed for the duration of the trick.
all that i know is that $g \in G$. I don't know which particular element you selected, it could be any element, but it is constant after selection.
 
oh... that makes a lot of sense
thank you
 
4:08 AM
@StudySmarterNotHarder what is your question?
 
@TedShifrin nvm Brian M Scott answered well
 
Yup, he always does.
 
$\Bbb{P}$ the set of $\pm$ prime numbers equals $\bigcap_{a,b \gt 1} \sum_{k \neq 0}(ab\Bbb{Z} + k)$ where the inner sum is symmetric difference of sets, not union and not elementwise summation of elements.
The reason symmetric difference works there is because the cosets are disjoint anyway
But $R = (\mathcal{P}(\Bbb{Z}), \Delta, \cap)$ forms a boolean ring, so that's why the notation
But, adding in $2$ to everything commutes with both $\cap$ and $\Delta$'s.
So we get that $\Bbb{P} \cap (\Bbb{P} + 2) = \bigcap_{a,b \gt 1} \sum_{k \neq 0, 2 \pmod {ab}} (ab \Bbb{Z} + k)$
So twin primes is that the last set is actually infinite.
But I was toying with the idea, since you know that the infinite intersection involving $\sum_{k \neq 0 \pmod {ab}} (ab\Bbb{Z} + k)$ is infinite (since it equals the primes), what happens when you take out just one more coset (hence the $k \neq 0, 2 \pmod {ab}$) part.
But Brian M. Scott gave an example where such a change does not imply the intersection of the added cosets is infinite, but that was way generalized to sets, not cosets of an ideal.
 
@copper.hat so, suppose that yes, after we pick $x$, it remains the same for the rest of the proof. don't we need some sort of logical property to generalize it to any other $x$ we might pick?
 
4:24 AM
no.
i think you are over analyzing things.
 
overanalysis, or total confusion? certainly, I am dispossessed of the answer
 
you have the answer. what about the answer is not convincing?
 
is their some problem with mathjax on thehomepage of MSE?
 
no.
 
I see that the math text is misaligned
 
4:29 AM
defcon 1
 
what I'm unable to convince myself of, is how the symbols $x, y$ can be treated as if they were independent objects, but eventually end up the same. it makes me think $x \in \mathbb{N}$, for example, is a very different thing from a specific natural number $2$, since you really don't learn anything new from $2=2$
it feels like I'm missing some logical property of variables
 
look at it another way: suppose $x\neq y$ and $f(x)=f(y)$ and you then show that $x=y$. then you have a contradiction, hence if $f(x)=f(y)$ you must have $x=y$.
 
a proof requires that for some $x$ that is in $\mathbb{N}$, $x$ must have the property of both being treated like a specific natural number, for the algebra, but also any natural number, for the universality of the proof
@copper.hat right, proofs by contradiction always seem to work nicely in terms of variables
 
i am not sure what you mean by independent objects. You just have some truths about the variables $x,y$, so $P(t)$ means $t \in G$, for example, and $Q(s,t)$ means $f(s)=f(t)$. What you are then saying is $\forall x,y$ ($P(x) \land P(y) \land Q(x,y) \implies x=y$).
there is no magic.
there is no requirement that $x,y$ have any relationship other than satisfying $P$. they could be the same or different.
 
4:45 AM
It sounds silly, but by independent objects I mean that, for $1=1$, we can say: perform left group multiplication by $x$! $x1=x1$. now, again by $y$! $yx1 = yx1$. now, right group multiplication by $y$! $yx1y = yx1y$. now, use invertibility and left cancelation! $x1y = x1y$. and we wouldn't know that all this time $x$ and $y$ were the same objects
so there seems to me to be a distinct symbolic existence $y$ that is irreducible to $x$, and we end up by saying: the symbols $x, y$ point to the same mathematical object
symbolic object $x,y$, which helps us do the algebra, and mathematical object, to which they point
 
i'm sorry, i really do not understand what you are getting at.
maybe think of it this way. one day an object who we will call $x$ comes to your door. you record the visit by some magic number $f(x)$. the next day another object who we will call $y$ comes to your door and you record the visit by some magic number $f(y)$. then you note that $f(x)=f(y)$ and from this you can conclude that the object that visited on day one is the same as the object that visited on day two.
 
can you map all points of a circle one to one on the points of a disk?
 
the cardinality is the same so yes.
 
@copper.hat that makes sense. when you see the first object, and when you see the second object at the your door, they don't look the same.
 
indeed. in fact, all they tell you is $f(x)$ or $f(y)$.
 
5:02 AM
@TedShifrin here is the result. A much cleaner line than before.
 
don't we need a third, concrete thing, to know they're the same? e.g. the proposition $f(x) = 20 = f(y)$ is true, and from this we know they are both $20$ @copper.hat
 
well, that is the essence of the proof. since $f(x) = f(y)$ we know $g \cdot x = g \cdot y$ and so $x=y$, so we know they are the same purely by knowing their '$f$' values.
i'm getting red/green seasick
10% of males cannot distinguish that
 
how do you call the equivalent of disk, but of a square? squaredisk?
 
it is the proposition $gx = gy$ that gets us the bilateral identity we need, then
 
i do not believe there is a common term that distinguishes the square from its frontier.
 
5:13 AM
slice of a cube maybe but then you have to tell what kind of slice (not all slices are squares)
oh wait, I'm not even sure if cube means a solid or only the hull
 
generally it is better to avoid ambiguity and be explicit.
relying on infrequent usage inevitably confuses.
 
Yep, I agree
 
poetry is wonderful because of the implicit, but what works in rhyme does not work in proof
 
So the dimension of a thing, does not change the cardinality of the number of points, I guess? Like a line has the same number of points as a solid cube? hard to wrap around that.
(excluding single points)
 
Well, cardinality is a very coarse measure, the cardinality of $\mathbb{R}^n$ is the same as $\mathbb{R}$.
it is not hard to see intuitively, take the boolean expansion of a number, you can then interleave n copies and create another number.
the interval $(0,1)$ has the same cardinality as $\mathbb{R}^{42}$.
so really, we could all live in $(0,1)$ and there would be plenty of space.
 
5:27 AM
so what is easier to figure out, a function which maps line to disc, or line to full square?
 
@AndrewMicallef I have commented on your question.
 
i was totally clowning around when it came to the fuzzy images, but they seem to be working real-world mischief.
lesson in there somewhere for somebody, maybe me. no clowning, please.
 
@leslietownes for example ;-)
 
what are you using to generate those? i hope it's actually applying gaussian blur to something in mathematica or equivalent
 
@leslietownes It is indeed.
 
5:36 AM
<3
 
fuzzy robjohn
 
6:10 AM
Oh, Oh, these fuzzy images are really causing headaches!
I'm trying to work through the suggestions I have recieved (and perservering with Ted's strategy before asking for more help.)
So far I have gone from this:
$$
-i\hbar \int\limits_{-\infty}^{+\infty}{\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\Psi^*\left[\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\right]\Psi}dx.
$$
to this
$$
i\hbar
\left(
\int\limits_{-\infty}^{+\infty}{
\frac{-i\hbar}{2m} \dfrac{\partial^2 \Psi^*}{\partial x^2} \frac{\partial \Psi}{\partial x} + \frac{i}{\hbar}V \Psi^* \frac{\partial \Psi}{\partial x}
 
@AndrewMicallef What is $V$?
 
Actually I don't know
It just is in the schrodinger equation
hasn't been defined in the book I think it has something to do with energy?
(hasn't been defined yet I should say I am only on page 16)
 
That could be quite important here
 
i think robjohn has identified a relevant point
 
I just turned to chapeter two, looks like V is a function of x,t as well
 
6:14 AM
ruh roh
 
ruh roh, whats that scuby?
 
Rastro!
 
V is the potential energy?
 
i never even took a real physics class but V being a potential sounds about right
 
silly me thinking I should read a book starting on page 1 and proceding in sequential order
also silly me for thinking I would understand qm before knowing anything else about physics
 
6:16 AM
physicists are unstuck from time.
page 2, page 26. is there any order? nobody knows
a friend of mine who got a physics phd and then peaced out in similar fashion as i did once characterized his phd program's mathematical rigor as "instructor spends 3 chalkboards proving the cauchy-schwarz inequality, because that's a bona fide proof, and then one line on something that probably isn't true or would take ten chalkboards to prove"
he was joking, he knew way more than i did about his area and could prove most of it
but there's a grain of truth in that
 
@robjohn do you think I need to know $V$ to reduce the rightmost integral to something in terms of just $x$?
forget about wave functions for the moment, if I have some function of $x$ and $y$ that maps $\mathbb{R} \to \mathbb{C}$
and I am looking to solve, $\int{f^* \frac{\partial}{\partial y}\frac{\partial}{\partial x}f}\,\mathrm{d}x,$ where $f$ is the function of $x,y$ I just mentioned and $f^*$ it's complex conjugate.
is there anything I can bring to bear here? Or do I need to have more information about $f$ (which I guess I do in my case, thanks to schrodinger)?
 
@AndrewMicallef Do $\Psi$ and $\Psi^\ast$ vanish at $\pm\infty$?
 
yeah they both go to 0
 
Do we have any equations that are satisfied by $\Psi$?
 
as in something of the form, $\Psi(a,b) = c$?
 
6:29 AM
or any differential eqns?
 
well I know that at the $\lim\limits_{x \to \pm \infty} |\Psi^2| = 0$
 
yeah, we went over that
 
And I know this is the case:
$$
\frac{\partial \Psi}{\partial t} =\frac{i\hbar}{2m} \dfrac{\partial^2 \Psi}{\partial x^2} - \frac{i}{\hbar}V \Psi$$
so far that's all I have been given (without jumping forward though the material, which I could do, I just figure this should be solvable based on what I have been told thus far)
 
While the instructor draws lines about 8180..He says 10%,1%,0.1% and 0.01%
I am completely unable to understand what he means...
A detailed insight into the same will be most welcome.
I hope this is mathematics...
 
this is maths
can I try
@RajorshiKoyal is the question to determine what percentage of 8180, 412 is?
 
6:35 AM
Yes
 
also there looks to be a lot of scribbles for that
so what is 1% of 8180?
 
wait thats not the way to think about it, sorry my bad, let me try again
so what is $\frac{412}{8180}$
 
@AndrewMicallef can I ..
 
Sure..
 
6:38 AM
$412*100/8180=5.03667481663$
 
Anybody can try..
 
yeah I'm making a mess of this: thank god for historical revisionism
 
it is easy...
 
@Euler2 yes the same
 
@AndrewMicallef that could be quite important in evaluating the integration by parts.
 
6:41 AM
no kidding.
 
oh, and by the way, setting off the bomb could be detrimental to your health
 
@robjohn Which bomb?
:P
 
@RajorshiKoyal is the confusing thing your instructor is doing long division perhaps, because that always trips me up.
 
not one of those copper.hat bombs i hope
 
@leslietownes Can you provide some assistance?
@AndrewMicallef I do not know really
 
6:45 AM
i don't interpret scribble. i think others have got you well on the way to answering the question. but as to the stuff on that image, who knows.
my own mind is a chaos. anyone who looked into it would be driven insane. so too are the images i see on this chat board.
 
Suppose $G$ is a group, $R$ is the set of elements of a row of $G$'s cayley diagram, $g, h$ are elements of $G$, and $r$ is an element of $R$ that satisfies $gh = r$. Show $R$ contains every element of $G$ only once.
By $gh = r$ there exists an injective $f_1: G \to R; x \mapsto gx$. Since every element of $G$ is invertible, $g^{-1}gh = g^{-1}r$, which implies $h = g^{-1}r$; therefore there exists a surjective $f_2: G \to R; x \mapsto g^{-1}x$. Then, $f_2f_1(h) = h$, which is a bijective function from $G \to R$, so $R$ contains every element of $G$ only once. $\blacksquare$
 
I feel like I'm missing something super important because I am basically asking the same question agian...
$$
\int\limits_{-\infty}^{+\infty}{
\Psi^* \frac{\partial}{\partial t} \frac{\partial \Psi}{\partial x}
}dx
$$
How do I get that equation in there with that derivative of a derivative of $\Psi$ in the mix?
 
i feel like i've always been the caretaker here at the overlook hotel
 
bombs are far behind me now i hope...
 
so i may be borrowing a proof technique from set theory
but that has to work in abstract algebra, no?
 
6:47 AM
there's no such thing as borrowing a proof technique from somewhere else. unless you're deep in the weeds of logic, which we're not.
it's just, i don't know, reasoning?
 
@RajorshiKoyal if they are talking about multiples of 10, and drawing lines like that while effectivly computing a fraction, my money is on they were trying to talk you through long division. Which is something I am incompetent at
 
familiarity with definitions, working with definitions, going from there.
 
proofs are social processes...
 
proofs are really up to you. how does it make you feel, copper.hat?
 
I am unable to follow is there anyone who can assist me :P
 
6:49 AM
with computing percentages?
 
andrew and i am on the same page here. is the issue the computation of a percentage or is it something else.
 
@leslietownes I incorporated your suggestions on the proof of bijectivity. I just don't know if it is convincing
 
anyone who doesn't find anything that i said convincing can find me in the street. right. now.
 
@copper.hat That is the sort of thing a bomber pilot always prays for
 
certain bombers did not find a need for aviation.
 
6:51 AM
my mind is clearly in the b-52 era
 
then again, the last bomb was entirely unexpected.
this was the 1985 era
 
are you not the same person who get's serached by the TSA for bringing microcontrollers on commerical flights?
 
@leslietownes i want to bring back those rigid impenetrable line by line idiotic proofs
 
please don't tell me that you mean the two-column format.
i will throw myself out the window if that's what you mean.
 
amazingly when tsa should have been looking out for me they were dozing
yes, yes, $n$ column format
 
6:53 AM
one time i was touring the british museum and we were evacuated from a quadrant of the museum due to a bombing threat. the staff were very polite, but they did say 'bombing.'
it got our attention.
 
@leslietownes Thats hilarious
 
on behalf of my fellow countryman i apologise
 
there's a joke, you're in a room with hitler, stalin, and the two column format of proofs, and you have a gun with two bullets. what do you do? you shoot the two column format of proofs in the head, twice, just to be sure.
 
i like
 
6:55 AM
that's tasteless and i apologize. but something about 1% of that offensive is true.
 
tasteless shows good taste
 
maybe 0.001% of that offensive.
anyway i regret saying that. replace all of it with, i don't like two column proofs.
 
this?
 
that's the format
why don't you just stick a piece of dynamite in my brain and set it off
 
aarrghhhh, aaarrgghh , noooooo pleeease stopppp
anything, you can have my brut aftershave, just take it and go
 
6:59 AM
That is so beutiful
 

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