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1:45 AM
0
Q: About emptiness of a set of holomorphic functions[CSIR-UGC NET]

vidyarthi Let $ D $ be the open unit disc in $ \mathbb{C} $ and $ H(D) $ be the collection of all holomorphic functions on it. Let $$ S= [f\in H(D):f(\frac{1}{2n})=\frac{1}{2n}\forall n\in \mathbb{N}]$$ and $$ T=[f\in H(D):f(\frac{1}{2n})=f(\frac{1}{2n+1})=\frac{1}{2n} \forall n\in \mathbb{N}]$$. Th...

How $T$ is empty?
$f(\frac{1}{2n})=\frac{1}{2n}\implies f(z)=z$ and $f(\frac{1}{2n+1})=\frac{1}{2n}\implies f(z)=\frac{z}{1-z}$
So, $T$ has two elemnts. right?
 
@Mathgeek: Read carefully what the condition for $T$ is.
And of course you're using an important theorem to deduce your equation $f(z)=z$, for example.
heya @Eric
 
@TedShifrin hi!
 
Hi @anakhro
 
What have you been up to?
 
1:56 AM
Not much.
 
I have to consider generic 1-parameter families of generic 1-parameter families of vector fields, and I have no idea where to start.
 
Is that different from a (generic) two-parameter family?
 
$f(\frac{1}{2n})=\frac{1}{2n+1}=\frac{1}{2n}$. I really don't get your point.
 
I am not sure, Ted.
I know the characterization for generic 1-parameter families, but when I have a family of families, I don't know what really ought to happen.
I tried looking up generic 2-parameter families but never really got anything.
 
@Mathgeek: You're not thinking. Does the first $f(z)$ satisfy $f(\frac1{2n+1}) = \frac1{2n}$?
@anakhro: Unless you give me a definition otherwise, I'm going to say it's a two-parameter family.
 
2:02 AM
No.
Thank you
 
Yeah, I would think so, Ted.
It's my gut feeling. :P
 
I mean, the first family is indexed by $t$, and $s$ indexes which element of the "second" family you're in.
 
Yes.
And both are smooth in my case.
 
Right, so I would assume you have a jointly smooth two-parameter family.
 
Seems reasonable.
I have all these little perturbations to help with generic 1-param families.
But it's a mystery how they might work with 2-parameters. I guess it really depends on the connection between the two parameters.
 
2:24 AM
@anakhro maybe a homotopy?
H(x, 0) = g(x), H(x, 1) = f(x)
Anyone know how I should approach learning algebraic topology
I only want to know enough to understand the abstract math involved in homological algebra & category theory setting
 
@BananaCatsCategoryTheoryApp read weibel then
 
Yes, I have that on Kindle, but it assumes a lot of Topology bg
for instance
one sec
 
It does???
 
I thought it did the other day
some example I was looking at
I'll take another look, thx
I've got the worlds most beautiful proof of Yoneda's lemma
it's 100% pure visual
 
"Several of the motivating examples assume an introductory graduate course in algebraic topology but may be skipped over by the reader willing to accept that such a motivation exists. An exception is the last section (section 10.9) which requires some familiarity with point-set topology."
-Weibel in his intro
 
2:29 AM
Nice
What if I don't want to skip the examples?
There's not much in the way of algebraic topo books. Hatcher's is too high level.
I did have a copy of Munkre's elementary algebraic topology, but lost it
J.P. May's get too advanced too quickly
 
I thought you just wanted to understand the "abstract math involved in homological algebra"?
 
Yes, but also just a little bit of topology
I understand how a simplex is formed
with convex combinations
I'll start with Weibel though, good idea!
Maybe I'll just pick up algebraic topology a little here and there
@anakhro did you read Weibel?
o___o
 
A little.
@BananaCatsCategoryTheoryApp how much topology do you know?
 
I know up to fundamental group
but skipped Baire's category theorem
This was a while ago though, when I studied
I know that you can topologize the integers with $U_a = \{ax^k + b : x \in \Bbb{Z}\}$ as a basis.
But if $k = 1$ and you take $U_{a, b}$ you get a topological ring
used in Furstenberg's proof of prime infinitude
@anakhro what do you study now?
 
2:47 AM
I am doing my thesis in contact geometry.
 
What's contact geometry?
physics?
 
Do you know roughly what a manifold is?
 
Yes, it's a way to treat the tangent space of a surface as always isomorphic to $\Bbb{R}^n$
Using charts and stuff :)
I did study those before too but that was definitely the longest time ago, over 10 yeras
*years
Maybe 5 years lol
 
Yeah so contact geometry studies specific manifolds which have an extra structure of a really twisty hyperplane field.
 
What open problems does it address?
That might be hard to answer, I know, depending on my understanding
 
2:53 AM
It has its own open problems. The easiest to explain are existence problems, like can you always find this extra structure on a manifold, a certain type of the extra structure, etc.
 
Who started the field?
An algebraic geometer or topologist or... :)
 
It's in geometry, so it addresses many features, both topological and algebraic. Historically it can be seen across a variety of subjects.
So no particular birth mother.
 
What made you fall in love with the topic?
 
It touches on a variety of fields.
So that's neat.
 
Yes, it is
that's why I like categories and hence my name :D
 
2:59 AM
I thought you enjoyed fruit and hairy mammals.
 
:D
I was thinking "apple computer...hmm - banana!"
Would you like to test drive my app when its ready?
 
What does it do?
 
It's for drawing diagrams, but is has built-in functoriality
Let me show you an old demo vid
It's not zoomspace anymore
it's BananaCats
it's been through several versions, one which connects to a graph db, but I scrapped that idea
Right now the design is going to try to incorporate diagram transformation rules
without worrying about "adhesive categories" and gluing
for instance, composition can obviously be applied everywhere in-place even in a complex diagram, where as you don't always get commutativity if you take a product and glue it in just anywhere, so I'll account for that with an option (or something)
It's go to understand and parse a simple variable format
which includes greek letters
 
Finite categories?
 
It has auto-indexing now, so when you create a node with $X_1$ you can auto-index on either $X$ or $1$
No, diagrams are finite
clearly
but when a scene node is labeled "C" it's really just saying the diagram it contains is in that category
It's got to do a complicated graph-matching with the latex strings and parsing out variables, etc, but there's networkx lib for graph searching, and it can always just be done with brute force, as these diagrams are usually no more than 100 nodes
 
3:06 AM
I see.
Do you like homotopy type theory?
 
So I'm bypassing the whole formalized type system / proof assistant mainly because I don't understand enough of type theory
I'm borrowing the idea of type theory / logical deduction that
you can apply rules to an existing system and transform it
Instead of text-based hypotheses, mine are graphical!
 
A little more clumsy, don't you think?
 
Yes, but it's for learning purposes, it's not meant to replace Coq / Isabelle
And the fact that it's really hard to draw a commuting diagram without say TikZ or the limited CD language on MSE.
with my app you'll be able to drag - n - drop into browser
but they'll be images
with text
It is certainly very clumsy as can be demonstrated by all the bugs I gotta fix :)
It's already better than existing diagram editors (at least specific to CD's)
LaTeX is supported, that demo vid was just text version
I'm thinking of giving away Python version for free, then rewriting 1-1 in C++ for graphics scene speed, and selling that version.
 
Why paid?
 
I have no money :D
Maybe I'll do it with a donate button
:/
 
3:18 AM
I don't know how much people would pay for an app related to category theory.
Let alone how many.
 
I'm guessing, 1,000,000 at $5 / piece :P
 
$5 million in your pocket, sweet deal!
 
I could try slinging it to University math programs
I'd like to be more self-employed
I get work from a company, and I did the work, and they don't look at the app, test it, give feedback, I'm just waiting...
so I work in my spare time on BananaCats
 
Neat.
It's good to have a hobby.
 
3:55 AM
@BalarkaSen, you there?
I have a question.
Prove that every convex subset of $\mathbb{R}^k$ is connected. (don't solve this for me, let me try first)
what I have done so far:

I am using the result: A convex function on $(a,b)$ i.e. a function such that $f(tx+(1-t)y) \leq tf(x)+(1-t)f(y)$ is continuous, where $t \in (0,1)$ and $a<x,y<b$ .
Now....
 
@SubhasisBiswas why don't you try proving something else. Try proving that every path connected set is connected.
 
4:14 AM
@Albas wait. I have an idea
Pick an arbitrary convex subset $E$ of $\mathbb{R}^k$
 
What is the optimal $\gamma$ parameter in the exp3 algorithm for the multi-armed bandit problem?
 
4:55 AM
nah, my approach is terribly flawed
Now, supposing that $E$ can be written as the disjoint union of two separated subsets $A$ and $B$ of $E$ such that $A \cup B =E$. We pick a point $\mathbf{a} \in A$ and
a point $\mathbf{b} \in B$. Now, let $\mathbf{a} = (a_1,a_2,...,a_k)$ and $\mathbf{b} =(b_1,b_2,...,b_k)$. Now we break the each individual components of the point in three categories : $P=\{(a_i, b_i) : a_i>b_i\}$ and $Q=\{(a_j, b_j): a_j<b_j \}$ and $S=\{(a_k,b_k) : a_k=b_k \}$ [we compare the $n$ th position of $\mathbf{a}$ to the $n$th position of $\mathbf{b}$].
in the end I realized that I am getting into a wrong proof
@Albas overkill?
i will try something else
 
It's the most natural approach but it's also easy to do it without that.
 
@BalarkaSen which one?
 
Certainly NOT "overkill"
 
don't do it for me right now
let me push it some more.
 
I am not I am just saying you should not dismiss Albas's approach as saying overkill. It's the easiest and the most natural.
 
5:01 AM
@BalarkaSen i am not dismissing it. I am a bit intimidated by it since I never really internalized the definition of a "path" before.
man, I just wish I had someone to coach me irl
 
There's a general approach to prove certain things are connected which is basically the path-connectedness idea but doesn't use paths explicitly. Let me know when want to hear it
 
@BalarkaSen not right now. But path connectedness is a stronger notion of connectedness?
 
Yes, there are topological spaces which are connected but not path-connected.
 
so, if I can somehow manage to prove that every path connected set is connected, then a convex set will also be connected. Since for any two points $x, y $ , there is always a straight line (a continuous curve) that joins the two (via a specific kind of path)
or, more formally, $f:[0,1] \to A$ such that $f(t)=ty+(1-t)x$. where $f(0)=x$ and $f(1)=y$
 
Using that same kind of function f from the open interval [0,1] to any path connected set X you can also prove that any path connected set is connected. It's actually a very nice proof.
 
5:16 AM
There's a characterization of connectedness in terms of functions. Do you know it?
 
@BalarkaSen Nope. Tell me
 
Any continuous function X -> {0, 1} is constant.
 
@BalarkaSen that means, the function takes either $0$ or $1$ as its output?
but not both?
when the domain is a connected set?
 
@BalarkaSen feels like some kind of intermediate value theorem.
 
Either everything maps to 0 or everything maps to 1, yes.
 
5:20 AM
But yeah it makes sense why that would happen.
 
@Albas yes, I felt that too. No "middle" values will be attained by the function.
 
@Albas It is an intermediate value theorem. Image of connected set by a continuous function is connected.
That's the most general IVT
 
@BalarkaSen i know this result.
i was trying to use it in my former "proof"
 
Yeah.
 
The only connected subsets of the discrete space {0, 1} are either {0} or {1}
 
5:23 AM
so, when it is the codomain set of a continuous function whose domain is a connected set, then to maintain the "connectedness", it takes either one of the values
 
@SubhasisBiswas Prove that path connected spaces are connected using this, and as a corollary get your result.
 
right?
@BalarkaSen ok. I will do my best. If I get terribly stuck, I will ask right away.
 
5:44 AM
$\{x\mid x\notin x\}$
@Secret I wonder how many axioms of ZFC we'd need to get rid of to allow a set of all sets
Clearly we need to get rid of foundation, since the set of all sets necessarily contains itself
We also need to get rid of the axiom of specification
('cause clearly $\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\}$ false outside $V$, contradicting the idea that $V$ contains all sets)
 
Ok, I finally have this
 
But without specification it feels too "nerfed" somehow
Maybe we can only weaken specification
@Secret This almost feels like trying to delete axioms of ZFC in order to get a largest ordinal
 
6:02 AM
Suppose $E \subset X$ is a disconnected set but it is arc connected. So, we can find a pair of non empty open sets $A$ and $B$ such that $A \cup B= E$.

Pick $x$ and $y$ respectively in $A$ and $B$. But, being path connected, we can find a continuous function $f:[0,1] \to E$ such that $f(0)=x, f(1)=y$.

Now, for an arbitrary continuous function $g$:

$I$ connected $\implies g(I)$ connected.

So, contrapositively $g(I)$ not connected $\implies I$ not connected.

Here, $E$, i.e $f([0,1])$ is not connected, but $[0,1]$ is connected. A contradiction.
@BalarkaSen
@Albas
 
@SubhasisBiswas Why is $f([0, 1])$ not connected? (Also, arc-connectedness means something else: you meant path-connected)
$E$ is not $f([0, 1])$.
 
@AkivaWeinberger I have not studied much about the universal set, but removing foundation is absolutely necessary. You might need to use urelements (thus depending on how they are implemented, may blow up the axiom of extensionality as now you have a lot of things that cannot contain elements and yet are different from the empty set)
New Foundations for example, use a hierarchy of types and urelements to produce the universal set
Hmm...
$\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\}$ sounds like the set of all well founded sets and it obviously does not contain $V$ because $V$ is an element of itself (along with many non well founded sets) hence does not satisfy the predicate on the right
So this set will actually be smaller than $V$ I think (assuming foundations is nuked)
$\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\}$ should be an element of $V$ unless my brain is not working
I don't think in any way you can end up with something like:
$\{x\in V\mid x\notin x \land x\in x\}$ which is the Russel set
That is, I suspect $\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\} \cap \{x\in V\mid x\in x\} = \varnothing$
o wait, then we have: $\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\} \cap V = \varnothing$, I am not sure how to interpret this
Does $\{x\in V\mid x\notin x\}$ contain itself?
 
6:31 AM
@BalarkaSen, at least tell me whether or not am I headed in the right direction...
 
ok, I think the above set cannot contain itself, for if it does, then it violates $x \not\in x$
but wait, then it means it satisfy $x \notin x$ and should be included, so we end up with the Russell set
 
@SubhasisBiswas this is the correct direction but you need to think about what continuity means
 
yeah, I think blowing up foundation is not enough, the consistency of the Russell set is something that cuts much deeper than set axioms
New Foundations get around that problem because by making types a hierarchy, the Russell set cannot be a set
Meanwhile Wikipedia:
> ZFC does not assume that, for every property, there is a set of all things satisfying that property. Rather, it asserts that given any set X, any subset of X definable using first-order logic exists. The object R discussed above cannot be constructed in this fashion, and is therefore not a ZFC set. In some extensions of ZFC, objects like R are called proper classes.
So blowing up foundations will not automatically allow you to have the Russell set in $V$
9
Q: Why does the Axiom of Selection solve Russell's Paradox in Set Theory?

athul777I am a beginner in mathematics and I was reading a text on Set Theory that talked about how Zermelo's Axiom of Selection "solves" Russel's Paradox. I understand that the the axiom does not allow constructions of the form $$\{x \:: \text S(x) \}$$ and only allows$$\{x \in \text A \:: \text S(x) \...

So strictly speaking, no known set theory actually has the Russell set in their universe, even in ones where the universal set exists
The Russell set obeys the inclosure schema, which is purely of logical consequences. Set theories are meta systems and thus they alone are not strong enough to block the Russell paradox (Not sure if I am using the terms correctly here as my logic is still not very good)
One way to restrict axiom of specification is to ban the use of negations in the predicates. This immediately forbids $x \notin x$ and avoid the Russell paradox. The resulting set theory is called positive set theory.
If you want a Russell set to be explicitly included in the universal set, I am afraid you might have the change the underlying logic system to avoid the inclosure schema from causing trouble
 
7:01 AM
yes. It was a mistake. $E$ is not the range, rather it is a codomain set.

As to explain why $f[0,1]$ is not connected:

[first of all, I forgot to mention that $A$ and $B$ are such that $A \cap B = \emptyset$ ]. We consider the sets $P =f[0,1] \cap A$ and $Q =f[0,1] \cap B$. Clearly, $P \subset A$ and $Q \subset B$ and $\overline{P} \subset \overline{A}$ and $\overline{Q} \subset \overline{B}$. Therefore, $\overline{P} \cap Q = \emptyset$ and $\overline{Q} \subset P = \emptyset $ [since $\overline{A}\cap B= \emptyset$ and $\overline{B} \cap A =\emptyset$] . Further, $P \cup Q = f[0,1]$
@BalarkaSen
$\overline{Q} \cap P = \emptyset$ **
 
@SubhasisBiswas Sure, OK. All of this is too complicated though. You can directly argue $f^{-1}(A)$ and $f^{-1}(B)$ are disjoint open subsets of $[0, 1]$ such that their union is all of $[0, 1]$.
They are both nonempty as well, because $0 \in f^{-1}(A)$ and $1 \in f^{-1}(B)$. But $[0, 1]$ is connected, so this is an impossible scenario
Continuity means preimage of open set is open, that's all
 
@BalarkaSen oh man. I missed that.
A personal question, brother. @BalarkaSen. Am I worthy of ISI?
i mean I keep trying, but...I don't seem to be that bright.
@BalarkaSen now, I want to ask a stupid question (I don't even have the slightest of idea about that subject).
Is there a relation between the homotopy class of loops and path connectedness?
 
ISI is a shit place and "X is/isn't worthy of ISI" is a garbage judgement thereof which only elitist fools who don't actually accomplish much academically keep saying in quora or whatever
 
Morning all
 
Brightness is immaterial just keep learning/enjoying learning
@SubhasisBiswas Sounds like a horse-before-carts question. Loops are paths $\gamma : [0, 1] \to X$ with $\gamma(0) = \gamma(1)$, i.e., "same initial and terminal point"
 
7:17 AM
@BalarkaSen I am. It is astonishing to me how much I am learning every day. This "path connectedness" is a way to view the world. Intuitively, as I have interpreted it, it acts sort of a bridge between any two points in a set.
perhaps there are some holes in my view, but for now, this is what I think of it
 
Homotopy is a different ballgame. You say two paths $\gamma_1, \gamma_2 : [0, 1] \to X$ with $\gamma_i(0) = p$ and $\gamma_i(1) = q$ for $i = 1, 2$ are homotopic if you can "continuously slide $\gamma_1$ to $\gamma_2$" while keeping the endpoints $p, q$ fixed.
 
@BalarkaSen *carts before horse
 
Depends on if you're standing in front of the cart or the horse!
 
@BalarkaSen reference frame?
one should mention it :p
@BalarkaSen ok. So, as I keep sliding the curve smoothly to another (i.e. reshaping the curve into another, but in a smooth way), the initial "area" (in two dimensional world) must be covered smoothly...
 
@SubhasisBiswas Yes, but you can use connected sets as "bridges" as well. If $X$ is a topological space such that for every two points $x, y \in X$ there is a connected subset $C_{xy}$ of $X$ containing both $x$ and $y$ then $X$ is connected. You can prove this.
 
7:22 AM
area between the two curves
 
There is no such notion as area in topology
 
@BalarkaSen suppose that topology is metrizable... then the "distance" between point to point gap must be covered..
wait..let me draw a picture, i can't utter this clearly enough
 
I think you're spewing too many words which really have no correlation
I recommend reading some proper textbook on topology, like Munkres, before trying to develop ideas about these things on your own
 
@BalarkaSen perhaps. I told you.
@BalarkaSen I really should. But it is very tempting to develop ideas.
 
Yes, but if you have no foundations on the subject, your ideas will mostly be crap
Read a book, solve some problems. Then you can spend time thinking about things
 
7:27 AM
i was talking about the "lines" as distances...
you have to cover them first, in order to reach the other one
no skipping
 
This is all fine and daisies but there's no mathematical content to what you're thinking about right now
 
@BalarkaSen okay. just a 1 or 2 more questions. I promise
will the region $A$ be path connected?
now, this is too much of a specific example. In $\mathbb{E}^2$. But what about the generalised version?
That's all
 
The region you're speaking of is going to be very complicated in general. But yes.
 
was this at all a valid question, mathematically speaking?
 
No, because you didn't parse it mathematically. It can be parsed mathematically but unless you can't do it it's not a mathematical question
 
7:37 AM
@BalarkaSen :( ok. Can you do it for me?
I won't understand tho.
 
I can, but I won't.
 
@BalarkaSen I am trying.
 
@BalarkaSen is it true that a function $f:\Bbb R \to \Bbb R$ is continuous iff its graph is path-connected?
 
a function is continuous iff its inverse image set is open
!?
@LeakyNun maybe we can use that
 
@LeakyNun I believe so, yeah
Not too hard to prove
 
7:44 AM
@BalarkaSen ok. don't prove this. Let me try
 
@BalarkaSen surely there's a homology proof :D
 
no
 
okay, I have done something @LeakyNun
By the definition of path connectedness, for any two $x, y \in \mathbb{R}$, there is a continuous function $f:[0,1] \to \mathbb{R}$ such that $ f(0)=x$ and $f(1)=y$. [ for example, consider the function $f(t)=(1-t)x+ty$, $t \in [0,1] \ \ $ ]. Now, map $\mathbb{R} \setminus [0,1]$ to $0$.
Okay, consider the graph as a set $G \subseteq \mathbb{R}$. The graph is path connected. So, we can indeed find a continuous function $f_{\{x,y\}}:[0,1] \to \mathbb G$ such that for any two $x, y \in G$, $f(0)=x$ and $f(1)=y$. Now, for a bounded set, let $\sup G =M$ and $\inf G= m$. We consider $f_{\{m, M\} }$

We map every point in $\mathbb{R}\setminus [0,1]$ to some $p \in G$
 
@ÍgjøgnumMeg fake news?
 
I'm quite glad that people glossed over Atiyah's proposed proof as a symptom of advanced age
and I'm sorry for bringing it up
lol
 
 
2 hours later…
9:56 AM
> NFU does not conclude that the universe V is a model of NFU, despite V being a set, because the membership relation is not a set relation.
Wat
'Cause it's not type-level
Weird
 
10:13 AM
@ÍgjøgnumMeg Don Zagier is everywhere
what a beast
 
Set theory is so weird
I just wanna talk about collections of stuff
Is that too much to ask
 
yes
 
I don't need all this "can collections contain themselves" and "what about the collection of all collections" riddle bullsh*t
("And if they can contain themselves, what about the collection of all the ones that don't")
…The word collection has stopped sounding like a word
Maybe jamais vu is what allowed set theory to develop. The more you say "set", the less it sounds like a real word, the better you feel about never actually defining the things
 
 
2 hours later…
12:18 PM
I prefer types. Sets are just too limiting because you will inevitably get restricted by the notion of containing something
 
user131753
0
Q: Topological spaces which are not pseudometrizable.

user 170039Let $(X,\tau)$ be a topological space. Then we know some conditions under which $(X,\tau)$ is metrizable (see for example this and this). It is also clear from these theorems that not every topological space is metrizable. However, I am wondering whether the same is true for pseudometric spaces ...

 
12:53 PM
Set theory is pretty weird, yeah.
But anything is gonna be weird when you're fooling around with such fundamental notions.
 
1:53 PM
Given two vector fields $x,y$ and their flows $\varphi_x^t,\varphi_y^t$, is there a simple expression for the flow of the commutator, ie for $\varphi_{[x,y]}^t$?
the simplest I've got is that its the flow associated to the vector field $[x,y]_p=\frac12\frac{d^2}{dt^2}( \varphi_{y}^{-t}\varphi_x^{-t}\varphi_y^t\varphi_x^t )(p)\lvert_{t=0}$
 
It's $\varphi_y^{-\sqrt{t}} \varphi_x^{-\sqrt{t}} \varphi_y^{\sqrt{t}} \varphi_x^{\sqrt{t}}$ upto second order, I believe
 
but thats a differential equation, so basically an "implicit" definition (the soluton of BLAH)
@BalarkaSen That doesnt have hte property $\varphi^t\varphi^s=\varphi^{s+t}$ I think
But yeah, up to second order thats right
 
I think that might actually be all I need
 
If your vector fields are left-invariant vector fields on a Lie group then there's the Baker-Campbell-Hausdorff formula which I think gives you an explicit answer
I encountered this some time ago when thinking about the Lie bracket
 
1:59 PM
yes, it does, and motivates that you wont get an explicit thing in general
 
Right
 
Suppose, $X$ is not connected. Then there exists a pair of non-empty open subsets $A$ and $B$ of $X$ such that $A \cup B =X$ and $A \cap B = \phi$. Choose $x \in A$ and $b \in B$. By hypothesis there is a connected subset $C_{xy}$ of $X$ that contains both $x$ and $y$.

Consider $P= C_{xy} \cap A$ and $Q =C_{xy} \cap B$ . Now, $P \subset A$ and $Q \subset B$ $\implies \overline{P} \subset \overline{A}$ and $\overline{Q} \subset \overline{B}$ .

Now, $\overline{A} \cap B = \emptyset$ and $\overline{B} \cap A = \emptyset$. Therefore, $\overline{P} \cap Q= \emptyset$ and $\overline{Q} \cap P
any nitpicking is welcome.
that typo again. $y \in B$***
 
2:23 PM
@SubhasisBiswas I don't know what you're doing with the closures flying around everywhere. $P$ and $Q$ are open in $C_{xy}$ by definition of subspace topology, nonempty because $x \in P$, $y \in Q$, and $P \cup Q = C_{xy}$ as you rightly observed. That's all!
$P \cap Q$ is empty because $A \cap B$ is empty
 
Yeah I don't know where you appeal to the closures after even...
In terms of clarity, definitely do what Balarka suggested and note explicitly that P and Q are non-empty.
 
Hi @anakhro!
 
I considered the closure since $\overline{A} \cap B= \phi$
Is that a mistake?
@BalarkaSen
 
That's true for any "disconnection".
Any disconnection $A\cup B = X$ has $A,B$ clopen.
 
That is why I considered those closures.
 
2:29 PM
So $\bar A = A$ and $\bar B = B$ always.
Why do you need that for what you wrote?
 
$to show that $\bar P \cap Q = \emptyset$
And the other one
 
Why do you need to show that?
All you need is to show $P$ and $Q$ are disjoint nonempty open subsets of $C_{xy}$ with $P \cup Q = C_{xy}$.
 
I did that, and that was unnecessary
I admit
But was the proof correct?
 
Sure.
 
Okay. I will follow what you just said. I mentioned a truckload of useless things there. Proof should be as much concise as possible
 
2:33 PM
Note that path-connected => connected falls out as a corollary from this, by the line of reasoning you were progressing along previously
For any $x, y \in X$, let $\gamma : [0, 1] \to X$ with $\gamma(0) = x, \gamma(1) = y$. Let $C_{xy} = \gamma([0, 1])$. That's a connected subset containing $x$ and $y$.
 
You should have given it to me as an exercise
 
I wouldn't say that the proof should be as concise as possible, but it shouldn't mention irrelevant things.
 
Well you already had the right circle of ideas so I just disclosed it instead. To compensate, here's another exercise: Prove that finite (actually, do it without this adjective as well) product of connected topological spaces is connected.
 
Anyway. That we have proven path connected ==> connected, we have that any convex subset of $R^k$ is connected. (We have proven it in two ways)
 
in The h Bar, 5 mins ago, by Secret
Thus unlike in non relativistic quantum where the "basis states" have clear physical meaning under some observables, some of the fields $\phi$ corresponds to fields in new physics, and hence we don't know what they are until we discovered them
infinity is when we can guarentee we can always discover new physics regardless of how far humans are into the future civillisation
For else by proof by contradiction, there exists some maximum finite number $M$ where we will stop finding new physics
 
2:40 PM
@BalarkaSen, you mean that $X \times X \times X ...$ upto some $k$ (and infinitely)?
Or $X \times Y \times Z...$
Where each of X,Y,Z is connected
 
Latter.
 
Will try
 
@Secret still on this philosophy kick, eh?
 
Secret is a philosopher at heart.
2
 
@SubhasisBiswas better notation is $X_1\times X_2\times \dotsc \times X_n$.
 
2:42 PM
You cannot really deny I want to touch infinity with my bare hands
even if it means I will die
 
Also something of a poet
 
@Secret what infinity do you want to touch? $\aleph_0$?
bends down beside $\aleph_0$, "Show me on the commutative diagram where that bad man touched you."
 
Well, $\aleph_0$ is a must, for it is where the whole notion of infinity begins. Being the hardest thing to get to from below (you cannot reach it by applying hartog number construction a finite number of times on any finite number, and with the exception of NF (which is basically a cheat since it is derived from the universal set) no foundations I knew of can construct it from below), being able to touch $\aleph_0$ will be a milestone
 
how do you touch a mathematical concept?
 
I have no idea, it really depends on whether there exists physical infinity, which as far I am aware, it is still an open question
but suppose it does not exists, then the natural question to ask is what is a finitistic proposition that form a one to one correspondance with the definition of e.g. $\aleph_0$
This is because if physical infinity does not exist, then either it is completely idealistic, or that it is a shorthand for something we do not quite understand, and finding what it is actually a shorthand for can be very illuminating in understanding the concept of at least what it means to be countable
 
2:55 PM
I was assuming that "touch infinitely" was meant in a figurative sense.
 
@Rithaniel from my understanding, he really wants to manhandle it.
 
So,if physical infinity does not exists, then obviously you cannot touch it in the literal sense, but you may be able to touch it figuratively by unravelling the underlying notion on what it really means
 
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