Language Overflow

Damkerng T.

06:07

Before I may forget, I'd better write this down. I just realized that our discussion yesterday is actually quite important for learners, though I think most learners learn these without being aware of them!

8 hours ago, by Damkerng T.

It seems like we have three related things: forms, grammatical categories, and meanings.

We do have three related things indeed!

Forms, grammatical categories, and meanings -- Or linguistically,

Morphology, syntax, and semantics

I think when I was thinking of calling the simple present the plain tense, I was (unknowingly) talking about syntax.

It's the same idea as the two-tense system.

Leech mentioned the Past Tense and the Non-Past Tense, but chose to use the term the Present Tense (instead of Non-Past Tense) in the rest of the book after making the point about the two time zones. (To avoid terminological confusion, iirc.)

So we have: the Past Tense and the Non-Past Tense

or: the Past Tense and the Present Tense

I think a bit more, and now can recall that my idea about these two tenses was that it could be better if we call them:

the Remote Tense and the Plain Tense

The main reason that I think the Plain Tense and Remote Tense could be better (for learners) is because it detaches the form (i.e. grammatical categories, or syntax) from its use (i.e. meanings, or semantic).

I like the term "Remote" because it covers all the past, the distance/politeness, the hypothetical, and the unreal (irrealis) thinking.

Damkerng T.

07:56

3

Q: I wish I knew who you are

I wish I knew who you are? Is the above sentence correct?

grammaticality

A good question!

The answer says, I would say, "I wish I knew who you were," since it's subjunctive.

That's illogical, I think.

I think there is a clear difference between:

> a) I wish I knew how people do that.

> b) I wish I knew how people did that.

Damkerng T.

08:41

Isn't it strange that googling for the meaning of the word misogynist (which I found in a movie review) landed me on 5 Things To Do When You Get Treated Unfairly. Dan Waldschmidt: Author of EDGY Conversations?

(Switching back and forth between blog-wiki-chat is confusing!)

Anyway, some good advice in there...

> It’s going to happen. On your conquest through life, others are going to lie about you, stab you in the back, confuse your motives, and misinterpret your intentions.

> They are going to over react, blame you, say mean things about you — to everyone around you. They’re going to shout, point fingers, lie, scream, and accuse you of things that are just not true.

A sort of common sense, I think. I mean, we all know it, but it's good to be remind of this kind of thing every once in a while.

Some part of me (still) kinda resonate with the page. -- I tried #3. Didn't work. #4 won't kick it. (Can't fake. Won't fake.) So, I think I'm at #5.

The last two sentences are a really good reminder.

> Don’t let the emotions of being hurt trick you into acting like an idiot.

> Sometimes bad things happen to good people. Hang in there. Be awesome.

moving on...

(PS. Two grammos/typos up there (in my text, not theirs). Can you spot them? Maybe you can spot more. :-)

Damkerng T.

09:05

4

Q: “My grandmother, along with two of her friends, (is/are) planning a trip to Mexico.” –What will be in the gap?

“My grandmother, along with two of her friends, (is/are) planning a trip to Mexico.” The summary, plus all these reports, (needs, need) to be typed by tomorrow. Fill in the gaps please .I am confused about the correct answer. And please explain why?

prepositions conjunctions subject-verb-agreement coordination

How many kinds of agreements do we have in English?

I remember three.

(But can't remember what they are exactly.)

Damkerng T.

10:53

interested on you is not proper English. So that would be a first difference. — virmaior Jan 13 '14 at 5:14

Even more interesting, it's a first.

The problem is I think it's fine.

But I remember vaguely that our English teachers would say that it's always the first.

Now, how can I explain that a first is fine too?

Damkerng T.

12:01

Learners who has these symptoms (..., poor retention, guessing at meanings, fail to comprehend reading texts, ..., fear of speaking English, wrong encoding/oral language comprehension, avoid speaking English, ...) are adult with dyslexia!

Or so this web page seems to say: oknation.net/blog/englishclinic/2009/06/24/entry-3

> คนไทยส่วนมาก ( ประมาณ 70%-80%) มีอาการภาษาอังกฤษบกพร่อง ที่ เราเรียกว่า dyslexia ซึ่งหมายความถึง ความไม่สามารถในการเรียนรู้ที่จะฟัง พูด หรือ อ่านภาษาอังกฤษได้คล่องอย่างถูกต้องและ ชัดถ้อยชัดคำ อาการภาษษบกพร่องนี้ไม่ได้เกิดกับคนไทยที่มีไอคิวต่ำ แต่เกิดได้กับเด็กและผู้ใหญ่ที่มีความฉลาดและสภาวะของร่างกายปกติทุกประการ รวมทั้งความสามารถในการได้ยินและได้เห็น

It was presented in the 12th UNESCO-APEID (24-26 March 2009).

(I think. The original says วันที่ 24-26 มีนาคม 2522, which I assumed it's a typo.)

So all learners who can't understand what native speakers say in real speech are people with dyslexia?

That's not quite right, I think!

We shouldn't conflate the problems found in learning a kid's first language with his or her second languages.

Damkerng T.

16:01

A random thought about dialects...

Can we use this kind of construction to identify an unknown speaker's dialect?

> a) I don't think any of them has the book.

> b) I think none of them have the book.

> c) I think all of them don't have the book.

Damkerng T.

16:52

0

Q: What is the most appropriate way to say these sentences

As you know, we have four conditional structures ,even though I know almost how to use them where to use them, sometimes some conditional sentences come to my mind and I don't know which conditional structure could be better to express them. For example I've written a letter and I don't know w...

word-order

The myth of the three (plus one) conditionals wouldn't go away easily, I think.

Damkerng T.

18:26

Something about chess...

Chess

Chess is a two-player strategy board game played on a chessboard, a checkered gameboard with 64 squares arranged in an eight-by-eight grid. It is one of the world's most popular games, played by millions of people worldwide in homes, urban parks, clubs, online, correspondence, and in tournaments. In recent years, chess has become part of some school curricula. Each player begins the game with 16 pieces: one king, one queen, two rooks, two knights, two bishops, and eight pawns. Each of the six piece types moves differently. The objective is to 'checkmate' the opponent's king by placing it under...

> The number of legal positions in chess is estimated to be between 1043 and 10^47 (a provable upper bound), with a game-tree complexity of approximately 10^123. The game-tree complexity of chess was first calculated by Claude Shannon as 10^120, a number known as the Shannon number. Typically an average position has thirty to forty possible moves, but there may be as few as zero (in the case of checkmate or stalemate) or as many as 218.

> [...]

> Zermelo's theorem states that it is possible to solve chess, i.e. to determine with certainty the outcome of a perfectly played game (either white can force a win, or black can force a win, or both sides can force at least a draw). However, according to Claude Shannon, there are 10^43 legal positions in chess, and the timeframe required to compute a perfect game puts this possibility beyond the limits of any feasible technology.

I'm so happy to hear that...

> Zermelo's theorem states that it is possible to solve chess

which is exactly what I think. (I've never heard of Zermelo's theorem before.)

Back to grammar stuff...

Last night, StoneyB mentioned the -ing, -ed, -en forms.

So I checked my PEU (Practical English Usage), and found that...

PEU uses "-ed form" to mean the past participle!

And the book avoids saying "anything form" in the past tense entries entirely!

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