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12:11 AM
@TeresaLisbon There were no "personal jabs" - I simply mentioned that the answer used magic vs. math (which was explained in other comments). Likely the answerer flagged it.
 
@BillDubuque I know there were no personal jabs : I'm just wondering if it was flagged for possibly being one, and the flag was accepted as such. You were right to point it out, and should raise a point about it in meta.
 
 
2 hours later…
2:03 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at beginning of body (41): Newton's formulae for homogenous symmetric polynomials. by Mini kute on math.SE
 
 
1 hour later…
3:22 AM
For closure: C1, C2, C3, C4, C5
For deletion: D1, D2, D3, D4, D5, D6, D7, D8, D9
C6, C7, C8
 
4:23 AM
 
 
2 hours later…
6:49 AM
Please close this PSQ Attempted some mathematical clarification.
 
7:18 AM
The context given in C11 is too superficial to be good enough.
 
8:02 AM
@Saad I think there is some context in OP's comments that can be added to the post.
 
 
5 hours later…
12:55 PM
@BillDubuque We won't be able to get rid of this nonsense. There is already one reopen vote and far too many upvotes. Giving an answer with informations one cannot have (or has to guess) , but presenting it as an utterly valid mathematical calculation is just cheating. I wonder why some moderators are not able to judge such situations right.
Some comments are also utterly off-topic. Wolfram Alpha is not an answer to such a question , and to claim that mentioning the factors multiplying to the number means that one does not need brute force is absurd. This could also be done in the case of a calculation that took, lets say , 10 years. After we have the factorization, we just have to consider the multiplication. Great :(
 
1:08 PM
Do we have a way to handle questions like this now? I have a hard time believing it fits the site. It isn't really quite even a question. But I don't understand what people feel about big-list nowadays
 
@rschwieb I think big-list requires motivation. Why should I search for hereditary properties, for example? What use are they in mathematics? I have been wanting to ask a big-list question for some time, regarding random walks on abstract collections of objects, but I've been searching for motivation for this for ages, so I haven't quite been able to ask it!
I have motivation for isolated examples (e.g. random walks among elements of a group as a simulation of a card shuffle etc.) but I think the main context for a big-list question is : WHY should we collect these things together? That's not clear in that post.
 
@TeresaLisbon Yes it definitely requires... something!
 
@BillDubuque It looks like your comment contained a "magic word" (I have no idea which one) which allowed it to be deleted with a single flag. No moderator was involved, so far as I can tell.
I have deleted much of the rest of the thread, as the answer prompting the thread is now deleted, and the discussion itself was doing nothing to convince the offending answerer.
 
magic words, interesting
2
 
1:19 PM
@XanderHenderson Thank you! I tried to convince the answerer there, and probably fell on my own sword.
It's good that the conversation was deleted : I felt like someone had punched my insides, each time I got a reply of the same kind. The question also should go, if not for the answers defending it.
 
@rschwieb There are certain words and phrases which are considered inappropriate in comments, and comments containing these phrases can be deleted by a single flag. I think that "what have you tried?" and "thank you" are two such phrases.
I have a vague memory of a Meta SE discussion on this topic, but I can't find the link right now.
 
Damn automatation. Again a case where it failed.
 
In any event, I need to prep for class now. And, per my previous announcement here, I am likely to be mostly offline for the next several weeks. I will try to check in regularly, but make no promises.
 
@XanderHenderson Good luck! I hope another mod covers for you.
 
1:31 PM
 
1:57 PM
interesting questions - I think it deserves a good score.
 
 
1 hour later…
3:05 PM
@TeresaLisbon I guess the author actually missed "$1230$"
 
@Peter Yes, I think they did too! Ross and Henry have the correct directive : it's about finding the number of integers $K(N)$ between $10^N$ and $10^{N+1}$ which satisfy the property. Once you do that, you just break the sum into parts, each part consisting of just $N$ digit reciprocals. An upper bound for that part is then $\frac{K(N)}{10^N}$ , and a lower bound is $\frac{K(N)}{10^{N+1}}$ : hopefully, if both these sequences either converge or diverge, we are done.
Of course, K(N) needs estimation and not calculation.
 
Does it help that with $N$ , the numbers $N+11,N+22,N+33,\cdots ,N+99$ are in the list as well ?
@TeresaLisbon No motivation why integration by parts should be avoided, but 6 upvotes, sigh !
 
@Peter It should! In fact, I see it now : we can probably estimate K(N) recursively because, you know, adding a digit at the end of a "good" number and all that stuff : and about the integration-by-parts PSQ, I find it extremely difficult to ask people to provide reasons for why they ask questions like that. It's almost a given that it's out of pure interest. I don't even know what to ask the user there.
 
I made a typo in my above statement, but cannot edit it anymore.
 
In fact, in general with these questions of "pure interest" , I find it very difficult to communicate with such authors ,because they are thinking : "Ok, interested people answer the question, the rest of you leave, why is it my responsibility to get people interested!"
 
3:15 PM
It must of course be "$100N+11,100N+22,\cdots , 100N+99$"
 
@Peter Yes, I got that. After understanding that, I hit the recursive-type thinking.
Is this an abstract duplicate of the last linked question? I'm tempted to think no, because it's a discrete vs. uniform battle, but others can chip in.
 
Interested in a semiprime-project ? Then come into Martin Hopf's room.
 
3:35 PM
 
@Peter Error! Sorry, I should be putting a different link up.
Please delete this duplicate The answers to all these duplicates are insufficient or already present earlier.
Can anybody understand this question? It's not clear to me what's going on : perhaps there is a desire to describe something , but it's not clear to me. If it is to others, great!
 
3:52 PM
@TeresaLisbon I think the question is okay. I don't really like the answer. The OP specifically asked for a simple expression.
 
@TeresaLisbon No such thing will happen, as @quid has since deserted responses to comments. @Xander dlaims to not have time for this site, but he has time to criticize users here who try to rectify matters.
 
@vitamind Thanks, I think if the question's okay then the answer is fine, but I think about impressing friends at a party : that's context?
Anyway, this means it's borderline, but I'll still leave it here.
@amWhy Going by the load we've got coming now, I'm kind of unhappy that there's no support. I'm expecting a boom in early July- Mid August, when semesters here in India begin and kids start getting in their first batch of real analysis questions : it's going to be bad!
 
@XanderHenderson I find that saying such a blanket policy is inappropriate. Rather than reading the context of the comment, and taking that into consideration, you want black and white criteria so you can delete whatever fits it. Well, @Xander, we did not join this site to put the greatest priority on pleasing mods.
 
And having no mods around is basically delaying the entire thing. Whatever it is , they have to step up.
 
@TeresaLisbon I know, and yet it seems mods are "striking" on this site, and come back only to shame users who are doing the best we can with absentee moderators like Xander and @quid.
 
3:58 PM
@TeresaLisbon In this case, I think it's enough context. If I'm not mistaken, context should be provided to prevent PSQs, LQQs, copy-homework questions, cheating etc. I think it's clear that this question is a "fun challenge". It's not too easy but not too hard. I think it's okay.
 
@vitamind Fair point, I'll leave it as it is.
@amWhy To be honest, I'm okay with Xander going, at least he was there at some point of time. There are some mods who've probably forgotten the spelling of the word CURED.
 
We already knows most other mods never engage with us. @Xander, if you have no time to interact with us, then please don't act only to judge us.
 
Perhaps the spelling of MSE as well.
 
@TeresaLisbon I am okay too, with Xander taking more time off, save for the fact he seems to find plenty time to pop in and dismiss users here.
 
Please delete this duplicate It has been confirmed in the comments that the answer is a dupe as well.
 
4:01 PM
 
@TeresaLisbon And yet those mods put in the minimum effort required of them to remain mods, "sign in once every six months." And @quid seems to have followed @Xander's lead, "on strike". Perhaps it's time we show mods what users being on strike looks like.
 
@amWhy To be honest , I've already got evidence of that : user XYZ who was off leash for three days posted 27 answers in that time, of which 5 were dupes and 3 were to PSQs. I can only imagine this is the tip of the iceberg.
 
@TeresaLisbon I understand your need to publicly kiss up to math.se mods. But for me, it's not worth losing my integrity over.
 
@amWhy Kissing? I'm giving him the least amount of credit he needs, over the others.
 
4:05 PM
 
@vitamind No sooner had you posted it, than an answer came along.
 
@TeresaLisbon I wanted to write exactly the same. Let's close and delete vote it.
 
@TeresaLisbon That wasn't fair of me. Obviously, he alone can take on the burden of the abuses on this site. Yes, I have regularly voted in confidence of him. But... the fact is, now we are left with no one.
 
@vitamind Yes, I see that as being the only possibility. Or flag : right now itself I'll do that.
@amWhy Yes, of course we are left with no one. But we keep going, because that's what we should be doing. I want to take matters into my own hands : and why not, after all the lack of backing on this chatroom. But I can't , I'm on a leash as far as discussions here with the mods have reflected. The only way I can show my dissatisfaction is to avoid doing this : but it pains me. I probably can't do it.
 
@vitamind Answerer self-deleted answer. @TeresaLisbon
 
4:13 PM
I swear I'm on a leash. I can't reply to a comment that openly ridicules the EoQS : passing it down the line to a moderator who , in their measured ,calm and collected reply carries nowhere near the amount of vivacity and force I would want in a reply, doesn't feel good at all.
This is exactly what happened yesterday , with that comment which was posted here : ignorant users who haven't read meta, are coming up with their own ideas of how they want the site to run, and wish for it to magically run that way. That's irritating : and no moderator chat is going to inform the user and make them buckle, let's be honest. Suspensions are going to increase tension.
 
@TeresaLisbon Exactly. They give us EoQS, but won't permit us to enforce it, even when they fail to. You did nothing wrong. No moderator has been in the mod's chat for five days now. And it seems like they have started blaming us for their failure to enforce the EoQS.
 
The only suggestion, of all of this, is to get a back-and-forth in with the user on the spot : let them know they are missing something immediately. But no, I have to send it down via a flag , and it gets a message : "helpful" well of course it's helpful, and I'm happy about it, but everyone knows that by then the user doesn't remember the incident and probably has hard emotions about it that make it even more difficult to converse.
@amWhy Fantastic point. At this rate we may need an actual CBI to look for some missing mods!
 
@TeresaLisbon Absolutely. I share your frustration.
@TeresaLisbon Go for it!! ;D
 
@amWhy Yes, of course , a little pie-in-the-sky! Back to reality ; with Henderson not around, I really will hope that the mods get together with a fava and a chianti and think over this entire project again. It must come to fruition, every vote on the EoQS page is of a well-wisher. Throwing 100+ significant meta votes down the drain is not going to help anybody's case, certainly not the mods'. They better grasp hold of this.
 
I think some mods, or at least one mod, was overly optimistic about introducing EoQS at a time he new he'd (1) have his hands full with two classes to teach in an unreasonable amount of time, and already knew his daughter would be visiting for two months this summer. And to add to his disclaimer claim.... "I won't be available much", when he does manage to come here, he shames users who are more invested in promoting EoQS, than he is.
 
I'm even more disappointed in @quid, who has also bailed out, with absolutely no "heads up." At least Xander tried to provide us a one day warning and notification not to expect him here for the duration of the summer. @quid has not responded to me since Saturday, despite pings. Perhaps he's just avoiding me, but that's no excuse to abandon this site, and enforcing the EoQS.
If those two, @quid, @Xander, are burned out, then this site is going to sink.
 
@amWhy I've always been sure that we wanted EoQS more than them. That's definitely part of the reason why I argued for so long regarding taking comment replies and frequent EoQSing into my own hands : so that I could determine how I vented my frustrations at the present scenario, rather than have it passed on. I'm sure you feel the same.
 
@XanderHenderson Please do not make promises, but also, please stop making so many excuses. You volunteered to be a mod. Stop making excuses.
 
I wanted to take control of certain situations being a high-rep informed user and having read a lot of meta threads about various aspects of the site. At the moment, I feel limbless , in some sense. The news that Xander won't be there is also a definite sucker punch @amWhy we really do care more than them for sure.
Question with source and definition but no attempt Please share your thoughts, I think we should close it but I could be too harsh.
@amWhy I'm feeling very low today with the Xander news. If anything, this probably will make me go even harder, because I don't want to sink. I don't want to sink. I want that amazing site , that site that we dream of. We will try to do as much as we can to get there, even in the absence of people who we know care less than us.
 
@TeresaLisbon I know. We don't know what flack Xander has faced with other mods. I think he has honestly fought for the EoQS, but I'm afraid he's caving to other mods, or hate expressed from users suspended, And that is a shame. Burnout among those seeking what's right is a consequence of unhandled, unaddressed, issues, and violent tones from those who can earn as much rep as they want in a day anymore.
 
4:41 PM
@amWhy I really swear and hope that the situation at least stays the same, if not improves, until he's back. Also, it'll be our responsibility till then to at least make sure the rep hunters are kept in check.
 
@TeresaLisbon I support you, and I will do my best, and keep track of what you are doing and I am doing, so if all fails, mods can't blame us.
@TeresaLisbon But all our flags, and comments, become moot, if they are not handled appropriately, in a way that we are painted by mods never on board, as the problems.
We can not handle flags. We have the power only to focus on closing and deleting posts as needed, which is what we've been doing, or at least what I've been doing, forever.
 
@amWhy Exactly, that's probably the best attitude. If we fail, so be it, but we did our best, and those at the top failed us. And failed the 100+ voters on the meta thread, along with everybody here who sits on CURED and visits the close queues regularly. As to the comment regarding flags and comments, yes we are in deep trouble in that aspect. That's the biggest aspect of the entire enforcement that I wanted to change : no. Not happening, it seems.
Whatever happens, though, one thing does remain : if those offensive comments are not handled, the inevitable cause of frustration and chaos on the site, will be us, the closers. We are "an unfortunate symptom of an unhealthy site" well, people who don't realize their own lack of health blame everybody except themselves when they fall sick. This is like that.
(That quote was from a meta post : I'm unhappy with it, but stick with it because honestly, I'd rather that everybody was an absolute angel and I could focus on math, than to be cleaning high rep waste bins daily).
 
@TeresaLisbon I don't know that I can go on much longer. Not after seeing that @quid was active on this site four hours ago, and answered a somewhat poor question yesterday on main, but has not replied to any comments I've left on Sat., Sun., nor Monday. It seems that mods on this site are sinking to the lowest common denominator: "above all else, make my work easy for me. I don't care how much time you put in to this site, just smile, so we have virtually nothing to do."
 
4:59 PM
@amWhy I wish I had the guts to say that, and the answer to the poor question : well, I've seen questions much better than that up for closure. If mods set this kind of an example, then MSE's sinking won't compare to even the Titanic's.
2
What actually was that question!
 
It's just hard to come to face that this site has been a farce all along: fake internet posts, fake moderators, all created to help lazy askers get their homework done by retired, bored, and egomaniac answerers "think" they earn fake internet points. That will be a hard pill to swallow, but it's time I face it.
 
@amWhy Maybe we should face it? Then again, I remove the points and the gamification, and I see people who want to help and be helped, and I see where I was pre and post MSE , from struggling student to nation's top 10 in a competitive exam : and I want others to dream, and I think this site has to be there to facilitate that rise, that success story. I want more people to succeed from coming here.
 
@vitamind Deleted, what a weird answer!
@amWhy We need more active participants on MSE that work away from the gamification aspects of the site and focus instead on the quality of service they can provide, and raising the profile of question they provide it to. On the other hand, we also need a dedicated bunch of answerers who can cater to improving and answering elementary questions from mathematically inferior askers. At the moment , people of the first kind exist, it's people of the second kind for me that are creating trouble.
Whatever @amWhy just finishing up a mail to you since I need to go to sleep now, so I'll see you and let's see what happens from here on.
 
@TeresaLisbon "I do not do the truth, i am not the truth. Let Your truth live with You, my lie will die with me: c'est la vie!" (comment of the answerer)
 
5:11 PM
@TeresaLisbon It's been great to talk to you! We all need mutual support!
@vitamind Likely a troll, but mods on this site allow almost anything but profanity or offensive targeted attacks.
2
 
5:31 PM
@amWhy Mail done, you can see it. Good night!
 
@TeresaLisbon Sleep well!
 
@amWhy I sure will!
 
@Saad Thanks for your help in this chatroom! I've added you as an owner of this chat room!
 
@TeresaLisbon Flagged the comment begging for an accept, but I guess it will be declined.
 
@Peter Which post is that? It seems mods no longer see pandering for votes or accepts, to be a problem anymore. What you predict is what happened when I last flagged such a pathetic desperate comment pandering for a flag: it was declined.
 
"Now that the answer is in answer form, @NayanPahuja , you should accept it by marking the check box"
 
@Peter Yes, I saw you responded to the applicable post from Teresa. One more delete vote is needed on the question, and it will all go away.
Please vote to delete this poor question.
 
6:27 PM
@amWhy In the answer an answer not even existing is mentioned. I only see a statement and not the answer contatining "it is false".
 
@Peter It seems the answerer was expanding on a comment, which he called the "given answer"... which is to circular. Their answer should be a full answer, but in fact, the question should not have been answered :(
@vitamind Are you around any time soon?
 
@amWhy I am right now, why?
 
We need a delete vote on math.stackexchange.com/questions/4179592/…, @vitamind. But, OMG, I keep forgetting you and arctic char may not have the rep to delete a question until two or three days later. Sorry to have bothered you!
 
weird question and complain about an unsufficient answer although there is no such answer since the meaning of "find" is not mathematically defined.
 
No problem :)
 
6:41 PM
@vitamind You need more rep to be able to give delete-votes :) So happy collecting rep-points.
 
@Peter Closed, open for deletion. What a lame answer. Why do some people feel the need to answer anything/everything posted. If a cockroach appeared as an image, with no text in the body of the question, it would likely be answered! >:-[
4
 
7:02 PM
@TeresaLisbon One more delete vote.
@TeresaLisbon It's just copy-paste of the question and relevant definition. Up for deletion now.
 
@user21820 @Teresa, it's now deleted.
Thanks, @MartinR for your contributions here!
Thanks, @user21820, also for your delete vote on the "weird question"!
 
@TeresaLisbon Up for deletion.
 
@user21820 @Teresa, one more delete vote needed.
 
7:24 PM
 
@TeresaLisbon I think it is not about mathematics, and moreover it has zero value for anyone else. Voted to close, and recommend deletion later.
 
@user21820 I agree.
 
@user21820 I agree that it has zero value for future readers (maybe a little bit, regarding the link of the search website), but it is not a low quality question e.i. does not harm the quality of the site. I won't intervene in any c/d votes since I totally understand them.
 
I am now feeling like a ghost. Carry on, y'all.
 
@amWhy Sorry, I just didn't have anything to say in response to your last few pings.
 
7:32 PM
53 mins ago, by vitamin d
No problem :)
 
@amWhy I am not sure why you are criticizing me here. The comment BD mentioned was deleted without moderator intervention. It happened automatically because the system has a list of "bad" words.
The remainder of the thread seemed pretty pointless, as the original answerer was not budging, and their answer was deleted. Moreover, the comments had already been moved into chat by a different moderator, indicating that the discussion was no longer welcome in the comments.
As (1) the thread had already been chatified and (2) the underlying issue was essentially resolved (e.g. the incorrectness of an answer), there seemed to be nothing to gain by leaving the comments around.
Hence removing the comments was entirely in-line with the removal of comments which are no longer necessary.
 
No problem, very well. That was not my issue. I know you are so busy right now such that I would not dare infringe on your time. Enjoy your summer! ;D
 
Then I honestly don't understand what the problem is.
 
@user21820 No problem! This question was noticed by Martin R, a repost of a dlosed and deleted question. I could not close as a dupe, due to the deletion. But the question should be closed. math.stackexchange.com/questions/4177737/…
 
@amWhy It's on its way to closure now.
 
7:39 PM
I also flaged the answerer, who has recently taken to answering very low quality answers. I'm just not fond of OPs posting questions they already posted which were closed, deleted, and then asked again.
@user21820 Yay!
Welcome, @shoteyes ;D
 
7:59 PM
D1, D2, D3.
D4, D5, D6.
D7, D8, D9.
@amWhy Up for deletion now.
 
@user21820 Awesome. One more delete vote to go!
 
8:17 PM
Feedback, please. Is my last response to the user who answered a question now closed, below the question, too harsh? I just don't understand users thinking, hey, they just wanted an answer they didn't get earlier, like anyone who askers anything here deserves an answer? But at the same time, I do not want to ruffle feathers. So feedback welcome from my colleagues here. math.stackexchange.com/questions/4177737/…
 
Keeping past actions of this user in mind, I don't think you were too harsh.
 
8:34 PM
@vitamind Thanks.
 
@amWhy don’t mind me. I stumbled upon this chat after using chat for the first time ever on this website. I tend to use stackexchange on my phone so I click on things accidentally all the time :(
 
@shoteyes No problem! It's good to explore chats. You are always welcome here, even if this was not where you intended to be! ;D
 
9:03 PM
this looks computer generated, or at least super weird and irrelevant, right?
 
@user1729 Absolute nonsense! It's now deleted. Thanks for posting!!
Sadly, it reminds me of the SE algorithm for creating audits for the "suggested edit" queue!... Nonsense.
 
9:23 PM
Hey, @BillDubuque !
@BillDubuque The question itself has two delete votes now. Thanks for your contributions in this chat. You were right to point out the fake answer.
Unfortunately, it seems some mods have gone AWOL. :(
@Bill, we could use your help in casting the final delete vote on this question, which, as noted below the post, is a duplicate from the same user's deleted question.
 
@XanderHenderson I don't recall the text of the comment, but I highly doubt that it was removed due to some "bad" word (unless "maguc" is a bad word). You can see the deleted comment so please tell us what really happened. Moving comments with helpful mathematical info into chat is always a bad idea, since they can no longer easily be searched, e.g. to help future readers, to reference when such issues arise again etc, I am very disturbed by the high number of helpful chatified comments as of late.
 
9:41 PM
@XanderHenderson You seem, as a team, now not to deal with issues but rather "hide them in chat" so most of the site never encounters them. In so doing, you have censored information, and become part of the problem on this site, not part of the solution. Please expunge the unhealthy and unfair comments/accusations you and other mods post readily, as quickly as you transfer content to chat, and often deleted it altogether.
 
Hmm, well that's a possibility, my comment contained the word "accept", and maybe the auto-delete-when-flagged heuristic wrongly misclassified it as a comment begging for answer acceptance. Could you please post the comment so I can report a bug to SE if that ends up being the case.
@XanderHenderson Damn, you actually deleted vs chatified all the recent helpful comments. This is really bad. I was planning on collecting and moving my comments into another question. Could you please make them available again e.g. in a sandbox. Please, if you do something like that, never destroy useful content - at least chatify it.
 
9:59 PM
@quid One last ping: if you want to attack me, come to where I'm at regularly; I'm sick of being expected to be a dog, called by his/her master, for punishment and abuse.
 
@amWhy let's not forget is was you that wanted to put me in a harness.
 
@quid I'm blanking on that reference, likely from The Cafe, said in jest, perhaps a word from a word search.
 
@amWhy yes.
I'm not sure what is requested.
 

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