The Whiteboard - 2012-10-30

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12:34 AM

@JimG. - And the "most slopes aren't slippery" comment is a (potentially, but apparently not in this case) useful concise expression of the idea that most human phenomena that people apply the slippery slope metaphor to can't possibly actually be dominated by an unstable equilibrium, because such systems, to extend the metaphor, spend most of their time in a heap at the bottom of the hill. You don't have to agree, but it's not ridiculous, and it's not polite to call it such.

2 hours later…

2:39 AM

@psr: ...It's not ridiculous, and it's not polite to call it such. - And yet you had no problem telling @Thomas Owens that when it comes to the broken windows theory, "...You can use it to justify basically anything."

@JimG. - You can - that is the problem with the argument. Which is a specific criticism, not non-specific ridicule.

2 hours later…

4:46 AM

@psr FYI we don't just through "broken windows" around... I've had countless conversations of the "why did you close my question, since this and that are open" variety with people on ProgSE. People see open upvoted questions that slipped through the cracks and model theirs on, and it's confusing when we close them.

9 hours later…

1:18 PM

Ok I have to ask, why does my blog say I got 63 referrers from Meta.Programmers.SE today?? Is someone advertising my profile??? :)

1:32 PM

@Rachel Yes.

You've made Hacker News.

@YannisRizos Why?

@Rachel news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4716543

1:56 PM

@YannisRizos thanks :)

@Rachel I have no idea why someone would post that to Hacker News, but it made their frontpage for a while.

...I miss Pierre.

2:10 PM

@YannisRizos >>Unfortunate, but we can't do anything about it now, especially since the site's experiencing steady growth and an overall increase in quality since the new scope was solidified. The majority of the community seems to be quite happy with the current direction of the site, no one has called me an evil nazi mod on our Meta site in months ;P

@YannisRizos >>Unfortunate, but we can't do anything about it now, especially since the site's experiencing steady growth and an overall increase in quality since the new scope was solidified. The majority of the community seems to be quite happy with the current direction of the site

@Morons Well it's true, I haven't been called out on Meta in a while, and I'm starting to wonder if I'm doing something wrong ;P

@YannisRizos Growth? Quality?

Not by a long shot..

@Morons Hm?

For growth, just take a look at our aggregate traffic stats: quantcast.com/programmers.stackexchange.com

For quality, well that's not easy to measure, but the past few months we steadily get at least one stellar question per week (and quite a few good ones), and some amazing answers...

This place may was supposed to be a place for Professtional

And is it not?

2:14 PM

no.

Care to explain?

Sure look at questions being asked, its all newbe stuff that can be found out with a little research

look at reps of people asking.. all new to the site

@Morons And what's bad about that? I thought you wanted the site to grow...

I do...

Also: Why the hell aren't you voting (up/down)? If you think the questions we've been getting lately don't show research, downvote them...

2:18 PM

but this was supposed to he high level site, it not.

...and award questions that meet your standards with upvotes.

I don't down vote questions.

Then you don't get to complain about quality.

I vote to close if off topic... Im not saying they are low quality questions

4 mins ago, by Morons

Sure look at questions being asked, its all newbe stuff that can be found out with a little research

2:19 PM

i take it back

my research i meant.. a bit of trial and error

that's how we did it back in the day, we figured it out.

if you feel the questions we are getting don't show any research, just downvote them.

A lot of the stuff being asked is on niche topics, so there is no real good place to go for info

I don't down vote questions.. I see it as black and white.

Hm? If this place is supposed to be a bit more high level, obviously the questions will be on niche topics. And why would people be asking here if there was really good places to go for the info?

Either it meets the criteria of the site or it dosent

so i vote to close if it not on topic

We have two systems, one for quality and one for topicality. If you refuse to use the quality system, that's your choice, but you don't get to complain about the quality of questions.

2:25 PM

I'm not compiling :), just disagreeing

The short list of questions I've posted on HN are good examples of recent quality questions.

409

Q: My boss decided to add a "person to blame" field to every bug report. How can I convince him that it's a bad idea?

In one of the latest "WTF" moves, my boss decided that adding a "Person To Blame" field to our bug tracking template will increase accountability (although we already have a way of tying bugs to features/stories). My arguments that this will decrease morale, increase finger-pointing and would not...

teamwork bug-report

Why is that even on topic? Its the most idiotic question ever...

"My Boss is a Jerk, How can i convince him to be less Jerky?"

The others are bettter :)

@YannisRizos I view this site differently than most , i don't view it as community owned.. its owned by SE , SE is doing a community service . I am appreciate of that

@Morons The site is community run (for the most part), but not community owned. The content is community owned though.

So i am most certainly not going to complain or critse a gift

Exactly... People here should be more appreciative

I didn't mean complain in the sense that you were whining. But if you have concerns about quality, you should do your part and downvote the questions that you don't feel are up to our standards. And perhaps you should start asking some questions yourself, you've only asked one!

2:37 PM

i asked a quetion?

@Morons Yeap, it's now deleted. programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/54541/…

oh yea!

that book Spin selling was awsome!

its gonna be the book recommendation of my next blog post

probably gonna write it today... i'm stuck at home because of the storm

Fog Creek's data center in NY is shutting down due to flooding from Sandy. FogBugz, Kiln, Trello will be unavailable. Follow @fogcreekstatus

Tweeted by spolsky on October 30, 2012 at 2:35 PM

@YannisRizos You know that in the early days Programmers would get at least one "stellar" question at least weekly, if not daily, right? At least, stellar by community standards, although I'm not sure if they'd qualify for SE standards

@Rachel I think we have vastly different definitions for stellar... I hope you aren't talking about upvotes...

2:50 PM

I have to agree with @Morons, I don't like the quality of the questions being asked nowadays, and anything interesting usually gets closed fast

@Rachel That's not what @Morons is saying.

@YannisRizos Yes I'm talking about upvotes, that's why I specified "Community opinion" and not SE opinon

His quote: "Sure look at questions being asked, its all newbe stuff that can be found out with a little research"

23 mins ago, by Morons

Why is that even on topic? Its the most idiotic question ever...

23 mins ago, by Morons

"My Boss is a Jerk, How can i convince him to be less Jerky?"

And I must say I agree. All those NC crap questions was exactly what NPR was about...

@YannisRizos You listed it as a great question on HN!

NPR?

@Morons Not Programming Related, the original name of the site.

@Morons I listed it as a good example of what's on topic on the site. I never said I personally like it.

That said, the community loved it, my personal opinion is largely irrelevant. 410 upvotes, 2 downvotes (one is mine).

Some of the answers I think are great though.

@Morons btw I've been noticing some questions lately from a certain group of people that get almost instant upvotes, just a second after they are posted. We might have a nice little voting ring operating on Programmers, upvoting each other's sub par questions, but they haven't done it for long (yet?) and I don't have solid evidence. But if you see extremely poor questions getting upvotes, it would be a good opportunity to break your rules and downvote...

3:07 PM

I agree with not downvoting in most cases. It's not their fault we're a confusing site, and I find downvotes more destructive than constructive

Blog - Stack Exchange: Are Some Questions Too Simple?

Jeff Atwood on February 22, 2011

On Podcast #58, Joel and I had a disagreement. Not the first, and certainly won’t be the last:

Joel says that the only bad simple question is a duplicate simple question. I say simple questions are OK as long as they’re actually interesting (in some way) for other users to consider and answer. To prove his point, Joel actually asks the question on Stack Overflow: How do I move the turtle in LOGO? Do you think this question adds value?

We still have this disagreement. Our community is now struggling with the very same issue across multiple network sites: …

@Rachel You can use your votes as you see fit.

I agree with @joel-spolsky on this.. questions can't be too simple

@Morons And I'm with Jeff on this one ;)

I go that :)

3:10 PM

210

Q: How do I move the turtle in LOGO?

How do I move the turtle in LOGO?

anyhow.. If i feel it doesn't belong i'll vote to clode

close

Closed. As it should be ;P

I know Joel Lost...

I do upvote.. So i do think some questions are better then others.

I wonder if eh changed his mind...

4:06 PM

-8

Q: Should Programmers.SE exist?

The programmers.stackexchange.com FAQ defines its purpose: Programmers — Stack Exchange is a site for professional programmers who are interested in getting expert answers on conceptual questions about software development. If you have a question about... algorithm and data structure ...

discussion stackoverflow programmers

I have a lot of things to say to that guy, but all of them would get me suspended...

5 hours later…

9:37 PM

@jzy why is bacon floating over the Programmers mug? https://i.sstatic.net/yYx5g.png

Tweeted by BenBrocka on October 30, 2012 at 9:19 PM

3

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