Game Development

MickLH

00:00

@Sie lol damnit, I just read the log at all. what did I do now?

Chris McFarland

♥

Jon

___|\____\o/______

MickLH

⚐

@Sie what is this supposed to mean HUH? WHAT?

Jon

0xxxxxx{=================>

<o> -- -- -- --- >o<

Sie

01:37

It's always sad seeing games you liked in EA stay dead in the water. Delver was a lot of fun and had a lot of potential but it hasn't been updated since September 2015.

Garan

EA? Electronic Arts?

Sie

early access

Garan

Ah.

Chris McFarland

01:56

bloody acronyms

yeah, I've been burned on an Early Access title before

It's not really different from games getting canned mid-development
except in this case, customers have paid for it

Bálint

Can anyone tell me

What the hell this: developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/frequency#hz

is used for?

Chris McFarland

Future playback of audio I'd assume

Bálint

I started writing down every property and what prefixes you need to use with them

I'M half done and I have a 250 lines long JSON file

Chris McFarland

it's currently a "Candidate Recommendation" so isn't final I believe

nor supported by any browser yet according to that page

Bálint

@ChrisMcFarland This one's better: developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/hyphens

I should start using firefox

arda

02:11

@Bálint you should

everyone should. Mozilla cares about privacy and future of internet a lot.

Chris McFarland

yeah there's all sorts of lovely CSS things :)
I remember when I first delved into CSS back in 2002, read the whole CSS official doc, was awesome how many things you can manipulate

Bálint

developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/--*

I want this

this is amazing

Why is it experimental

Chris McFarland

Bálint

Put a star after the link

arda

@ChrisMcFarland add * to link

Bálint

02:14

SE thinks that's not part of the link

Chris McFarland

ah, https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/--*

thx

arda

oh hey it is chris mcfarland

Chris McFarland

well hey

arda

I should really buy tallowmere, had that on wishlist for a while.

Bálint

Chris McFarland

02:18

no pressure!
I'm working on the sequel at the moment
Been debating with myself today on how best to implement heaps of item attributes

Bálint

@ChrisMcFarland Component system?

Chris McFarland

I have a large list of item attributes I plan to code in

and for each attribute type, will probably be restrictions for what item types they can be applied to, as well as ranges of percentages, or strength values/rankings

and in the event I want to buff or nerf an attribute in a patch, I don't want an attribute value to be hard-coded to the player's savefile

Bálint

@ChrisMcFarland Language?

Chris McFarland

C#

Bálint

NEat

arda

02:21

Bálint

THen create an object based item component system

The components can subscribe to each other, can have restrictions

Chris McFarland

so I've begun hard-coding ItemAttributeDefinitions into an ItemAttributeDatabase, and your various InventoryItems will contain <List>ItemAttribute which will be linked to an ItemAttributeDefinition with just a vague strength rating I think, and I'll let the game convert to the appropriate percentage in real-time

@arda :D

Bálint

Every component knows it's task and nothing more

Chris McFarland

yeah

Bálint

You can create component systems without hard coding the types of the possible components

Which doesn't just make your life easier, but can also enable modding the game

Chris McFarland

02:24

There's no right or wrong way to do it
I tend to lean towards a basic class and then use a lot of switch cases where needed depending on its type
I either end up with lots of short files that inherit from a base class, or one long class that has code for everything within

Modding for T2, will probably just be sprites, audio, and text for the most part

Bálint

Basically, what I'd do is to have an abstract Component object and an Entity, the Entity has a list of Components and a way to get a component, the components have an id (a string or number) and an update method

Chris McFarland

yeah, that's basically Unity in a nutshell :)

Bálint

Yeah, I found that out after I wrote mine

But you must admit, Unity's system is good

Chris McFarland

I like it. I find it comprehensible

I'm not the smartest programmer

Bálint

No one is

Chris McFarland

02:28

the editor's visual aspect really helps me, seeing everything I'm implementing

Bálint

I like code and a sheet of paper better

Chris McFarland

For me, I like being able to click things with a GUI to get things into their base/ready state
However, when it comes to manipulating sequencing and logic in real-time, I prefer the readability of code

like, I tried Unreal's Blueprint system, and that was just a headache

I can't stand Unity's Animation system, I just hard code everything instead

:31248539 I googled it, I think I found it, but at this point I'm too afraid to ask

MickLH

lol computer algebra system

Bálint

@MickLH I didn't get any closer with that

Link maybe?

MickLH

Computer algebra system

A computer algebra system (CAS) is a software program that allows computation over mathematical expressions in a way which is similar to the traditional manual computations of mathematicians and scientists. The development of the computer algebra systems in the second half of the 20th century is part of the discipline of "computer algebra" or "symbolic computation", which has spurred work in algorithms over mathematical objects such as polynomials. Computer algebra systems may be divided in two classes: the specialized ones and the general purpose ones. The specialized ones are devoted to a specific...

you can make cool graphs and stuff

and then export code lol

it's really lame if you're not a math nerd, but it's really awesome if you are :D

Chris McFarland

02:37

The main reason why I failed high school maths is cuz I lost interest, I could not see myself ever using advanced math

and now I just use methods to manipulate numbers

but I tip my hat to you if you understand math really well!

MickLH

I really enjoy analyzing the details, it really pushes me to work simpler because analysis gets hard more quickly than the concepts involved in the code I think

lol I was just joking as a response to "a sheet of paper" btw

Chris McFarland

analysing is good
analyse too much though, and you'll never get anything done

MickLH

^

mick, listen to this guy seriously

Chris McFarland

lol

MickLH

I go overboard sometimes lol

Chris McFarland

02:44

it's fun

MickLH

yeah it counts as taking a break right? :P

it's a break from getting stuff done anyways

Chris McFarland

sometimes it's needed

honestly sometimes I'm not in the room cuz I just need some peace and quiet, concentration, less distractions etc

other days I don't mind

MickLH

lately I'm working for 5 minutes at a time and getting bored and taking a break lol

I am approaching "barely surviving" with that lmao

Chris McFarland

hahaha

I'm on the fence about having RangedWeapons like a Bow, Gun, Blaster, Launcher etc
and then having Projectiles - and then in theory you could apply any Projectile to any RangedWeapon

a gun that shoots knives, or exploding kittens, or anything

Bálint

@ChrisMcFarland Define advanced math

My classmates think that Trigonometry and linear algebra is magic

Chris McFarland

02:51

@Bálint like, trig, or algebra (I know a little algebra but I try not to think about it), or just crazy graph plotting and shader math and stuff

Bálint

Trigonometry is awesome

MickLH

@ChrisMcFarland gun that shoots knives sounds pretty awesome, would it count if they bounced off a wall and landed on a baddie's head?

Bálint

You can do circles and shit

Chris McFarland

@MickLH Could be coded as optional random attributes for the projectile, and/or the gun itself

bouncing projectiles, homing, gravity or not, number of bounces, multiplying on hit (up to maybe 3 times), just anything really
I want so much RNG

Bálint

mcdorli.github.io/hypercube/index.html

You can do this with matrices

Linear algebra is awesome too

Chris McFarland

02:53

heh, woah

Bálint

codepen.io/mcdorli/pen/LkdoZo

This one's linear algebra too

codepen.io/mcdorli/pen/PzjKqK

And this is both trig and linear algebra

Chris McFarland

cool
yeah I just can't be bothered to try and begin to want to comprehend how to do that

Bálint

Nah, it's not that hard after a while

Chris McFarland

:D

Bálint

I started 3 years ago when my informatic teacher wanted me to make things go in a circle with javascript

Chris McFarland

03:00

sweet

Bálint

Last time in math class we spoke about what vectors are. Only the very basic stuff, direction, length, some coordinate systems

Somehow my teacher found out that I know way more about it than I should know at my age.

And she started asking me about every vector-based operation, like multiplication, dot and cross product, etc. Mainly what comes out of them.

She wanted to find something I don't know

Well....She failed

Hmm, I got 300 lines of pure JSON

amazing...

arda

03:16

@ChrisMcFarland katana is OP

MickLH

maybe that's because it's more realistic and literally scientifically proven to be the most fun also...

just speculating, completely hypothetical

Chris McFarland

haha

yeah like, T2, I'd love to have a random weapon
teleportation + knockback + corpse explosion and/or any other random attributes
there's so many fun combos I think I can create

Garan

03:53

@ChrisMcFarland Which game?

Chris McFarland

my sequel I'm making, tallowmere2.com

Bálint

06:07

I finally published my package \o/

Writing 300 lines of JSON by hand is not fun

SpicyWeenie

has anyone had a problem with getting the glm math library to compile? Intellisense recognizes it, but when it comes time to build, it acts like the files arent there, even though Im pointing to them

Bálint

@SpicyWeenie IDE?

SpicyWeenie

Visual Studio 2015

Bálint

Did you add it to the compile list?

SpicyWeenie

Include Directories?

VC++ Directories->Include Directories is where the path is at

Bálint

06:21

@SpicyWeenie Doesn't Visual studio have a list of what to put in the output file when it builds the project?

SpicyWeenie

what do you mean

Bálint

@SpicyWeenie I'm not a C++ expert, but whenever I work with libraries in any language, and I want to build/compile the project, then I need to include that library in the output file somehow

Alexandre Vaillancourt

You can't compile glm, it's headers only... @SpicyWeenie

SpicyWeenie

Misplaced word. I was thinking of two different things lol

The problem is that its notrecognize them when I try to build, but recognizes them while coding

Alexandre Vaillancourt

It gives a compile error when you try to compile?

SpicyWeenie

06:33

yes, it says C1083 Cannot open include file: ... No such file or directory

but the path is there!

Alexandre Vaillancourt

Make sure that it's there for release and debug builds

you can take a look in the properties of your project, inc c/c++ -> command line, you'll see what's sent to the compiler and you'll be able to track where and why the paths are not where you expect them

SpicyWeenie

Not saying anything out of the ordinary

Alexandre Vaillancourt

06:48

It's a bit hard to debug remotely :P

SpicyWeenie

it just doesn't like it for some reason when it comes time to build, but has no problem coding

maybe its my digital machismo

arda

09:26

Its a multiple choics quizz game and each question in quizz is image with four possible answers(again images) so 2000 questions with 8000 answers that adds up to 10,000. And can you please explain what do you mean by 10-20 templates? path + name do exist there is no doubt about it. — Daniyal Azram 2 hours ago

pls

just pls

Pip

10:59

morning

user92578

hi

Lasse

hey

user92578

I'm trying to make my website look better on mobile devices

NaCl

hi

@Tyyppi_77 You know jQuery mobile?

user92578

nope

NaCl

11:09

Very helpful for making a website look better on mobile devices. :D

user92578

I've almost got everything figured out, I just need to tweak one side-by-side layout and fix the logo scaling

Jon

11:37

Naw

Matt Jens Jensen

@NaCl jQuery is highly recommended, that and SemanticUI or Bootstrap make web development really zen

NaCl

yep

@Tyyppi_77 Are you testing it on multiple devices?

user92578

I'm testing by resizing my browser window

NaCl

seems legit

user92578

hey, it works

user92578

11:50

Currently I'm fighting with one annoying div that gets no height

NaCl

webdev 101

user92578

lol finally

user92578

I had leftover rules

Pip

13:12

pfft leftovers

Leggy7

13:31

it is possible for a game to be on steamstore without having to pass the greenlight system?

user92578

no

user92578

well, if you hack steam like the watching paint dry guy did

Leggy7

try checking roguelands

has been published on 13 june

no trace on greenlight

user92578

might be a big publisher?

Leggy7

smashgames

the ones who made magicite

self published

NaCl

13:35

6

Q: Upload Games to Steam without Greenlight?

I've been working on a little game, (which is nowhere near completion) and wanted to know, that when I'm finished, if I would be able to release it onto Steam without having to get it Greenlit. The reason why this is, is that I already payed for tools and editors for making my game, and don't wa...

Leggy7

hmmm

user92578

maybe valve contacted the guy?

Leggy7

the only thing coming to my mind is that has been submitted with another name?

TheMuffinCoder

lol I'm glad I wont have to go through Steam

PearsonArtPhoto

I suspect it is possible to get a game on Steam without Greenlight, but you have to be well known first.

user92578

13:40

yeah

TheMuffinCoder

Just gotta register a domain and my HTML5 game would be good to go

user92578

well no one has to go trough steam

Leggy7

well, they just made magicite. a beautiful title but definetly not that big

PearsonArtPhoto

How's the greenlight coming anyways?

TheMuffinCoder

well most people aren't going to download .exe games without having a trusted publisher

But anyone will play a HTML5 game

user92578

13:40

I don't think that's true

user92578

itch.io

NaCl

I do think that's true

TheMuffinCoder

lol 99% of people I know only get games via steam

Leggy7

yeah

nobody has to use steam

PearsonArtPhoto

Computer games.

TheMuffinCoder

13:41

I only hear about all these other sources from you guys xD

Leggy7

but if you want to sell, you might be pushed that way

PearsonArtPhoto

That's why I'm aiming for Steam.

NaCl

humblebundle, uplay and co. are somewhat important as well

TheMuffinCoder

uplay????

lol I would think Origin is more used than that

NaCl

I wonder how Steam became so popular

Leggy7

13:42

yeah humblebundle is quite well known

PearsonArtPhoto

I'm certain if a AAA game studio came to Steam and said we want to put our games on, they'd take it without questions. Maybe even a AA studio.

user92578

@TheMuffinCoder How are people going to find about your game?

Sie

@Leggy7 Yet most PC gamers do. Why? They're friends are there, it's fast, it's convenient, and depending on when you buy, cheap.

Leggy7

yeah I want to use steam since I think that's the fastest way to success

PearsonArtPhoto

Steam became popular at least in part because it achieved a happy balance between developers and players.

TheMuffinCoder

13:43

@Tyyppi_77 I plan on self advertising on Reddit/Imgur/9gag/4chan with a link to my game's domain name.io

PearsonArtPhoto

Plus they had a few good starting games, which always helps.

Leggy7

I was just wondering why I could not fine a greenlight for Roguelands, published on 13 june

TheMuffinCoder

Then I plan on going to YT too once I make Android port

NaCl

@TheMuffinCoder Very good idea to put your game link on 4chan

5/7

TheMuffinCoder

lol Agar.io came from 4chan

PearsonArtPhoto

13:44

I think my game could play relatively well on mobile, but I'm only going to do a mobile game if requested.

user92578

People get games on Steam because they find about the game, and find out that the game is accessible on Steam. If they find about the game, and like it, I don't think they won't buy it because they'd have to get it on itch

TheMuffinCoder

lol + my game will be f2p

I think is hard for people to trust anything but steam to use their credit cards for you guys

user92578

Yeah that's not true

PearsonArtPhoto

My first steam game: X-com Complete Pack.

TheMuffinCoder

lol

PearsonArtPhoto

13:45

March 19, 2011.

TheMuffinCoder

Oh snap I found the agar.io original thread from 4chan

archived.moe/v/thread/292460089

Sie

@PearsonArtPhoto I don't know. I kind of wonder how long Steam will be the good guy. They aren't Electronic Arts but I think that they've been getting lazier (on Steam side of things) and they are just surfing off of everyones goodwill.

PearsonArtPhoto

Sadly, everyone does that...

TheMuffinCoder

Wait didn't Steam become popular because of CS?

NaCl

^

Sie

13:48

Not really.

TheMuffinCoder

reddit.com/r/Steam/comments/2tkwbg/what_made_steam_so_popular

Sie

It became popular because of HL2.

NaCl

HL3 confirmed?

PearsonArtPhoto

TF2, Portal, HL2, which I guess were all released together, right?

Sie

Steam has a lot of great developers. Yet they don't seem to be in the business of making games anymore. What a waste of talent.

TheMuffinCoder

13:50

wait they're making L4D3

PearsonArtPhoto

valvesoftware.com/games

Nothing in a long time...

TheMuffinCoder

Then again they were focused on steam OS for a long time

Jon

HL3 is going to be unveiled VR exclusive and lock out rift

vive only

PearsonArtPhoto

Nothing like realizing an interface change is required when you have 6 classes already implementing that interface...

Jon

gordon will be stuck in a hospital bed and fend of demons

PearsonArtPhoto

13:57

That's what I get for not choosing to do some of the more complicated items first... Oh well...

MickLH

14:22

@PearsonArtPhoto At least it's not in C++ where you have to update 12 files to change 6 classes lol

PearsonArtPhoto

This is true.

MickLH

I think the worst time that happened to me there was just under 20 classes and I had to update 40 files :P

PearsonArtPhoto

I've definitely had some major refactoring snafus. Still, I'm getting better at reducing their impact, in general...

MickLH

(and it wasn't just a rename either, I had to actually implement stuff * 20)

PearsonArtPhoto

Most of the time for me it's add a simple function, most of which doesn't do much for most items.

MickLH

14:33

@NaCl It's pretty straightforward, they used to get behind crazy ideas from high college kids and produce them into polished pieces of amazing without damaging the original creativity and insight. They took good ideas and then added actual unadulterated hard work and nothing else.

CS? high college kids modding HL. DoD? more modding. Portal? high college kids thesis project. HL? ... I actually don't know how that game was conceived but the whole story screams "LSD THOUGHTS" lol

I know I'm just a hipster for it but I called bullshit on Valve the day Steam came out.

Leggy7

@Tyyppi_77 how is your stairway to heaven going?

user92578

I'm on a really slow stairway to hell

MickLH

It'll be fine as long as you actually release

Leggy7

rising?

Pip

These screws are the worst

Leggy7

14:44

slowly but still going up?

user92578

slowly going down of course

Pip

I'm taking apart an oooooold PC power supply

and the screws basically instantly stripped themselves

MickLH

@Pip lol why

Pip

to power an LED strip

actually, thinking about it I can probably just use it without taking it apart

MickLH

yeah just jumper the enable pin to ground

Pip

14:46

if I just steal a 5v connection from one of the molex connectors or something and use a paper clip to turn it on

MickLH

Pip

oh thanks for the v1 schematic

that's the version of the one I have here

I did know how to jumper it though :P

MickLH

lol it only took 2 seconds to pull up an image anyways so I had to

Pip

Anyway

Jon

user92578

14:50

Finally.

Jon

only missing one upgrade to code in

then I have to balance it out

MickLH

@Jon lol this feels so tight mechanically, it's hard to imagine something physical actually rotating perfectly by the corner

Pip

I'm powering these: adafruit.com/products/2959

MickLH

lol 2 amps is no joke

Pip

That's why I'm using this desktop psu :P

oh man these leds are so nicely designed

they have two ground wires included

that just hook together

MickLH

14:55

how long of a strip are you going to use?

Pip

so it hooks the power supply ground to the controller ground

just a meter at the moment

MickLH

man I need to get new headphones again soon

the ones I have still work great, the sound quality is still perfect I mean, but the nice trim and all that stuff is starting to fall apart lol

MickLH

15:22

@Jon can I use sub bass?

Jon

what is that?

MickLH

Bass notes that you can't really hear but you can feel

most users wont have any playback for it lol

for the users that don't have speakers for it, it costs some volume

the volume would appear to be quieter on mobile speakers, for example. it straight up doesn't come thru, but then you plug in headphones and all the sudden there's another layer

Jon

that is cool

if you are asking me if you can use it for gorb? hell yeah

MickLH

lol cool I was trying to keep it mobile friendly but this part sounds so much better (imo) with sub

@Jon emailed. let me know if you want the .wav, I only sent the .mp3 because it's not a final version and so I'd rather not jam this tiny tiny comcast pipe up with it for an hour lol

Jon

oh cool

MickLH

15:35

I try to do high-sober cycles

break up the monotony (and a lot of other stuff) with something creative, then come back and fix the other stuff lol

Jon

that sounds amazing -- my dog shat all this disgusting diarhea in my damn computer room halfway through it

so I had to pause and it kinda ruined the entire thing

MickLH

hahaha

Jon

but yeah that sounds great man

how is that not finished?

MickLH

idk I think my meter for "finished" never reaches 100% but just exponentially approaches it

could always revise a melody to be nicer or something

or add a new, more subtle layer

Jon

what you have now works quite well

MickLH

15:47

idk if the horns are a little too much too, I wanted to complete that "triumphantly continue" kind of trip in the middle but you know

I don't want to be all like BA JAM BA JAM BA RAKKA TAKKA up in your face and stuff

Jon

i know its not the typical kind of music you would produce

but you should be pretty proud of it, its awesome

MickLH

lol just so you know, it's all 1 synth routed through 5 different channels with about 7 effects gently applied and back down to stereo

I'm just sending a lot of notes to a few different channels on that same synth :P

Jon

I sure as hell can't do it

MickLH

If you want to hire an orchestra for some insane reason though I'll totally export sheet music

Jon

haha

Dolphin Emulator 4.0 | Mario Kart: Double Dash!! [1080p HD] | Nintendo GameCube

►

have you seen how the dolphin emulator is blowing shit away ?

MickLH

15:54

I haven't played emulators for daysss

Sie

I haven't messed with it in ages but PPSSPP (a PSP emulator) was doing amazing last I heard.

The development was going very quickly.

Jon

man, i wanna go play gamecube games now lol

they are looking crisp

MickLH

omg @2:10

so scared

Jon

dodged 2 shells and a bananers

Sie

So do you guys really think it'd be worthwhile to implement that edge feature you were talking about yesterday?

Jon

15:57

how long would it take you to prototype it?

i just looped that song like 20 times @MickLH

it is good

MickLH

@Sie Eh it's not the biggest deal ITS ONLY THE FATE OF YOUR GAME you know

Sie

@MickLH No pressure. Thanks mate.

MickLH

@Jon that's a good sign lol

Sie

@Jon Not sure. Not really sure how to approach this honestly. I'll have to do some more research later.

Jon

the edge you pick, would select the two vertices that are connected

use the same technique, but move 2 at once instead of just the 1

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