@Kitfox Ha, sorry I'm confused. Are you asking me when I'm going to finish my novel? Or your are asking me about finishing a novel in general?

@alexchenco I thought you had come for chat. We were talking about how to get started writing a novel. I thought you might have some suggestions.

I'm in the nick of time for so many unrelated reason I just melted in my seat.

But I do have a question...

Anyone seen Minority Report?

I have seen the film and read the story

though both sometime ago

But do you remember the cinema-style of the film?

I guess. Something in particular?

@Matt, Wikipedia says Neo-Noir...

@MattЭллен Yes. It's sort of the 'mood' it set. The color of the whole setting, or its feeling, or something like that.

@Mussri hmmm. maybe. I'd have to see it again t be sure.

it is a noir-detective style story

@Mussri yes

In other words, how to do you set the 'mood' of the scenes you want the reader to imagine? Notice that the 'mood' isn't necessarily the emotional state of the scene but how it feels for an outsider, ie. the viewer/reader...

@DForck42 Tackle a project that specifically aims to suggest the visuals and kind of 'entice' the reader to imagine the scenes in the work as if shot in the style of this film.

What would you do?

hmm...

i think a lot of it would have to do with how you frame the world/environment. i'm not too great at setting up imagery like this

@DForck42 I neglected the other aspects of writing for around 2 years trying to get my imagery right that now I can't even get people to flow well with a dialog and not scratch their heads.

_brb

@Mussri ahh. in the chat discussion yesterday @gracenote kind of hit on that subject, about initially setting up your environment/mood, and then allowing your characters and plot to shape and refine that world.

Make sure to be doing all writing in that. Not formulating. Writing.

@GraceNote i don't know what that means

What it means is that, if I weren't clear yesterday, all I talked about designing plot, characters, and world, that should all be done in writing. It should be written out. Not just something you think about.

ahh, gotcha

Pick your own means of writing - synopsis, in-character events, side stories, what have you. Just make sure you actually write.

:-D

_back

@DForck42 I read the whole thing, actually. More than 400 lines of chat!

@Mussri welcome back

@Mussri heheh

@GraceNote I'm a quantum-tunneled discovery writer. I don't do any planning or notes, except the occasional note of a piece of dialog or a good expository entence that happened to come to me during school day.

@DForck42 :D

This is less about planning, more about doing

Which is why it was pretty bad of me to neglect that portion

@Mussri so... you're a pantless writer ;-)

@gracenote so that'd probably be a good note to hit on pretty hard next week, if you're there ;-)

Probably. It was somewhat part of how I do character design, anyway

@DForck42 I don't call it that but yeah...

@Mussri that's what kitfox called it yesterday

@DForck42 I know. But I still don't like it!

heheh

@GraceNote Still, anything on conveying imagery?

Advice? I have none to give on that subject today

It's an important thing to be able to do but it's not one I've ever really tried to teach.

For example, I always 'felt' of the Lord of the Rings Book one as somewhat 'gray and yellow and green' while The Hunger Games was 'Green and Blue' and Harry Potter (1-7) was 'orange' and lastly The Mockingjay was 'black and red.'

@GraceNote I'm speaking generally; anytime, anywhere.

@Mussri ...?

@Mussri That's why I followed up with why I have none. It's "None today" because I can't think of anything to say, not because I'm withholding or anything.

@GraceNote I know. But you implied that it wasn't a part of your creative process -- "It's an important thing to be able to do but it's not one I've ever really tried to teach." -- so...

Because I've never tried to teach it, I can't just spontaneously give advice on conveying imagery. That's all.

Hey @DForck42, didn't you create a Nano account?

@GraceNote And hence "Anytime, anywhere" !

I'm not pushing or anything...

@KitFox yup, Thirster42

i haven't added anyone yet

Want to be buddies?

@KitFox yup

meant to add everyone, and forgot to

I can't find you.

I must be doing it wrong.

Can you find me?

Did you check that the regions matched?

@KitFox what's the name again?

Kitfoxfire

@KitFox ok, done

@gigili i added you as well, my name's thirster42 on there

I can't get to your profile in order to reciprocate.

@KitFox odd. is it saying anything?

non-critical emergency

Weird. Now I can.

heh, weird

We can't start posting anything until October, it seems.

@KitFox funsies

i'm working on a word document with my questions in it and some of my notes

@kitfox @gracenote in a novel, what's the typical number of chapters?

I don't know.

Uh, depends on the length?

A chapter isn't like it has to be some discrete length of pages or events

ok

It all depends on how the organization of events fits the narrative structure. Remember that a chapter serves, if anything, a categorical break point for readers. A save point, if you will.

So the break must be at a point where people can put it down a lot easier than mid-page, but not all such points need to be chapter breaks.

Let's say you have a story wherein there are 4 nations. To deal with a threat, the protagonist must visit all of the nations and petition for help. An easy way to look at it is to do one chapter per nation for this starting segment. Or, you might figure that say, one nation (the character's home nation) gets its own chapter, but the other three are all done in a single chapter (even if the events of each nation compare to the first chapter in length).

ok

In the latter scenario, while the three nations each take up considerable amount of time, they can still make sense to fit within one chapter on account of it still being the same pattern process for all three. In a way, it keeps it from feeling repetitive.

ok, so, i won't be working on my teddy bear short story in google docs.... every time i go into it and start working on it it decides it needs to "reconnect" and i can't do anything

@DForck42 OK, thanks. We're buddies now.

@KitFox I really don't know how to write a novel. Why do you think I have some suggestions?

@alexchenco Well, because you write a lot. I thought you were working on a novel.

Writing a lot is a good step

@KitFox Haha How do you know I write a lot.

@KitFox Well, have written 6297 words so far. I think there's still a long way to go.

@KitFox I'm making this: writers.stackexchange.com/questions/5930/… a full-length novel.

@alexchenco You ask a lot of questions on Writers. I figured that meant you wrote a lot.

@alexchenco Yeah, I remember reading that question.

@KitFox Yeah, I guess you are right. I used to write six hours a day.

@KitFox so most people here are not writers but editors?

I'm not sure. Neil's an editor. Grace is a teacher. I write.

@KitFox what kind of things do you write? (I mean genre)

Here's my writing blog, if you want to read. I'd say general fiction, I guess.

With a bent toward sci-fi sometimes.

@KitFox I'm reading your stuff, it's really interesting. This is my stuff: alexandrochen.com/existential-fiction

@KitFox I write magical realism I think (not very sure).

Sweet. I'm going to bookmark this for later. I guess I'll get to see what happens in the stories that you've posted in your questions?

I've got to go. See you around!

@KitFox Sure, see you around.

@KitFox Hey, where is the continuation of Alma's story? I really like it.

liked it

@KitFox I teach only because I write

@GraceNote Careful what you advise ;) Most writers go for page turner endings. They do not want, that the reader put it down.

@LadybugKiller Well, you want people to keep turning pages, but cutting it off in the middle just feels wonky, no? You want the sequence to continue without it to be interrupted.

Yeah, sure. Just the "put it down" is not something many people would advise (even though I write those breaks myself (and on purpose), but I wouldn't call me a successful writer)

Ah

Yeah, when phrased that way, it does sound like I gave pretty bad advice,

@GraceNote Are there writing teachers who do not write? Oh, wait, yes, there are. I think I'm reading a book of one just now.

@LadybugKiller I meant that I teach as a writer, not as a writing teacher

If you teach you teach, if you write you write. If you write and teach, you teach and write.

I guess you can say that

So keep up teaching, because teachers are needed. By the way, why do you not answer questions on the main site?

Timidity, mostly. It took @KitFox practically dragging me in here to show up here for these.

Timidity? Are you fricking kidding me? You are not timid on all these other sites either.

In the other community I'm in, I'm yakking out writing advice a lot because they're all kids (relatively) and they're all "I want to be all good at writing!" so I want them to keep that heart and drive. That and it followed naturally from where I was telling all the artists to keep doing their work to hone and practice it.

Now I learnt a new word. See, you are good at teaching :)

I'm not as timid on, say, Gaming, because I'm pretty good at video games after let's just round up to 20 years worth of gaming experience. I'm certifiably helpful there.

Here? That kind of early fear that stops you from trying, stopped me from having really looked at the main site since its early days. I remember looking at a couple questions and thinking I could say something, but then I kinda turned tail and hadn't looked back.

No feasible or logical reason. Just is as it is.

And SO? Game Dev? Meta? You have no reason to be timid. And I do not accept it as excuse :)

So from tomorrow I expect you start hunting Lauren.

SO I only asked for work, I haven't posted since job change. Game Dev I hid in the tag wikis because the last thing I'm going to do is give advice as a game dev with no products to speak of, and Meta is well, natural to me.

Lauren?

Rep leader

(If you check my game dev profile, you'll note that I've never actually posted any questions or answers)

Ah

It's a little bit sad, that only one person managed to jump over 10k so far. So you see, we need you!

I'll see what I can offer. Starting some day that isn't today.

Tomorrow. Which begins in one hour.

Not here it doesn't. I'm not letting it begin for 17 more hours here. Not after this 11 hour marathon of work.

Ok, UTC is the official SE time. Then it's in three hours. Get going, lazy bum.

Nuuuu

Fine. Why don't we meet somewhere in the middle. Let's say two hours.

Seventeen

Deal. I expect your first answer in seventeen (17) hours from now.

I'll see what I can wreak

Just write ;)

Have I already mentioned it's near midnight? The old man has to prepare going to bed. I read you in 17 hours. Bye!