TRPG General Chat

12:00 AM

@Axoren I didn't realize they'd removed the "save sense" in 5e. That something I'd always relied on, to some degree, in previous editions.

Axoren

It's likely the MOST important thing about spellcasting.

Imagine culturally if spellcasters couldn't tell that their spells were doing anything at all.

Testing Suggestion on your best friends and them just doing what you're saying to motivate you to not give up on spellcasting

Casting invisibility and recreating the Emperor's New Robes

You'd be damn sure that Fireball works, but that's easy.

"Is he on fire? YEUP! It worked."

Karelzarath

Yep. Anything not explicitly overt would be impossible to judge.

From a game design perspective, it does remove the "I'll cast it until he fails" mechanism that gets kinda annoying.

Axoren

@Karelzarath That's what limited casting is for

If you're not playing with the Rest rules in mind, and you just let players recoup their full casting throughout the day, a lot of rules become useless, a lot of game features are trivialized, and encounters become embarrassingly easy to overcome.

Karelzarath

Of course, but there are plenty of ways to get around those limitations, often by throwing money at it in terms or wands or other charged items.

Axoren

I'm not yet fully aware of the economy of 5e

But in any other system, money becomes a VERY limiting factor.

Karelzarath

12:07 AM

Flat not knowing if your spell hit or was resisted can forestall some of that. Not saying it's good or bad, just that that's likely where the design choice came from.

Axoren

If players are willing to empty a wand for security sake

That's the trade their making, and it's their own fault for being annoyed.

nitsua60

@Karelzarath Certainly in 5e this isn't the norm. (Grocery-store levels of availability of wands and the like, that is.)

@Shalvenay it took me an unreasonably long time to find the fix you made. But thank you, after I finally found it =)

Shalvenay

12:24 AM

@nitsua60 yeah -- 5e was designed to be lower-magic overall than 3.x got

Karelzarath

@nitsua60 As primarily a Pathfinder player, I don't know the finer nuances of 5e. Thanks. :)

nitsua60

@Karelzarath A potion of healing is the only "listed" magical item. You may play in a high-density or low-density of magical item campaign, but the design assumption is that there's not a magic item economy, per se.

nitsua60

1:51 AM

Good communication is critical. Expedient it would be for lawyers everywhere to invigilate on that.

Shalvenay

@nitsua60 haha xD speaking of writing -- can I poke you in Discord PM for a bit?

nitsua60

If it's quick--I'm working on a huge pile of grading. (Ignore that I'm dropping random links in chat while saying that.)

VtC system needed.

Joel Harmon

4:45 AM

129

Q: Without a magic item economy, what is gold for?

PHB page 144, Equipment, Wealth, Selling Treasure Magic Items. Selling magic items is problematic. Finding someone to buy a potion or a scroll isn’t too hard, but other items are out of the realm of most but the wealthiest nobles. Likewise, aside from a few common magic items, you won’t norma...

daze413

4:58 AM

chat! HALP!

trogdor

eh?

daze413

Im trying to come up with a monster ability for dnd 5e

**Wretch (recharge 5-6)**
The swine regurgitates the contents of its stomach at a creature within x feet. The target makes a DC x Dexterity Saving Throw or take x poison damage. Additionally, on a failure, the target must make a DC x Constitution Saving Throw or become affected with a random disease. If the target fails this Constitution Saving Throw, it must make a Wisdom Saving Throw or gain one level of madness.

i dont like it... too many saving throws...

trogdor

ah 5e,... I have no idea in that system

daze413

I could run it as is but it'll take forever to resolve and quickly become boring over time

Magician

Is there a reason you want it to inflict poison, disease and madness, all at once?

daze413

5:02 AM

am asking here as it doesnt look like a good main site Q.

@Magician it does very little damage, but is intended to be a "debuff". I only want it to model getting degrees of severity of the attack. Where 3 failures gets you the damage+disease+madness

trogdor

is this a thing from Darkest Dungeon?

daze413

yes

the Swine Wretch

those little guys that vomit alloverya

trogdor

mk, it seemed a lot like it

Magician

Hrm. Madness is a core mechanic of Darkest Dungeon. That probably can't be said about 5e (not that I know how it works there)

daze413

haha, thanks :D I'm glad someone recognized it. Some of my players are real big fans of the game and dont want to be disappointed ;)

@Magician yeah, madness is great in 5e. There's a whole section of it in the DMG

Magician

5:05 AM

Can you summarize? I don't think it's in the basic version of the rules.

daze413

ooh. It's only in the DMG. Basically, you can add a new ability score to the game (totally optional, you can use Wisdom just fine) called sanity. And whenever you fail at a sanity roll (check or save), you gain 1 level of madness. Madness comes in degrees: there's short-term effects like being stunned, fainting, etc. There's long-term like amnesia, fear, etc. And then there's indefinite madness, paranoia, phobia, etc.

You start with 0 madness or no madness. When you gain a level of madness, you get short-term madness which goes away in minutes. Then when you gain another level, you get long term madness which takes hours, and so on. When you reach the indefinite madness and gain another level of madness, you get an ADDITIONAL short-term madness and then rack that up again.

Magician

Well. It seems that, while certainly stressful and disgusting, having a swine monster throw up at you shouldn't cause madness as such. It's fine in DD, where stress goes up to 100 (200?). In D&D, I'd reserve it for something truly horrific. Because there are plenty of monsters in D&D that do comparable things, and don't normally cause madness checks.

BESW

Not all madnesses are equal, and it sounds like the D&D madness mechanic isn't a good match for DD's madness themes.

daze413

Hm. alright, but I'm keeping the sanity checks for the Madman and the Bone Courtier

Magician

@BESW Yeah, in DD it's death by a thousand cuts.

daze413

5:14 AM

I was toying with Call of Cthulhu but the system doesnt really give the bad-ass feel for DD, though horrific, there are times when heroes really shine

Magician

@daze413 Shadow of the Demon Lord? I haven't read it, but it's meant to evoke a very similar feeling, I believe.

daze413

There is a whole stress system theiddm homebrewed.

am hesitant to use it, though.

@Magician I'll look into that. Thanks

trogdor

yeah, it is a strange thing to try to combine DD aesthetics with D&D

daze413

It's not perfect, but im optimistic it'll fit. None of my players really want to invest in learning a new system more complicated than Great Ork Gods haha

trogdor

I certainly won't tell you not to try it

I just personally don't think I ever would

BESW

5:26 AM

Hmm. Don't Rest Your Head?

trogdor

oh, maybe indeed

BESW

Lift the Cthulhu Dark sanity mechanic but use a bigger die?

trogdor

@BESW the Darkest Dungeon sanity damage is actually dangerous because of several several small hits to sanity rather than single big ones

I don't know that a bigger die would make that better

daze413

5:48 AM

yeah, I love the creeping fear of the stress gradually stacking up. And by love, I mean the love of being punished like in Souls games.

trogdor

yeah, I don't want a game to punish me

daze413

I just might use theiddm's stress mechanics, the only thing I don't like in there is the Afflictions, because I know if I'm going to inflict "abusive" to one of my players, they'll just end up making lewd jokes. Aaaand the game becomes Dankest Dungeons.

trogdor

difficulty is great, but there is a fine line between the two things XD

I have played a few pretty hard, or at least hard if you crank the difficulty up, games

daze413

That moment when... "Teetering on the brink, facing the abyss..." Reynauld's resolve is tested... VIRTUOUS! is one of the greatest thrills of the game, I wonder how it can be modelled in DnD though. Probably can't ever. hah

trogdor

certain fighting games, platformers, shooters and such, but the key component to making the game good is that it isn't so frustrating that I decide I don't want to play it anymore XD

that being said, if game isn't hard enough that does also make me bored of it eventually so there is that

@daze413 but that is like, a completely random proc right?

that is one of the things I dislike personally about Darkest Dungeon, it is a hard game, and a punishing game, and there is a lot to do with random dice rolls behind the scenes to determine the outcome of an action

there is skill and strategy involved, even heavily involved, but for me it gets obscured by the random elements

daze413

5:59 AM

@trogdor yeah, believe it's 25% to be virtuous. So if your whole party becomes stressed, one of them might be virtuous. That is, if you don't get abilities that build around getting virtue

trogdor

it doesn't by any means make it a bad game, and some people I am sure love that random element

but I personally like it better if the only thing I can blame for any failure in a game is my own lack of current skill or experience, or a simple or not so simple mistake I made

daze413

@trogdor I felt that way in the beginning, too. It's like playing DnD but you don't know how you got to +5 attack rolls. I looked up the actual mechanics of the how the game calculates it and it's not that frustrating anymore

trogdor

if I were to play Darkest Dungeon, I feel like the very first time one of my party members in an expedition died due to dubious random elements I would rage quit

@daze413 but part of the fun in random elements in RPG's is that I have other people there with me to comiserate on a bad roll

and I rolled those dice myself

and in some RPG's, like Fate, I can say "hold up, I am spending this resource to mitigate or re-roll this random element"

daze413

@trogdor true. totally different seeing a 2 roll, vs just seeing "miss!" on the screen

trogdor

in that last case, the random element can still be there, but I have the ability to try to reverse it when I am not ok with that outcome

@daze413 exactly

daze413

6:12 AM

Eh, I find that a stoic outlook at failure in games is best for me. If a hero is at 100 stress, youre probably already losing anyway. Or, if you're in the actual darkest dungeon, you have to be ok with a hero reaching 100, you have to expect that to happen and be fine with it.

trogdor

6:35 AM

that is all fine, and I admit that there are definitely things in the game that you can do, and prepare, to mitigate the random stuff

but in the end the random stuff is still there, and being controlled by a machine with no empathy for my struggle with frustration at the random elements

and I do like difficult games, the difficulty isn't the issue

it really is the introduction of random elements that I know are basically random and which I have no control over that turn me off in games like this

I have heard recently that there will be a new mode introduced that makes the game a little less unfair,.... somehow

called like, "radiant mode" or something like that

it still doesn't mean I will necessarily want to play the game, but intriguing none the less

Urist McDorf

6:55 AM

Apparently the radiant mode just cuts down on the grind

I semi-liked Darkest Dungeon. It got boring and repetitive pretty fast

trogdor

7:09 AM

oh, what I had heard mentioned only vaguely what the radiant mode would do

and it encompassed cutting the play time to win down, but seemed to imply other things

either way, not enough to convince me I want the game, but it was interesting to hear

Urist McDorf

I dislike games that intentionally make the player miserable

trogdor

because I have actually like, watched a bunch of playthroughs of the game, and one thing that stuck out at me is that all the people I watched played a loooooot and never beat it

Urist McDorf

There's a very, very big difference between difficulty to progress and ease of losing progress

Darkest Dungeon, Dark Souls, other games are part of the latter category and I loathe it

trogdor

@UristMcDorf yes, indeed there is a large difference there

I have heard that Dark Souls games are mostly extremely fair about difficulty though

Urist McDorf

I mean, I might drop a game if I played it for two hours and then something happened that made me lose that progress.

I'm not sure. I haven't really played DS.

Nor do I plan to.

trogdor

7:13 AM

that being said, I have also watched people playing some of those, and I would say that the way that some enemies jump out and can potentially one shot you doesn't necessarily converge entirely with my definition of "fair"

Urist McDorf

Yeeeah.

trogdor

@UristMcDorf same here, but by what I have seen regardless still doesn't make me want to

Urist McDorf

One of my favorite games is Dustforce. It's extremely difficult - you have to S-rank a low-difficulty level to even gain access to a higher-difficulty level, and accessing the last level requires you to S-rank the whole

game

And that's awesome.

trogdor

I get that people can play Souls games and learn how to avoid the "unfair" stuff

I have spoken with at least one or two people who have played at least some of the Souls games, and they mention that you can learn how to avoid the things that look "unfair" to me

but the fact that it looks to me like you kinda have to be blindsided by it at least once to learn that kind of thing,..... doesn't sit right to me

Urist McDorf

Nor with me

trogdor

7:17 AM

@UristMcDorf that isn't my cup of tea either honestly, I get that people like that kind of thing, but I prefer a game not actually force me to play completely perfectly just to progress

the flip side being, if a game doesn't force me to, I will then feel my own inclination, often enough, to improve a rank or score on a level

Miniman

@trogdor It's hard to explain, but you don't have to be blindsided. It's just that very few people are willing to maintain the kind of concentration Dark Souls requires for very long, so we get lazy and make mistakes.

Urist McDorf

"Lol bet you didn't know that" isn't difficulty, it's just artificial lengthening of the game.

trogdor

@Miniman fair enough there then, it just still seems like,... overly punishing to need that level of concentration at every second in a game

Miniman

@trogdor You don't need it! You just need it if you don't want to get randomly killed.

Urist McDorf

@trogdor Fair enough. Though the S-rank there just relies on you not getting hit all level and clearing all the dirt without too much time spent between each patch (or you'll break the combo). Most of the "perfection" comes from the leaderboards.

trogdor

7:20 AM

on a sort of side note, I kinda like some point and click type games, but even a lot of the good ones end up making puzzles that literally make no sense,......... those also infuriate me

@Miniman well see, there in lies the problem

Urist McDorf

I broke the top 100 in one level

I was exhilarated.

trogdor

not getting randomly killed is low on the bar for what I want in a game

Miniman

@trogdor Despie appearances, dying in Dark Souls is not particularly punishing.

@trogdor It really is hard to explain, but I can't recommend trying it enough.

Urist McDorf

Doesn't it reduce max health or something in DS2?

Miniman

@UristMcDorf Yeah, I was talking about Dark Souls the game, not Dark Souls the series.

Urist McDorf

7:21 AM

Ok

Miniman

The sequels make some questionable decisions, especially DS2.

trogdor

@UristMcDorf I do like leaderboards, there was a span of time I was trying every day to get on the leaderboards for Steredenn

@Miniman ooooo ok fair enough

I don't think I ever watched the first one

Urist McDorf

@trogdor The thing about Dustforce that got me was that getting a perfect is just a matter of getting in the flow - and you get a perfect when you get in the flow anyway (most of the time)

trogdor

the rest of the series that I have seen does indeed seem to punish you for dying, at least depending on circumstances

Urist McDorf

And speaking of flow, it's an extremely fluid game. Hard to explain, but that's what I love about it.

trogdor

7:24 AM

@UristMcDorf to be fair, Steredenn also only lets you progress if you don't die to the ridiculously escalating stages and bosses,..... but at least it doesn't keep you from progressing because you made mistakes

too many mistakes = dead, but any at all means you still can progress

Urist McDorf

Fair enough.

I also can't recommend Reus enough. It's basically a space and time management game that disguises itself as a god simulator (you know, like Black and White).

CTWind

From what I know of Dark Souls, it's a difficult game but one with very little randomness. The game doesn't punish you for dying, but it does punish you for not learning enough from your death to get to where you originally did.

Urist McDorf

You basically have 30/60/120 minutes to make the most advanced humans you can on a tiny planet.

trogdor

@CTWind fair enough, the first game, again, is not one I have taken a look at

I kinda made the assumtption that it worked more similarly to the later games than it sounds

Urist McDorf

You have four giants, each able to create their own kind of territory and resources, and each combination of territory + resource type produces a specific resource in that tile (like domestic animal is chicken in the forest and uh tuna in the ocean? I can't remember atm). Each resource provides a bunch of stuff - food, wealth or science. Once you have resources in place, humans appear to build cities near them, and from them on your task is to provide them with as much food, wealth and science

as possible. There are some catches though. Oh, the beautiful catches.

You're limited by time. At the same time, giants are corporeal entities that have to move around the globe to create resources at specified spots. Also, if you give too much resources too fast to a city, it'll get greedy and fight nearby cities or even the giants. You're limited by space. At the same time, the meat of the benefits provided by resources is not their passive "+2 food" or something; it's the synergy benefits - "+3 wealth if there's a quartz adjacent" or "+2 science if an animal

lair within two spaces" or stuff like that. So you have to figure out how everything will work together.

Oh, and cities create projects where you have to provide them with X of one or two kinds of stuff before time runs out, and if you do they get a huge conditional boost and give you ambassadors. Ambassadors on giants let the latter improve resources and turn them into other kinds of resources.

So it's basically about juggling limited time and space to create the most efficient (but not too efficient) engine at a time, constantly making adjustments to the things you've already placed and to new things.

It's at the same time hectic and relaxed (the pause helps)

trogdor

7:35 AM

one game I actually only started playing recently, even though I owned it for a while because my brother had gotten a Humble Bundle pack for me a long while back for my birthday (or maybe chirstmass or something, not sure) is Skullgirls. I origionally didn't want to touch it because it looked like just fan-service-game-number 101, but I tried it out a few months ago and it turned out to be a really hard but rewarding fighting game

Miniman

@trogdor Also, the best tutorial in any fighting game I've ever played.

trogdor

and I miss stuff like Tekken and Street Fighter and Soul Calibur and such, which I used to have

@Miniman I tried that yeah, it was little frustrating to some degree

I am not so great at doing all the more advanced stuff in the game yet

Miniman

@trogdor I get that - years later, I still haven't finished it.

Urist McDorf

I like fighting games, but I can't be good at them

trogdor

Steam says I have only played like, 9 hours of it

Urist McDorf

7:37 AM

The execution aspect trips me.

Miniman

But the way it takes you through everything one steap at a time is great.

@UristMcDorf Oh, I'm terrible at fighting games. Skullgirls is just really fun.

trogdor

@Miniman yes it is a very good tutorial, no arguments from me there

Urist McDorf

Sirlin's making Fantasy Strike which is very forgiving execution-wise but that's about it.

trogdor

@Miniman it is pretty great, and to think I neglected to play it for the same reason I didn't watch Gurren Laggan for all that time

I am seriously glad I was able to get past it for both things

Miniman

@trogdor Nah, I completely get that. So much of the fanservice-y stuff really is crap that it's hard to guess when the fanservice is just incidental to something awesome.

Urist McDorf

7:40 AM

Man, I just want to drone on about my favourite games

Started with Dustforce and couldn't resist making a wall of text about Reus

trogdor

@Miniman but then I heard several times how much of a good show Gurren Laggan was, and at some point a while ago I heard people talking about how good Skulgirls was, so I figured a chance must once again be given

I am so glad for that XD

Urist McDorf

Now I want to tell you guys about Might and Magic Clash of Heroes :)

trogdor

@UristMcDorf hey, I do that enough sometimes myself, I get it

Miniman

@trogdor If it didn't involve ping going to US and back, I'd suggest you slaughter me over the intertubes.

trogdor

lol

Urist McDorf

7:41 AM

Well Might and Magic Clash of Heroes is an amazing game

It took the match-3 formula

trogdor

@Miniman Guam and back, but maybe still XD

Urist McDorf

And made it into something beautiful and strategic.

trogdor

unless,... I guess all the servers are there,.....

Miniman

@trogdor Oh are you guys actually connected to us?

trogdor

@Miniman possibly not,..... I didn't even think of that

Urist McDorf

7:43 AM

Your basic match-3 "blocks" are actually units that, when matched horizontally, create a wall and vertically - an attacking formation that will attack in a few turns.

You also can only move units column to column or destroy units. Not the whole grid is filled at any time.

The units are different within a faction and per faction, and you also have elite/champion units (which you have to get two/four units of that colour behind to activate) which have special abilities.

The goal is to get enough of your attacks through the breaches in the opponent's defence to reduce their HP to zero

It's simple, elegant and a ton of fun.

trogdor

ah, so you push lanes in it?

with units?

Urist McDorf

Nah, you both have a half of the screen and that doesn't change

See how there's only one measly spearman on the human's side?

If I was attacking in that column, I'd probably destroy him (losing a bit of the attack's power in the process) and deal a bit of damage to the hero behind, because there's nobody else between the attack and the hero

But since attacks take some time to charge up, the enemy usually has time to prepare at least somewhat.

Oh, forgot to mention it's not real-time, it's turn-based. You have three moves per turn which you can split between moving units, destroying units and summoning reinforcements (refilling units on screen to capacity at random; they don't automatically replenish)

trogdor

ah ok

Urist McDorf

The extremely limited space is the meat of the game. You can't balance offence and defence when you only have a 8x6 grid to play with and walls take up your reinforcement slots. So it's a bit of a game of back-and-forth when you try to find breaches in the enemy's defence, and he blocks them, and while he's doing that you redirect your attention elsewhere, and so on.

It's great.

Okay sorry vidya rant (?) almost over

trogdor

lol

Urist McDorf

7:56 AM

Just wanted to say that @trogdor if you own a DS (or cough are willing to emulate cough) you should try Dawn of Heroes. It's a tactical game where every combat is a puzzle (and that's every - each level has its own gimmick, its own approach to the enemies) and it's very obviously inspired by DnD 4e.

And you like 4e.

And fiddly bits.

trogdor

ah

fair enough then

XD

Urist McDorf

I feel like I've flooded the chat a bit and I should apologise. I get carried away sometimes.

trogdor

if you feel like that, next time you have a lot to say you could move it into chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/13848/…

the not a bar

but I mean, what you were talking about followed the conversation at hand

so most people probably would not/did not mind

and you are not by far the first person who has taken an off topic discussion in the room further

and if any had wanted it moved, they could have asked politely first for all of us talking about vidya games to move it to the not a bar

so no biggie, I think

:)

Urist McDorf

8:23 AM

Cool

Thanks

I hope today I've encouraged people to play games I think are great even if obscure :)

Oh, M&M: Clash of Heroes has a duel multiplayer mode. So if anyone picks it up, I'd love to play with them sometime.

Urist McDorf

9:20 AM

Oooh

If anybody's interested in Star Wars Saga Edition, here's a compilation from adventures used in the RPGA Living Force events, approx 150 of them: smallshinyobjects.ca/star-wars-rpga-living-force-adventures

And of course they can easily be adapted to other Star Wars systems too.

Patta

Sounds interesting, I'll be starting a game of Edge of the Empire with my colleagues this evening. Maybe there's something interesting in there. Thanks :D

Urist McDorf

:D

I liked SWSE

It had an interesting semi-classbased system

And I really liked some of its ideas, like the lack of an AC defence.

BESW

Faith Corps seems like the system I'd use for Star Wars if/when I ever played such a game. I'm looking forward to @doppelgreener experimenting with Faith Corps with us.

Patta

Oh, in my opinion the fantasy flight games are awesome. Kinda sad that the release of the german versions for Force and Destiny & Age of Rebellion took so long... But they are coming soon (I think :D)

I never played any of the d20 Star Wars Games, though.

BESW

The d20 System is epically unsuited for games in the Star Wars rhetorical mode.

Urist McDorf

9:31 AM

Can't comment on that but can say the Saga Edition is great for SW

Patta

Isn't the Saga Edition d20 too?

Urist McDorf

Not as good as the FFG games but still pretty great and with its own flair

Quentin

Most fun I've had with a Star Wars RPG has been in a one-shot at a con with sentientgames.wordpress.com/2012/12/28/star-worlds — it makes me want to run it (along with all the other games I want to run).

Urist McDorf

It is based on that, but it's its own thing. Usually SW d20 refers to the predecessor to it.

Patta

And yea, I could not, for the life of me, play (or even watch) Kotor 1 or 2, because of it using the d20 rules (or whatever system it actually is)

Urist McDorf

9:33 AM

Oh, KotOR was fine. The mechanics you can ignore largely (just pick what fits best) and focus on the story.

Which is amazing.

KotORII has one of the best plots (as in - story, dialogues, characterisation...) in all of cRPGs, IMO.

Patta

Oh, I believe that, but the mechanics put me off totally....

Urist McDorf

Well

You could read a screenshot LP

Patta

Last time I tried to play it, I did not even finish creating the caracter....

Urist McDorf

So you don't need to suffer through the mechanics.

doppelgreener

@BESW Me too!

Patta

9:35 AM

Maybe, if I have time :D

Urist McDorf

lparchive.org/Knights-of-the-Old-Republic-II

It's a good one.

Patta

Thanks, I'll take a look.

Urist McDorf

:)

Gotta go now.

Have fun everyone

trogdor

have a good day

Patta

Bye :)

Patta

10:43 AM

Is that guy with the Fix: XYZ question really trying to play a character with a 5e race (that is really, really badly written, too, but that is not the point... :D), and multiclassed pathfinder/4e stuff?

eimyr

Does it annoy you?

Patta

kind of, yea. Mostly the badly written race annoys me, though :D

eimyr

which race is it

?

Patta

dandwiki.com/wiki/Beeforged_(5e_Race)

Urist McDorf

I see the name

And I don't want to click the link

eimyr

10:48 AM

LOL!

That's an amazing idea!

Patta

Yea, well.... :D

It is, yes.

BESW

That.. sounds like it'd be great in ARRPG.

> Beefriend. Once per session you can create a swarm of bees with two free invokes.

> Hivemind. You are immune to mental control, but weak against smoke and fire.

> Wax on, wax off. You can use Physique to create advantages by applying beeswax to a problem.

eimyr

Not the bees! Once per scene, when an opponent concedes, you immediately gain a Fate Point.

BESW

> Bee yourself. You can communicate with insects and similar animals.

Patta

What does ARRPG stand for, btw? I'd google it, but I don't really have the time, sorry :D

BESW

10:56 AM

atomic-robo Role-Playing Game.

eimyr

Enemy-bee-gone. You can use Attack with Physique to inflict Mental Stress.

Patta

Oh, ok, thank you. Can't say that I know the comic series or something, but... At least I know what you are talking about now D:

I enjoy the beelicious jokes though, so please, keep going :D

Urist McDorf

I once made a beesease for SS13

It made people buzz instead of speaking

At later stages it made them explode in bees

Patta

Now I want to implement Bees into my star wars game this evening.

doppelgreener

@BESW That actually really does!

Patta

11:01 AM

There is Wasps on Tatooine, though, I think. That would be close enough :D

doppelgreener

I presume its voice would sound like the buzzing of thousands of bees.

BESW

Or just one bee with a megaphone.

doppelgreener

Hahaha! Yes.

BESW

> The Language of Bees. You are absolutely better at dancing than a human, but weak against bright colors.

doppelgreener

This guy would have his bee-golem aspect as a Signature Aspect, I think.

BESW

11:05 AM

> Eye of the Beeholder. You can see ultraviolet light, and smell pheromones.

doppelgreener

> Bee afraid. Absolutely better at inspiring fear (Provoke) than any human, but at a cost.

BESW

> Bee very afraid. You get +1 and wpn:2 when using Provoke to attack by inspiring fear.

doppelgreener

Heehee.

Urist McDorf

@doppelgreener I think you wanted to say "beebee".

doppelgreener

> Beebee gun. Spend a fate point before rolling to apply an attack to everyone in the same zone as you.

Miniman

11:12 AM

@doppelgreener Ehehehehe.

Patta

I think you wanted to write "@doppelbeener", Miniman :P

trogdor

lol

doppelgreener

11:38 AM

> Doppelbeener. You can Create Advantage with Deceive to physically impersonate any other person through generous morphing of your own wood and beeswax and application of your disguise kit, as long as you know what they look like or have time to study them. This disguise won't pass close inspection.

eimyr

@doppelgreener ...because you're green anyway.

doppelgreener

@eimyr oh, no, this one's for the Beeforged stunts we've been riffing on. (Hence doppelbeener.)

eimyr

@doppelgreener Do you think you can shake your legacy off that easily?

doppelgreener

A doppelgreener disguise wouldn't stand up to any degree of inspection, ha ha ha.

Patta

Does Fate Core really use stunts (or whatever category those fall under) that are completely defined, as in your examples? I only have experience with Fate Accelerated and Fate Trash.... Where this is not at all the case :D

BESW

11:44 AM

What do you mean, "completely defined"?

doppelgreener

(Unless I'm impersonating Gamora, or J'onn J'onzz, or maybe a green-skinned Green Lantern, or...)

BESW

We're riffing on the Atomic Robo stunt format, which has a few extra bells and whistles (specifically the "immune to," "absolutely better," "weak against," and "but at cost" elements), but overall we're using the standard formulas of "+2 at something particular," "get a narrative permission," and "periodically break a rule."

Patta

Interesting. In the versions of Fate I have read, only "+2 at something particular" and "do something special once per session" exist,

That is what I meant

BESW

Ah, yeah.

As you read more variations on Fate, you'll find that those are starting guidelines.

Patta

(And then there is Fate Trash, where Stuns don't exist at all, but I don't know if Fate Trash is something that actually exists in other rulesets than the Deponia RPG rule set)

*Stunts

BESW

11:48 AM

The more comfortable you are with Fate, the easier it is to break out of those guidelines without breaking the stunt concept.

Patta

Yea, I can see that. Intereseting. Maybe I should actually start to read more Fate games.

BESW

Roughly speaking, I tend to think of a stunt as being equivalent to spending an extra Fate point on average once per scene.

Patta

(I have next to no actual experience in Fate, except in the Deponia RPG)

BESW

The Worlds of Adventure for Fate are a great set of free variants/hacks/adventures by Evil Hat.

They're a good place to start.

Patta

More stuff on my "To read" list, thank you :D

Btw, as I mentioned it already: Does anyone know if the Deponia Pen&Paper was released outside of germany/in other languages?

BESW

11:50 AM

And the Fate SRD is a great resource.

Patta

I am not quite sure if the target audience would be that big :D

doppelgreener

Different editions of Fate have different stunt guidelines and templates, too.

BESW

I'm not finding anything about an English-language Deponia.

Yeah, Atomic Robo's stunts are a bit more powerful per stunt than, say, Masters of Umdaar.

But not so much that I had any trouble running characters from both systems side by side in the same game.

doppelgreener

Masters of Umdaar, for example, dials the "+2 with action with skill in situation" template to a once-per-scene benefit to achieve a different feel and aesthetic.

And "+3 when you would get +2" effects also occur only once per scene (e.g. the first time it would apply each scene).

I find that helpful and enjoy it.

It makes the +X effects represent something super cool and flashy, rather than an ordinary thing I expect to see occurring regularly.

BESW

Masters of Umdaar definitely hits a lot of our group's sweet spots.

Okay, that's enough typos to tell me I should be going to bed.

doppelgreener

11:58 AM

Goodnight!

nitsua60

12:50 PM

@KorvinStarmast were you dictating?

eimyr

1:25 PM

@nitsua60 [wave]

KorvinStarmast

2:11 PM

@nitsua60 No, I was not dictating and it's great to see the author break lurk.

Urist McDorf

2:35 PM

Also ugh I wish I hadn't seen that question: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/94993/…

I want to puke every time I get reminded of Cook's... kookery, I guess?

That said the answer is extremely good

nitsua60

3:20 PM

TIL: if you edit in a tag, then VtC, your gold tag-badge hammer-privilege is voided (for that question). Interesting bit of edge-Stackery.

GreySage

5:11 PM

@nitsua60 Of course, otherwise you could add your tag to any question you want closed, and unilaterally close them.

SevenSidedDie

6:31 PM

@nitsua60 Yeah, IIRC that was built into the feature from the beginning. A clever bit of forethought.

Adam

7:24 PM

@SevenSidedDie I've felt the same way you do since first seeing this question: http://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/95069/how-to-avoid-the-determinism-of-passive-perception

I was actually been a bit torn on whether or not to VtC it since it wasn't generating very good answers for a bit there.

SevenSidedDie

@Adam Gonna try out another question banner that's built into the system, on that question. See if it makes any impact…

nitsua60

8:02 PM

Ooh, I like that banner.

good afternoon

Hello!

@Adam how goes it?

It goes. Only 2 more hours to freedom!

DForck42

@Adam 3 here

then 3 day weekend

Adam

8:11 PM

Im jealous! I get to go back to the grind on Monday

DForck42

@Adam what sort of work do you do?

Adam

8:23 PM

contract software development stuff. Basically I'm a code monkey

Urist McDorf

And I'm working on the weekend and monday :(

Then again, the rest of the week's off so I shouldn't complain.

DForck42

@Adam fun, I'm a developer with the state of missouri

SevenSidedDie

@nitsua60 My only meh about the banner is that it contrasts what we want against “one line” answers, which isn't really the problem we have. It was obviously written for SO ages ago to combat answers with one-line commands or code in them. But it does talk about what we do want, which is answers explaining why they're best/right, and supporting themselves. So, eh, close enough.

Thomas Ward

@SevenSidedDie Too bad custom ones don't work, eh?

(You could always add your own quote box at the bottom heh)

DForck42

@SevenSidedDie I wish each site could customize these a bit, instead of shoe horning everything into SO's wording

SevenSidedDie

8:54 PM

@ThomasWard We can get custom ones. We have one we used to use for recommendation questions, when those were still on topic. Only CMs/staff can set them up though, so there has to be a really good reason with a really clear case for them being useful. Yeah, I wish we could just tweak the existing ones.

Thomas Ward

custom mod box reason + protect :P

"DON'T TOUCH THIS OR THY SHALL BE SLAPPED! -- Mod Team" would work :P

just a quote box with that text in it xD

anyways I digress.

SevenSidedDie

@ThomasWard That's effectively what we try to do, but it's frequently in vain. People just ignore mod instructions; new people often seem to not notice them or maybe just not grasp their significance.

Adam

To be fair, it isn't exactly an obvious association for new people that the diamond is for mods.

SevenSidedDie

@Adam It really isn't obvious, yeah.

BlackVegetable

Just added an Armor list (via link) to my free Dungeon World magical/special items lists.

See: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/11?m=35370622#35370622

Man, I can never figure out how linking/quoting starred posts is supposed to work.

SevenSidedDie

9:15 PM

@BlackVegetable If you make the message just the link, it'll box it as a quote.

BlackVegetable

Feb 11 at 16:46, by BlackVegetable

Just opened up my magical weapons list for Dungeon World to the general public: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kP_evn_HbROSY5NhE036chDXIBv_jD35s_uxE_7DSvI/‌edit?usp=sharing

Ah neat

Is that star-able?

SevenSidedDie

@BlackVegetable It is, but the starboard will only show the link itself. Starring the original will show the original.

BlackVegetable

gotcha

meh

Urist McDorf

9:45 PM

I must say this comment is amazing: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/95072/…

2

SevenSidedDie

10:34 PM

Two successes in getting people to cite their own experience here: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/95069/… . Effective, but labour-intensive. :/

nitsua60

anyone in the twitterverse, this question probably needs Jeremy's weigh-in.

BESW

@SevenSidedDie Yey!

BESW

11:52 PM

Bubblegumshoe Eratta - One of our clever Sleuths (Thanks Adrian Bott!) found a few math errors on our exam.… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/832697821891489793

Tweeted by SeanNittner on February 17, 2017 at 9:06 PM

Transcript for