Discussion on answer by henning -- reinstate Monica: How can I deal with a candidate mentioning God twelve times in their application?

@Buffy Not on religious grounds, on lack of professionalism. And it could only tip the scale - although I have a hard time imagining a focused and well-written application that manages to refer to some deity a dozen times on about two pages.

Even someone who shared the same religion would have a good reason to dislike this aspect of the application. You don't pick a mechanic whose most strongly emphasized competency is religious, because you need someone who can fix your car. (And if you have beliefs or culture in common with the most competent mechanic available, so much the better.)

@AnonymousPhysicist What if they didn't know to spell check their application? What if they didn't know not to use profanity throughout? What if they didn't know not to include racist or sexist jokes? Discriminating against people for being from another culture is one thing, but it seems that you suggest that we should ignore disqualifying characteristics of an applicant if those characteristics happen to be cultural.

@m.raynal If you are unable to realize that such expressions are simply manners of speech that characterize the formal register in some cultures, than that would be a major red flag for your suitability for any sort of managerial task.

@AnonymousPhysicist Well for a phd you need to be "unbiased" and one should always question everything: this is the full basis for scientific method that we use. "Believing" in something means you are not open for facts in that aspect and you follow what others have said - just because they say so. Who's to tell you don't do this in other fields as well? Apparently you're susceptible for doing this, so you're not suited for a position where you need to do your own research. And if a applicant truly stresses "belief" and "god" it's just bad, they miss the point of researchers questioning all.

@AnonymousPhysicist: The fact that there is a thing called the Internet which features a vast amount of information on everything conceivable is not a cultural thing anymore. Using it will be a crucial skill for a PhD student. However, we might underestimate how easy it is to miss this for somebody who does consult the Internet. Most application guides don’t explicitly advise against mentioning God, since in secular cultures, this is so far off. But then, the candidate should note the complete absence of God from example applications.

@AnonymousPhysics I didn't mean that religious belief implied prejudice, but fair enough if you think they are not comparable. You say you are fine excluding based on spelling for a program that doesn't teach spelling. Engineering PhDs don't teach students how to write an application without mentioning religion a dozen times. Ostensibly that is something that should be learned prior to PhD. And yes, they should be able to look it up on the internet. If they can't, then they probably aren't ready for a PhD.

@Wrzlprmft I think the candidate should note the absence, but I don't think absence in examples alone is enough to infer that a common action/phrase in your culture is inappropriate elsewhere or to actually apply this knowledge. Suppose in your culture people generally eat their food with a fork, knife and spoon. You go to a restaurant in a foreign country where everyone is eating with chopsticks. Is it a faux pas to grab your own cutlery instead of the chopsticks? (IRL, this depends) If you do know that you should eat with chopsticks, do you actually know how to eat with chopsticks?

(in the latter case you should perhaps learn to eat with the chopsticks, but learning this may be non-trivial, and well, just grabbing a spoon is so much easier, you're getting pretty hungry and surely it's not that big of a deal...)

@Wrzlprmft Tashus But to need to look up examples of applications on the internet, you need to be aware that the skills set and conventions that you have already learned with regard to such applications don't apply in the place you're applying to. If you are highly proficient at applications within your own academic culture, you might just do the same thing with this application. You need to be aware of the difference in order to address it.

@AnonymousPhysicist Are you really and honestly suggesting that applicants to a PhD may not know that some piece of information lies somewhere on the internet, and that this may not be a problem ? Arer you really suggesting that we can't expect a PhD applicant to gather some information about the background and customs of the countries he applies a PhD for ? That's a huge red flag, regardless if it is about god, heavy metal, eating pig or enjoying BDSM. You must gather information on your own already if you want to become a researcher.

@m.raynal It's question of which information you think you need. If you don't realise you have a particular gap, you won't try to fill it.

@m.raynal I tried searching "mentioning God in application;" there wasn't really all that much that came out from the first page. One source recommends against, one for as long as it's not overused. Adding "France" to the search terms didn't give anything useful. If I were searching from a location in the Middle East I have a feeling that there won't be much advising against mentioning God and likely some advising for it.

Look, if a PhD applicant is unable to realize that (i) EU ain't muslim and (ii) workplaces are secular in most of the EU academia (and that if they're not, better not mention a non-christian god), then I'd say your PhD applicant clearly lacks deduction skills and general culture (the info is not black on white, but it's obviously deducible from other facts). I'd say your PhD applicant hardly realizes that people in other places in the world can think and do things very, very differently. A red flag indeed.

I learned long before graduating that I had to get rid of my manners of speech and my own cultural artifacts in the professional environment. Not because I followed some specific courses, but because I came to realize that my way of doing things or saying things or thinking things was not the way. I do my best not to bring my culture at work, and expect my co-workers to do so. FYI, my team is scattered on several continents, and we do well. That includes me not bursting out atheist thoughts like I do at home. My coworkers have no idea about it, even if it's been part of me for ever. Basics.