Conversation started Oct 3, 2013 at 9:13.
Oct 3, 2013 09:13
So, the next scene, I think, is opening the vault.
We'll assume Sen can find it in the living room, because failing to find it would be boring.
makes sense, Was I given an indication of where this would be?
That is a good reason to justify his auto-finding.
um... so I enter?
or.. is it like a safe?
Not so fast. It's locked, and your keycard isn't enough to get in.
drats!
Oct 3, 2013 09:15
It's like the door to a bank safe, only hidden --like a secret Scooby-Doo door-- in the side of the living room chimney.
and the lock is electronic?
Opening the vault is a Challenge, and the first thing to do with a challenge is identify is component parts.
The lock is definitely electronic.
yes, I intend to use some water from a vase or something to short-cirtuit the electronic lock.. because of course splashing water on it will work
You have the right tools for the job, so you could bypass it more subtly... given time... you're not an expect at this.
cough trope cough
Oct 3, 2013 09:18
So here are some of the ideas I had for the parts of the challenge:
- bypass lock
- stay quiet
- avoid guard patrol
makes sense
What else do you think is involved in this challenge?
don't leave a trace?
or is that not important?
since I am stealing something after all
he will know someone was here
Sounds durn important to me!
You don't want to leave any evidence that'll lead back to you.
Oct 3, 2013 09:20
So we've got four parts to our challenge.
A challenge is a series of overcome rolls, all against a set difficulty.
Once all the rolls are made and we know the results, we put them together to form the narrative of how the challenge went down.
Okay. So lets say the right tools for the job includes some kind of electronic lock hacking machine thingy mabob
I will invoke that with a F point.
and I suppose that means using Clever.
I'm thinking, you're in the middle of a well-guarded house with a state of the art security system, with your only disguise as a coat made for a snapping turtle three times your width and little to no training in the tools you're using.... let's say a difficulty of +5.
makes sense
my +2 for clever +2 invoke gives me a +4
(As a Fate GM, never feel like you need to pull your punches--failure is fun and you can almost always succeed at cost.)
Well, make the roll and then choose how you spend your points.
Oct 3, 2013 09:24
Doesn't matter the order, so...
so lets start with trying to bypass security
Okay.
That does sound like a Clever check.
roll with clever?
4d
thats a +4
Oct 3, 2013 09:24
One under what you need.
Spend a fate point, or succeed at cost?
And don't forget that the right tools for the job is a boost with a free invoke. [evil]
well.. seeing as It would be impossible for me to do this without the tools.. I guess I will invoke them.
And I will use a fate point. Because I want to keep the boost.
Good call!
So you succeed by +1 on the first Overcome check.
Next, how about staying quiet while you do it?
so.. "stay quiet"
I suppose that is "careful"
because Sneaky would be avoiding the patrols
Sounds reasonable.
actually
I think avoiding the patrol and staying quite are teh same thing
I only need to stay quiet if there are patrols around
so staying quiet is avoiding them
Oct 3, 2013 09:28
Okay, fair enough.
I'll roll them together into one obstacle.
And I am concerned about "leave no trace" what skill will that be?
careful?
Let's say being quiet is sneaky and leaving no evidence is careful?
makes sense.
and "being quiet" is combined with "avoid being noticed"
Aye.
So I will roll that first
4d
Oct 3, 2013 09:30
Fail, Fate point, succeed at minor cost, free invoke?
why fail? isn't it a tie?
4/4
8 mins ago, by BESW
I'm thinking, you're in the middle of a well-guarded house with a state of the art security system, with your only disguise as a coat made for a snapping turtle three times your width and little to no training in the tools you're using.... let's say a difficulty of +5.
I thought that was for breaking the lock specifically
Oct 3, 2013 09:31
Oooh.
"Opening the Vault: challenge: difficulty 4"
Yeah, I wrote that earlier.
Okay. anyway
4/5
so.. um...
hmm
Usually a challenge has the same difficulty all the way through, but...
you're right.
+4 is more reasonable for these, and so +4 it is.
Tie.
So that's "success at minor cost" on avoiding attention.
meaning succeed at minor cost
yep
lets leave it at that
Oct 3, 2013 09:33
Aye.
brb 2 min
We'll decide the minor cost once the challenge is over.
back
now its "leave no evidence"
Aye. Difficulty +4 again.
and Sneaky.
Oct 3, 2013 09:36
Careful, this time, I think.
Sneaky was for avoiding notice?
right!
Not much difference for your guy, though; they're both +1.
But matters in the narrative.
But narratively.
4d
Oct 3, 2013 09:38
[impressed]
A sweeping victory, with only a minor cost.
I started with bad luck, and it got better! :)
I've got an idea for the minor cost, but I'd like to hear if you have anything.
the minor cost is supposed to be related to the action right?
Oct 3, 2013 09:40
Not necessarily to the specific "avoiding attention" bit.
like... if I "succeed with cost" and the action is "avoiding attention" the cost should not be "I get noticed"
Yeah. That'd defeat the whole success at cost idea.
exactly
However, it could set you up for being discovered later.
I don't really have any good ideas
I was thinking maybe I take the coat off and leave it somewhere that seems suspicious?
Oct 3, 2013 09:41
Okay, here are two ideas, both of which are setting up potential complications for later.
Ooh, that's a good one too.
a) The guard in the guest house stops plunging the toilet and notices his coat is missing.
b) Although you managed to break into the vault, your inexpertise accidentally reset all the electronic lock codes in the house.
I have a hard time believeing a State of the Art system would fail like in b. So I think a makes more sense.
okay.
afk a mo'.
(Leaving your coat out makes sense too.)
(And losing a boost is an appropriate minor cost.)
This is a thing about costs: they can be mechanical (leave your coat out, lose the boost from it) , or purely narrative (the guard notices his coat is gone).
I like going the narrative style
plus - it makes sense that he would notice eventually
it also gives a sense of the passage of time.
whereas I am still wearing the coat.. and I don't see why I would just take it off and leave it there.. not when I am being careful
@BESW indeed.
.. ?
Oct 3, 2013 09:50
Sorry, afk an unknown amount of time.
no prob. I need to do some work :)
Oct 3, 2013 10:16
Lunch time.
Oct 3, 2013 10:39
Okay, I am returning.
Sorry, thought I'd had another hour at least.
Oct 3, 2013 11:00
@InbarRose Ping me if/when you've got time to continue.
@BESW I am back.
Yey!
So, Sen deftly uses his borrowed tools to hack the complicated vault lock swiftly and silently, timing his work between guard patrols and wiping any trace of his presence before slipping through the door, closing it softly behind him.
Meanwhile, the toilet in the guest house has been successfully plunged, the workers managed to keep from laughing too hard, and Sen's absence has not yet been noticed... but the guard on plunger duty can't find his coat.
dramatic drum roll :)
(One cool thing about Fate is that it can, if the group wants, lend itself to dramatic cutaways to what the villains are doing.)
I imagined as much :)
Oct 3, 2013 11:05
The other side of the vault door is a vertical shaft leading into the bedrock, flooded with water.
I enter the vault and carefully close the door behind e.
wait
I first make sure I will be able to open the door again later to leave
otherwise I try to find something to jam in the locking mechanism so the door appears closed/locked but is actually unlocked.
That seems reasonable. We'll say that barring unforeseen circumstances (like success at cost), you'll be able to open the vault door from the inside easily.
Okay, I take off my clothing and reveal the wetsuit that I had been wearing under my workmans outfit.
leaving them all in a small pile on the inside of the door
Sounds good.
I put my phone/keys/wallet (why did I bring those?) In a the small waterproof bag I brought with and strap it to my back
Oct 3, 2013 11:09
You expect to need to pass three guards in this tunnel before you reach the lab.
Okay, from what I have been told. What are my obstacles: verticle water filled shaft, 3 guards, and?
A locked door to get into the lab.
the guards are in the water?
Once in the lab you'll have to disable the security on the item itself.
Yes.
oooo fancy
Oct 3, 2013 11:11
Basically you've got a vertical shaft about forty feet deep, flooded, with a door every ten feet or so and a guard at each door.
You're at the top door, you want the bottom door.
question - what is on the other side of those doors? (i mean, wouldn't opening the door flood the other sides/expell water from the shaft?
Small air locks, which also serve as scanners to ensure nothing's being removed from the labs without authorization.
and there are 3 guards in the shaft? how wide is the shaft?
Yes. About ten feet wide.
And is there light in here?
Oct 3, 2013 11:13
(I'm making this all up as I go.)
I know.
Yes, it is well-lit.
even in the water?
It's got underwater lighting recessed in the walls of the tube.
cool.
I have an idea!
I get the huge coat.
I put it into the water
Oct 3, 2013 11:15
The lighting is flickering florescent, surprisingly cheap.
I don't release the coat, but does it float or sink?
Umm. I'll go with whatever's going to be cooler.
okay, My plan is to hide inside the coat (curled up) and let it fall into the shaft... when i get to the first guard - who I hope will just think someone dropped their coat(since he will recognize it as one of the guard coats) and since I am small I will be unseen in this oversized coat. And then As I pass them I can either stay hidden in the coat or jump out and surprise them (if they notice me)
I hope they don't notice me.
[blink] Wow, okay.
Just an innocent empty coat floating down the shaft... nothing to see here... :P
Oct 3, 2013 11:19
Roll sneaky vs their... I'll say unmodified roll.
4d
Okay, the first guy doesn't see you in the voluminous coat. He's kinda surprised, and doesn't react quickly as it sinks past.
Oct 3, 2013 11:20
perfect.
I take note as I descend if he starts paying it more attention/following it down
But he calls down to the next guy, "Hey, who's the butterfingers dropped their coat?"
@BESW um... how?
underwater?
I'm assuming that turtle-people can talk underwater.
oh, okay then.
I casually let the card drop from the pocket. and try to let it get to the second guard before I do.
Or at around the same time I do
so as to distract him
ie: create an advantage
Okay, vs his unmodified roll.
4d
Oct 3, 2013 11:23
Because I am a salaman, I get +2 whenever I Quickly create water-related advantages.
4d
3 vs 2
I win again! :)
Guard #2 pauses, stares up at the coat coming toward him, blinking. "Ummm. Nobody's scheduled to relieve us yet. ....but there's a keycard." He snatches at it and misses, so he calls down to the third guy.
This is exciting. Every roll is a small discussion which reveals more and more about teh story, and give me more and more information about the game. as opposed to lets say D&D where each roll is just another attack...
Oct 3, 2013 11:25
"Hey, Sam, check whose card that is!"
"I'll get the coat."
He's going to try snatching the coat as it goes past.
but... I created an advantage?
Oh, sorry, what advantage did you create?
Forgot to stop and define it.
hmm
situation aspect...
And it's a lasting one, too, not just a boost.
The keycard's more interesting than the coat, maybe.
wow
its like you read my mind
I was trying to word something like that
All I could think of was "forget the coat, look at the card"
but.. anyway...
yours is much better :)
I have to try to overthink less
and just go with the basic
Oct 3, 2013 11:28
For character aspects, it's good to cram a lot into them.
For situational aspects, keep it simple.
got it.
Okay, so if the keycard's more interesting than the coat, he'll probably let the coat float past.
I hope so.
The guard at the bottom snatches the keycard and peers at it.
wait
"at the botom"
meaning, the door I need is guarded?
Oct 3, 2013 11:30
Yes.
:(
Okay, lets see what happens.
Four doors, one guard at each door except the top one you came in through.
yeah, got it.
"Hey, it's Max's card! He isn't cleared for the vault!"
uh-oh!
okay, here is what I do....
I Flashily reveal my true form! (ie: get out of the coat) I do a special maneuver that the salaman race is known for, which is used to elude predators by spiraling quickly through the water like a screw (which looks beautiful I might add) I attempt to get passed the guard at the bottom door and enter the chamber and then lock him out.
Anything worth doing is worth doing with style
and I hate to kick a man when he's down
seem to sort of help me here.
Oct 3, 2013 11:36
Okay. There's one problem that you'd know about with this maneuver: the door to the lab is locked.
aha...
A keycard would work...
But Max isn't cleared for the vault, so his won't.
well, in that case I simply stay huddled in the coat, and hope they let it hit the bottom without taking much notice of it.
I actually had this complication planned out, and will offer you a Fate point for it to be true.
hopefully they are too distracted with the card.
@BESW not sure I follow.
Oct 3, 2013 11:37
If you would rather that this is not a complication, you can pay me a Fate point instead.
what complication?
This is an event-based compel to complicate the situation: the event is "The door is locked and Max's key card won't open it."
okay. Well I will take the fate point.
I added it to your pool.
awesomeness.
Oct 3, 2013 11:40
All three guards start arguing, and swim to the middle of the shaft to talk about what to do next.
Sam --the guard on door #4-- keeps the keycard, but the coat is ignored and let to float down to the bottom of the shaft.
Because, after all, the keycard is more interesting.
yay
but now... how to get through the door...... hmmmm
(Creating aspects makes things that are true. One of the jobs of a GM is to mediate about whether a given aspect is powerful enough that it requires a much higher difficulty to place.)
I see
So.. you say they are in "the middle" is that the 3rd door down? or between the 2nd and 3rd doors?
(Usually in a multi-player game, someone else will call foul.)
@InbarRose Ummm. They were at doors 2, 3, and 4, so they met at door 3.
One of them has his radio out, but they haven't decided what to say yet.
underwater radio?
Oct 3, 2013 11:43
Yes. [firm nod]
(They're security guards. The logic of heists demands that they have radios.)
(It also demands that they poke their heads around corners to see what that noise was.)
I take a quick look around, now from the bottom of the shaft, maybe I see something I didn't see before/was not revealed to me before.
Ahah, now we get to something cool.
You can create an advantage to notice something that was already there in the story, but which we as players didn't know about until now.
oooo
Maybe the drain is right underneath me, and the emergency switch is just a simple mechanical lever?
The more improbable and advantageous the thing, the higher I'll set the difficulty for it to be true.
@InbarRose That... actually, yanno what?
You can use "create an advantage" to remove existing aspects.
The shaft has the "flooded" aspect.
Oct 3, 2013 11:48
So first you create an advantage to say the Emergency drain is easy access.
because of course it is.
Then you use that aspect to justify being able to change or remove the Flooded aspect.
(And get a bonus on the roll, because free invoke for creating an advantage.)
What do I roll for that? (noticing something)
Oct 3, 2013 11:49
This is where FAE starts to fall apart.
mmhmmm
So, why do you know the lever is there?
... Because..... I can see it?
Do you just see it now? Did you notice it in the blueprints before the heist?
Did I have bluebrints of the vault?
I thought I was just told about the vault
Oct 3, 2013 11:50
Hmmm. Good point, you probably didn't.
> A Careful action is when you pay close attention to detail and take your time to do the job right.
> A Clever action requires that you think fast, solve problems, or account for complex variables.
I think you could narrate either of those as being reasonable.
I think that Clever is more suitable (also its got a +2) because it would be my wits that lead me to realize that I can actually use this to my advantage
Sounds good--you'd normally be loathe to remove water from a situation, I imagine.
So... difficulty...
It is reasonable, and amusing, and still needs another roll to pull off.
If you pull it off it'll be pretty awesome... and... [evil grin]
Difficulty of +2.
2 shifts
Oct 3, 2013 11:55
Nice.
The shaft now has the aspect Emergency drain is easy access with a free invoke for you.
2 free invokes.
Hm? You need 3 shifts for style.
I am pretty sure its 2?
> You succeed with style if your total is at least three greater than your opponent’s total.
Everything else goes in 2s.
(Which I think is why style goes in 3s; to make it harder to pull awesome out of the jaws of just-barely.)
hold on
so... is this just FAE, or FC as well?
Oct 3, 2013 11:57
Both.
I am sure I read that its by 2 shifts... :S
Succeed with style in Fate Core.
"Succeed with Style

If you roll higher than your opposition by 3 or more shifts, you succeed with style."
okay :)
thats good to have clarified.
Indeed.
Okay, the emergency drain is easy access.
oh well, I only needed one anyway
Now.. I use the emergency lever.
Oct 3, 2013 11:59
Now you get to pull the lever and drain the shaft, using an Overcome action to remove Flooded from the zone.
I'll make this difficulty... also +2.
I would say this is also a Clever action?
Works for me, same logic as before.
3/2
if I use my free invoke I am 5/2 and its with style
Oct 3, 2013 12:01
+3, needed +2. Would you like to modify the Flooded aspect, or remove it entirely?
Ooh, nice. Style!
I have an idea for getting fancy with your style bonus on this one, but first let's see what you do with the Flooded aspect.
well...
When water is being drained, it creates a whirlpool effect... which should toss those guards around a bit.
so.... I guess modify it to "Draining" ?
Hmm.
May I suggest?
please do
I am hoping to get your experience.
Remove the Flooded aspect completely--the emergency drain takes its job seriously.
okay.
and... ?
Oct 3, 2013 12:04
Now, "with style" is usually (especially in FAE) a boost.
But in Core, it's clear that anything worth roughly two shifts can be substituted, provided it makes sense and seems fair.
@BESW I don't understand what that means.
what do you mean "worth roughly two shifts"
So I would like to suggest that you deal two shifts worth of stress to the guards--that's enough to take one guard out entirely as he is swirled twenty feet down and smacks his head on the ground.
@InbarRose A boost is worth a free invocation, which is +2. The same as a Fate point. That's two shifts on a roll.
Oct 3, 2013 12:06
So anything you could do with a single Fate point, or a +2 on a roll, is fair game for a "with style" bonus if the group agrees and it make sense in the narrative.
Okay. was not aware of that
Yes, that is what I wanted to happen anyway
yeah
it's pretty nice
It's not strictly speaking Fate Core as written, although they talk about it a bit.
For them to get incapacitated
But it is very much "hacking Fate" and is awesome.
Oct 3, 2013 12:07
hey - we are two guys playing a game, we can do whatever we wanty.
rules shmules
@InbarRose Fate Core does agree with that.
In that exact wording too, huh? :)
Pretty much.
okay, so one dude, (not sam, I like that poor dude) gets his head smacked.
Excellent.
Oct 3, 2013 12:09
and we'll say I hold onto the safety handle bar which is conveniently placed right near the emergency release lever
Sam and his friend land on their shells, losing dignity but not stress tracks.
The third guy lands on his head, and there is a "crack" noise.
Sen is now at the bottom of a 40-foot well with two angry terrapin guards and a locked door.
 
Conversation ended Oct 3, 2013 at 12:10.