Shog9's guidance for flagging

Shog9

Mar 27, 2018 20:54

@Mithrandir I declined all of those flags.

Mithrandir

@Shog9 Any particular reason?

Shog9

well... going by the decline reasons, 3 particular reasons

Mithrandir

I mean... I'm not sure what's to gain in addition to the comment I left and the flag itself.

Shog9

moderators are here to assist you in moderating the site. But moderation neither begins nor ends with the team.

Presumably there's a reason why those answers should've been... something

Something you could've put into a comment when downvoting

But the flags contained neither reason nor request

Mithrandir

I did leave a comment.

Shog9

Mar 27, 2018 20:56

then why skimp on the flag?

"This answer should be deleted because it provides a suggestion without explaining how it might solve the asker's problem"

Mithrandir

Because I assume that the handling moderators are aware of the policies set on meta and/or will look at the post, including comments?

Shog9

Why?

Why should anyone do that if you can't be bothered to give them something to look for?

...wow, GIMP takes a long time to start up

Mithrandir

...I'll disagree, again, that I didn't give them anything to look for; I left a comment, complete with a link to meta, and raised an (albeit short) flag. I can see the argument for including more detail but it's not like that short flag was the only thing I did.

spiral succulent

@Shog9 So does footyshoop

Shog9

and folks say GIMP isn't competitive. Pfft.

@Mithrandir it was insufficient

and...

...it's kind of a bad sign that you left the exact same flag on numerous answers

if they'd been identical or even similar answers, that'd have been understandable

but...

Mithrandir

Mar 27, 2018 21:04

The answers themselves aren't similar except in what they lack.

Alright. So I'll include more explanation in my flags, when I'm out of the flagban. I wouldn't have minded the declines so much if not for that.

Shog9

Q: Assuming I have no way of knowing this person's marital status, should I use "Mrs." or "Ms."? Or is it a best practice to use neither?

A: Unless you are positive that someone is married you should not use Mrs. If you want to use one of the two then use Ms.

Your comment on A:

> Hey, thanks for the answer! Can you please explain exactly why you think that this is a good idea? Why do you say to take this course of action? What’s the thought process behind this answer? As this currently stands, this is essentially a “Try this!” answer. We require that answers provide some sort of explanation for why they are suggesting this solution, and unfortunately, at the moment this answer doesn't appear to do that.

Now, why are you flagging that answer (twice)?

Mithrandir

@Shog9 Because we have a meta policy that such answers without any explanation/backing up are not acceptable for the site. I tried a regular flag to push it into the Low Quality Posts queue, and when that was disputed by users clicking "Looks Okay", I escalated to a mod flag.

Richard U

@sphennings the only time I tend to get into trouble are the times I actively try to avoid it.

Shog9

@Mithrandir you know "meta policy" is meaningless by itself, right?

it's like a strongly worded letter from the UN

unless there are troops on the ground, no one cares

Meta is a venue for hashing out what to do on main

but if folks just talk... it doesn't do much

Mithrandir

Right... which is why some people are actually trying to put 'em in place to avoid a crap overflow situation on main.

Shog9

Mar 27, 2018 21:14

you read meta, and then you go to main & put it into action

Mithrandir

Which is exactly what I was attempting to do with those flags.

Shog9

so if you read meta and become convinced that answers lacking explanation / back-up are problematic... You go to main and downvote, comment, and flag.

And if you flag as NAA and your flag gets disputed... Well, you're already on thin ice 'cause either the folks reviewing your flag didn't read meta or they have a different interpretation of back-up than you do.

So when you go to flag again, you better put forth a really credible argument for why this specific answer needs some sources to remain on the site.

spiral succulent

@Shog9 They didn't read meta

Shog9

that's where you use what you learned on meta

Not the fact that meta exists

I guarantee you, the mods here read meta as much as if not more than anyone else

and yet, those flags had been sitting in the queue for... In some cases over a week when I found 'em

if you can't convince the folks who practically live on meta with a link, then what hope do you have?

none.

none hopes

Richard U

@Shog9 that sounds rather ominous

Shog9

Mar 27, 2018 21:17

so better to decline the flags & send you back to the drawing board, to flesh out some arguments

> Dearest moderator team, it is with joyful anticipation that I greet you on this fine April morning. This answer, you see, provides advice that may well be correct - yet, there exists no way to verify the information presented! Would that I could add references or supporting arguments based on my own experience... But, I have none; and the answer itself provides me with no augmentation in this regard. Though I've searched long for another way, I have concluded that this answer must be removed.

6

WITH TWO CHARACTERS TO SPARE

Mithrandir

Wonderful. I'll practice for my upcoming NaNoWriMo project in custom mod flags. *wry grin* Alright, I get the point, although if nobody is willing to act on what was decided on meta... I'm afraid the site has a problem.

Thank you for discussing this.

user15026

@Shog9 It's still March ;)

Shog9

> My own upbringing confirms that this answer is indeed likely to be correct: Mrs for married, Ms for unmarried. Yet, it provides no sources, and in these times of great change perhaps even the rules of respectful titles are in flux - I cannot say, nor does this answer provide me with any assurance that my misgivings are unwarranted. Should I follow its advice when greeting a Millenial, only to be roundly chastised, this answer will not save me from doom; please delete and save us all!

@Ash pretty sure it'll be April before Mith can flag again...

user15026

@Shog9 Ah, okay, I follow :)

user15026

(I wasn't sure how long flagban lasted)

Shog9

Mar 27, 2018 21:27

@Mithrandir same goes for canned comments, BTW

If you get the chance to relate the problem to the post you're commenting on, do it.

Don't expect anyone to care about a seemingly-abstract policy

"this is problematic because..." goes a lot further than "we decided things that match the pattern which this post matches should be deleted"

Mithrandir

@Shog9 Summarizing entire meta threads in a single comment can be... difficult.

Shog9

@Mithrandir that's the challenge

OTOH, the chance that an entire meta thread applies to a single post is usually small

Usually, there's One Big Thing

"This answer is problematic because..."
...it becomes useless when a link breaks.
...it lacks any evidence that the author didn't just make it up.
...it suggests a course of action that will likely result in a punch to the face.
...it grosses me out.

Now, of course any one of this can be and have been fodder for pages upon pages of meta discussion. But, that's not the problem that's the discussion; "this is problematic because ... you can fix it by ..." usually does fit into a comment.

or a flag

or both

The Awkward Silence

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