Conversation started May 26, 2015 at 13:46.
May 26, 2015 13:46
@LordStryker A question on solubility of salts. Can I ask?
Go for it
@LordStryker Is there a way of comparing which salt is more soluble between Hg2Cl2 and Cr2(SO4)3 without knowing their Ksp's?
Well lets see. Is the chromium complex anhydrous?
@LordStryker complex?
well it isn't a molecule so I called it a complex.
May 26, 2015 13:52
Cr3+(xH2O) type of complex?
Something like that
Its chromium sulphate in crystal form. So, ya... anhydrous.
Okay so I'm not exactly sure how to go about comparing relative solubilities here but I would take a gander that one could consider the intermolecular interactions that would be taking place for these types of salts.
Something like comparing lattice and hydration energy relatively
Perhaps
I hate saying this sometimes but I really don't know the answer to your question at the moment.
You could look these things up in solubility tables I suppose (no Ksp's needed there) but I assume that isn't the kind of answer you're looking for.
You could try and make solutions of these things yourself and compare relative solubilities that way but again I don't think that is the answer you're looking for.
May 26, 2015 13:58
I think the answer to my original question is : NO
Well it may not be.
There's no real reliable way to compare solubilities just by looking at the formulas, I'm pretty sure
Since the carions and anions are different.
@NicolauSakerNeto So the only reliable way to compare relative solubilities of salts (in non extreme cases) is experiment?
@NicolauSakerNeto formulas and relative size of the ions. But even that info wont help.
May 26, 2015 14:01
User, it might help but it's not reliable, especially not quantitatively, and if you're looking up data, why not look up the Ksp in the first place!
@NicolauSakerNeto No. I am not looking up any data.
LordStryker, I'm not sure if there's any other way to do it
As far as I understand solvation is an extremely difficult problem even with molecular modelling methods
So I don't really see how some sort of qualitative extrapolation can have a good chance except in some relatively trivial cases
Of course some ions have a tendency to make more soluble or more insoluble salts, but quantification of this may be quite difficult
And this question doesn't look fit for the main site too.
Solvation certainly is a problem to model but I don't think that necessarily translates into predicting the solubility of something.
But I think it makes for a good question @user223679
@NicolauSakerNeto Can you give some examples of those ions?
Too broad? @LordStryker
May 26, 2015 14:06
The solubility of anything would be dependent on the strength of the solvent-solute interactions minus the solute-solute interactions
Solute-solute is easier assuming a perfect crystal
I don't see how it would be too broad. The question directly focuses on an alternative process for determining relative solubilities if Ksps were not available.
Solvent-solute is hard
Of course you may want to state that conducting the experiment or looking these things up in tables is not really what you are looking for as an answer.
And what examples of ions do you mean, User?
this probably
5 mins ago, by Nicolau Saker Neto
Of course some ions have a tendency to make more soluble or more insoluble salts, but quantification of this may be quite difficult
May 26, 2015 14:11
Well, I mean if you were to compare, say Ca^{2+} to Hg^{2+}, you'd expect the calcium salts to be generally more soluble than the mercury salts
Though that is a very extreme comparison, which makes it comparatively simple
If you were to ask between Fe^{3+} and Cr^{3+}, it would pretty much be guesswork
@NicolauSakerNeto Whats the logic behind this?
If you look at several calcium and mercury salts on a Ksp table, you'll find that mercury salts tend to be more insoluble
If you want to take a large Ksp table and calculate the solubilities for each ion, go ahead, that could be quite an interesting job
Probably not too hard with a spreadsheet program
Great, now I'm doing it myself
Damned curiosity
Can someone suggest me a good title for this question?
Is there a way of comparing which salt is more soluble without knowing their Ksp data or performing experiments? this looks too long.
@NicolauSakerNeto Haha
"Determining relative solubilities of salts without Ksp values?"
or "predicting" may be more precise
May 26, 2015 14:25
@LordStryker should I add that I cant experiment in the title? Or in the body?
"Predicting relative solubilites of salts without Ksp values?" - In the body of your question make clear that you are aware of experimental based procedures but you are curious to know if any (semi-)reliable methods exist to predict these types of things.
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Q: Predicting relative solubilites of salts without Ksp values

user223679Is there a way of comparing which salt is more soluble without knowing their $ K_{sp}$ data or performing experiments? For example, comparing $\ce{Hg2Cl2}$ and $\ce{Cr2(SO4)3}$. I am not sure but can I compare lattice and hydration energy relatively or the ion size and estimate? Experim...

 
Conversation ended May 26, 2015 at 14:36.