iszi? your here >?

@epeleg For the moment.

hi, thanks for your note over at my Q.

No problem.

maybe I am a bit thick today,

but I seem to be missing something

without password the communications is cleartext - right ?

Yes.

and with a password ?

does it encript the same for all the users ?

@epeleg Generally, yes.

so it should be more secure to use a password even if everyone know it - is it not so ?

maybe a bit background

someone else where I live decided to provide such a free network around his house

and I was under the impression that it would be better for him and the people using his free network if it had a password

even if the password was written on such a sign

but wanted to ask here so I won't be missleading him

@epeleg In that specific case, I would somewhat disagree.

o.k, can you explain why ?

For all current Pre-Shared Key encryption methods used for WiFi, there are attacks available that allow a hacker with knowledge of the PSK to sniff all the traffic on the WiFi network.

and when you say to sniff the traffic you mean to actually see it unencripted ?

@epeleg Yes

So, the level of protection for that network is directly proportional to the level of effort put into keeping the password unknown to unintended users.

hmmm.... and if everyone is welcome to the network? there is no way to secure the users from one another ?

@epeleg For a hacker with the appropriate tools, there isn't much you can do if he has the PSK.

o.k. I accept that BUT...

what if its a less skilled hacker? will there then be a difference in the chance of him sniffing a network that has a password (that he knows) then one that has no such password

@epeleg Probably. But, if you're posting the password on a big sign out front, then you really have to consider the worst-case scenario because you'll never know who has the password or what level of expertise they have.

In the case of a home WiFi network, the signal probably (for most receivers) is only clearly audible for about a block or so. Therefore anyone who can see your network also will have easy access to find your PSK if you put a sign up front. My suggestion to better protect the network, is that you instead post a phone number or e-mail address by which the password can be requested. And, be selective in who you give it to.

but the worst-case is then not different when you have no password or have a known-to-everyone password. and in the less worst case a less skilled hacker will find the known-to-everyone password protected network a bit harder to hack.

I see your point. a personal approach might push away a potential hacker. but again, since I can not validate who will be the caller and anyone asking for the password will get it. we end up still with the same worst case.

@epeleg The PSK does indeed still offer a layer of security. But, in the case of a freely-accessible, publicly-available PSK the protection is no more than that offered by WEP, MAC Address Filtering, or SSID Hiding these days.

@epeleg Like I said, the network's signal will only stretch out for about a block before it becomes unusable to most systems. So, in the end, the only people that should be using the network will be your neighbors and their visitors - people you should know or people who can be validated by those you know.

this is not the case here, its not a city, it a village that has guests visiting and we want them to have free internet access...

to summ it up. you are better of not letting a hacker into your network. but if you do, then it takes a better hacker to hack a known to everyone password protected network then the one needed to hack a password less network.

why does it say 969 below my name at the left and 5292 below yours ?

is it total reputation accress all stackexchange sites ?

@epeleg In this case, the PSK that requires a personal contact is sort of like posting a "home security" sign in front of your house - it probably prevents more attacks than the alarm alone.

@epeleg Yes. Most of my rep is on RPG.SE, and IT Security is probably my second-highest.

yes, maybe the sign should also say "all traffic is monitored :)"

RPG.SE ?

@epeleg On a small wireless network like you're proposing, that's not a big threat to an attacker.

@epeleg rpg.stackexchange.com

cool. didn't know they had RPG as well.

where are you from? (if I may ask)

Florida

I am from Israel. thanks for your help, If you want to post a summary to my Q I will accept it as the answer.