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02:00 - 08:0008:00 - 00:00

3:15 AM
@GustavoBandeira mostly bullshit
 
@belisarius SHUT UP, I'M GOING TO SPACE IN 2020.
=D
 
@GustavoBandeira You could go right now.
but natural speech recognition is not around the corner
and artificial intelligence is at a dead end
 
Natural speech recognition is easy to do. Just hire third world people and make they pretend they're robotic.
@belisarius Why?
 
@GustavoBandeira yep. Brazilians, Argentinians ... I am getting creative
 
@belisarius Thank god, Im from Blagadesh.
 
3:20 AM
@GustavoBandeira Yes sir, Your surname is clear enough Mr. Singh
 
@belisarius Why is AI at a dead end?
 
trying to answer that with a glass of wine in each hand .. wait
Mostly because in the 70's (an before) everybody thought that AI was a "natural evolution" of algorithmic computing. Once PROLOG and LISP were established they saw it around the corner. Fail.
The whole thing is MUCH more complicated
They started the "expert systems" buzz
and God saw they were good ... but rule-based
rules aren't enough
so they went to "evolutionary" algorithms
 
@belisarius Even if you count with a big number of them?
 
self learning, and the such
 
Yep, I guess this is one of the most recent paradigms now.
 
3:26 AM
@GustavoBandeira What is a "big nimber"?
10^8?
 
@belisarius Big number of rules.
 
how many?
 
Something like that.
Have no idea.
 
how many COORDINATED rules can you design
 
I'm just speculating with the lack of knowledge I have.
 
3:27 AM
The problem starts when you try to learn something about automated reasoning
just go ahead
read something about neural networks
it's VERY interesting
 
But neural networks is just one paradigm, right?
 
yes and no
 
There are bayesian networks, and all that.
I just heard about them, lack of classification in mind though,
 
are binary computers just a paradigm?
@rojo hi!
 
@belisarius I think yes.
 
3:30 AM
@belisarius Alo
 
@GustavoBandeira Ok. Suppose you got to another paradigm. How many years to maturity?
 
@belisarius ~100
 
10^8
 
@GustavoBandeira Ok that is AI horizon, I believe
@Rojo you are a tipical pesimistic argentinian
 
But the actual AI paradigms already have some applications, right?
 
3:32 AM
Clank clank clank clank
 
@GustavoBandeira Of course ... you can play chess
 
I guess they overestimated the utility of their concepts. (Ok, i'm sure.)
 
and replace engineers. But that is easy!
ha!
 
@belisarius XD
2 Lines in mathematica code.
 
@GustavoBandeira no, they underestimated complexity
complexity is an exponential problem. They thought it was x^n, with som n
 
3:34 AM
That's because they are trying to build up AI from scratch
 
@Rojo From brazilian soccer ?
 
If they brought natural intelligence down, we only have to find where to put a remote control chip in the brain, remove emotions, and breed people
 
@Rojo It's already done. They call it school.
2
 
But most of the world goes or went to school
so
 
3:37 AM
the current type of people is the natural people
 
Do you know when scholarization (not an Enlish word) was installed as an obligatory thing, and why?
 
No, I really don't
but honestly, I hate the educational system quite a lot
Enlighten me
 
The industrial revolution. They needed more educated manpower to take care of the machines
 
@Rojo Same here.
 
an economic issue
a mere economic issue
 
3:40 AM
Very interesting
 
no liberation, no human rights, nno bullshit
 
How did we get to have so few engineers and so many lawyers and psychologists then
 
progress is a dangerous word, indeed
@Rojo I don't mean university. I am talking about obligatory education. Primary.
 
Well
Economic or not
 
University affairs are not (wholly) controlled by economy
 
3:42 AM
Progress would turning their "oficios" uselss
 
@Rojo What is "progress"? Did you read about about an Indian bald guy?
 
I don't know what is, I know what I meant
People want stuff, need stuff. We trade because we suck as individuals, by nature, and because we just have no more space left for each to roam freely and crop and hunt
Someone finds a way to produce more stuff with less work
 
Progress is healthy and fed people. Progress is no wars. Progress is economy managed so people are taken in account
 
So, more stuff around. "Most" people get more stuff, but those who did that stuff get less
 
that is capitalism, not progress
 
3:46 AM
I told you
already
That's what I meant
 
But you are telling me what Hobbes wrote 200 years ago. And he was wrong
History proved that
 
What do you think is wrong of what I said? (not what Hobbes wrote, what I said)
 
You want me to tell you your mistakes since you was born, or just in this chat?
2
 
Come on
 
:::DDD
damn I am laughing so hard I can't drink my wine
 
3:50 AM
We won't be able to exchange much if we play with misunderstanding everything that wasn't said literally even if obvious
 
C'mon it's late. I am trying to relax. Don't be stiff
 
Sure. I just wanted to know what you meant, without having to read up on a 200 year old book
 
@belisarius You reminded me of this:
In the course of this procedure there came to pass the complete obliteration of a most important distinction--the distinction between training and education. As we have observed, very few people are educable; the vast majority of mankind cannot possibly be educated. They can, however, be trained; anybody can be trained. Practically any kind of mentality is capable of making some kind of response to some kind of training; and here was the salvation of our system's theory.
If all hands would simply agree to call training education, to regard a trained person as an educated person and a training-school as an educational institution, we need not trouble ourselves about our theory; it was safe.
 
@Rojo I think the cite Gustavo posted in enlightening
And of course wrong
Everybody can be educated. Why not? Who is the referee? Who can possible say: you are vanilla stupid
I know there are a lot of more capable people than me. That doesn't stop me of trying to educate myself. Why not?
I 'm not surely Aristotle, nor Newton, nor Maxwell
but none of them could surrogate the right to ban education from me
And I have not the right to do that with others
brb
sorry, need to leave for a sec
 
Buhbye world
@GustavoBandeira, @belisarius
 
4:00 AM
@belisarius It's from a book.
You can read/download for free here: mises.org/daily/2765
@belisarius The referee is Jesus, shut up you atheist!
 
@GustavoBandeira Shhh ... I'm undercover
 
@belisarius Haha
 
@GustavoBandeira just look
8
A: How can I solve the equation with integers as a solution?

belisariusA geometrical view of the solutions: s = Solve[(x - 1)^2 + (y - 1)^2 + (z - 1)^2 == 49, {x, y, z}, Integers]; pts = {x, y, z} /. s; subs = Subsets[pts, {2}]; minds = Union[dists = N[EuclideanDistance @@@ subs]][[1 ;; 3]]; Show[Graphics3D[Sphere[{1, 1, 1}, 13/2]], Graphics3D[Line /@ Extrac...

 
OMG!
I'm not so good at mathematica programming.
 
G'd provides
 
4:10 AM
Mostly because of dumbness on my part.
I have leonid's book, need to read more.
 
@GustavoBandeira Is that a confession or just a note for your autobiography?
 
@belisarius A confesion, someone told me that you feel erotized when someone say that to you. =*
 
@GustavoBandeira Damn! Is my shrink active on the site?
I hate these questions
0
Q: How to solve a differential equation of nonhomogeneous fourth order real variable complex function with Mathematica?

lesdeuxRecently, I was got in trouble in solving a fourth order differential equation with Mathematica. And it is written like: $$ -a^2\zeta+\frac{1}{b^2}(\zeta''''+4ia\zeta'''-6a^2\zeta''-4ia^3\zeta'+a^4\zeta)-\frac{c}{d}[-\zeta'-ia\zeta+(1-x)(\zeta''+2ia\zeta'-a^2\zeta)]-\frac{1}{d}(-2f(a)\sqrt{\frac{...

C'mon ... solve this for me
and a bunch of math
a fourth order DE just for you
 
@belisarius How to solve a differential equation on nonhomossexual fourth order real variable complex function with mathematica.
 
you are sliding dangerously
 
4:15 AM
Why?
 
too much sexual connotations. Mr.Wizard will suspend you
 
R.M
@belisarius from what?
:D
 
sorry gotta go! see u later
 
R.M
bye
 
4:57 AM
@R.M So much imagination... ;P
 
5:26 AM
@R.M Is a cause necessary? he doesn't use infix enough
 
R.M
6:10 AM
@belisarius I didn't say "for what?"... ;)
 
@R.M OMG. So, I don't understand you
 
R.M
of course, you don't speak toadese
 
of course not. only spanglish
and perhaps a little sanscrit
 
R.M
why (and when) did you learn sanskrit?
 
I didn't. But the same could be said for Spanish and English
German, Hebrew, Latin and French share the same category
and many more
a pity
 
R.M
6:17 AM
so basically languages \ {toadese}
 
I am amazed about how beautiful and complex a well mastered language can be. Take for example Shakespeare. I (mostly) can understand any English native speaker, perhaps with some problems with some accents, but anyway. But for WS, I've to read each sentence 20 times before giving up :)
and he's not speaking
 
R.M
Well, most native speakers would say the same for WS :) It's just a different era, and besides English was highly non-standard back then...
Compared to other romance/germanic/indic/slavic languages which have very well defined rules of grammar, spelling and pronunciation with very few exceptions, English seems to have arbitrary rules and way more exceptions than you'd expect
 
@R.M No no, I've read (for example) Chaucer without trouble. It's WS mastery of language what is really foreign for me. Not the language variations or lack of standards
 
@belisarius Do you know what love is?
 
errr
not sure. Tell me more
 
R.M
6:25 AM
@belisarius Ah, I see what you mean
 
@belisarius Random question for the night. =D
@belisarius You likelanguanges too.
I have a library with lots of languange courses.
 
R.M
@GustavoBandeira perhaps it's a resting place to shelter you from the storm
 
I was thinking on learning Akkadian for fun.
 
@R.M I've read for example his sonnets. There are quite a few of them that seemed just words piled one over the other until I went to read "interpretations" on the web
then all those beautiful metaphors ... awesome wriiter indeed
@R.M You still here?
 
R.M
@belisarius yes; sorry, stepped out
 
6:34 AM
@R.M At what age is a native speaker supposed to read WS?
 
@belisarius The wordplay is exceedingly intricate...
 
@J.M. but lovely!
 
@belisarius well, part of the intricacy... ;)
 
If I only could understand it without help
 
@belisarius Back in my teens, I could understand it, but I had to stare at each line for about ten or so minutes before I got them fully...
 
R.M
6:37 AM
@belisarius Hmm, I don't really know... I had my first exposure to WS at grade 9 or 10.
 
Needless to say, reading it was a very slow process.
 
R.M
I had read some of his plays before that, but I didn't realize at that time that they were abridged versions, with all the complexities unentangled...
 
(But I had more stamina back then.)
 
There are writers in any language that share this rare privilege ... to to extremely difficult to translate
@R.M shame on you :)
 
@belisarius He was a kid tadpole back in the day, cut him some slack.
 
6:39 AM
hehe starred
Two households, both alike in dignity,
In fair Verona, where we lay our scene,
From ancient grudge break to new mutiny,
Where civil blood makes civil hands unclean.
From forth the fatal loins of these two foes
A pair of star-cross'd lovers take their life;
Whose misadventured piteous overthrows
Do with their death bury their parents' strife.
The fearful passage of their death-mark'd love,
And the continuance of their parents' rage,
Which, but their children's end, nought could remove,
Is now the two hours' traffic of our stage;
that is an easy one
although convoluted if you stop to think about it
 
@belisarius And thus, also frequently adapted for "modern" readers...
 
@J.M. what does that means?
 
@belisarius It's one of the more "digestible" and "relatable" Shakespearean works, so it gets adapted a lot (simplified versions, movies, etc.)
compared to, say, A Comedy of Errors or The Taming of the Shrew.
 
@J.M. Oh yeah. My kid read an "abridged" version this same year at school. A shame.
I love the comedies :D
 
Especially the dirty ones? :P
 
6:44 AM
"The tempest" is my favourite
 
I'm back.
Chrome crashed
And I went for a shower.
 
but I also love Greek theater. Tell me doctor, am I beyond cure?
 
Back in the 1998, I had a pentium 486 - 166MHz.
It used to do some noise.
And I don't hear all this noise in todays processors.
 
R.M
@GustavoBandeira that's because your hearing ability goes down as you age...
 
I supose it has something to do with the clock frequency.
 
6:47 AM
processors are quite silent. you hear the vents
 
@R.M Actually not. When I was 3 years old, I've been blessed by Jesus: "Senses working perfectly forever"
 
OMG
another creationist
 
I'm not lying.
You guys are atheists!
Don't have faith!
 
who? who is in the first base?
 
I guess two.
The first numerical base is base 2.
Base 1 is kinda senseless.
 
6:50 AM
Hmm, should make for a nice test: "what should be the value of c for you not to hear the result of Play[Sin[c x], {x, 0, 1}]?"
 
10 -> 1111111111
@J.M. But it's going to vary because we have different speakers.
 
R.M
@GustavoBandeira your brain begs to disagree
 
@R.M Haha
 
c is light speed. Doesn't compute in a sound wave
 
I was in the chat screen, suddenly I went for the main MMA screen - The one with the questions.
@J.M. Kicked me?
I was talking with a friend about this book.
 
6:54 AM
gatesucks answered before I had time to read the question
 
@belisarius Learn to be faster, dude.
 
Many scientists speculate that people with anorexia, autism, and schizophrenia are "wired differently," but nobody knows for sure If nobody knows ... Why should I read it?
 
@belisarius Why not?
 
@GustavoBandeira Because he says "He also examines the evidence that these maps will someday allow humans to "upload" their minds into computers,"
 
@GustavoBandeira No, why would I?
 
6:57 AM
@J.M. Dunno. =(
@J.M. Only to show who's in charge here.
=D
@belisarius Why the sceptcism?
 
@GustavoBandeira It takes a bit to rile me up, and hope to high heavens that you'll never do...
 
and you could, with the same probability say that "He also examines the ability of elephants to fly spaceships, but nobody knows for sure"
bullshit. Pseudo science is a neat business
 
@J.M. I'll do it only when I become the moderator of MMA.SE and owner of Wolfram Research.
$$\frac{\left(\frac{\huge \bullet \bullet }{ \sim } \right)\; }{\huge \lambda} \; \; \; \; \;< \text{ Moderator of MMA.se - Owner of WR...}
$$
 
i.e., when hell flies and pigs freeze over... :)
 
"upload your mind to a computer" is like saying "transform wine in blood" or "fly like a bird"
 
7:02 AM
@belisarius "Look, up in the sky!"
 
@J.M. Dude....you're destroing my self-esteem. I'll flag you for "destroying others self-esteem"
 
@J.M. Lucy? Lucy in the sky?
 
R.M
@GustavoBandeira The first step to owning WRI is to replace your Bible with NKS
 
@belisarius with diamonds, yes. :)
 
@R.M clap!
 
R.M
7:03 AM
@GustavoBandeira you lost the ego game. Ergo, you can never replace SW
 
@R.M I have NKS, and it's in a better place than my bible.
BUT, I was joking. I'm atheist.
 
sorry for you. life is harder for an an atheist.
 
R.M
@GustavoBandeira Phew, I was worried for you...
 
you don't have anyone to blame for
 
@belisarius Of course I have. I blame @J.M. for destroying my self-esteem.
 
7:05 AM
@GustavoBandeira Nahhh @J.M. is not that kind of ... of ... well, could be
 
R.M
@belisarius we can always blame dead byzantine generals
 
@GustavoBandeira No can do; your "self-esteem" is what you make of it.
 
@J.M. You just need to wait until I grow up.
 
@J.M. MY self-esteem was a present of my father. His name is Sigmund
 
@belisarius Good for you. I had to build mine from scrap...
 
7:07 AM
@R.M Only some of them
 
Dude. Why would one want to have boobies when grown up?
 
@J.M. That is clear enough
 
@belisarius Yes, I don't really bother disguising the rough edges...
 
@J.M. The problem with self-esteem is the "self" part. That makes it difficult to achieve. I think one should be able to opt out and get a good life esteeming something else
 
@belisarius Like esteeming a bunch of bananas?
 
7:12 AM
 
@J.M. Who is the hostess?
I love those two old men at the end
 
@belisarius Statler and Waldorf are always a hoot. I forgot the name of the hostess.
 
@J.M. I almost cried looking at Henson's funeral ceremony
he was a real genius
 
*nods*
 
7:36 AM
 
lol
Some bananas became corns.
@belisarius Ah, I guess you would like:
Velikovsky is a complete crackhead...
 
@GustavoBandeira Interesting "the modern "intelligent design" movement is almost a carbon copy of the 19th century flat-Earth movement in its argumentative techniques"
 
@belisarius =)
 
I always was curious where they got inspiration. And thought it was from the medieval texts. But no, they are more clever
 
7:51 AM
How old are you, Gustavo?
 
@belisarius 22.
Last one I have:
@belisarius Why the question?
 
Ok, I will tell you something for you to think in perhaps 5 or ten years
 
@belisarius Tell me.
 
Think the opposite: WHY DO PEOPLE believe IN science?
 
I do think that.
 
7:53 AM
an ...
and
 
My interest in epistemology and logic comes from this.
 
ok. and ..
 
BUT, I know that once I know something about, I'll repeat this: Why I'm believing this?°
So, if you formulated that question, I presume you may have something to fill it's gap.
 
no no, I am not talking about uni people. I am talking about people. Plain old ppl. Your grocery attendant, your taxi driver ... why?
 
@belisarius I guess we're used to hear that science solves this and that, that it's healing our cancers and STD's - the number of repeated expositions to it may generate some belief on it.
 
R.M
7:58 AM
Repeating a lie has the same effect too...
 
ok "repeated expositions" is one side of it. Let's call it "media advertisement" ... do you agree?
 
Yes.
Yes, RM.
 
ok, so advertisement is one side. "upper class" following is another.
 
What you mean with upper class following?
 
02:00 - 08:0008:00 - 00:00

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