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12:23 AM
I don't think "Sparknotes" has a religious affiliation. It's not a religious website. It's essentially a student handbook website for helping students with literature and other academic subjects.
The Bible is typically viewed as religious literature, so it is plausible that the website will discuss the Bible.
The problem is, once an author makes an interpretation to the Bible, that interpretation can influence the reader, especially if the reader is gullible, naive, or impressionable.
@Daи What other languages? (Just wondering. I'm thinking both human languages and computer languages.)
 
12:50 AM
@Daи This stinks. On one hand, I want to say, "Eh... I'd rather be a Roman Catholic then and let the priest interpret everything for me." On the other hand, putting so much power on the priest is a frightening thought. While reading A History of Lutheranism by Eric W. Gritsch, I've learned in depth about the abusive history of the Roman Catholic Church and the Lutheran justifications for reform.
 
@Anonymous I think there's strong evidence the author was Protestant :P
@Anonymous Spanish, some German. Also learning French and Russian (at least I'm trying to)
 
@Daи Strong evidence? How can you tell? (I'm very, very naive in this.)
 
@Anonymous I don't have time to discuss more right now, gotta run - but it was just my impression from what the author focused on in the book
@Anonymous check out my answer to this question
 
@Daи I've spent my middle school and high school years learning Spanish. I'm raised speaking Mandarin with a bit of the Wuhan dialect. In school and in public, I've always used English.
 
@Anonymous very cool
gotta run, sorry!
ttyl
 
12:56 AM
My library resource has this tool called "Mango Languages".
It essentially helps people learn new languages. It even has biblical Hebrew and Greek!
 
1:27 AM
@Anonymous back now
 
1:40 AM
@Daи How did you get that impression?
@Daи Cool.
@Daи However, I think that would be the case in an ideal situation. Reality is hardly ideal.
Therefore, the only thing that the naive reader can do is to check out what the Bible says and get the gist of it, which may be most important, since some parts of the Bible are culturally important. If the reader is not aware of the culture or the language, any interpretation by the reader is spurious.
And the people who typically have the training in understanding the ancient cultures and languages can probably take the scripture and relate it to modern people's lives, making the scripture more significant, meaningful, and enduring.
 
@Anonymous well, I would have to ask, who chose which books went into the Bible? The Church. So who really has the authority? ;)
 
I suppose one option for the determined unaffiliated is by reading sermons from a particular church but never really participating in church services and all that.
 
@Anonymous if you're ever interested in hearing an Orthodox perspective on some of this, I recommend:
that book is written by a Protestant and he is not trying to convert anyone to Orthodoxy (he himself is Protestant and decidedly so)
 
@Daи Well, I was thinking more from a cultural perspective and the bazillion quotes from the King James Version of the Bible. It might be useful to know the English idioms' origins. :P
 
it is just a good book for understanding Orthodox distinctives from a Protestant perspective without trying to refute them - merely understanding them on their own terms
@Anonymous that isn't the easiest Bible to read, even for native English speakers - many of the idioms used have different meanings now which leads to much misunderstanding of the text by KJV-only folks
 
1:58 AM
I'm beginning to think the Bible is overrated.
I remember the time when I picked up the Bible at my university's library for the first time. I had a history class as a General Education Curriculum requirement, and I chose a world history class. The first lesson was a chapter from the Jewish/Hebrew Bible. I checked out the English translation of it (not sure which version) from the library and read it. I actually thought it was kind of interesting and spent the rest of the day reading it, all the way to the Book of Job.
The professor said that we could read it as literature, and I (falsely) assumed that I could read it as literature. Little did I know that in order to relate the scripture to modern times accurately, you have to know the culture, the language, and church history.
As a person with little experience with this stuff and no religious affiliation, I think this would just a call for sitting in a pew and hearing the sermon on a weekly basis, and listening to everything the priest's says. That would take a really long time.
I wish I had Christian parents. Then, my parents could have taken me to church and Sunday school every week, and Christianity would no longer be mystery to me. :P
I think it's easier to visit a Catholic church than a Protestant church. A Catholic church is so big that nobody really cares if you exist.
 
@Anonymous bingo, yet lots of Protestant Christians believe that any person can interpret the Bible for him or herself with no understanding of its context, language, culture, history, etc. Which leads to lots of problematic beliefs that don't jive with the text.
@Anonymous sadly, most pulpits don't teach the background of the Bible, either
@Anonymous well, that's not always a positive, either :P
@Anonymous there is a Chinese student at a local university where I have served as an adjunct faculty member that hangs out with Christian groups on campus but does not believe in God. He likes the moral beliefs but not the metaphysical beliefs. He also found a group of friends which are Christian, which I'm sure is a big factor
 
@Daи Are Catholic priests more trained in church history, doctrine, theology, biblical cultures, and languages and stuff?
@Daи What is the university?
@Daи ...unless if you're just stopping by as a casual visitor who may attend the church for the entire year.
 
2:15 AM
@Anonymous it depends on their education. They tend to be better trained in philosophy and theology, and their faith is very intertwined with history. That doesn't mean they retain all of this information if they are not personally interested in, but they do tend to get quite a bit more training than the average local pastor who has no educational background in the Bible
@Anonymous An extension campus of Purdue
@Anonymous being able to blend in can indeed be a good thing at times, just not always :P
But I have a lot of respect for the Roman Catholic faith, and also for historically-rooted/informed Protestantism
such as Lutheran, Reformed, Anglican, etc.
 
@Daи As long as the person is not participating in any of the sacraments, I think that'd be safe for the person and respectful for the church.
 
@Anonymous indeed, although in my case as an Eastern Orthodox Christian, I am welcome to participate in the Roman Catholic sacraments, but my Church would not reciprocate this to Catholics and do not wish for me to do so
but personally, I tend to be very ecumenical and long for Christian unity
 
@Daи In that case, biblical interpretation would be extremely difficult to accomplish, and one must be wary of the many "Bible study" books out there.
 
@Anonymous well, in Orthodoxy and Catholicism the authority to interpret scripture rests in the Church, not in its individual members
in Orthodoxy, we try to never say anything 'new' - merely to continue to articulate the apostolic tradition. In practice, however, I believe all Christians are somewhat innovative, reinterpreting the Bible through the lens of their cultural context
 
@Daи So, non-denominational evangelical Protestant would be a misnomer, huh?
@Daи Actually, some Protestant churches nowadays do explicitly say that all are welcome to participate in the Eucharist. I am still not sure if they mean it literally, as in the religiously unaffiliated and the unregenerate.
 
2:23 AM
@Anonymous you can't divorce yourself from history. Beliefs don't spring up in a vacuum. Non-denominational churches are generally functional Baptist or Reformed congregations, but can be just about anything. Even so, they have a history that influences their beliefs - whether they acknowledge it or not
@Anonymous some do mean it literally. Contrast that to the early Church who not only didn't commune the uninitiated, but also made them leave the Liturgy early and not even participate and watch
@Anonymous mind if I migrate us over to the C.SE chat room (Upper Room)? Some of this discussion would not be appreciated by all of our users here
since we are not a Christian site
 
@Daи In Autumn 2011 quarter, I attended a Mormon Sunday service. I didn't know what I was doing, really. I saw the bread, and I saw the water. And well, I thought they served the bread and water as food and drink for the guests.
@Daи Sure, move it.
 
5 messages moved from The Library
58 messages moved from The Library
@Anonymous over here now ;)
 
@Daи There was one time when I asked too many questions on Judaism on the Christianity.SE chatroom, and Daniel (not you, Dan) requested that I should ask on the mi yodeya site.
 
@Anonymous yes there is a division of labor of sorts on SE sites regarding scope
I once described it to someone by explaining that you probably approach SE with a big question, but actually have to ask multiple questions on different sites and then piece it together yourself to get your 'big answer'
 
@Daи Well, that may be one way how experts operate, each expert in his or her discipline. But some experts may be multidisciplinary, such as evolutionary biologists.
Evolutionary biologists have to understand a great deal of physics, chemistry, biology, anthropology, sociology, anatomy, and maybe psychology.
@Daи In which cases don't you want to blend in?
 
3:18 AM
@Anonymous if you're trying to hide, it may not be good for your spiritual formation to be able to do so
to avoid having a spiritual father
 
@Daи There was one time when Jehovah's Witnesses came to our house. My father thought I was interested in the Bible and stuff, even though I don't think he's aware of the fine distinctions of the denominations. Anyway, I gave them a chance, and I had a few weeks of Bible study with them, and even attended a service with them. During the Bible study, I became suspicious by how they interpreted scripture. They would say, "So, what do you think of this?" And I would give a bogus answer.
It's a great way to encourage self-esteem, but self-esteem in biblical interpretation is not what I wanted. I'm used to being wrong, so I'd expect to be wrong with biblical interpretation, especially if the interpreter really has no experience with the background information.
So, one day, I telephoned the Jehovah's Witnesses and politely ended the Bible study.
 
0
Q: Is Xtian Fiction on topic?

AaronKornXtian Fiction is on the rise. Primarily OT Fiction. NPR did a report on this. Mesu Andrews talks about what is Xtian Fiction her Interview video. Is this something that is going to be incorporated into this site? What are the rules for fiction, OT fiction, NT fiction, and/or Xtian fiction? Are ...

 
3:41 AM
@Anonymous you may have had a similar experience whether with the JWs or in a Protestant group, sadly
 
4:11 AM
@Daи I think a serious, academic inquiry about Christianity is best done without the church, because that may be the best way to find truth. Even Martin Luther became a monk, then a priest, then a professor at Wittenburg University. He probably knew that the way to find truth is to go back to the sources rather than listen to the clerical authorities who have, in Gritsch's words, "betrayed the gospel".
 
@Anonymous well, you are bringing quite the Western worldview to this, and that of modernity
granted, the Roman Catholic Church of Luther's day had many problems - but this had as much to do with the Church being the governmental authority as just being flawed humans
all man-made governments/kingdoms are corrupt and grow moreso over time
that book is phenomenal
addresses some of this
 
Interesting title. It sounds like a play on The God Delusion.
@Daи It's from Yale. Anything from an Ivy League school has the potential to be phenomenal.
 
@Anonymous indeed - and the author is Eastern Orthodox, I might add
 
@Daи "David Bentley Hart" doesn't sound like an Eastern European name.
 
@Anonymous nor is my name
I'm a convert
I think he is too, but not sure: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Bentley_Hart
 
4:27 AM
@Daи Sometimes, I embarrassingly conflate religion with ethnicity.
That can only be applied to an ethnoreligious group.
 
@Anonymous most Orthodox Christians do, too, unfortunately. cf. phyletism
 
Indeed, researchers may ask, "What's your ethnicity?" on forms. And the choices are "Spanish, French, German, Jewish, Korean, Chinese, etc."
Apparently, researchers always disregard the type of Jew: Sephardi, Ashkenazaic, etc.
When I was in 7th grade, I asked my teacher what was Anne Frank's ethnicity. And she told me "Jewish". I specified the country, and she told me, "German". So, really, I was thinking, "Seriously, Hitler killed his OWN PEOPLE?"
 
@Anonymous yep
 
@Daи At best, even if Hitler disliked the Jews, he could have enslaved them instead of killed them. That was done in biblical times too.
@Daи Of course, that's assuming that the Bible is true on historical matters.
@Daи Did you know that Martin Luther disbelieved in the Copernican cosmological model, thinking that it was a threat to biblical authority? Hey, even Martin Luther wasn't perfect!
Still, it brings an interesting point that the assumptions people make about the world and tie to theology may be false and temporary.
And of course, an incorrect model of the universe leads to bad theology, which leads to the perception that the religion itself is false or proclaims false teachings about the world.
Therefore, the study of nature might be interpreted as a way to study God's creation.
 
4:56 AM
@Daи Why did you have the impression that Sparknotes might be written by a Protestant?
I don't know, but I think it could have been written by a person who might come from an academic institution or alma mater that feeds the students Protestant teachings, and the person happens to think in that specific type of interpretation.
In contrast, the author of Sparknotes may really be a free thinker and just happens to side with the view that Paul emphasizes faith in Jesus instead of faithfulness of Jesus.
 
5:19 AM
@Anonymous if he relied on any major English translation, he probably wasn't aware of another option
 
 
17 hours later…
10:37 PM
0
Q: Are exploratory questions off topic?

CalebSince the very early days of this site, I have been fairly outspoken in my opinion that this is not (and should be made to be) an appropriate replacement for churches in researching, formulating and refining the field of theology or the practice of it in the lives of believers. In fact this site ...

 
10:54 PM
This comment thread does not bode well :( — Benjol Jan 31 '11 at 6:21
 
@TRiG A problem we've seen many times in comments on the actual site... >_>
 
@El'endiaStarman I just find it interesting how the problems predicted there came up and were dealt with on the actual site.
If it becomes a forum of any kind, "fanboy" or otherwise, it will have failed as a Q&A site. — TRiG is Timothy Richard Green May 28 '11 at 23:08
 
11:25 PM
Now we're having fun!
 

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