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12:10 AM
I just saw that an app came out for Android!
0
Q: Charcoal - free bad post finder and flagger

The Wobbuffet It's now in the Google Play Store (Android), available here. Coming soon to iOS! (about 1-4 weeks) Please note that mass flagging is not helpful to moderators, so please watch how much posts you flag. So far it only finds comments to flag, questions and answers coming soon! In the current v...

 
1 hour ago, by kalina
^ is that you guys?
1 hour ago, by ManishEarth
@kalina Tavern regular. Liked the idea of Charcoal, made it into an app.
 
12:25 AM
@ManishEarth you're a genius coder type person thing
you are exactly the right person to tell me if this is easy or not
There is this old thing I used to use on IRC called PieSpy
How easy is it to make something that connects to chat and outputs the contents to a text file in a format that resembles IRC logs
 
@kalina So you think that Manish isn't a person? That made my day. :P
 
@hichris123 kalina-isms, you'll get used to them
I paid him a compliment!
I called him a genius
my mind couldn't make the word "developer" fit into the sentence
 
@kalina Know anything about AI?
 
I... I'm not a developer
 
Well, you can learn. :)
 
12:32 AM
ironically, I'm employed as a developer
did I hear that you had a bot written in python?
you being you guys in here
 
Manish wrote it. :) I helped with the finding of the spam part... a very little bit.
 
with something like that, wouldn't I be able to modify it to output irc style logs?
 
No clue.
 
well, python can write to a file, no?
and the bot can see all the text in chat
 
 
1 hour later…
2:04 AM
@kalina doable, but /me have no time.
Also, involves scraping chat -- best done over a long time period lest you anger the SE gods.
However, it is easy to watch for and log all new messages, though I'm not sure if my server would support that load
 
 
2 hours later…
 
3 hours later…
I have noticed the highest absolute rate of all-caps titles is on askubuntu
 
@SETH WHY DO YOU PEOPLE TALK LIKE THIS?
(OK, I'm an Ubuntu user too)
 
8:08 AM
@ManishEarth I have a PC it could run on, and I'd be willing to learn some python to do this since it would be my experiment
 
also, morning
1
Q: Adding "all capitals" to the quality filter

FlykSo, the guys over in Charcoal HQ have been working on a Smoke Detector that detects potential spam so it can be flagged quicker. One thing that has been noticed is the number of posts that get raised with an all-caps title. Here are some examples of things that have come through so far today - ...

 
 
1 hour later…
9:27 AM
[ SmokeDetector ] All-caps title: IIS 7.5 / WFF / ARR
 
10:08 AM
 
10:29 AM
 
 
1 hour later…
1:08 PM
@kalina So, all you've got to do really is to fetch messages from SE -- you can scrape the transcript (there's something called scrapy that does it very well!), making sure you don't hit the servers too much.
And then you just convert that data into an IRC log-style data
 
yeah
I'm not even thinking of scraping the transcript going backwards, just logging messages going forwards
I've done enough load inducing things recently, I'm actively trying to avoid doing more
 
@kalina Logging messages going forwards -- ChatExchange does that already :p
 
@ManishEarth then fantastic, I just need to transform/format the output in a way that looks like standard IRC logs and just import that straight into piespy
 
@kalina yep
Gimme the output format, I can write the script
 
uh, good question, I'd need to research that
 
1:20 PM
Because with the current script it's really easy.
 
I know @pings would need changing to match people names, and I'm not sure how piespy would handle not getting raw output for user lists on join
but I will research that tonight and find out
I expected this to be more difficult than you're saying it's going to be
 
It probably is
 
I was all geared up to start learning python
 
@kalina Actually, if you fetch like only 5 days worth of transcript at a time, I think that you can get the past transcripts pretty quickly. Much quicker than waiting for it to roll in
@kalina you still can :p Try to figure out ChatExchange (see test.py for usage) yourself.
 
link me to it
 
1:55 PM
 
2:42 PM
@ManishEarth ...who willingly names a software "snort"?
 
@GraceNote (real Manish) hahaha... well, you could say the same about git
 
"real Manish"?
 
I never really understood that one either, but at least we have a hub after it in some points.
@kalina As opposed to the SmokeDetector.
 
o...k
 
@kalina (fake manish) because I become sentient....slowly
 
2:44 PM
fake Manish was my first thought
 
3:30 PM
@ManishEarth When should mod nominations happen?
ours just got tagged [featured], and I'm afraid people are going to focus too much on it and not enough on actually building something to moderate :P
 
@Undo on SR?
 
@kalina yup
 
on eBooks they happened after it went public
the thread was asked...
let me check
 
Yeah, when was the thread featured?
 
3:39 PM
heh
 
more than a week after the site opened
and I don't think it ever got
 
I think they usually do
 
How many days into private?
 
but it was featured several weeks after it was asked
 
3:41 PM
Huh, odd.
 
it was already public when the question was asked
 
Maybe the CMs want more suggestions earlier just because of the site?
I dunno.
 
you shouldn't do this during private beta, just because you committed to it doesn't mean that you should be the only choices for temp mods
you = general user, not you personally
I imagine in the case of SR though
you have a lot of crap that needs cleaning constantly
 
I know, SR is special-like.
special
 
also, our "who should be mod" question was asked by a user, not a CM
 
3:43 PM
@kalina Yes, but a CM just featured it 12 minutes ago.
 
it's likely they want to offload the work asap
 
So they must like it somehow.
Ours was asked by a user.
 
^ edited
 
I don't think that's the case.
It's great that you're taking the reins like this, but we generally don't look at appointing moderators until a couple of weeks after switching to public beta (though, we're watching now to see who stands out as good candidates) — Tim Post yesterday
Although maaaaaaybe they changed their minds.
I can't imagine them wanting to do anything other than watch the site like a hawk, though.
 
@Undo not too important, the noms are just a guideline for the team who watch the site anyway
 
3:45 PM
oh yeah, it's definitely an experiment
 
but yeah, too much meta-focus on modding isn't good at the start
 
if SR actually works, it will be a migration target for like the entire network
 
@ManishEarth Well yes, but... we should build it first, right?
exactly.
 
yes you should
 
@Undo yes
 
3:45 PM
more time should be spent working out what is on topic than focussing on who is going to mod it
especially in the case of a site with that particular subject
pretty much every single post on that site would fail due to being "low quality" on every other site on the network
and I'd be pretty confident that being the person/people who takes control of scoping that place will guarantee you a spot as a temp mod
 
:P
I dunno if I want it. That site is going to have hurdles...
 
that site is going to be a low quality nightmare
it's going to perpetually suffer from "well you allowed <X> question! why is mine closed?" drama
 
exactly.
 
and if we (the network) aren't careful and you (your mods) aren't resilient it will probably turn into a dumping ground for any recommendation question
you'll have no shortage of questions though
and I bet your traffic will be insane
 
Ugh. Yeah.
 
3:49 PM
what's the question count at so far?
 
180 something, methinks.
But we get new ones like semihourly.
 
ok so you're basically catching ebooks and ebooks has been running for 6 weeks
has 230 questions
 
The timestamps on this page are insane.
 
I can't see that :p
 
@kalina Oh.
 
3:51 PM
by the time you're out of private beta you'll be ahead of ebooks
 
We're at 189 right now. But it looks like we're getting 3-4 questions an hour :P
 
how many people are in private beta?
 
And our meta is crazy active.
@kalina 280-ish, methinks.
 
imagine how bonkers it's going to get in ~5 days when world+dog can sign up
 
yeesh
that's going to be interesting :P
Maybe we do need PTs ASAP :P
 
 
2 hours later…
@ManishEarth prove that "Prove that 2.101001000100001&hellip; is an irrational number" is an irrational question :-)
 
@ManishEarth Dupe detector borked.
 
6:09 PM
@Undo it only detects consecutive duplication
 
ah.
that must be changed :P
Maybe keep a list of the past 100 ID's?
 
@ManishEarth interesting
there is smoke coming off the smoke detector
3
 
@ManishEarth cache results for a day? Should I implement that?
 
I prefer better filters
 
Smoke detector is now on fire
 
7:27 PM
[ SmokeDetector ] All-caps title: DISK BOOT FAILURE
 
8:11 PM
well that needs an edit.
 
8:22 PM
@JanDvorak We could, but why? This seems to be a rare use case.
That there are two simultaneous posts and they clash
but -- as long as you write it in a sane way that doesn't use \infty ram, pull requests always appreciated. Caching for a day is still a nice idea
 
8:41 PM
@Undo I got nice question on AI. :P
 
@hichris123 Yay!
@hichris123 The AI meta frontpage scares me. The whole thing fits on one screen :P
You guys have to have some problems to talk about somewhere :p
 
@Undo I know. I'm thinking of some meta questions... not sure what to ask about. ;)
 
I've got to go now, cya
 
Cya.
 
8:58 PM
arrives from eating
 
in Tavern on the Meta on Meta Stack Overflow Chat, 7 mins ago, by hichris123
^ Who's going to be the lucky 200th committer?
Yay!
200
Arduino

Proposed Q&A site for developers of open-source hardware and software that is compatible with Arduino

Currently in commitment.

@Undo ^
 
Yay!
@hichris123 You're going to be really active there, right?
 
@Undo Hopefully.
 
Good. I'll probably drop in and watch when it gets created. And maybe poke people with sharp sticks :D
 
Sharp sticks are fun.
 
9:05 PM
Yep. IIRC Rebecca Chernoff is the master of sharp sticks and their uses in poking things.
 
woah. chat activity
 
Hiya @LordStryker
 
@LordStryker oy
 
Hi @LordStryker!
 
This chatroom has no relation to chem.se :p
 
9:08 PM
@ManishEarth Um... Ch arcoal, Ch em
 
Uh-oh, @ManishEarth are we in front of the main room in the chatroom list now?
 
yeah
 
Uh-oh
 
@LordStryker hey, any ideas on how to improve that chat session idea of mine?
 
:D hello everyone
 
9:10 PM
Oy
 
@LordStryker pokes
 
1
A: Nominate temporary moderators for this site here

World EngineerMy name is World Engineer. I've moderated Programmers Stack Exchange for the last 11 months. I believe this site can work but will take a solid effort by everyone involved to ensure good content. This will not be easy. Recommendations are inherently subjective to a higher degree than much of the ...

Yay World Engineer wants to help us!
 
@ManishEarth Get people to commit. Schedule a regular time (a few hours on certain days) and encourage people to bring a coffee or beer to chillax with
Then we all hash out answers to questions.
 
@LordStryker how do we get others to realize that there is such an event? I can pin stuff to the community bulletin, but otherwise ... not sure.
I guess we'll have to float a scheduling meta question anyway
 
The biggest problem with Chem:SE is that many questions are indeed specialized or many questions can lead to 'very technical answers' depending on how far into the concepts the answerer wants to go. This is one of the main reasons why I have trouble posting answers to questions... because I know a little bit but not enough to give a 'proper answer' which can take a lot of effort.
 
9:13 PM
we can see the response on that
@LordStryker exactly
 
@Undo I thought that you weren't supposed to nominate yourself for pro tem
 
@kalina It's 'allowed and even encouraged'
 
A lot of answers that can be provided can always lead to "well... thats not quite right... and heres why" type directions
 
I must have totally misread the guide during eBooks then
 
If a gen. chem. student comes on and asks a question about orbitals, for example, you could give a gen. chem. response but if you've already taken phys. chem. or have done post-graduate work, you know that the answers can be far more complicated than the person asking even realizes.
Its a tough community to contribute to lol
 
9:16 PM
@kalina Or maybe someone posted the wrong guide :P
 
@ManishEarth But definitely start with putting together a tentative schedule in Meta and tweak it as people chime in.
 
@LordStryker Yeah, my worries are that people won't chime in :p
 
Well we have to try.
 
Yep!
 
cq
whoops
 
9:19 PM
@LordStryker so, an informal session, where we just come together, hunt for answerable stuff, and answer together/help each other answer?
 
yes. informal.
It would be helpful to have people respond in meta or something with their 'field of study' so we know how diverse our group will be
It would be embarrassing for a bunch of P. chemists to try and solve organic chemistry questions on their own.
I know I couldn't. Haven't done OChem in nearly 7 years.
Maybe have everyone put their FOS in their profile like Field of study: Inorganic
But nothing too specific like "Analyzing thiolated-gold clusters with Mass Spec. techniques"
And to put a nice cherry on the sundae, keep a running score of "Q's answered since... " or "Q's answered this month" would be a nice encouragement.
 
@LordStryker that is a good idea :)
 
9:39 PM
@ManishEarth have a minute?
 
yeah?
 
@ManishEarth So what do I do with the SR nom?
 
@Undo um...you can just wait on it
 
@ManishEarth Yes, which is what I'm doing. It just... scares me.
My participating there was kinda an afterthought, TBH :P
 
Meh, you can ignore it
 
9:41 PM
Yeah, I'll just leave it for another week.
 
@Undo my participation on Chem was not so motivated, initially. Sure, I wanted the site around and was sharing the proposal. But I didn't plan on getting too involved. But I really liked the place, so... :)
 
The other thing that scares me is I really don't know if I can do it. SR is... special. And needs people with experience.
 
@Undo "special" as in "special school"?
 
@JanDvorak Ehrm... yeah. Exactly :P
 
@Undo what do you mean "experience"? Do you consider yourself inexperienced moderation wise just because you've never had a diamond?
 
9:48 PM
@Seth Why Seattle as your profile pic?
 
@hichris123 Because I'm a fan?
 
@Seth Kind of, yes. I have experience in the non-diamond tools, but only for a short amount of time (and the higher ones only on small sites). I'm not seeing myself as being able to offer what SR really needs.
 
and they just won the super bowl?
 
@Seth Yeah... but... :P
 
but what?
 
9:49 PM
Change is weird.
 
@Undo I understand what you mean by seeing yourself, but I don't see how that experience you have isn't just as good as mod folks, with or without a diamond. The only difference I can see is that people with diamonds are more used with having the last say...
Am I missing something?
@hichris123 It's only temporary. I'll change it back next week.
 
@Seth The people with diamonds have gotten used to the diamond tools. I haven't, and I'd have to learn on what's probably the most challenging site on the network right now. And... I can't even drive yet.
Don't get me wrong, I want a diamond.
 
@Undo you fail to convince me :P
bbl
 
But I also want to see this site succeed. And I think that might mean letting people with more experience putting out fires and whatnot step up.
 
10:20 PM
ahh, there we go.
More experience putting fires out.
 
Yeah, that's the most of it.
 
Yes, that would be something only mods would really have. But then, how are you supposed to learn if you only leave it to other mods? (I'm not arguing with you, nor pressuring you to accept the nomination, more just thinking out loud)
 
Yeah, that makes sense...
@Seth I am... much younger than the vast majority of users here. That also gives me pause.
As in much, much younger. Barely COPPA-legal :P
 
Not younger than I (I think). :P
 
I think that has very little to do with it. You could be a dog for all I care, as long as you are good at what a moderator needs to do.
(as in, on the internet, no one knows you're a dog)
 
10:24 PM
I suppose...
 
Again, just thinking out loud.
 
I appreciate it.
 
Trying to understand something I didn't understand. Which I understand better now. So I'll shut up :)
 
You're being very encouraging ;)
 
Well I'm glad about that :)
 
10:25 PM
@Undo canyouhazthediamondz
 
:P
 
I find the attitudes some of the other cough users cough on softrecs to be.. discouraging if not rather.. offensive.
 
I suppose it's all up to the CMs anyway, so I'm not really pushing someone awesome out by accepting.
 
@Seth I need to go look... haven't been on there in a while.
 
but on the other hand, upon turning the same question against myself, I'm not sure I would accept the nomination either, although I've kinda wanted to get a moderator job myself.
 
10:27 PM
Any opinions on this?
 
I think reopen.
 
"this item is not reviewable"
?!?
 
@Undo What?
Oh, it just got reopened.
 
@hichris123 That's what I got when I went to that link.
Post reopened, BTW ;)
 
in Software Recommendations, 5 hours ago, by Seth
It is no more too broad than the python one:
in Software Recommendations, 5 hours ago, by Seth
3
Q: Python IDE with rich features: code completion, debugging, etc

Adnan UmerI'm looking for an good IDE for Python that should run on Windows 7 and higher. The program should ideally support the following features: Syntax highlighting Code Completion Debugger Support Support to run Shell side by side Support for CPython and IronPythin Navigation to Definition (As in Vi...

in Software Recommendations, 5 hours ago, by Seth
The OP lists what he wants, and the answerers answered. I fail to see anything "Too broad" about it.
Pretty much sums up my opinion on that one, but then I have the top voted answer on that question :P
 
10:29 PM
Yup.
Makes sense to me.
 
Yeah, unclear.
 
I'm just cleaning up after things on SR, you guys go ahead and answer/question stuff. :P
 
I'm going to wait for it to come to review :P
 
@hichris123 I think that we don't really know what we're supposed to open and close is the main problem right now.
 
10:32 PM
@Undo Mm... to meta?
 
Every time I open an SR question my finger goes through the close -> off-topic -> recommendation-request sequence :P
 
It's broad because I am very open to any suggestion of a Java application so long as it is i) open source, ii) requires the user to interact with the GUI, iii) actions within the application are not all immediate, some actions should take time to complete — user973758 33 secs ago
Then it really should be closed...
 
Yup
 
O_o
I don't even have any posts on meta..
 
@Seth You said you used all your meta votes up that one day - maybe that factors in?
 
10:36 PM
I know it does, but I would think it factors answers and question bigger than comments and votes..
(I actually used all my meta votes all 3 days..)
 
Voting is important...
 
yes, but if Gilles didn't answer there would be nothing to vote on :P
(I'm kinda taking this room off-topic.. sorry)
 
Meh, doesn't matter.
 
@Seth Erm... you haven't seen how off-topic it's gotten. :P
 
We can always migrate all this over to the SR room.
Heh, yeah.
 
10:38 PM
Like when I was asking for help on my Python script... :P
 

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