The Whiteboard

2:31 AM

@MichaelT Seems elaborate. I like good chef-quality meals, but they need to be simple to make and to clean up after

And my wife is hard to cook for. I don't think she'd eat that. Her idea of "walking on the wild side" is "Shepherd's Pie."

Done traditionally.

user55340

> Recipe:
Hollow out pineapple.
Trim bark off pineapple.
Shove meat in the hole.
Wrap in bacon.
Smother it in spices.
Smoke at 240 for 5 hours.

Robert Harvey

It's that last step that's the deal-breaker.

user55340

@RobertHarvey Not the "Shove meat in the hole."?

Robert Harvey

Um...

I'm married, remember?

user55340

Boneless ribs (wait a moment... ribs are bones... how can they be boneless?)

Robert Harvey

2:37 AM

Plastic glass.

Military intelligence.

Jumbo shrimp.

user55340

The bacon wrapped pineapple... just as that though.

user55340

I've had serrano ham wrapped dates... those are quite good.

Robert Harvey

You can wrap anything in bacon, and make it taste good.

user55340

So, wrap some pineapple with ham (that sounds quite good actually... the contrast of texture and the sweet vs savory vs spicy mix)

user55340

Jamón serrano

Jamón serrano (Spanish: [xaˈmon seˈrano]; "Serrano ham", literally "ham from the sierra, or mountains") is a type of jamón (dry-cured Spanish ham), which is generally served in thin slices, or occasionally diced. The majority of serrano hams are made from the landrace breed of white pig and are not to be confused with the much more expensive jamón ibérico. == Preparation == Fresh hams are trimmed and cleaned, then stacked and covered with salt for about two weeks in order to draw off excess moisture and preserve the meat from spoiling. The salt is then washed off and the hams are hung to dry for...

Robert Harvey

2:39 AM

Yum.

user55340

It is delicious

user55340

One of my favorite tapas from Cascal in mountain view...

user15026

This summer when I get tasty melons from my CSA I think I am just going to buy Serrano ham (if I have the cash for it) and just sit there with a melon and a knife and wrap things and stick them in my face

user15026

@RobertHarvey debates a bacon wrapped banana

user55340

> Grilled Serrano Ham & Date Brochette – Serrano ham wrapped dates filled with Cabrales cheese

Robert Harvey

2:41 AM

@AshleyNunn Candied Bacon Ice Cream

user55340

Reel Flavor - Stuffed Dates Wrapped with Serrano Ham

►

user15026

@RobertHarvey I've made a peanut brittle with candied bacon in that was SO tasty

Robert Harvey

Doesn't even need salt.

user15026

It was the first thing to disappear at the town Canada Day picnic last summer at my parents neighbour's house

user55340

You can substitute prosciutto if you can't find the real thing.

user15026

2:43 AM

Usually I can find both, it is just a matter of what I can afford

Robert Harvey

Epic Meal Time never fails to amuse.

durron597

3:03 AM

please vtc this as duplicate, not as too broad. thanks

Duga

4:18 AM

@JoshuaFerge programmers.stackexchange.com is probably more relevant of this type of question. Nothing is really wrong with your question. Not sure why it is receiving so much negative attention — vihan1086 23 secs ago

Duga

7:20 AM

If your problem is entirely related to logic, you can ask the same at programmers.stackexchange.com — Sourav Ghosh 32 secs ago

Duga

8:32 AM

This question should be migrated to programmers.SE — Juann Strauss 22 secs ago

MetaFight

9:53 AM

You should def use OOP and a scrum methodology, get the scrum master to draw up a backlog of tasks and check with the Product owner for acceptance critera — Ewan 1 hour ago

deostroll

10:58 AM

How "does" a mail server application handle an RSET smtp command...

Do we basically restart with EHELO, HELO, etc?

user114359

@deostroll No idea here. My knowledge of SMTP involves configuring Thunderbird, and even that is painful at times.

Duga

@SouravGhosh algorithm questions are on-topic at both sites, but this question is specifically asking for implementation help which is on-topic at SO but off-topic at Programmers. Please read: What goes on Programmers.SE? A guide for Stack Overflow. — Snowman 21 secs ago

André

11:17 AM

@deostroll cr.yp.to/smtp/helo.html

durron597

12:36 PM

gahhh i am fussing like crazy over what to wear. my recruiter told me i could wear shorts if I wanted... but I'm not going to do that

André

@durron597, oh, good luck in your interview! :-)

durron597

I am wearing slacks & nice buttondown but honestly I think I should wear a polo

I also have a sports jacket that's just slightly too small

user114359

I always wear a suit but apparently that hasn't been required for a few years, at least in IT.

durron597

@Snowman Recruiter specifically told me not to wear one.

> Yeah, we're really casual. Jeans are absolutely fine. If you prefer khakis or shorts that's fine too, whatever makes you comfortable

user114359

@durron597 That is reasonable. I would not wear shorts. Business casual, then. No tie.

user114359

12:42 PM

If you wear jeans, wear a polo tucked in.

durron597

@Snowman Polo or button down? if Button down, blazer that is just slightly too small, or leave it in suitcase

Nah I'm wearing slacks

user114359

Polo

durron597

At least THAT decision has been made haha

user114359

so business casual

user114359

If shorts are acceptable, even a tie would be overdoing it. But go at least one step above the bottom rung of the casual ladder

André

12:44 PM

nods

durron597

@Snowman Why polo over button down? I have both

I have a tie too but I wasn't going to wear it.

user114359

If that makes sense. Casual, but not too casual. Somewhere in the middle of the boundaries HR set. In the range of [shorts, business casual] I would go business casual but on the casual end. So no tie or button-down

user114359

That's just me, you really need to decide for yourself.

user114359

> Many good questions generate some degree of opinion based on expert experience, but answers to this question will tend to be almost entirely based on opinions, rather than facts, references, or specific expertise.

durron597

@Snowman Honestly I think I would argue with any suggestion you made, because I'm freaking out. haha

user114359

12:46 PM

Actually the range is [shorts, business formal)

durron597

My shoes are an awful lot like these, if it matters:

user114359

Typical office shoes. Goes with almost anything except jeans and t-shirt

durron597

@enderland are you here? I need a The Workplace expert :-P

Yeah these are my office shoes. I wear jeans and a polo every day to current job

André

interesting, here one would wear these only with suits

durron597

@André If they had laces I'd agree with you

user114359

12:49 PM

My subjective view having interviewed and been interviewed is if someone walked in wearing jeans and a polo, he damn well better be a rock star. Shorts would be rejected at the door. But Google is... different.

durron597

@Snowman I'm not wearing jeans.

André

one would sport more casual shoes with jeans and a polo here @durron597

user114359

N.B. that has nothing to do with the day to day dress code policy: always go at least one up on the day to day dress code.

durron597

Well slacks are one up from my typical jeans

user114359

@durron597 I know, I'm just giving my perspective

durron597

12:50 PM

honestly this buttondown is a little too small also. I gained like 20 lbs, went from a middle-32 waist to a high 34, bleh.

Let me see how my polo looks tucked in.

It certainly fits better.

quora.com/What-is-the-dress-code-for-an-interview-at-Google

The funny thing is that I went to school with the girl who answered that question... and I could code circles around her in college

user114359

@durron597 The rule of thumb there is basically what I was saying above. I agree.

user114359

In other news I am working from home today and put the smoker out around 5:30 AM to have ribs and chicken for dinner. According to the Internet, the only precipitation today is supposed to be thuderstorms tonight. Of course, it just started raining. On my smoker.

durron597

1:10 PM

@Snowman That sucks. I hope I have better luck today than you do :)

I can't decide whether to leave my laptop bag with the luggage people here at the hotel or bring it with me

Ah fuck! I didn't print out copies of my resume

meh. too late to do anything about it now.

Duga

This question would probably be more appropriate on programmers.stackexchange.com — Xaqq 18 secs ago

user114359

@durron597 Take anything valuable with you. Even if you just carry it around, better off not stolen.

Duga

@Xaqq Education advice and resource requests are off-topic on Programmers.SE. Please read: What goes on Programmers.SE? A guide for Stack Overflow. — Snowman 8 secs ago

user114359

@durron597 Why does the internet have to lie? Not like "hey look a cold front" is so damn hard to forecast.

Duga

2:13 PM

On Stackoverflow a question such as: "how do I switch between implementations at compile time?" Would be fine. For design questions, best practices and opinions ProgrammersStackExchange might be a better place. — Erno de Weerd 37 secs ago

@ErnodeWeerd Whiteboard and design questions are welcome on Programmers.SE. Anything opinion-based is off-topic there, same as on Stack Overflow. Please read: What goes on Programmers.SE? A guide for Stack Overflow. — Snowman 13 secs ago

Ampt

just submitted my timesheet to the revelation that I've spent more time on vacation than work since last month

.... hello?

is anyone out there?

André

@Ampt, hey there

Ampt

oh good, I thought you had all gone off to a private slack chatroom while I was away

André

2:28 PM

Slow morning, went to some dev conference, heard all the new buzzwords for my region, was okay

Ampt

awesome! if there's one thing our industry needs, it's more business analysts with buzzwords who are pretty sure they could do our job!

user41796

> We can neither confirm nor deny the presence of any said private slack chatroom for The Whiteboard.

Ampt

and I wasn't invited??? :'(

user41796

44 secs ago, by GlenH7

> We can neither confirm nor deny the presence of any said private slack chatroom for The Whiteboard.

Ampt

that's fine, I'll start my own chat room! With Hookers and Booze!

user114359

2:29 PM

and blackjack

André

@Ampt, this time were buzzwords for Architects, QA and DevOps

user114359

Ampt

woah woah woah, now hold on a second

user114359

DevOps is itself a buzzword

Ampt

Architects, QA, and DevOps are not buzzwords

Duga

2:31 PM

Thanks @Snowman I still have trouble figuring out what is and isn't on topic on Programmers.SE — Erno de Weerd 27 secs ago

Ampt

DevOps is IT for Developers

pretty straight forward

André

I'm might be misusing the term buzzword then, I think I'm trying to convey is the hype about all the new frameworks and processes with those roles/areas

Ampt

ah ok. I guess in my mind a buzzword is a nonsensical word people apply to things they don't understand in hopes that they can put it in a box

kind of like "the cloud"

does it run on a computer somewhere else? MUST BE THE CLOUD!

user41796

I'd argue that there's a lot of a buzzword aspect to devops still

Ampt

fine, next time jira goes down, you can take time out of your day to redeploy it!

user41796

2:34 PM

It's getting better and solidifying into something meaningful (unlike the "cloud) but it isn't fully baked yet

user41796

It's more the lack of a common definition for what it means that makes it a buzzword

user114359

Does anyone know of a usable Java profiler for Eclipse?

André

I enjoyed hearing about the view of a DevOps here, I already do some work within such role, automate this, docker that

I always end up using VisualVM @Snowman

user114359

Somehow PE-23 is pegging two of eight CPUs at 90% despite being single-threaded. I am curious why my implementation sucks so hard.

user114359

...and still comes up with the wrong answer

Ampt

2:38 PM

two of eight physical CPUs, or virtual ones?

user114359

258778ms ~= 4.3 minutes

user114359

i7 so two of eight virtual CPUs. The corresponding "halves" are at 0%

Ampt

I'm guessing that pegging one physical CPU is pegging both virtuals as active

maybe you're using a shared resource on the die

or, you're generating a ton of garbage and the garbage collector is on the other

on that topic though, there's one of them fancy 6 core i7s at frys for 350 this weekend... reallllly have to try not to drive out there and buy it...

have to upgrade to the 2011 motherboard but.... them sweet, sweet flops

user114359

Shouldn't be hardly any garbage though, using primitives and cached java.lang.Integer instances.

user114359

I think this is simply an algorithmic inefficiency.

Ampt

2:42 PM

then I'm guessing whatever you're doing is using the shared resources between the two virtual CPUs

so, misreporting

Duga

@ErnodeWeerd Every Stack Exchange site has What topics can I ask about here? — Snowman 6 secs ago

user114359

@Duga BAD Duga! You are not supposed to dig into URLs to match "Programmers"!

user114359

Unless Eclipse or the JVM is spinning up a very active thread.

user41796

@Snowman Be gentle with Duga. Think of all the wonderfully bad suggestions we've been able to shut down through him | her.

user41796

This is the module that Duga uses to filter for Programmers references, btw.

Ampt

2:48 PM

came across a video on different weld patterns on youtube. looks like I have a new hobby that I have absolutely no need for

user114359

@GlenH7 I know, I know. I should be nice for when robots take over the world because it has been proven (with math, no less) that zombies cannot.

user114359

4

Q: Would a zombie apocalypse be possible if a zombie existed?

I want to do something on the first weeks of the zombie apocalypse. I am using a virusal, slow, infinite energy, 24 hours or so transformation time, zombie model. So I want to know, if let us say a zombie is created, or even 100, can a zombie apocalypse theoretically happen? Wouldn't the military...

zombies

user41796

@Snowman And Duga is a good bot :-)

Ampt

@Snowman isn't that assuming that the only transmission vector is biting and that infected have to turn in 24 hours?

I think those are the worst characteristics you could choose.

what if it was airborne, and took 6 months to show symptoms, but was completely transmittable during that time?

now you're talking about a worldwide epidemic!

user114359

@Ampt if you read the question and others like it on WB.SE you will find that you are correct, the zombie apocalypse as portrayed in Walking Dead et al is utterly unfeasible.

user114359

2:51 PM

It has to be more like The Stand but with a flu that turns people undead, not kill them completely dead.

Ampt

I just remember playing that game where you try to infect the world with something, and the best strategy was always to create a super viral, but super benign virus that infected like 50% of the world without anyone noticing, and then BAM, turn it into a crazy killer

André

@Ampt, I think I played too, getting to infect Madagascar was hard

user41796

@Ampt That's how I played it as well

Ampt

granted, that's not even remotely close to how real viruses work (you cant remotely change the RNA of a virus on command...) but it shows that getting noticed early is inherently bad for a good virus

Thomas Owens

André

2:55 PM

@Ampt, nods you want to be silent and deadly as ninjas

@ThomasOwens, that, yeah :-)

Thomas Owens

I remember starting in Madagascar once.

user114359

@Ampt that is why you need something with a long incubation period. Similar to how Ebola can take weeks to show symptoms. Drop your virus in Manhattan or Las Vegas or LAX or anywhere else with a ton of travelers from all over the world, make it spread easily through the air, and you could have a worldwide zombie pandemic in short order.

Ampt

ha..haha.....hahahaha....MWAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAH

André

I wonder if I cough now I will collapse Madagascar economy

Ampt

Thomas Owens

2:59 PM

@Ampt Image not found?

Ampt

bettar?

Thomas Owens

Much.

user114359

@ThomasOwens doesn't your work filter stuff?

Thomas Owens

@Snowman Some stuff.

For example, imgur is blocked. stack.imgur isn't

user114359

I just vaguely remember this being an issue before.

user114359

3:03 PM

So, it turns out that the Eclipse Marketplace built-in to Eclipse has an entire category devoted to profiling. One plugin has 45k downloads. I guess I'll follow the crowd on this one.

Thomas Owens

Which plugin?

user114359

JVM Monitor

Thomas Owens

That's the one I use.

It's been a while since I had to use it, but I have it installed.

user114359

If you scroll up you will see me crying about my Project Euler program taking too long to run

Thomas Owens

Ah.

I wonder if Project Euler is a good way to get the hang of a new programming language.

My only concern is that it is likely to be more suitable to a procedural or functional style, given the mathematical nature. So if you wanted to explore the object-orientation capabilities of a language, it wouldn't be so good.

user114359

3:11 PM

The only reusable component I have created is a Sieve of Eratosthenes. There are a handful of math functions but nothing much.

user114359

and actually to help performance I grabbed a prime number list off the internet and load them from a text file in my project. Ends up being a ton faster than calculating them, even with file I/O.

Thomas Owens

Exactly my point. I wish there was something more generic than Project Euler. Or perhaps other things.

user41796

code katas?

Thomas Owens

@GlenH7 More like code katas. But even those (at least the ones I've seen) aren't really suitable to test implementing reusable components.

I'd still approach most of those procedurally or functionally.

user41796

Yeah, I'd agree with that too

Thomas Owens

3:14 PM

Which is find if you want to learn F#, Haskell, Lisp, Scheme, OCaml, or use the functional aspects of C#, Python, Ruby, or even the new Java features. But something that is more suitable to the multi-paradigm capabilities (including object-orientation) of the latter set of languages would be nice.

I'd almost think that the "problems" or "exercises" would need to build on each other, though.

I don't even know what kind of problem set you'd want to cover a language like Prolog.

I had to use Prolog for a course once...it was mindblowing. At least I understood Scheme.

OK. Time for me to take a phone call and my lunch break. bbl

user114359

3:32 PM

This profiler is less than useless. Not only does it give me a blank page for where the CPU is spending its time, it clearly knows what is going on because it can generate charts. It is actively trying to piss me off.

Duga

Welcome to Stack Overflow! Please take a tour to learn what this site is about. We expect specific code questions, while futures of software may be on-topic for another site, like Programmers (but take their tour first). — Unihedron 39 secs ago

Ampt

@Snowman Perhaps a user error?

Duga

@Unihedron Predicting the future is off-topic at Programmers much as it is here. Please read: What goes on Programmers.SE? A guide for Stack Overflow. — Snowman 9 secs ago

user114359

@Ampt my gut feeling is this two-year-old software is not fully compatible with Java 8 bytecode. But what do I know? I am made of snow, not clothing.

Ampt

why not use the profiler that comes with the JDK?

forget what it's called

user114359

3:44 PM

VisualVM

whatsisname

i did not want to come into work today

user114359

Guess I can't fix it for you

user114359

SWEET! VisualVM can latch on to my program running in Eclipse and report on it.

user114359

4:10 PM

Apparently, executing a loop 1,272,294,425 times takes a while.

André

haha

Thomas Owens

4:28 PM

Back. Going to what I was saying before...are there things like Project Euler or code katas that are useful for fully exploring languages? Most I've seen are more geared toward procedural or functional solutions.

user114359

4:39 PM

@ThomasOwens I am not aware of any collection of projects like that but I am sure something is out there.

user114359

For someone who is an experienced developer who simply needs to learn a new technology or language it should be easy enough to make up a project though.

André

Well, there is the Architectural Katas but they don't relate to code, more problem solving

it's a group activity too, so you can debate the end result

Thomas Owens

@Snowman I don't think it's that easy to make up a project.

At least one that's of an appropriate scale.

user114359

Something large would be tougher, but do you really need something large? Besides, I think thinking back to projects I have worked on I could easily pull out modules to reimplement.

Thomas Owens

@Snowman That's the thing. I want something between "trivial" and "large".

It's hard to come up with those ideas, especially when you're also learning new syntax and dev tools.

user114359

4:47 PM

I have a perfect example of a module but it is a bit much to fit in this format

user114359

technically it would expose proprietary information from an old customer too so I would need to modify it a bit anyway

Thomas Owens

A collection of those would be nice. I'm sure I can come up with a few. But it's not an easy task to come up with modules. Ideally, a collection of katas, Project Euler problems, and this other kind of component would be presented and used as a set to learn a language.

user114359

I think part of the issue too is the boundary of "language" or "framework" you are learning. Want to learn C++? There is no built-in GUI. Want to learn VB.NET? It is designed around GUI development.

Thomas Owens

True. Even things like database access and concurrency could change wildly. I haven't used C++11, but I don't know if I would want to wish concurrency on someone using C++, unless you were introducing Boost.

user114359

Is there something specific you are trying to learn, or just talking in general?

user114359

4:51 PM

@ThomasOwens C++11 concurrency is built on Boost's concurrency library. Not the same, but close enough.

Thomas Owens

Just in general. The list of languages I want to learn or get better at is growing. I don't want to do these huge projects, though. But I want things that are more meaningful to show off.

user114359

I can see value in having a small enough project for a single developer to learn. Define requirements, data, define success criteria, and package it up for reuse.

Thomas Owens

I'm not thinking about project reuse.

user114359

The tutorials would be reusable for more than one person to learn from

Thomas Owens

Not that kind of reuse.

user114359

4:54 PM

If I were going to put something together like this I would put it on my web site for others to use. That's just my take on it though.

Thomas Owens

Think about Project Euler. You don't really construct classes that you continue to use and enhance as you proceed. A few algorithms may be useful across multiple projects, but each one is generally a stand alone thing.

user114359

Ah. I mean "reuse" as in "multiple people can learn from it"

Thomas Owens

It's not good for learning the object-oriented languages since you don't need to use polymorphism or encapsulation or composition.

user114359

Actually right now I am in the process of refactoring some of my PE code to be reusable between problems. I already did that with the prime generator, now I am doing it with factorizations.

Thomas Owens

Yeah, there are small pieces. But generally, the PE questions are best suited to a procedural or functional approach.

user114359

4:56 PM

No doubt. The core algorithm is one-off, but the "need to iterate primes" or "need to factorize numbers" is reusable, but certainly does not use OOP concepts. I have static methods I am using because an object doesn't make sense for most of that.

user114359

pretty much any reusable object I would create for PE implements java.util.Collection, meaning it is already written.

Thomas Owens

Different languages have different object-oriented capabilities. For example, JavaScript and Java and C# have different capabilities. A set of problems around those object-oriented capabilities would be nice.

Although, maybe that problem set doesn't exist. Maybe there is no good universal set of problems that are well-suited to the object-oriented paradigm.

André

Well, every language does have it's capabilities, that are suited better or worse for different problems. I'm sure doing PE in pascal would be pretty "easier" than Java

Thomas Owens

I wonder if there's another side. Every language probably has some mechanism for reusable components.

André

Well, bad choice of languages, but I hope you understand :-)

jt000

5:09 PM

Hey y'alls. I have a legacy server that spits out custom binary representing a complex UI. I am planning on writing a client-side JS library to render it that will be used by multiple 3rd parties (somewhat like a PDF viewer). I'm thinking the client-side JS library will generate SVG, but there's also the option of WebGL (not widely supported) or generating html DOM elements (difficult to get pixel-perfect positioning). Thoughts? Alternate options?

user114359

@jt000 How do you convert SVG to a usable, interactable GUI?

user114359

Adding an extra middleman does not make sense to me, at least based on what I know so far.

jt000

Aren't there click handlers in SVG?

...or rather don't the html click handlers work on svg elements?

boogdesign.com/examples/svg/load-svg.html

user114359

@jt000 Looks like it. I didn't dig into the SVG but it appears JS is adding handlers to SVG objects. I didn't know that about SVG, I don't do much web development. Interesting.

jt000

I personally haven't used it much either & have heard that the performance is pretty poor with a lot of objects

The old renderer we have is built using a server-side HtmlWriter in .NET and a ASP.NET control hosting an iFrame. The goal is to move both of the components to client-side.

user55340

5:25 PM

@Snowman points -= score(0.3f, comment, "programmers.se/help"); // maybe this?

user114359

@MichaelT I don't know, but what would that match? That is not part of the URL or the links we typically post, is it?

user55340

		points -= score(0.3f, comment, "please stop using programmers.se as your toilet bowl");
		points -= score(0.3f, comment, "what goes on programmers.se? A guide for stack overflow");

user55340

I suspect its looking at the raw text of the comment - not processing the markdown.

user55340

	public static float calcInterestingLevelProgrammers(StackExchangeComment comment) {
		float matchPattern = bodyContainsProgrammersLink(comment.getBody()) ? 1.0f : 0f;
		return matchPattern + calcInterestingLevelProgrammers(comment.getBodyMarkdown());
	}

user55340

so it contains the link, and ... oh, it does process markdown.

user114359

5:28 PM

Ah, so that second one will grab the name of the meta post.

user114359

Doesn't bother me if Duga repeats my own stuff, I am more interested in filtering out the links we commonly post. I feel like it was doing that previously.

user55340

> An SQL query goes into a bar, walks up to tables and asks...
"Can I join you?"

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT bad programmer!

user114359

@JimmyHoffa There you are! Did you see this?

user114359

3

Q: What makes functional programming languages declarative as opposed to Imperative?

On many articles, describing the benefits of functional programming, I have seen functional programming languages, such as Haskell, ML, Scala or Clojure, referred to as "declarative languages" distinct from imperative languages such as C/C++/C#/Java. My question is what makes functional programmi...

functional-programming imperative-programming declarative-programming imperative-languages declarative

user114359

5:32 PM

I figured the asker could use some functional information straight from the fire hose.

Jimmy Hoffa

@Snowman nope, I'll give it a look when I have some time - but the wall of text will take some time

The reason I asked this question is that a lot of people try to promote functional programming as some new distinct paradigm completely separated from the paradigms of C/C++/C#/Java or even Python when in reality functional programming is just another higher level form of imperative programming. — ALXGTV 8 hours ago

^-- me thinks he wants to win the argument online that he's been losing with someone else

ergo wall of text as opposed to simple clear question

seeking vindication does not a good question make

user114359

"Wall of Text" should have been a MegaMan boss. No matter what weapon you use it just bounces off him as he slowly crushes you against a wall.

user55340

@Snowman Wall of Flesh is in Terraria.

user114359

The only way to win is not to play.

user114359

Nah, not the same. I am thinking literally a wall made of words that crushes your poor little blue MegaMan.

user114359

5:38 PM

@ThomasOwens or any other mod around? The comments could use some cleanup:

user114359

-4

Q: algorithm to pick N objects from each location in an array

I want to find the maximum amount of times I would need to pick an item at random from an array to have N of each item. I need to pick one item at a time from the array at random, so that at the end I have N of each item. If it's not possible to do so I must do so I must print -1. I have set up...

algorithms

Thomas Owens

5:51 PM

Better?

user114359

@ThomasOwens Yes. I think it is still unclear but at least this guy is willing to work with us.

Duga

6:04 PM

This might be better asked at programmers.stackexchange.com since it's not a specific code issue — Sami Kuhmonen 5 secs ago

@SamiKuhmonen - This question is a poor fit for Programmers. It would quickly be closed and likely down voted. The question is far too broad to work well over on Programmers. — GlenH7 40 secs ago

Jerry Murphy

HI, I am trying to complete one of the challenges in the may 10 day challenge on codechef. The site says it is ok to get help from anywhere as long as you dont copy and paste code as the idea is to learn. This is the link to the challenge :codechef.com/MAY15/problems/CHEFRP. I wanted to reword the required algorithm the best way I could but have failed miserably it seems!

The question was asked at programmers.stackexchange.com

Jimmy Hoffa

0

A: What makes functional programming languages declarative as opposed to Imperative?

The real defining characteristic that separates declarative from imperative programming is in declarative style you are not giving sequenced instructions; at the lower level yes the CPU operates this way, but that's a concern of the compiler. You suggest CSS is a "declarative language", I wouldn...

Not well structured or thought through, but hopefully clear

user55340

@JerryMurphy So... whats the design that you've come up with to solve the code chef problem?

Jimmy Hoffa

Will edit it to give it organization of thoughts..maybe... when I have time or motivation to be more concise and convincing

:21657828 then you eat them! nom nom nom!

Jerry Murphy

haha

user55340

6:16 PM

Are you having trouble understanding the code chef problem? Coming up with a solution? Getting it to run in a reasonable time on their server?

Jerry Murphy

"She, being lazy, wants to know the maximum number of times she would need to pick items from the box in the worst case" This is the part Im struggling with, how do I know the worst case?

user114359

@JerryMurphy imagine making the worst possible choice each time you make a choice. How bad could it be?

user55340

> Input:
2 - T (number of test cases)
2 - N (number of ingredients in test case 1)
2 2 - (A1 = 2, A2 = 2)
1 - N (number of ingredients in test case 2)
6 - (A1 = 6)

Output:
4
2

user55340

Work through that one by hand.

user55340

I'm going to point out that at the core of this is a math problem rather than a problem dealing with arrays and such.

Jerry Murphy

6:30 PM

If I understand it correctly the worst case would be to pick all the extra ingredients (over 2) and then finally picking 2 of each on the last try.

Then how would I know if was impossible? I thought it was if she tried to pick an item but there was none left but that can't be right

user41796

@JerryMurphy What if there's only 1 of the ingredient?

André

I have a question, too board and "opinion based", not fit for programmers. I have to generate a report, I end up crunching too much data (too many queries, for one row, it end up being 15-25) and end up being slow. My requirement is "we want a faster report". Does anyone have tackled this issue? Any experience with this kind of situation?

user55340

@André Where is the data stored? And if you say access... run away screaming.

Jerry Murphy

@GlenH7 Thanks, its seems so obvious now lol

André

@MichaelT, AHHHH, one MySQL instance

user41796

6:34 PM

YW. FWIW, I think the puzzle is poorly phrased which makes it harder to understand.

user55340

Are the queries the slow part? or the crunching of the data?

user114359

@André Reports are generally poorly written because either non-technical people write them, or the job falls to junior developers who don't have the experience to know how to do it right

André

Crunching data, most of the queries are context based, if this user is X then query for Y and if Y is W then display A

user114359

@André Run away and cry.

André

yep, that was my initial conclusion

user114359

6:38 PM

Actually, are the conditionals in the report itself? I.e. run query X or Y, or is it in the query? CASE WHEN X THEN ELSE Y END CASE

user114359

What I want to know is, are the queries themselves simple select from X inner join Y where... or is there a lot of tomfoolery going on?

user55340

Does this need to be real time? How long does it take to run a query? Can you run it every five minutes and show the most recent one?

André

Sadly, this is one of the main features of the system, needs to be real time. @Snowman, simple queries, maybe bunch of joins, a few counts here and there

user55340

Make sure you check the query plans... just to make sure you are running things as fast as can be.

André

@MichaelT, checked :-)

user55340

6:40 PM

There are situations were the right index can drastically help speed up the query.

user114359

Yeah, the problem might be in the application code, not the DB

user55340

(had a query that was made 50% faster with an index...)

user55340

When its "display A" - what is this display in? There are report generating tools that typically do a better job than a human... are they options?

user114359

Whelp, my day is done. You can tell I am a government worker because I finished work at 2:30 PM. I make bankers jealous.

André

@MichaelT, the idea of "caching" periodically seems plausible, I might escalate that idea

user55340

6:42 PM

What is the current performance... and desired performance?

André

15s seconds, desired is 1 or 2s

user114359

that is unreasonable for a report. Filling the data and generating UI elements alone takes more time than that.

user55340

Thats a lot of performance to try to pull out of thin air.

André

It's just a field actually, needs to return a boolean, if the associate can register this year or there is missing any data of it's records

so there is lot's of IF then, each if spawns a query or two

user55340

First question... is the query itself running in 1 to 2 seconds?

user55340

6:45 PM

If it isn't, then no matter how much you push on the other side, it won't go faster.

André

nods

Well, that's what I thought, maybe I was hoping for some other idea, to avoid all this constant query madness

user114359

Reports tend to be query and data hogs by their very nature

André

I can't bake a cake without flour I suppose

user55340

Next step would be to profile on the application side. What language is this in?

André

Java

Will plug VisualVM and take a look at it

user55340

6:49 PM

Every IDE I've used so far has a good profiler.

user55340

Eclipse?

André

Yep

user55340

Just was doing profiling of REST requests yesterday...

user55340

Within Eclipse there's: eclipse.org/tptp/home/documents/tutorials/profilingtool/…

user114359

@André Hah, I just installed VisualVM today because Java Monitor wouldn't give me anything useful

user114359

6:50 PM

I thought tptp was abandoned

user55340

@Snowman Hmm... looks that way.

user55340

> TPTP 4.7.2 has been released! Posted Feb 25, 2011 | Permalink
The TPTP 4.7.2 release is now available. This release contains defect fixes not available in TPTP 4.7.1. Check out what's new and noteworthy, take a quick tour, and download it!

user114359

Doesn't work with Eclipse 4.x from what I remember

user55340

I think I was using JVM Monitor: marketplace.eclipse.org/content/jvm-monitor

André

@MichaelT, VisualVM is pretty okay, used to scrub some memory leak

user114359

6:52 PM

@MichaelT I installed that today. My theory is it does not handle Java 8 very well. I couldn't get any useful CPU monitoring, only memory.

user55340

Its ok... just nice to do within eclipse... don't recall if VisualVM allows you to do instrumented byte code method profiling.

user55340

I'd also say check out netbeans... for free, it has a rather reasonable profiler compared to fighting with Eclipse.

user55340

profiler.netbeans.org

André

oh yeah, their builtin profiler is neat

user55340

It was the feature I learned to appreciate with netbeans at Employer^ (a netbeans shop)

user114359

6:54 PM

@MichaelT this all started when I "finished" Euler 23 this morning. 4.3 minutes later, I got the wrong answer. So I decided to profile.

André

I just finished Euler 1 haha

user114359

I have skipped around a little bit but that is where I am at now. I have solved 1-22 plus a couple others.

user114359

I took a break from 23 to shore up some of my algorithms. I just saved a text file with the first 2,000,000 prime numbers so no more Sieve of E... whatever.

user114359

Now I am working on prime (and non-prime) factorization.

André

I have a feeling I will end up implementing naive solutions everywhere, math is not my forte

user114359

6:56 PM

Algorithms are easy, but making them efficient and reusable is a little trickier especially when The Whiteboard keeps distracting me

2

user55340

André

@Snowman, distracting like this?

Nice @MichaelT

user114359

7:24 PM

Anyone know what this guy is talking about? How can a number N have any factor greater than sqrt(N) other than itself?

user114359

1

A: Generating all factors of a number given its prime factorization

dimo414, generating factors is generally considered a very difficult task. In fact, the protection of most of your important assets (i.e. money, info., etc.), rest on the simple, yet extremely difficult task of factoring a number. See this article on the RSA encryption scheme http://en.wikipedia....

user114359

> Many people jump to this conclusion because of the very similar concept associated with generating primes. Unfortunately, this is incorrect, as you will miss several factors greater than the sqrt(n) that aren't prime numbers (I'll let you prove this to yourself).

user114359

Ah, nevermind, they are talking about non-prime factors.

user114359

8:30 PM

Is there anybody... out there?