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user20683
12:53 AM
@GlenH7 Today I encountered an epically bad web app
 
user20683
every single time a new item was added to a list it had to retrieve and update the entire database
 
user20683
and all edits were global
 
1:10 AM
@WorldEngineer guess someone quickly assembled a prototype for demo then top management decided to release it as is. "Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it and let them flee like the dogs they are!"
Well I run an experiment, flagged it NAA and got decline: "a moderator reviewed your flag, but found no evidence to support it". Wonder how hard is to not find evidence when post has comment referring to guidance from community moderator stating "let me be clear: this sort of response is not an answer. If you see this, flag it. Moderators, if you see it flagged, delete it" — gnat 2 hours ago
^^^ these SO mods are sometimes sooo funny. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that one day this declined flag will be wiped from my flagging history... yet again
7
Q: My "not an answer" flag is gone and not showing in my history

gnatSome time ago I flagged this as not-an-answer. For a while, link to this flagged answer has been visible in my flagging history (flag was declined in case if that matters). As far as I remember it also has been counted among my other declined flags. Recently I discovered that link to answer is ...

 
 
12 hours later…
user41796
12:55 PM
automatic detection of cross-posts would be awesome. My fear is there aren't enough of them to justify the development time to check for them. If it cuts down on the help-vampires then that ought to help all of the sites, including the big 3.

In a similar vein, if someone is Q-banned at one site then they should have stronger quality measures applied against them before asking questions on a related site. For "related sites", I'm going to go with SE's grouping of technology, science, culture, etc...
 
user41796
1:20 PM
That's ***awesome***. And kind of reminds me of what we did with initial attempts at a web service where we shifted the analysis time scale from daily down to hourly. <snickers> Initial (internal!) demos didn't fare well. We chose not to ship it at that point. :-0

It also reminds me of one of the soccer sign-up sites that I had to use. IIRC, you **had** to use tab to navigate between fields. And if you clicked on another field and started typing, it automatically kicked you back to the very first field on the form. Given that there were 60+ fields on the form, that was one of the m
 
user55340
1:32 PM
@GlenH7 A different way to approach that would be "don't suggest sites where the OP is question banned for migration". Though that might get fussed about for leaking information.
 
user55340
(now I'm curious what would happen if a question was migrated with an answer from a user who was answer banned at the target site...)
 
user41796
1:45 PM
@MichaelT Chaos. Discord. Anarchy. Dissolution of social constructs.
 
user41796
I'm kind of proud that Programmers has one of the highest community deletion rates.
 
user55340
@GlenH7 I'm tempted to give SO a bit of a pass there in that they have so much (and even more of a history).
 
user55340
But Math? They're "only" 10x bigger than we are.
 
user55340
They also appear to have the runaway inclusionists (given by glancing at the reviews).
 
user41796
I dunno. With the number of SO users past 35k (which is full # of delete votes), you'd think they would have a higher delete rate.
 
user55340
1:50 PM
active users - compared to how much they get a day?
 
user41796
True
 
user41796
I just want to pat us on the back more. :-)
 
user41796
You made a really good reference to that in your response to the MMSE whinging about "save us from our vigilante!"
 
2:04 PM
@GlenH7 in discussion of similar feature, it turned out that dev time for this could be lower than we expected:
There is a check to see if a duplicate exists on a destination site which rejects a migration if so, but ... I am not promising anything here beyond that I'll look into it. — Tim Post ♦ May 16 at 13:54
 
user41796
It would cut down on some of the more annoying noise, so it's worth asking
 
FWIF for question bans / limits situation is pretty similar: technical means seem to be there already (migrations are blocked), these only are applied at different phase of question lifecycle
 
user41796
A lot of the vampires just go from dumping ground to dumping ground trying to get their work done for them. They don't create any value for us or SE, so why not make their lives harder?
 
hi I have a SuperStore type in app. Only 3 instances. Using spring. Need currentSuperStore to be web session level, but want to cache the 3 stores, so singleton. I guess should use 2 beans? 2 classes too? Any suggestion for names? have SuperStoreFacade , SuperStoreService and SuperStoreDao now with methods like getSuerStoreById, getCrrentSuperStore, getAll
 
2:20 PM
With regards to the names. Unless you're writing your code in cement any of those would be just fine.
Damn you MainMa! Changing your comments and making my subsequent comments look completely insane!
 
user41796
@MetaFight She's really good like that.
 
I've noticed.
 
user41796
There's a reason why she has the amount of rep that she does
 
user41796
Today's dilemma is figuring out what cabinets I want for the basement before the sale expires today. 1WP FTW. :-)
 
user41796
And whether I want to build the wine rack that will span over the sink or if I want to buy it instead. I'm leaning towards build.
 
2:35 PM
0
Q: Perform automatic checks for cross-posting and question ban at SO when post enters close queue, not only at attempt to migrate

gnatSuggest to perform automatic checks for cross-posting and question ban at SO when post enters close queue, not only when it is attempted to migrate. If check detects a problem, system would raise automatic flag for moderator attention. I expect preemptive checks to help us more efficiently addre...

^^^ there we go
I plan to dupe-close two of my meta.PSE questions listed in "related section
 
@GlenH7 I'm not sure I follow. Are you suggesting she posts shitty answers and then continually edits them based on the comments she receives?
 
@MetaFight as far as I know MainMa is he, their user page refers their profile at SO Careers, with name, photo and such
 
ah, yes.
 
user55340
Now, I realize that we've got a high close rate... but math.stackexchange.com/… vs programmers.stackexchange.com/… just confuses me.
 
user55340
@gnat that was my last close vote.
 
@MichaelT I still have 1
 
user55340
@gnat if we delete those... I can start flagging with "blame grace note" in the flag text..
 
"refund" would likely make it 3-4 today...
9
Q: Refund close votes for questions deleted on the same day

MichaelTWhen a question is deleted the same vote-day as it was closed, refund the close votes cast on the question. There are three situations where this comes up: Question has a close vote or two, a comment tells the OP that this is off topic (or about issues with the question) and the OP self delete...

 
user55340
> I'm out of close votes. This is an implementation issue. Please close it quickly (possibly migrate it - or try (I bet the OP is question banned at SO), but its still crap). If you need to blame anyone for this flag - blame Grace Note - ;-). – MichaelT 19 hours ago helpful
 
2:49 PM
@MichaelT ah so that's what that means, I finally got it (couldn't figure back then when I read it over at meta)
 
user55340
There... with the link.
 
@MichaelT "I bet banned" - I just submitted feature request to save us from bets like that:
0
Q: Perform automatic checks for cross-posting and question ban at SO when post enters close queue, not only at attempt to migrate

gnatSuggest to perform automatic checks for cross-posting and question ban at SO when post enters close queue, not only when it is attempted to migrate. If check detects a problem, system would raise automatic flag for moderator attention. I expect preemptive checks to help us more efficiently addre...

 
user41796
@MetaFight No, most (all?) of MainMa's answers are really good.
 
user41796
@gnat This is what you get when you assume....
 
user41796
@gnat - do you have the link to MainMa's career profile? I'd be curious to read it over. My understand is MainMa was an attorney in a previous life, and I wanted to see what else they have done.
 
3:08 PM
@GlenH7 it's easy to find, just look into about me section in regular user page :) meta.programmers.stackexchange.com/users/6605/mainma
> Hire me? You may be interested in my profile on my company website, as well as my profile on Careers.
 
user41796
^^^^ Color me shamed. :-)
 
@GlenH7 no reason to. :) It's just I once looked into their user page and remembered that it's unusually fairly detailed
I'm not asking for career advice... I'm looking for some direction pertaining to websites centered around programmers and the community of programmers... i dont understand how this has no lasting value for the programming community... — user138392 1 min ago
^^^ oh sancta simplisitas
 
thanks meta
 
user41796
@gnat Pretty impressive resume. Native tongue is Russian, and his French is far better than mine. I couldn't find any mention of his previous work as an attorney, so I wonder if I had just imagined / misread that.
 
user20683
@GlenH7 I suspect imagined. It's highly unusual to find someone that young working as a full attorney but I know zilch about the Russian or French legal systems
 
user20683
3:20 PM
I guess he could have gone to law school and then been like software dev time but then he'd only have like 3 years of pro experience and it seems like he has loads more than that
 
user55340
Btw, @WorldEngineer we're running out of close votes here so you might need to do the evil mod thing for the rest of the day.
 
user41796
That's the conclusion I'm coming to as well. I thought he had said something about switching careers at some point. But the timeline doesn't support that
 
user41796
@MichaelT And he can claim he was trying to learn Haskell.
 
user20683
@MichaelT Just let there be a constellation of flags like a really fucked up United Nations
 
user55340
@GlenH7 Yannis did an epic ~20 delete vote spree the other day.
 
user55340
3:22 PM
I lost 25 points in that one... but I can't complain too much (10k link)
 
user41796
@MichaelT Did I mention I'm proud our site has the highest rate of 10k deletions for SE? :-)
 
user55340
Btw, I'd like to point out that we hold few things sacred when it comes to deleting things... even Shog9 is not safe.
 
@MichaelT if we want this to look less of the "evil mod" thing, it's worth commenting close-worthy questions to highlight issues, and voting them down
 
user41796
@MichaelT Those were the NPR days...
 
...oh I see you're already doing this...
@user138392 that happens to be the reason that was picked. This question also falls into the 'what project to do next' and 'recommend an off site resource', and possibly a duplicate of Getting involved with an Open Source Project. — MichaelT 14 mins ago
@MichaelT if you wonder where recent meta comment comes from, it's from here:
@gnat I commented in your link. — juanpastas 1 min ago
 
user55340
3:30 PM
@gnat working on a response there.
 
user55340
@juanpastas opinions do matter, but the site is poorly designed for having an opinion poll or discussion. Its specifically designed for questions that have specific answers or solutions. The site can't do everything ideally for all types of questions and so we try to focus on just those it can do Really Well. There is a bit more about this in On discussions and why they don't make good questions. — MichaelT 6 secs ago
 
 
1 hour later…
user55340
4:48 PM
@juanpastas: "stack exchange sites are a good place to do so" – No, they are absolutely terrible for that. There is no way to have a discussion about opinions on SE. You are looking for a discussion platform, not a Question/Answer platform. There are many of those, SE is not one of them. — Jörg W Mittag 2 mins ago
 
user55340
its nice to know that there are non-whiteboard people who read meta and feel the same way. Not that I doubted it before... but its just nice to have that confirmation.
 
how much data is too much data to store on the client?
is an array with about 3000 elements too much?
 
user55340
@Shahar it might be... it might not be. Its a question of is it worth it to have it on the client or going and fetching it from the server when you need it.
 
user20683
@Shahar depends on the situation
 
user20683
an array of 3000 pixels is pretty small potatoes
 
5:19 PM
When you say "small potatoes" you mean it's nothing?
It's like a Google Drive kind of thing
And people can upload entire folders with hundreds of files in them
So it's actually an array of strings/id's
 
user20683
small potatoes means of little concern, it's not nothing but it's close
 
user20683
but again it all depends
 
I'm already requiring the person to have HTML5/javascript hence I assume clients have an "advanced" computer/device
 
user55340
5:59 PM
@YannisRizos I haven't voted on the svg question... though its tempting. The original question is identical to one asked on Stack Overflow (and closed as a resource request). It would be better to close this one (quickly) and make the changes that you did to the Stack Overflow instance of it to see if that can get reopened.
 
user55340
The remaining core question is one of pure speculation though:
 
user55340
> Why doesn't Mono have a way to display an svg image? Am I missing something?
 
@MichaelT I don't mind the close votes.
 
user55340
@YannisRizos Its got 3 now... none of which are migration votes... so its not going to get bounced back to SO... though the "it got closed on SO, lets try asking on P.SE" is... disappointing.
 
In other news:
 
user55340
6:05 PM
Btw, @YannisRizos did you happen to glance at the Math Meta Drama thats spilled over into Meta.SE?
 
I read your answer on MSE, but didn't really look at Meta Math.
 
user55340
yesterday, by MichaelT
@gnat Its an interesting bit... appears to stem from some refusal of 10k users on Math.SE to delete crap... and someone going through and down voting questions with one up vote to a crap question.
 
user55340
There are some bits further down that are interesting reading over there.
 
6:17 PM
Heh, was about to ping the SoftRecs mods for the mono svg q, but @WorldEngineer already pinged them. Always nice when someone else does the work for you.
 
user20683
@YannisRizos It has a ludicrous amount of research behind it, it's the 10% so to speak.
 
user55340
6:43 PM
Yes!
 
user55340
@MichaelT thanks for your link very illustrative, now I understand more, not all people takes the time to explain it in a concise way as you did. — juanpastas 18 mins ago
 
user55340
@YannisRizos It really needs a "A Group..." meta answer permanently featured there.
 
user55340
13
Q: How can moderators prevent an 'in-crowd' forming?

Tom MedleyAs sites age and grow, it is inevitable that groups of older, more experienced users will tend to hang together and support each other. This is great, but it can go too far, to the extent that the community of the site can become impenetrable to new users who can be looked down on by older user...

 
user55340
You don't. It will happen.
 
user20683
No idea. I deliberately avoided Moderators. I can only see it ending badly.
 
user55340
6:48 PM
@WorldEngineer I'm just glancing. Its... intriguing... seeing people trying to fight against things that seem to be spelled out as "you have to accept these things"
 
user55340
@WorldEngineer I'm half tempted (no... not even that... just amused at the thought of) posting programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/136210 on Mod.SE.
 
startups.stackexchange.com was launched recently
 
user55340
@Shahar ... again?
 
Yeah Startup Business was closed
after 1176 days in beta lol
 
7:16 PM
The original OnStartups wasn't really beta, it was one of the SE1 sites that at some point moved to SE2.
 
I feel like there are so many other SE sites that will have the same fate
 
user20683
@Shahar There are many reasons why sites fail. Insufficient scope, wrong audience, bad marketing, subject is poorly adapted to objective short answers, etc
 
Bicycles is an official SE?
What requirements must a website meet in order to be one of those?
 
user20683
7:39 PM
@Shahar Be proposed on Area 51, get commits and then launch. The graduation requirements are more complex and ambiguous.
 
Jesus
if Bicycle is an official SE
In a couple of years we'll see an official elephant semen collecting SE >_<
 
user20683
@Shahar Duplicate of Pets
 
user20683
sorta
 
user20683
we don't have a Livestock SE
 
It will happen
I'll propose it on Area51 one day
 
 
4 hours later…
user55340
11:38 PM
@Shahar Bicycles have a very significant aspect of mechanical repair - much akin to DIY, just on a different thing. I will not be surprised when mechanics.stackexchange.com graduates some day.
 
user15026
@WorldEngineer Pets takes some livestock stuff, kinda
 
user15026
Their rulings on it are strange and varied
 
user55340
... and whats Pets doesn't, Gaming does.
 
user15026
@MichaelT Shush, you ;)
 
user55340
88
Q: What is the terminal velocity of a sheep?

FlauntingI am thinking of an alternative timing mechanism; I am building a trap and I wanted to try something different to set it off. I want to drop a sheep from n blocks high so that I have a delay before the trap is triggered. The timing needs to be very exact, but I don't know how the falling mechani...

 
user15026
11:41 PM
Hm. Chocolate milk stout, or blueberry mead?
 
user15026
@MichaelT Ah, yes, this one.
 
user55340
15
Q: Is there a substantial difference between a pet cat and a pet dog?

murgatroid99In Nethack, several roles by default start with a kitten or a small dog, chosen at random. They seem to be very similar: both have similar growth cycles and behaviors. Is there any substantial difference between them that is relevant to the gameplay? Do they behave differently, for example?

 
user15026
Hey! You are just reusing the questions from when we discussed this the other day! ;)
 
user55340
Ok...
 
user55340
8
Q: Advice on dealing with pets

espaisTwo part question, though both related - What is the best method of keeping my pet "happy" For this, I mean, how do I keep my pet from wandering off and either becoming feral or getting killed somewhere off in the distance? In the early game, my character generally doesn't come across tripe ...

 
user55340
11:42 PM
I bet that was migrated away from Pets.SE as too broad?
 
user55340
;-)
 
user55340
This one was a o_O when it hit hot questions...
 
user55340
37
Q: How can I kill puppies without consequences?

DoorknobThe starting pets can sometimes get quite annoying, since they keep getting in your way. Those little dogs keep blocking my path! Therefore, I quite reasonably want to slaughter them brutally. But of course I want to do this safely. I've noticed that whenever I kill my pet, I "hear the rumble of...

 
@MichaelT Knew it was arqade before I even looked at the site icon.
 
user15026
@MichaelT Oh, I remember that one.
 
11:47 PM
Another new Programmers user bites the dust. programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/252173
Oh, those Programmers meanies. Can't even help a new guy out choosing a programming language.
 
user55340
Good thing I noticed I'm on the SX.Gaming site. I was like WTH for a moment... :) — CodeAngry Mar 8 at 12:05
 
user15026
@MichaelT That formatting.
 
user20683
@RobertHarvey I have a simple algorithm for that:
 
user20683
1. Pick a programming language
 
user20683
2. if programming language is used at work, use programming language
 
user20683
11:56 PM
3. else if programming language is useful use programming language
 
user20683
4. if programming language is not useful, goto 1
 

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