The Frying Pan

3:00 AM

And I roast a good turkey breast.

Turkey is an unbelievably good value most of the time.

By the way, I read that turkey used to be the standard thing to eat on Christmas Eve in England, but then it became too popular, and now the avant-garde have goose instead!

Turkey is often cheaper than chicken, isn't it?

SAJ14SAJ

I think goose is actually the throwback.

Here, yes.

Cerberus

In what sense?

SAJ14SAJ

I can often get turkey breasts (that is, the whole breast, on the bone) for about $1/lb

Cerberus

Hmm.

SAJ14SAJ

3:02 AM

Goose was traditional in England long before turkey was even an idea.

Cerberus

Let me see what Albert Heijn (Ahold) charges...

SAJ14SAJ

Its frozen, and maybe injected with brine, :-( but when I am in my poor times... plus I love turkey. With mashed potatoes. Or evidently, in ramen.

Cerberus

Hmm they only sell turkey filet, and it's € 11,58/kg!

SAJ14SAJ

What the bleep is a turkey filet?

Cerberus

That's five times as expensive as yours, but without bones.

SAJ14SAJ

3:04 AM

And what part of a turkey is worth $7/lb more or less I guess?

Cerberus

Breast, I think?

Or what do you call it?

SAJ14SAJ

We would never refer to a cut of turkey as a filet.

But I understand the brits don't cut them the same way we usually do.

Cerberus

SAJ14SAJ

I get nothing from that link.

Cerberus

It's a plastic thingy with some turkey cut in it.

SAJ14SAJ

3:06 AM

Ah, it downloaded instead of showing in the browser.

That looks like a pounded section of turkey breast. We would call it a cutlet.

Cerberus

Ah.

SAJ14SAJ

That is about the most expensive turkey thing you could buy.

But still, $7/lb! OUCH.

Cerberus

Ah. What would it cost for you?

SAJ14SAJ

Right now on my delivery service--backed by Giant owned by ahold--I can buy a WHOLE kosher turkey, for about 3.29 /lb. That is an expensive turkey.

The cheapest whole turkey is $1.49 / lb.

Cerberus

Hmm that sounds very cheap.

How much does a whole turkey weigh?

SAJ14SAJ

3:09 AM

Cutlets are $6/ lb. I would never buy them though.

Cerberus

Ah OK.

So not much cheaper.

SAJ14SAJ

If I went to my dutch market (not like you dutch, PA dutch), I could get higher quality poultry at lower prices.

AT least lower than the high end prices.

But they don't deliver.

Cerberus

Yeah, markets are cheap.

A whole turkey costs € 11/kg from a real butcher.

For a turkey of 3 kg, that's the price I found.

SAJ14SAJ

You can see why I tend to by whole turkeys.

I also know how to cut them up myself, so I save money that way.

Not that that is my usual priority.

3 kg turkey?

Turkeys should weigh about 5 kg, at least.

What about pork tenderloin?

Running about $6/lb here right now.

Cerberus

Ehh I never buy pork except bacon. I don't really know what the names of all the cuts mean, not even in Dutch.

SAJ14SAJ

3:13 AM

But remember--my online delivery source is one of the most expensive ways to shop. I do it because I don't drive much, and love convenience.

Ah.

Cerberus

Understandable.

Oh, I also like pork sausages.

And (smoked) ham!

SAJ14SAJ

Pigs are generally deliicous. Sausage is wonderful.

The Dutch market makes amazingly good sausage.

Cerberus

But not an actual cut piece of pork, it's just not my thing.

SAJ14SAJ

There is so much variance in what ham is that it would be hard to compare.

Cerberus

Yay!

SAJ14SAJ

3:14 AM

Every holiday season, we get a spate of articles describing the different types of ham available here.

Cerberus

You think kotelet = cutlet?

SAJ14SAJ

So what do three-headed dogs eat?

Cerberus

I think kotelet is a common cut of pork.

SAJ14SAJ

I think it is likely a cognate, yes.

But we are often mislead by false cognates.

Cerberus

Yeah.

SAJ14SAJ

3:15 AM

It probably means "prissy thin thing" in latin or something.

Cerberus

Or true cognates that have acquired different meanings.

Heh.

SAJ14SAJ

That too.

Or in english, we adopt two different cognates at different times and give them different meanings.

Cerberus

Well, kotelet means nothing in Dutch, while cutlet makes sense in English?

SAJ14SAJ

cutlet makes perfect sense.

It is a cut of meat, typically pounded thin, suitable for very rapid cooking by sauteeing.

Cerberus

Right.

SAJ14SAJ

3:16 AM

Usually refers to veal or pork, but makes sense for other meats.

Very rarely used to refer to beef.

Cerberus

Do you have something like carbonade? That is a kind of pork cut here.

SAJ14SAJ

The basis, for example, of the famous German dish wienershcnitzel (sp?) which basically is breaded fried cutlets.

I have no idea what carbonade means in terms of pork, sorry.

Cerberus

Schnitzel, I think.

SAJ14SAJ

You know the Germans love their compounds.

Cerberus

I think you're more of a sarcophile than I am.

SAJ14SAJ

3:18 AM

I am pretty sure weinersnhnitzel means pork cutlet :-)

sacrophile?

Cerberus

Sarco, not sacro!

Sarco-phagus = flesh-eating.

SAJ14SAJ

But sacrofile is a real word! I just googled it!

And it fits :-)

Cerberus

Perhaps I should call you a sarcophage.

SAJ14SAJ

I like low temperatures, and hate hot weather.

I refer to my self as a carnitarian.

By analogy to vegetarian :-)

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ Hah, not in my dictionary.

SAJ14SAJ

3:20 AM

From some university website: There are also sacrophile, thermophiles, acidophiles, alkaliphiles, and many more. A mesophile is ... A sacrophile fluorishes in low temperature environments.

Cerberus

You know I cannot use hybrid words unless they have become so normal as to have become unavoidable...

SAJ14SAJ

Hybrid words?

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ My dictionary doesn't know it...

SAJ14SAJ

I am sure it is a technical word in a fairly narrow field.

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ A word created out of parts that are not "supposed" to be attached like that.

SAJ14SAJ

3:21 AM

I like to do that. Did you see the answer where I slipped in the word "breadophilic" :-)

Cerberus

By Hades!

SAJ14SAJ

Styx!!

Cerberus

I wonder what they based this sacro- on.

SAJ14SAJ

Je ne sais.

Cerberus

And by the Styx too, yes.

SAJ14SAJ

3:23 AM

Who is watching the crossing while you are chatting? I imagine the souls are prancing right out.

Cerberus

Ehh I'm on my smartphone?

SAJ14SAJ

You chat on a smartphone? I would not try that, without a real keyboard.

Cerberus

With Swype, it's actually possible, though of course still far inferior.

SAJ14SAJ

And I am just not believing there is cell coverage in Hades. Lets be serious.

I don't know what Swype is.

Cerberus

Why not?

SAJ14SAJ

3:24 AM

I am kind of a cell phone luddite.

Cerberus

Cell towers don't just broadcast sideways, you know.

SAJ14SAJ

The dead have no need for cell service. How would the companies recoup their investment?

ACtually, they kind of do.

They are optimized for directionality.

Cerberus

Swype is a kind of software keyboard (an on-screen keyboard, if you will), where you type a word by drawing a line over the letters that you want, then lifting your finger.

SAJ14SAJ

But even if you assume they are ideal antenae, the cell frequencies don't penetrate through earth very far.

Cerberus

Have you never seen those small iron thingies in the road?

SAJ14SAJ

3:26 AM

Think about when you go through a tunnel.

I have no idea what you are talking about.

Cerberus

Those are our amplifiers.

A kind of antennae.

SAJ14SAJ

You cannot amplify a cell signal.

They are digital.

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ Maybe because they are invisible.

SAJ14SAJ

You might be able to repeat it.

Cerberus

Repeat, yes, that's what I meant.

SAJ14SAJ

3:27 AM

Well, you could amplify it, but it would just amplify the noise too.

Cerberus

Wouldn't that work?

SAJ14SAJ

No engineer would put a cell repeater in the road at surface level. That is just crazy talk.

Cerberus

Why not?

SAJ14SAJ

Really?

Cerberus

Our engineers are divine. Or infernal.

It's simple. You just drill a hole upwards until you meet air, then stick an antenna in it.

SAJ14SAJ

3:29 AM

They are dead, they are not up on their engineering skills.

Cerberus

Not the dead.

They can't touch things.

But our bestiarium.

SAJ14SAJ

The only evidence of creatures from hades we have is Larry, Moe and Curley.

But I suspect you are actually an asylum inmate with internet privilege:-)

Cerberus

How dare you!

growls

SAJ14SAJ

Hiss?

I am wathcing Amazing Grace reruns. There have been two GORGEOUS kitties in that episode.

Cerberus

But hey, it's soul-catching time. Wouldn't want to let ghosts escape to surface houses.

Is that a television series?

SAJ14SAJ

3:32 AM

They left. They know you like to chat in the US evening time.

Cerberus

Yo no lo so.

SAJ14SAJ

It was, it was incredibly good. So it was cancelled after three seasons :-(

Cerberus

Aww.

Time for a Kickstarter campaign.

SAJ14SAJ

I am not a fan of kickstarter.

Cerberus

No?

SAJ14SAJ

3:33 AM

Well, the idea is fine. But the gaming blogs have been taken over with "news" that are articles about ks announcements. I have no interest in games that I cannot play. I don't want to read about them until I can actually but and download them.

I would be happer if they just reviewed the games when they actually come out.

Cerberus

What if you could play them sooner by pre-ordering on Kickstarter?

@SAJ14SAJ They will.

SAJ14SAJ

Half the articles you read now, they are not even real games yet.

Pah.

There are so many obstacles, I don't believe ina game until it is actually available for release. And even then only after I read reviews.

Cerberus

I don't think I read that many articles about games, and I never buy games so soon after launch anyway. I usually wait a year or two, until they become cheaper.

SAJ14SAJ

I do that for some games. Skyrim is down to 50% of the original cost on steam.

Almost time to buy it.

Cerberus

Still far too expensive.

Did you like Oblivion?

SAJ14SAJ

3:35 AM

When it hits 1/3 the original price, I will probably buy it.

Cerberus

My goal is absolute, not relative.

SAJ14SAJ

I didn't like Oblivian very much--I loathed the level scaling. It took away the feeling of increasing power, which is one of the things I like about rpgs.

Cerberus

It should be € 15 or less for a game I really want to play.

SAJ14SAJ

Most of the games I but now are < $10. They are indies, it seems.

Cerberus

Yeah, well, I installed mods to counter that from the beginning. But I still didn't like the combat. I just don't enjoy aim-and-click.

SAJ14SAJ

3:37 AM

I haven't liked any RPG combat system after the turn based era ended.

Cerberus

Ended?

SAJ14SAJ

To me real time combat and RPG don't go well together.

Cerberus

It hasn't ended.

SAJ14SAJ

It has, in triple A games. Only indies seem to be turn based much any more.

Name a single main stream turn based RPG in the last three years or so...

Cerberus

Well, I think mêlée combat can be fun, if it is all about careful timing and button combinations. But few games have that. However, I always play as a mage, and magic is always point-and-click when it's real-time.

@SAJ14SAJ How about Final Fantasy games? Not that I have ever played any.

SAJ14SAJ

3:40 AM

I like mages too. But I am terrible at real time. I am the cannon fodder in PVP, so I don't do it. I am terrible at twitch games. I hated that Mass Effect when more twitch based. Not to mention they ruined the story, but I didn't but the 3rd one because it was basically an action game.

Cerberus

I really like Bioware's combat system: party based, real-time, but you give instructions while pausing the game. So it is more or less turn-based, you could say.

SAJ14SAJ

FF are strange.

@Cerberus Ah the golden age ones.

Like Baldur's gate.

Cerberus

Golden age?

Yes, like BG.

SAJ14SAJ

Golden age of computer RPGs.

Or Icewind dale.

Cerberus

Dragon Age 3 will come out this year.

SAJ14SAJ

3:40 AM

I loved those.

I won't buy DA3.

Cerberus

Have you played the DA series, that is, 1 and 2?

Why not?

SAJ14SAJ

DA1 was so horrible in its combat unfairness, and DA2 (from reviews) was worse.

Cerberus

How do you mean unfairness?

I like the combat in DA1. I am playing it now—that is, I have finished all but the last DLC.

SAJ14SAJ

The enemies were not there all along. Instead, you had to enter an area and then they spawned SURROUNDING you so you could never play cautiously and tactically, but were constantly being ambushed in situations no half way intelligent player would tolerate.

Cerberus

That happens occasionally, yes. But most of the time, you can see them from afar.

SAJ14SAJ

3:42 AM

I loathed that.

ARe you playing the same game I did?

Cerberus

It makes combat harder, but...why is it such a huge problem?

SAJ14SAJ

It was near constant, especially after the beginner stuff.

Because it reduces the value of smart play.

Cerberus

That is not my impression.

SAJ14SAJ

Well, I guess you are less sensitive to that aspect of it.

Cerberus

I think the most important boss battles are (nearly) all like that, yes, probably also because they start with a dialogue.

SAJ14SAJ

3:44 AM

I got to the point where I was roadblocked at every battle, and no amount of tactics could overcome overwhelming ambushes. So I just quit.

Cerberus

But most standard battles you can prepare for.

At what difficulty level?

SAJ14SAJ

There were a LOT of them that you would enter a room or area, and nothing would be there. Then you would walk in further--poof! Surrounded!

Its been years, bleep if I remember what difficulty level.

I typically play RPGs at their "normal" or "standard" level.

Cerberus

I was roadblocked once or twice, but I saw it as a challenge. I just had to consider my tactics really well, and pick some new spells. Then I would be able to win, after a couple of tries.

Hmm I play at nightmare, and I like combat to be hard.

SAJ14SAJ

I didn't give up easily. I think it was this battle where you crossed some stone bridges, and then a huge number of INVISIBLE mages that you could not pre-buff against would root your characters and then blast them to death that made me quit the game.

Cerberus

Perhaps that's the difference: if you don't like that, but rather like to advance the story instead of dying a couple of times, then that would be more annoying.

SAJ14SAJ

3:46 AM

I think you are more a masochist than I am.

Cerberus

Invisible mages?

I have never seen invisible mages. Oh, wait...

SAJ14SAJ

AS I recall. Its been years. I am an unreliable narrator.

Cerberus

Do you have any idea where that was?

SAJ14SAJ

There was a dragon somewhere nearby I think.

Cerberus

Was it on a mountain top?

SAJ14SAJ

3:47 AM

No, I have no idea. Years, I tell you, years. When did that game come out.

Probably.

Cerberus

OK.

There are ways to survive strong mages.

One or two might have been around some corner or something?

SAJ14SAJ

Remember, I played the golden age games. They were difficult, but you were never ambushed like that except in a couple of boss battles due to the dialog effect. and even then you could buff up.

I recall a big open area with no where to hide.

Cerberus

Hmm was it maybe the final battle, against the so-called arch-demon?

On the top of a tower in the city?

Probably not.

SAJ14SAJ

I don't think so, because I hadn't doe all four branches of the quests or whatever you were supposed to do.

Cerberus

OK.

SAJ14SAJ

3:50 AM

I rmember one battle was in an inn. You couldn't prepare, but it would start when you talked to some NPC. And again, surrounded. I HATE that.

Cerberus

Well, anyway, I agree that sometimes battles were frustrating, when you felt like there was nothing you could do. But there always was, eventually.

SAJ14SAJ

And you couldn't NOT talk to that PC because it was on the critical path.

Cerberus

Yeah, that is kind of annoying, in a small space.

But there are spells you can cast.

SAJ14SAJ

Well, I don't have the patience to find what the one optimal way is... especially if you didn't min-max your chars, and have perfect equipment. Which I never did.

YEah, yeah, yeah. you have a bigger RPG epeen than I do :-)

Cerberus

There is a spell that makes the blood boil of all enemies in an area, a kind of paralysis.

SAJ14SAJ

3:52 AM

I would never take blood magic, I am a good role player.

Cerberus

But blood magic is not evil! You have been indoctrinated by the templars!

SAJ14SAJ

I never do the evil campaigns.

Cerberus

Neither do I.

SAJ14SAJ

I think I ended up killing blood mage dude.

Cerberus

Aww.

SAJ14SAJ

3:53 AM

As I recall, he kind of forced you into it.

Cerberus

You...puritan!

SAJ14SAJ

I am not a complete relativist like you :-)

Cerberus

I didn't kill him. I used his ritual to save this kid from a desire demon.

Haha.

SAJ14SAJ

I am pretty sure there were other ways to save the kid.

Cerberus

I don't think so.

SAJ14SAJ

3:54 AM

Well... don't care.

Its been a long, long, long time since there was a major RPG that really pressed my buttons in a good way.

Cerberus

At any rate, I hate it when combat is so easy that you never have to rethink your tactics and reload.

SAJ14SAJ

You should play Gratuitous Space Battles. Ithink you would like it.

Cerberus

I think smaller turn-based RPGs appear on a regular basis?

Quoi?

SAJ14SAJ

Indies, sure. Abadon wasn't too bad.

positech.co.uk/gratuitousspacebattles

Cthulhue saved the world, I am playing now. It s fun.

I never liked most of the Spiderweb ones--that underground world just didn't appeal to me.

My very favorite genre is the SRPG... but good ones are very, very rare.

The DS was a haven for turn based RPGs. Like Etrian Odessy.

Cerberus

That's a lot of spaceships.

I don't like dungeons either.

SRPG?

SAJ14SAJ

3:59 AM

Strategy RPG. The best known of the lot is probably Disgaea from the PS2.

Cerberus

Never heard of any of those.

And I'm not going to buy a second computer to play games on!

SAJ14SAJ

??

I use the same computer for games and work.

Cerberus

Especially not a crippled one that can only play games.

Playstation...

SAJ14SAJ

If you can play DA, you can play almost anything RPGish.

Oh, well... I take your point.

I won't be buying the next gen consoles. I think the best of gaming has come back to the PC.

Cerberus

I wonder why consoles still exist.

I hope Nvidia's "Shield" and Steam's "Steambox" will destroy consoles.

Where you can stream games from your PC to your television.

SAJ14SAJ

4:02 AM

Hard to say. But since you are a baby, you don't remember the beginning of the console era. They were THE way to play for some of us. I had an Intellivision as a child!

I have no doubt that those two will not make a dent.

Cerberus

Whatever that is!

SAJ14SAJ

Same era as an Atari 2600, but better :-)

Cerberus

They could be the beginning.

SAJ14SAJ

The iPhone and Android are the beginning.

Cerberus

People had SNESes when I was in primary school.

SAJ14SAJ

4:04 AM

You are a baby.

Cerberus

@SAJ14SAJ How so?

Shield can play Android games btw.

SAJ14SAJ

Casual non computer-based gaming is rapidly moving to them. People who don't want to fuss with the complexity of computer games have tablets and phones and Angry Birds to satisfy their itch. There is less of a low end for consoles to complete in.

Younger people--younger even than you--seem to use their phones and tablets as their primary or even only personal computing device.

So that is where they play their games.

They don't see any need for a console, where they are tied to the living room or whatever.

Cerberus

Perhaps.

On the one hand, people may want to play on a large, tv screen.

SAJ14SAJ

If I said the speed of light can not exceed 299,298 km/s, you would ask what the exceptions and limits are.

Cerberus

On the other, perhaps that is only a non-essential habit, the result of having only one screen in one's sitting room for so long.

@SAJ14SAJ ?

SAJ14SAJ