@OldeEnglish says "Surely you can't believe this". What you or I happen to believe is irrelevant on this site. ¶ "failure to respond to my earlier comment". If comments without questions required a response, they would go on forever. I presented the beliefs of one specific denomination; you linked to a presentation of a different belief. Other than an argument in comments, I don't know what response you expected. And the only claim in my answer was that the site will "give detailed explanations of …"; are you saying that my answer is wrong because that site doesn't give an explanation?

@OldeEnglish says "the wrong basic beliefs". This is not a religious site. All postings are supposed to be objective. My posting, that this specific denomination has these specific beliefs is factually true. Your statement about "wrong basic beliefs is totally inappropriate here. Defining "right" and "wrong" in terms of what you believe would be appropriation only for OldeEnglish.SE.

@RayButterwoth Read my answer again. While it was true the Pharisees popularized the Nisan 15 Sabbath in the late second Temple period, at the time Jesus died the Sadducees controlled Temple worship. Herbert W. Armstrong wrote an 80-page doctrinal paper on who controlled Temple worship at the time Jesus died and he has a shorter version also available online. It is titled Pentecost. HWA believes Nisan 15 was a Sabbath though and unfortunately, he was wrong on this count as Nisan 15 was a not a biblically based doctrine.

@RayButterworth Even if the Jews observed Nisan 15 as a Sabbath when Jesus died, it is unlikely (to me at least) that the inspired writers would have recognized it as a Sabbath because if wasn't a Sabbath. There is no evidence anywhere that Nisan 15 was a Sabbath when Jesus walked the earth. HWA believes that the Pharisees regained control of Temple worship sometime around 50 CE.

@RayButterworth After the Pharisees regained temple worship, they set Nisan 15 as a Sabbath as their predecessors had done in the first century BCE. Josephus and Philo held to the Pharisean view and Josephus was a Pharisee and recorded how the Jews celebrated the waving of the Omer on Nisan 16, the day after the annual Sabbath.

file:///C:/Users/DLM/Downloads/Pentecost_Study_Material.pdf The above link will help you understand that the Sadducees controlled Temple worship when Jesus died but it assumes the Sadducees kept the Nisan 15 Sabbath like the Pharisees believed it should be kept. There is no evidence, anywhere, that the Sadducees believed Nisan 15 was a Sabbath. It is ASSUMED but it is not true, Maybe you know some writing from that time period that shows the Sadducees believed Nisan 15 was a Sabbath.

@RayButterworth You claim that John would naturally refer to Nisan 15 as a Sabbath but you offer no proof for that statement. Why would John call Nisan 15 on a Thursday a Sabbath if it were not scriptural to do so? The Sadducees did not believe it was. And you can't prove they did call it a Sabbath. I can't see an inspired writer, writing for the Holy Spirit, the same Holy Spirit that did not call Nisan 15 a Sabbath in the original Scriptures, call Nisan 15 a Sabbath when it clearly wasn't.

@RayButterworth By the way, three days and three nights does not always mean exactly 72 hours just like a day does not always mean 24 hours. Some people work eight hours a day for five days and it is said they worked five days, and it doesn't mean they worked 60 hours. I don't believe Jonah was literally in the sea creature for 72 hours. Those that claim that it must be exactly 72 hours have the burden of proof to show this is so. Jews counted days inclusively so if Jonah was swallowed on Wednesday that would be the first day and Friday would be the third day.

@RayButterworth This means that Saturday would be the third night but it would also be a fourth calendar day. But there is no contradiction because it is said nowhere that Jonah would rise on the third day. If Jesus was literally three days and three nights in the heart of the earth that would contradict the many verses that claim Jesus rose on the third day. Nowhere does the Bible teach us that Jesus rose from the dead the fourth day but Saturday afternoon would be the fourth day. Jews counted their days inclusively so Wednesday would be counted as day one of his death.

@RayButterworth Saturday would be the fourth day of his death.

@RayButterworth Since the scriptures do not declare Nisan 15 to be a Sabbath anywhere, and you claim it is, then the burden of proof is on you to show that it is scriptural.

@SaberTruthTiger says "the burden of proof is on you to show that it is scriptural". Not necessarily. It is sufficient to show that the Jews then considered the 15th to be a sabbath. ¶ It's true that Judaism today believes it (Leviticus 23:15: "And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath", and counting begins on the 16th). The question is, how popular was this belief 2000 years ago. Even if wrong (and I'd say it is, even if only because there isn't much point in counting if the result is always going to be the same date), John could have used the popular terminology.

@RayButterworth I don't dispute that modern Jews have accepted Nisan 15 as a Sabbath but it wasn't so in the Hebrew Scriptures. Since it is found nowhere in Hebrew and Christian writings of the first century, and since you claim Nisan 15 is a Sabbath the burden of proof is on you. It is not my burden to prove it wasn't. It is in your lap to prove John would have used the popular terminology. The proper terminology in the time of Christ was Nisan 15 was NOT a Sabbath. You must prove it was and IF it was popular terminology, then prove John would have used the erroneous date if inspired by God.

@RayButterworth You have the burden to prove it is sufficient to show that the Jews in Jesus's day considered Nisan 15 a Sabbath. You need to qualify by what you mean when you write "the Jews" because the Sadducees were in control of temple worship at that time, and they celebrated the calendar according to a literal rendering of the Hebrew Scriptures. I have discussed this in great detail elsewhere and I won't repeat it now. You need to prove the Jews (as opposed to some Jews) believed Nisan 15 was a Sabbath and if they did, was it based in scripture.

@RayButterworth All I am asking for is evidence that Nisan 15 was recognized as a Sabbath by the inspired writers. Except when it fell on the weekly Sabbath. If Jesus was crucified and died on a Wednesday, then Friday would be the third day as Jews counted days inclusively. In Acts 10:30 the Gentile Cornelius referred to an event 72 hours earlier as "four days ago", That was because the Romans also counted days inclusively.

@SaberTruthTiger, Jewish Encyclopedia says "Rabbis maintained that "Sabbath" here means simply a day of rest and refers to Passover. The Sadducees (Boethusians) disputed this interpretation, contending that "Sabbath" meant "Saturday." Accordingly they would transfer the count of "seven weeks" from the morrow of the first Saturday in Passover, so that Pentecost would always fall on Sunday.". So the Rabbis (Pharisees) considered the 15th to be a Sabbath, and the Pharisees tended to dominate society.

@RayButterworth I have written an essay on this. It doesn't matter if the Pharisees believed Nisan 15 was a Sabbath; it wasn't. All I care about it what scripture says. The Nisan 15 Sabbath came a permanent part of the Jewish Law sometime around 50 CE and it has been that way ever since. When Jesus walked the earth the scriptural Nisan 15 was celebrated as a holy convocation, a high day, but not as a Sabbath, The Sabbath was not a simple rest day, it was a day of rest from ANY work. The other holy convocations (except Yom Kippur) forbade only servile work. I will find a link to my post to send

@RayButterworth The Sadducees had it right. What the Sadducees believed corresponded to what the Hebrew Scriptures taught. The Pharisees had the false teaching and they celebrated the wrong day as a Sabbath. Don't quote me with Jewish tradition, which is erroneous. Quote scripture to me when we discuss this. Would you like to discuss this further in chat?

@RayButterworth Here is my essay on the topic. wordpress.com/read/blogs/225360258/posts/522

@SaberTruthTiger says "The Sadducees had it right". At least we both agree on that. ¶ John 10:22 refers to Hanukkah, which isn't a biblical holiday, bu was celebrated by the Jews at that time. He could just as easily have referred to the 15h as a sabbath for the same reason.

@RayButterworth He could have, he should have, and so forth. You use "could have" but this Hanukkah is not a name of a biblical holiday. It does not harm the Hebrew Scriptures in any sense to refer to a national holiday that came after the Hebrew Scriptures were written. But Nisan 15 was a biblical holiday and it was established in the time of Moses and it was never called a Sabbath in all the Scriptures. When the Gospel writers refer to the next day as the Sabbath the only Sabbaths mentioned in the Hebrew Scriptures are the weekly Sabbath, the Day of Atonement and the Seven-year Sabbath.

Read my essay on the link I sent you and use it prayerfully. I wrote it years ago so at the time I wrote it I thought the Pharisees had control of the Temple worship. I have since become convinced it was not true. In any case, Nisan 15 was not a Sabbath and you are claiming that the inspired writers got it wrong when they called Nisan 15 a Sabbath but it was ok if it was in popular parlance.

A Sabbath was a day in which ANY work was forbidden. The weekly Sabbath and the Day of Atonement both forbade ANY work, and both were called Sabbath. The other six annual high days forbade only servile work and were not called Sabbath. Also, the Day of Atonement and the weekly Sabbath both prescribed the death penalty for breaking it.They both were the only holy convocations that paired the Hebrew words SHABBATH SHABBATHOWN in their instructions to observe them.

You need to prove that Nisan 15 was a Sabbath. I believe if it fell on the weekly Sabbath then it could be said that day was a Sabbath. Just like if July 4 fell on a Saturday that Saturday would be a holiday. The weekly Sabbath in John coincided with the high day. The word high day wasn't used in the Greek text by the way but the KJV translators used it and it is ok with me. The Greek actually say it was a "megales" day. That day was great. Today we call it a high day.

A link on the discussion wordpress.com/read/blogs/225360258/posts/45

Another link on the Nisan 15 Sabbath Part 2 wordpress.com/read/blogs/225360258/posts/52