Root Access

allquixotic

12:00 AM

windows update wants to feed me a load of drivers

Burgi

shit

i forgot i have a job to go to tomorrow

nn

Michael Frank

@allquixotic Since you're on Win10, do you ever have trouble with your Start button refusing to work?

allquixotic

@MichaelFrank I use Start10, but no

considering my start button is custom code, it's not comparable to your experience

Michael Frank

Yea... I'm wondering if I need to just do a refresh. This PC went from 7 -> 8 -> 8.1 -> 10. So I'm starting to think it needs a clean image.

Simon Sheehan

@MichaelFrank All through the upgrade process? If so, damn. Might be time for a clean image. I started over when I got Windows 10 and just did an OS X reinstall as well with my new SSD, it's nice to start over

Journeyman Geek

12:09 AM

@allquixotic \o/

Michael Frank

@SimonSheehan Yep, all through the Upgrade process :)

Ben N

Wow that's a lot of RAM

Simon Sheehan

@MichaelFrank Nice! Guess it's a testament to the upgrade process

@BenN @MichaelFrank I wish I had all that RAM, R3D files hate me :p

Ben N

In-place upgrades are still disastrous on Windows Server though

Michael Frank

Hotstaging Technician - Every time I see this guys job title, I think he's some kind of kidnapper.

Simon Sheehan

12:12 AM

@BenN Oh god I an only imagine

Ben N

Does the bot have an !!/ for a nuclear explosion picture? I would totally use it to explain

!!/nuke

ChatBot John Cavil

@BenN That didn't make much sense. Use the !!/help command to learn more.

!!/mindblown

!!/help

12:15 AM

@BenN Information on interacting with me can be found at this page

Michael Frank

!!/commands

ChatBot John Cavil

@MichaelFrank That didn't make much sense. Use the !!/help command to learn more.

Michael Frank

!!/listcommands

Journeyman Geek

._.

ChatBot John Cavil

@MichaelFrank help, afk, awsm, ban, color, convert, define, die, doge, domain, eval, export, findcommand, forget, forgetseen, github, google, hang, imdb, import, info, inhistory, jquery, learn, listcommands, listen, live, mdn, meme, moustache, mustache, norris, nudge, parse, refresh, spec, stat, stats, tell, timer, todo, unban, undo, unonebox, user, weather, wiki, xkcd, youtube, zalgo, ;), ;p, \/s*, after5, ahh, areyoukidding, bababababat, baroo, beatingbloodoutofarockwithahalberd, bespecific
boberror, brainf__k, bunny, caaaaat, caaaat, caat, cancer, caniuse, caution, chihuahuaunravelingins…

Michael Frank

12:17 AM

Wow, that list grew!

Ben N

!!/learn nuke "https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/Operation_Upshot-Knothole_-‌_Badger_001.jpg"

ChatBot John Cavil

@BenN Command nuke learned

Journeyman Geek

I'm not sure how that ethernet graphics card question HNQed

Ben N

!!/nuke

ChatBot John Cavil

@BenN upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/…

Ben N

12:17 AM

Pff

Michael Frank

@JourneymanGeek Link?

Journeyman Geek

@BenN always a good idea to upload images to imgur over chat

2

Q: Is it possible to connect an external GPU via Ethernet?

I have laptop which has working Ethernet port but I always use WiFi . I am wondering if it is possible to run and use a graphics card (with external power supply) connected to the Ethernet port (with some kind of PCI emulation to emulate the Ethernet GPU as a PCI one). A Cat6 cable can do 10 Gbp...

Michael Frank

@BenN chuck a <> in front of the URL "....

Journeyman Geek

!!forget nuke

ChatBot John Cavil

@JourneymanGeek Command nuke forgotten.

Bob

12:18 AM

@MichaelFrank Quite often, yes. Pretty buggy.

Ben N

!!/learn nuke "<>http://i.imgur.com/OtARAl7.jpg"

ChatBot John Cavil

@BenN Command nuke learned

Michael Frank

@Bob Do you also happen to use DisplayFusion?

Ben N

!!/nuke

ChatBot John Cavil

Bob

12:18 AM

@MichaelFrank What's that? :P

Ben N

There we go!

Bob

My Win10 is a clean install.

Michael Frank

@Bob It's like Display Properties, but on steroids.

Bob

With chunks of the user profile copied over, mind.

Michael Frank

Wallpaper management, taskbars, etc.

allquixotic

12:19 AM

is it common for Anker USB 3.0 hubs to be non-functional with both Ivy Bridge-era Cougar Point USB 3.0 controllers and with current Skylake-era Sunrise Point USB 3.0 controllers?

Ben N

@MichaelFrank Here

allquixotic

because I have two different models of Anker USB 3.0 hubs with VIA USB controllers inside, and neither one works with the back panel (native Intel) USB 3.0 controllers.

Journeyman Geek

@allquixotic sure the hub didn't die?

allquixotic

In fact they don't work at all except for charging

Journeyman Geek

"via"

eww

@allquixotic is there anything it works on?

is it detected (failing?) on device manager?

allquixotic

12:25 AM

not detected in device manager

I should try it on Ubuntu for fun

the Linux kernel's USB support is actually amazingly good

Journeyman Geek

yeah

that's a sensible way to test

allquixotic

and it seems driver installation has a penchant for hanging indefinitely

trying to install an ethernet controller and it's just hanging

and of course Gigabyte's download servers are all broken except for one FTP server in Russia

YOU HAD ONE JOB

Journeyman Geek

of course

allquixotic

how hard is it to serve files

I'm not confident at all in the sanctity of the internet infrastructure between Russia and here to download a file over regular FTP without encryption or md5sums so I ran it through virustotal

I was thinking MITM

Putin or anyone else between there and here

Bob

Ahh, Gigabyte.

Journeyman Geek

12:30 AM

could always see if you can get the drivers direct

Bob

I tried to grab the manual for your first board.

US link didn't work

Asia link did though

Journeyman Geek

pretty sure mine runs the stock MS drivers

Michael Frank

Pretty sure it's just industry standard to have awful file hosting if you're a PC part manufacturer.

2

Simon Sheehan

I use mostly stock MS drivers

My motherboard needed one for USB 3.0 I think. That's about it really if i recall that was major

Bob

!! s/file hosting/software/

ChatBot John Cavil

12:35 AM

@Bob Pretty sure it's just industry standard to have awful software if you're a PC part manufacturer. (source)

Simon Sheehan

I wish Windows supported Macbooks better, it sucks having to install these drivers

Bob

...

Simon Sheehan

No Mac hate, please

Bob

Windows has included Intel xHCI drivers since Win8.

Win10 already does the whole automatic driver search and download. (Really, that's existed for a while, but 10 is far more aggressive with it.)

You're asking for a feature that already exists.

Simon Sheehan

@Bob I skipped 8 completely, so the jump from 7 to 10 was interesting

Bob

12:38 AM

If your <device> has pre-Ivy Bridge (or non-Intel I suppose but I don't know how AMD CPUs do xHCI), then it probably has a [Renesas|Via] controller. I wouldn't exactly expect built-in support for those.

@SimonSheehan If the complaint is about Win7 not including xHCI drivers, that's like complaining XP didn't include AHCI drivers. The standard/implementation simply did not exist at time of release.

If it's Win10... then said drivers are included, for probably >90% of implementations, old hardware aside.

Simon Sheehan

@Bob Never meant that at all. I think my wording got mixed up in there anyway and was taken a bit out of context.

Bob

I just see too much of "Why doesn't <old OS> work with <new hardware> out of the box? <old OS> sucks."

Usually aimed at Windows.

Because apparently it's entirely reasonable to expect Windows 7 to work out of the box on new hardware when they wouldn't expect Debian Lenny (of around the same age) to do so.

Simon Sheehan

@Bob Windows 10 certainly had the least issues for me. My PC is getting a bit dated at this point so it was fairly good compared to previous installs by far. Any hardware I've added after had worked immediately. Windows 7 is technically something everyone should have moved on from, especially with brand new hardware

bwDraco

Not again... Duplicate of USB flash drive not working or is appearing as an empty disk drive, Disk Management reports "No Media" with 0 bytes size — bwDraco 3 hours ago

Just how many people are getting this "no media" error?

Bob

@SimonSheehan Oh, I don't have a problem with people using old OSes on new hardware.

I have a problem with the people who complain that they can't just load it up and have it work without having to do a bit of legwork to update drivers.

Granted, I've probably made similar complaints at times.

But I've always said I'm a hypocrite, so shrug

bwDraco

12:45 AM

Windows 7 is still a good OS for day-to-day use but you should be preparing to migrate soon.

Bob

@bwDraco If it's stable on the hardware it runs on, there's no real need to change that yet.

Simon Sheehan

@Bob My luck with installing OS's tends to suck, so I just assume tons of stuff will break or be broken anyway. Always set up for failure

Bob

Often it's best to match OS age to hardware age.

bwDraco

If it's Skylake or other very recent architecture we're talking about, Windows 7 may not properly support the hardware, hence Microsoft phasing out support early for these systems.

Bob

@SimonSheehan Pretty sure that's standard for everyone in this room.

@JourneymanGeek might be the only one with mostly-trouble-free upgrades? :P

Simon Sheehan

12:47 AM

@Bob Any computer enthusiast, for sure.

bwDraco

I personally would not want to run Windows 7 on a Skylake machine absent some technical reason it would be necessary to do so.

Simon Sheehan

@bwDraco Indeed. I found the performance of Windows 10 to be much improved anyway, if you're building a skylake machine I would assume you'd want the best performance out of it, so why run an old OS (outside of some specific use)

Bob

@SimonSheehan The biggest problem with Win10 is the UI is buggy as all hell.

Well, telemetry concerns aside.

Simon Sheehan

@Bob I'd agree with that being my only real issue with it. Although my PC has sort of really just become a gaming machine mostly these days

bwDraco

@Bob RPC issues, Runtime Broker locking up causing things like the Start menu and Cortana to fail.

Bob

12:50 AM

I've had to reset certain chunks of my profile two or three times, and I've only been on it for a couple months.

@bwDraco I've actually had certain parts (like the tile cache, and the Classes hive) become corrupted in some way.

Right now I'm still stuck in a bug where I can't change my HTTPS protocol handler.

First off, I'd suggest printing out a copy of the GNU coding standards,
and NOT read it.  Burn them, it's a great symbolic gesture.

bwDraco

FSF dominates the open-source software world. They make great software but I hate their almost communist philosophy.

Journeyman Geek

@Bob the way I set things up means I can essentially roll back at any time

allquixotic

@bwDraco they really don't dominate anything - companies and individual engineers are free to choose whether or not to assign copyright license of their software over to the FSF, and they're also free to choose whether or not to use FSF licenses

Journeyman Geek

if veem would get their linux backup software out I can do it

allquixotic

and oh no, communism any time anyone talks about sharing something *eyeroll*

Journeyman Geek

12:54 AM

@bwDraco yes and no. I think the GPL serves its purpose in ensuring open source software remains open source, and you can always pick another licence

allquixotic

communism kills people for dissenting; the FSF doesn't apply any sort of force whatsoever besides strongly urging people to not be antisocial (but if they decide to do it anyway, as long as they aren't violating copyright law, they're fine with it)

Journeyman Geek

I think stallman's viewpoint, that all software must be open source first and formost is silly

Bob

@JourneymanGeek That's the approach I'm using, but I shouldn't have to.

allquixotic

also, increasingly, the most important software around isn't even owned by the FSF's copyright license. it might be licensed under a license they wrote, but you can't blame them for someone else deciding to use their license, whether you like or dislike the license

Journeyman Geek

I'm a firm believer in pragmatics first

Bob

12:56 AM

Why should my backup software have to pick up Microsoft's slack?!

allquixotic

@JourneymanGeek if you're talking about Stallman's viewpoint, you should not be saying that his viewpoint has anything to do with "open source" -- that is a severe mischaracterization

Stallman's viewpoint is that all software should be free software except in extremely rare circumstances

Journeyman Geek

@allquixotic More as an extreme example of open source zealotry.

allquixotic

but Stallman doesn't represent the FSF, and the actual FSF policies are much less radical than Stallman himself

@JourneymanGeek well, no, it's just that if you are going to represent a viewpoint of another person, you should at least be accurate in representing that viewpoint; and under no circumstances has Richard Stallman ever backed anything labeled "open source"; he would insist you call it free software that he supports

Bob

@allquixotic Communism as a philosophy doesn't kill people; the pseudo-dictatorships under a communism label do/did. But then the two are pretty much irrevocably associated at this point.

allquixotic

you can call it open source when talking about software or other peoples' viewpoints, or even the FSF's viewpoints, but to say that "Stallman supports open source" or "wants open source" or anything positive regarding "open source", is purely false

Journeyman Geek

12:58 AM

(as opposed to a more pragmatic viewpoint - some folks may prefer free/open source software first, but at the end of the day its about getting the job done)

@allquixotic but when accusing the GPL of 'communism' its a useful frame of reference.

and that not everyone takes that view

allquixotic

Of course most people don't take that view, but Stallman feels he has to be the ideologue who's "pure" to encourage others to aspire to be more free

and often it works :P

Journeyman Geek

;p

allquixotic

he's an ideologue; he doesn't live in the practical world

Journeyman Geek

Yup

allquixotic

but people who do can take a page from his book and make the world a better place sometimes instead of dividing people

Journeyman Geek

1:00 AM

and we can't judge all FOSS by that.

allquixotic

I'd even say the FSF is a lot less radical than Stallman himself

they are oftentimes pretty practical

Journeyman Geek

heh

Yeah, no disagreement there

allquixotic

GNU is 100% practical; it exists purely as an engineering community

it's perhaps not the most efficient engineering community anymore but they house a lot of useful software (an increasing percentage of which has non-GPL equivalents elsewhere)

Bob

How open is open if it still restricts how you can use it? shrug

allquixotic

@Bob Pretty open, if some random idiot can take it proprietary and capitalize on the community's work, then drive their new Tesla Model X down the highway yelling "Thanks for all the fish, suckers!" as they make millions selling your code as a proprietary product. At least if it's copyleft they also have to release their own changes.

Journeyman Geek

1:03 AM

@Bob essentially though its saying "You can have my code, but I want others to have it too"

And some good's come out of that

allquixotic

If you had ever contributed to an open source product with a so-called "liberal" FOSS license and had that code proprietarized into someone else's product, without getting a cut of their profits, you'd wish it were copylefted

Journeyman Geek

open router firmwares (even if they're getting rarer)

allquixotic

What about all the ZFS and OpenSolaris contributors who helped Sun develop and improve OpenSolaris during its heyday, only to have that become the basis of proprietary Oracle code, and now they've turned off the fountain and stopped sharing their own innovations with the community?

All we have to move forward with ZFS and OpenSolaris is the "last release" provided by Oracle; they've decided to take their money and go home, while still making profit off of the work of external people who contributed to their product.

Bob

@allquixotic Not saying it's a good or bad thing, just that it seems to be a bit of a misnomer.

allquixotic

I'm perfectly fine with companies making money hand over fist off of FOSS; it's just part of the gentleman's agreement that you keep it open in future releases. That's how you avoid being a dick. Well, the GPL steps up the gentleman's agreement into a legal agreement. Works for me.

Android unfortunately is extremely liberally licensed all up and down the stack, having basically removed GNU stuff completely. Google could, at any time, thank the community for all their contributions and take the platform completely proprietary, declaring all future releases to be closed source except for privileged individuals within IHV companies.

It's within their rights to do so.

Wouldn't wanna be an AOSP contributor on that day.

Journeyman Geek

1:07 AM

@allquixotic they'd probably need to rewrite the kernel.

that said, it dosen't quite make sense for google to?

allquixotic

@JourneymanGeek Nah, the whole amalgamation argument gets them off the hook

Journeyman Geek

and don't forget, they don't need to give the code to anyone

allquixotic

The kernel is a separate piece of the system, so they can take everything proprietary but the kernel

Journeyman Geek

only people who get a copy of the software, and on request

allquixotic

@JourneymanGeek well, if the software is GPL'ed, and you get binaries, you are legally entitled to get source to whichever parts of the code are GPL'ed

Journeyman Geek

1:08 AM

there's nothing stopping them from distributing it to OEMs, then sending you printed copies of the code on request.

allquixotic

especially if someone other than Google holds copyright licenses to that GPL'ed code

if Google holds all the copyright licenses, they can just decide to change the license from GPL to something else and then you've got no rights

but Google doesn't hold all copyright over the kernel code

basically anyone who buys an Android phone is entitled to get Google's Linux kernel changes in source form (and this will never change unless all Linux copyright holders agree to change the license), but aside from the Linux kernel, there is precious little GPL'ed / copylefted code in the Android platform these days

Michael Frank

@JourneymanGeek Like that email guy! Printing out his encryption key when the court ordered him to hand it over...

Bob

@allquixotic Doesn't matter.

Already happened.

Haven't you noticed all those Google apps?

The AOSP equivalents have already been sitting stagnant for several releases.

Music, Calendar, etc..

allquixotic

@Bob Well, yeah, those are proprietary, but the base system isn't, even though a lot of the libs are BSD-licensed

Bob

@allquixotic IIRC they were based on the original AOSP ones.

allquixotic

1:13 AM

and CyanogenMod is doing the maintenance (to a degree) / improvements on the base apps

Bob

Then they stopped updating the AOSP ones.

allquixotic

@Bob ah - yeah, then they've already done that; that was probably designed to defeat their attempted competition from CyanogenMod and others :P

Bob

@allquixotic If you're going with that one, then CM can do the same for the entire base system (in theory) :\

allquixotic

see? when you don't use a copyleft license, it's a company's natural legal instinct to be a dick

even Google can be a dick; if "Don't Be Evil" can be a dick, who can't be?!

Bob

@allquixotic To be honest? Google's been a dick for ages.

allquixotic

1:14 AM

you have to hit them with a big fat billy club of "You will break the law if you're a dick with this code" by licensing it under a copyleft license, and split up the copyright assignment across many entities.

that's the ONLY way to prevent these companies from being a dick.

Bob

Meh. Thing with Google?

They don't particularly like accepting contributions in the first place.

allquixotic

lol

Bob

It's nominally open-source but getting your stuff ~~uplifted~~ upstreamed is a pain.

allquixotic

upstreamed you mean?

Bob

@allquixotic brainfart

allquixotic

1:15 AM

that's a pretty common phenomenon among cathedralized open source products...

Bob

Firefox? I can submit a patch pretty easily.

Chromium? Make a fuss on their bugtracker, hope a Google employee does something.

Granted, they have more paid employees.

allquixotic

Second Life, OpenSolaris, Google anything, Java... it's really common that these projects have a development and governance team primarily driven by the company behind the product, and the company will usually say they plan to address that issue "their own way" sometimes (much) later

Bob

(Ok, you can submit patches to Chromium. Perhaps not the best example. But it's not as well integrated into their standard bugtracker AFAICT.)

allquixotic

they hire such smart developers that the plebes can't possibly produce anything useful that finds a bug in their impeccable code

bad upstream syndrome; usually it's when a project is extremely commercial open source -_- sad but true

It can be fixed though. Red Hat has a lot of very friendly upstreams (and a few unfriendly ones unfortunately :P)

Often you find commercial maintainers are too zeroed-in on their own particular "ideal" use of the software in one particular way with their whole product stack, and are only willing to really consider improvements that benefit that angle, not any alternative use cases or hardware or etc.

BIOS update, brb :P

Michael Frank

1:34 AM

@allquixotic Lucky you! I can't even get into my BIOS for some reason...

Bob

o.O

Journeyman Geek

ugh dnf....

I'm trying to install one small package. Its downloading a ton of big packagelists sloooowly

or failing at it

Michael Frank

1:53 AM

25

Q: What is "OpenGL" and why did a player get banned for it?

Today, while playing Counter Strike 1.6 on a server, I saw a message at the left corner saying: Player Name - x. Permanent Ban. Reason - "OpenGL" detected So what is this OpenGL thing in Counter Strike?

terminology counter-strike

o.O

Journeyman Geek

2:22 AM

@Bob linked that yesterday

Bob

@JourneymanGeek so, nothing new? :P

just another day in RA

ugh. bloody browsers. github.com/philipwalton/flexbugs/issues/155

Can anyone test that on Edge?

actually never mind I have browserstack

Journeyman Geek

@Bob all three are the same length

Bob

Nice, thanks.

@JourneymanGeek Edge 13, yea?

Journeyman Geek

ya

Bob

@JourneymanGeek Thanks.

allquixotic

2:38 AM

well that's weird...

I had to do quite a lot of gymnastics to get 1/2 of my USB hubs working, and apparently one of the prerequisites is to cut power to the hub entirely for about 30 seconds (?) to reset it somehow (??)

now I have the Imperial BART 1 and Blue Yeti mic hooked up and working; keyboard and mouse of course; new AOC 15.6" side monitor; UPS info cable; and hotspot :P

Bob

lol

seems typical for USB hubs

allquixotic

which is basically everything

Bob

I have a mwave one that occasionally craps out if I transfer too much, and needs a full power cut (both mains and USB) to reset

Got an AmazonBasics one that works beautifully

allquixotic

it seems Via Technologies is basically the "standard" for USB hubs, unfortunately. maybe they have patents?

hard to find non-VIA chipsets in USB 3.0 hubs

Bob

Hm... I'll have to check when I get home

Think I have a Renesas one

might be the mwave

allquixotic

2:42 AM

oh, well; I spent my entire Friday, my entire Saturday, and about 85% of my Sunday getting this box working, but now I FINALLY have the mATX dream: a box that weighs about 23 lbs / 10 kg (weighed it on a scale) with top-end hardware that I can easily sling in a large suitcase or my car and just go

Bob

O_O

USB hubs have firmware updates?!?!

homeservershow.com/forums/index.php?/topic/…

allquixotic

Now I can "grab and go" with the following devices: mATX chassis; AOC monitor; Verizon hotspot; ThinkPad Compact USB Keyboard with TrackPoint; Imperial BART 1; BeoPlay BT headphones ==> 5 devices, requiring a total of 4 USB cables and 1 standard mickey mouse power cable to operate

Bob

@allquixotic Have you tried updating your hub's firmware?

allquixotic

@Bob No, but I know from Ubuntu that it's a VL812

Via VL812

Bob

Could give that a shot.

Though it might just kill it completely :P

Firmware updates are iffy.

On an entirely unrelated topic: @JourneymanGeek, @allquixotic, how does next weekend look?

allquixotic

2:48 AM

@Bob barring any stability headaches, it looks marvellous

Bob

I kinda wanted to finish that SoaSE game :P

But if JMG's available we're probably better off starting fresh.

allquixotic

AOC monitor keeps turning off then coming back on... the duration of the "outage" is about a second, and happens approx every 2-3 minutes

Bob

@allquixotic Oh, I did some reading... apparently Kols aren't particularly good at anything apart from soaking damage :\

That might be why the yellow titan takes forever and a day to kill.

I need to try more siege capital ships. And carriers.

@allquixotic That sounds almost like issues I've had with DisplayLink USB adapters :\

allquixotic

their direct fire DPS is good but maybe their abilities aren't very powerful compared to Marzas

Bob

@allquixotic Marzas have higher single-target DPS though.

Especially against bigger ships.

Apparently armour class affects different weapon classes differently.

Kols are more anti-swarm.

allquixotic

2:53 AM

so you're saying Marzas are kind of a cheese chip for anti titan?

Bob

Seems to be!

Or carriers w/ bombers.

I haven't actually tried in-game... just been reading the wiki a bit.

allquixotic

that makes them pretty OP because Marzas are also the best way to deal damage to an enemy planet's population, aside from spamming krosov siege frigates, which is not a very good strategy because they're fragile (Marzas not so much)

Bob

Apparently LRM frigates (Javelis?) pack quite a punch too.

@allquixotic But they're pretty weak to strike and frigate swarms.

Which is where the Kol comes in.

My current fleets are all Kodiak-heavy... I think I need to try adding more carriers and LRMs.

allquixotic

I dunno, I always felt that spamming Kodiaks and focus-firing them on one capital ship at a time was a pretty good way to DPS down enemy capital ships

might not be good against titans though

Bob

Kodiaks basically devolve into a battle of attrition where I lose 50-75% of the fleet and the AI just gets a new titan and capital ships a few mins later :\

@allquixotic Maybe against a few low-levelled ones?

Yellow had half a dozen level 10 capital ships and a titan.

I want to know how they keep leveling them up so quick!

Oh, yellow was Advent, yea? Apparently strong shields...

allquixotic

2:57 AM

I think yellow's specific race/faction has an insane armor or heal or shield mitigation buff that they keep using with their capital ship swarms to make them hard to kill

Bob

@allquixotic Another thing I've been neglecting are Hoshikos (repair cruisers). Need some of those.

@allquixotic Yea, Advent was shields, TEC was hull/armour, Vasari is in the middle.

allquixotic

heh well in theory a well-balanced fleet of lots of different stuff should be better overall than just spamming all of one ship type, but that depends on you correctly micromanaging everything -- once you start introducing hoshikos and gardas and LRMs, you're talking extremely squishy parts of your fleet that can get eaten by capships or titans in seconds flat

or starbases

starbases have the crazy number of hardpoints thing where they can fire at a ridiculous number of different targets at once, and deal hundreds of DPS fully-upgraded

a starbase firing all its weapons at as many targets as it can fire at probably DPSes at around 5000 dps

hmm, I notice the AOC monitor stopped flickering when I moved my browser window off of it

it's probably a bandwidth problem?

Bob

@allquixotic Apparently Hoshikos and Gardas are actually pretty tanky.

LRMs are definitely squishy :P

@allquixotic Good thing that Ogrovs hard counter starbases then!

@allquixotic How is it connected? That sounds a lot like my DisplayLink problem.

allquixotic

Micro USB 3.0 cable to front panel USB 3.0, then front panel USB 3.0 to a header on the motherboard

Bob

@allquixotic Wait. How are you connecting a display via USB?

allquixotic

3:04 AM

DisplayLink.....?

Bob

@allquixotic Which one?

allquixotic

that's the point of DisplayLink

Bob

Some of their older (/lower-end) chips are absolute crap.

@allquixotic That's exactly what DisplayLink did to me!

allquixotic

AOC E1659FWUX Pro

Bob

I think I broke it :P

us.aoc.com/products/…

us.aoc.com/products/pdf/monitors.php?id=90

allquixotic

3:07 AM

no clue what that Unknown USB Device is, since all the USB devices I actually have plugged in, work fine

Bob

Hm. They don't say which chip.

Ok, more info.

We bought three DisplayLink adapters. USB 2.0 to VGA.

Two ran fine, the third was crap. Screen kept going off, more if you actually had something rendering on it.

Opened them up. Crap one was a DL-160, good ones were DL-165.

The only place with that info was on the chip itself.

DL-160 was a 2007 chip, DL-165 2009...

The more recent one in your AOC display is prooooobably a DL-41xx

But I don't really trust DisplayLink at this point :\

allquixotic

it's so weird that ALL of my USB devices share a single USB 3.0 controller

at least it's Intel and not some random shit, but it doesn't seem to be working very well

Bob

@allquixotic Your theory of bandwidth problems is possible, but not too likely (we got it workong on USB 2.0, after all).

Might be the hub crapping out? That happens a lot, IME.

allquixotic

this is 1080p

Bob

@allquixotic Yea, we got 1080p60 over USB 2.0.

allquixotic

3:12 AM

how could it be the hub when it's directly connected to the system ?

Bob

Still occasional stutters apparently, but they're rare.

@allquixotic Oh, I thought you were going through a hub.

allquixotic

front panel header

does that count as a hub?

Bob

@allquixotic It could. Depends how the front panel is implemented :P

Journeyman Geek

nope

allquixotic

look at my device manager

Journeyman Geek

3:13 AM

Its usually connected to the main USB controller

allquixotic

6 mins ago, by allquixotic

Bob

Ah, doesn't look like there's a hub in there.

@JourneymanGeek Pretty sure 4-port front panels need a hub. 2-port doesn't need, but some cheapies... never know.

allquixotic

there was a time when USB was super reliable

now... *Kol captain voice* Times of unreliability are upon us

Bob

@allquixotic I prefer the Marza "ALL POWER TO JUMP DRIVE!"

At least I think it was the Marza o.O

allquixotic

eh, I'm ok with only some of my power being diverted to a jump drive ;p

yeah I think that's the marza...

Bob

3:17 AM

> Bringing out the big guns!

heh.

allquixotic

have you seen BSG yet?!

there are lovely parallels between BSG and SoaSE, even without the BSG total conversion mod

Bob

Oh damn, the Ragnarov Titan's quotes look awesome...

> Expand and Exterminate!

> I put the laughter in slaughter!

> Let's make some martyrs!

lol Shriken Corvette

> (impatient growl)

@allquixotic No :(

allquixotic

oh god, something is really fucked in this system! "Scan for Hardware Changes" in device manager hangs

I know it's the USB controller, I just know it :(

gigabyte gave me a bum USB controller.

Bob

> The Advent's ship voices are feminine or, more often, those of children.

o.O

@allquixotic O_O

allquixotic

yeah, a lot of USB related operations seem to hang indefinitely

Bob

3:22 AM

@allquixotic Do you have a USB PCIe card to test?

allquixotic

can't test that with 2 out of 2 PCIe slots in use

Bob

> All Vasari have guttural, growling voices and frequently practice evil laughter.

allquixotic

3:36 AM

whoa, it's like a big lock came unlocked and all these pending transactions happened very suddenly

it took like 25 minutes for my monitor to finally recognize itself as plugged into the back panel

Journeyman Geek

\o/

I think I got vnc working on my linux box so I don't need to switch monitors to use it

Bob

You think? O.o

Journeyman Geek

It 'works' but not sure how reliably yet

I had a wierd glitch earlier on

allquixotic

so apparently moving the AOC monitor to the back panel USB 3.0 works better

Rahul Basu

3:57 AM

@Bob "I put the laughter in slaughter!"... That's classic...

allquixotic

useful: uwe-sieber.de/misc_tools_e.html

Rahul Basu

nice...

Transcript for