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12:01 AM
@TomWijsman, do you know anything about CeroWRT / OpenWRT?
 
@allquixotic Only have used DD-WRT.
 
@TomWijsman it's not that compile jobs bother me; cgroups takes care of that on modern Fedora/Ubuntu anyway. You can make -j255 and it won't bother you at all unless you start swapping because of running out of memory. But.... it's just the time it takes versus a .deb or .rpm download
 
@allquixotic: And as a last resort I believe you can use a binary host for a lot of the packages.
Heavy compiles have -bin equivalents often too.
 
@TomWijsman Ah. I'm trying to see if I'd have to do anything special to set up CeroWRT to use this router as a NAT and wireless access point for a USB RNDIS WAN connected to the USB 2.0 host port.
 
I don't mind waiting for wireshark to compile.
@allquixotic Ah, I have cgroups too, didn't know they allow you to pump the jobs count up.
 
12:05 AM
With these easy questions, it's like a race to post the answer first :P
 
Basically my Android phone provides an RNDIS internet connection, complete with its own DHCP and DNS, but I want to host multiple boxes behind the router and connect them all over wifi because my cellular signal booster cuts the effective range of the wifi chipset on my phone
 
bbl
 
At the moment I have -j7 -l7 for make and -j4 -l7 for emerge.
 
@sidran32: basically it is
 
@TomWijsman do you use -flto -Ofast with gcc 4.7?
 
12:06 AM
@sidran32 go answer my questions then :P
 
aww, I apparently got a pair of downvotes on one of my questions, for a situation I couldn't replicate
 
@allquixotic These:
CFLAGS="-O2 -pipe -march=native -ggdb -flto"
CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"
LDFLAGS="${LDFLAGS} -flto"
What does the -Ofast do?
 
i often wonder how much slower binary packages for Ubuntu/Fedora are compared to -Ofast -flto -march=native
@TomWijsman on gcc 4.7 it basically enables -ffast-math, which apparently violates some IEEE standard but results in a huge performance gain :D
 
@allquixotic: Hmm, might that have consequences when I do scientific stuff?
 
-flto does link-time optimization which is basically equivalent to taking your entire program (which is split up into multiple translation units, one .o per .c/.cpp file) and recompile the whole thing as if it were a single translation unit (.o file) which vastly improves codegen quality and reduces duplication and removes dead code rather than exposing it in the symbol table
 
12:08 AM
Should probably read up on it.
 
@TomWijsman -ffast-math sets -funsafe-math-operations which I assume is rather, yeah, unsafe for... math that needs to be insanely accurate
it does cause noticeable performance speedups on certain desktop software that does stuff with floating point though; particularly, resampling algorithms and DSP processing algorithms related to audio or video whose source format is floating point
and the reduction in quality is truly negligible, in the full sense of the word... you literally cannot tell the difference
but scientific research can tell the difference
it's pretty great for lanczos image resampling, so it can speed up floating point textures in the OpenGL stack (mesa)
although, IIRC, mesa might already enable -ffast-math for their floating point texture translation units anyway
 
@allquixotic: Hmm, dunno if it's easy to isolate scientific and non-scientific programs.
 
ffmpeg's build system also enables -ffast-math with no additional input needed from the user
 
Because well yeah, I can enable it global wide and disable it for anything scientific I will do.
Currently, I actually don't run any scientific things but I might do so next year...
 
you may want to leave it disabled, because many open source programs that KNOW they can benefit hugely from it with no downsides already enable it
 
12:12 AM
Ah okay.
The real problem is that when I enable it nothing will use it.
 
they don't enable -flto though
 
I'm not really a fan of "recompile the whole system to use a certain optimization".
Just as things update they get better. :)
Yeah, -flo on now. Barely seen any breaks.
There's like currently 3 packages that don't compile.
spidermonkey and two virtualbox packages, but I haven't checked if it's because of -flto yet.
And bug reports with -flto get ignored so unless I find an existing bug report that doesn't mention lto I can't report it...
Probably will take some stabilization time before they consider it as testing or as a stable default.
@nhinkle: Ouch...
"Stack Overflow is having its own separate contest" - thanks. My question is more appropriate there. — Ark-kun 33 secs ago
 
@TomWijsman goddamnit
 
@sidran32: The forecast is somewhat handy and the averages page is really awesome, quite some detail there.
@allquixotic: I've actually been thinking of starting a LFS in a chrooted environment to get an even better understanding and looking if I can brew things myself, although I'd miss Portage if I'd go down that road.
CLFS :: Cross Linux From Scratch provides the means to cross-compile an LFS system on many types of systems.
This is perhaps interesting towards the RPi, although it might be an overkill...
This is how I changed YouTube, three columns! :D
Wanted to show it to HTH earlier on, now I need to wait until he's back around here...
Got to love Stylebot for this.
Heh, a form of Tetris were the blocks don't disappear but you can keep playing.
 
12:48 AM
ooh
apparently mobile versions of sites work great in side docked browser windows
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek narrow screen and all :P
finally figured out the API!
well, mostly
 
@Bob: the 'standard' version of the site dosen't adjust to the page size gracefully
 
Bob
for some reason, specifying a start date (fromdate) skips questions with negative scores
...
Why does the Update component of my HP printer software require 700 MB?!?!
That's more than the rest put together... :S
 
@Bob for the same reason that SQL Server 2010 tried to take up 20 GB of disk space
without any data in the actual database
 
Bob
12:57 AM
:S
 
1:20 AM
Been playing this for more than half an hour, trying to get the blocks as small as pixels to see what happens if the game attempts to make the blocks smaller than pixels. :D
 
@TomWijsman "Hmm... Now that you've said it I'm starting to think this is the case. Is there any way to move question other than reposting it? I wonder whether Windows 8 Challenge (win8challenge.com) allows posting questions on StackOverflow instead of SuperUser" rolleyes
CODERS DEVELOPERS!
(coders are fine. I guess ;p)
 
@JourneymanGeek Closing kind of moves it, and reposting, other than that I don't think so.
Devs can probably move it DB wise.
But I don't think you can use other sites to fund the challenge with extra votes.
> You earned the Bounty Earned tile in the Windows 8 Challenge!
Ah, about time, those bounties kept on running...
 
more like the whole attitude of it
"I'll post a large rant, then see if i can game the system"
 
Ah yeah, that post, he ignored us throughout...
He didn't repost so far, so think we can be glad. stackoverflow.com/search?tab=newest&q=net%20winrt
 
ok. is it just me, or is this one just a little too blatantly an attempt to get a [windows-8] question? superuser.com/questions/494368/…
Retagged of course
 
1:31 AM
Seen some like that, dunno...
 
Thats clearly a CP question and a self answer
 
Also wonder how the reboot is implemented, would be fun to see whether the shutdown cancel method cancels the scheduled reboots.
Ah, didn't note the self answer through my quick look, yeah, maybe.
 
commented about the tag, but not how dodgy it seemed. there's probably a dupe somewhere
 
1:44 AM
hm
thats odd
my desktop just complained of a memory error
this is annoying though, its intermittant enough that i can't troubleshoot it effectively
 
Think I've played enough now...
 
2:01 AM
ok, it just rebooted in the middle of memtest
 
2:16 AM
trying again with the case fans plugged in
 
2:36 AM
@JourneymanGeek that really doesn't sound good. o.o
 
@JourneymanGeek That sounds unstable...
Hmm, I wonder if there's some software based memtest such that you can still read the temps.
 
Is the Win 8 fever dying out ?
Less people are answereing
 
At this hour...
user image
2
 
@HackToHell hopefully not; the number of people focusing on should allow me more room for answer Linux questions
 
Didn't see this one before.
@HackToHell: By the way, I forgot to show you earlier:
2 hours ago, by Tom Wijsman
user image
 
2:44 AM
at least cement is fairly stable
 
@TomWijsman I hate the video page though
woot
 
@HackToHell how did you get that to come up in-place?
 
add the http
 
@HackToHell Tweaked that a bit too...
 
2:47 AM
no there... closest thing, Windows 7
and that's not my #1 :P
 
The networking doesn't surprise me. As a web app security tester, I must know A LOT about networking to do my job
 
@HackToHell: ^
 
There's nothing on the sides !
 
Widens the video at about the width of what's below there.
 
2:48 AM
and no black background
 
all that wasted room
 
also, Morning
 
good morning
 
@Sathya good morning :) it's 10:48 pm here, I'm getting ready to start a night of hacking in eclipse
 
@HackToHell The sides used to be black, still need to fix that. And I also used to move the title from above the video to below the video but I think they did that themselves now.
 
2:49 AM
sleepy time on weekend == start working on code... that's how i operate
 
Although the problem is that the guide link in the top left is in the way, so might just leave it as is.
Contrast makes me focus on the video enough...
Automatically selects Full HD from the start, so switching to full screen doesn't introduce an extra delay.
Apple inspired questions, because Microsoft inspired ones won't do anymore. :D
What are we gonna do when the #1,000th question is asked in that tag?
It better be a good question!
 
Ah, yeah, remember seeing better footage of that on news (of another edition though).
Would be funny if you were there as a tourist. :D
@Sathya: Hmm, where did superuser.com/review/broken-links go?
 
this 802.11n (final, not draft 2.0) can be run on fully free and open source software, all hardware included... amazon.com/Netgear-WNDR3800-Premium-Edition-Wireless/dp/…
i find that rather cool... I'm going to put CeroWRT on it.
Maryland meets Hurricane Sandy in 2012: pictures from what will be ground zero in 24 hours: stores selling out of stuff...
the first one is the ice freezer, showing only one bag of (broken) ice on the shelf
the second is a shelf that is normally full of bottled water with only some water bottles left and a six pack of some beverage that someone didn't want
this was on Friday, over two days before the storm
 
3:05 AM
@allquixotic: Mine only has draft it seems reviews.cnet.com/routers/linksys-wrt610n-simultaneous-dual/…
Although I'm generally not bothered by the speed as it feels quite fast, though I've optimized it out.
 
@TomWijsman I have two of that exact router
problem is, I can't put CeroWRT on it; its flash doesn't have enough memory for it lol
 
Don't like the OpenWRT site.
 
also, draft 2.0 doesn't sit well with my final 802.11n chipset in my tablet and my thinkpad
 
Though I'd need to check out alternatives in the future to see what other nice things there are.
 
final 802.11n base stations generally work well with draft n clients, but not so well in the reverse
@TomWijsman the main reason I'm getting it is so I can plug an RNDIS device into it (such as a smartphone) and use that as a WAN and broadcast it over a larger range using the dedicated base station hardware of the router
a good router can broadcast in multiple rooms and floors of a house; a smartphone's wifi chipset simply isn't designed for that
also, CeroWRT provides that fq_codel I was raving about the other day, so the devices sharing the network can't blot out eachothers' bandwidth with big downloads
fair queue controlled delay active queue management is to IP packets what cgroup scheduler is to CPU usage sharing... it prevents any one user from overwhelming the system with huge queues (in the case of networking, packets; in the case of the CPU, processes scheduled for CPU time)
 
3:14 AM
I see.
 
@TomWijsman a good test for whether you'd benefit from fq_codel: start a big download and try to surf the internet... if your browsing speed is very significantly reduced, then fq_codel would cut that reduction in speed by about 80%, without seriously impacting the download speed
the main thing it does is cut down on latency for the "squished" requests (the small bandwidth HTTP requests that get backed up behind big download packets)
and in HTTP, since a lot of stuff is done in serial, latency is everything
you can't fetch a page's dependent resources until you first fetch the page itself and parse it to determine which URLs it refers to
so you pay a latency cost for every round trip, and most sites have many round trips
 
@allquixotic Don't think so... svn.dd-wrt.com:8000/ticket/2680
 
@TomWijsman huh? that bug is for dd-wrt.
oh... IOW, you are using dd-wrt and it isn't enabled, right?
I don't think it's even in mainline OpenWRT yet
it's just in CeroWRT, which is a fork of OpenWRt
 
@TomWijsman It happened a few months ago. Memtest is USUALLY clean.. which is wierd
 
@TomWijsman hm, didn't notice that - must've disappeared during the new beta review overhaul
 
3:20 AM
@allquixotic ehm prolly overheating. This system usually isn't taxed so I unplugged the (usually excessive) 200mm fans
 
@allquixotic: Yeah.
@Sathya: Was still there at a point, just wondering now if they decided not to go for it.
 
@TomWijsman possibly, considering waffles was the one who worked on it and is no longer with Stack Exchange
 
Bob
3:41 AM
...Win8 is rather unpolished
Windows 7 File Recovery sounds like a development name :\
 
@Bob it has a fairly poor system for dealing with unexpected situations, during install, repair, etc.
 
4:25 AM
Can someone help a guy out? :)
0
A: Windows 8 Snap on desktop not working

sidran32You have to drag the app to the left or right until you see a vertical dividing line appear in the background. Once you see that, you can release the mouse button and it should be snapped to that side of the display. However, this feature requires at least a 1366x768 screen resolution. If your s...

I hate asking for upvotes... but I'm asking for upvotes.
:P
 
Bob
lol
 
Thanks :P
I actually worked a bit on that answer. :P
Man... I doubt that FedEx is going to ship my computer on Sunday.
This means I'll probably get it after the storm.
 
4:41 AM
@sidran32 Sandy?
 
Huh?
What do you mean "Sandy"?
 
Bob
@sidran32 The name of the hurricane-thingy :P
 
Oh, yeah
 
Bob
I hate dealing with DNS records :\
too much caching to see what the heck is going on :P
 
@sidran32 it'll be hitting me too
 
4:47 AM
I'm gonna get the combined form with that cold front
 
yup
the cold front is kinda keeping the hurricane at bay a bit longer, which is making it gain strength from the ocean
they think it'll be worse than the earlier models predicted
but later
more like Tuesday morning now
 
heh
 
 
2 hours later…
6:36 AM
superuser.com/questions/494463/… found something new and cool ;p
can't get it to work yet though. But... yay, they finally have an LVM-alike
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek isn't that essentially the same as previous versions of Windows' software RAID?
 
@Bob: apparently its new ;p
 
Bob
o.O
what's new about it other than the name?
I swear it's always been there
 
You could boot of windows software raid, right?
 
Bob
boot off it?
sure, in Windows
I think there might have been some way to boot Linux off that too, can't remember
 
6:44 AM
this can't ;p
 
Bob
... isn't that worse?
 
Its not raid
its jbod ;p
 
Bob
6:59 AM
ah
 
Hey jorneyman.
 

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