The Upper Room

2:56 AM

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Are questions that ask for answers from various theological contexts always overly broad and to be flagged? For example, How do the various traditions today celebrate Christmas? Or How do non-Predestinationalists understand Matt 2:15 as not referring to predestined, divine guidance? ...

discussion

Does Elisha speak?

3:25 AM

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Q: What if you cant find the question that yours is supposedly a duplicate of?

Occasionally, as a fairly new user, I see interesting questions that are flagged as duplicate, but I search and I find no questions that really adequately answer the issue. I really think that if you want to flag a question as avduplicate, the onus is on you to link to the question(s) that are d...

feature-request bug

Does Elisha speak?

3:54 AM

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Q: Analysis of Patristic Texts

So, say I have a question concerning the translation of a Patristic text, say, of Gregory of Nazianzus. It would go something like this: In his first discourse, Gregory of Nazianzus wrote, εἴπωμεν, ἀδελφοὶ, καὶ τοῖς μισοῦσιν ἡμᾶς, μὴ ὅτι τοῖς δι' ἀγάπην τι πεποιηκόσιν, ἢ πεπονθό σι· Such...

discussion

Does Elisha speak?

9:27 AM

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Q: How much third-party editing is allowed to improve a question?

How much editing is allowed to improve a question or bring it to the point of being acceptable? I feel we have a lot of questions on hold (probably rightly so), and many could be salvaged with a little editing. For example: Breaking Engagement due to Cheating As one comment states, this would ...

discussion

Does Elisha speak?

12:17 PM

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Q: Requesting to staff action:

Requesting to merge with account http://christianity.stackexchange.com/users/17561/31415926 followed by deletion of both accounts. [Posted here, since impossible to post to meta without 5 rep.] [Creating separate account, since impossible to recover original account.] [Also requesting this qu...

discussion

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

12:41 PM

Out of curiosity, is there any place that prohibits man from creating life? I remember reading that only God can create life, but is there any mention that specifically only allows him to create it?

I'm doing an assignment on Artificial Intelligence, and I'm gathering information on the Christian views on creating artificial life. This is purely a hypothetical situation and doesn't relate to any current events.

Andrew Leach

1:56 PM

One could argue that men and women create life millions of times a day. (With a global population of 6bn, "millions" is probably right)

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Yeah, that's what I'm finding with my googling skills as well.

I was thinking specifically outside procreating.

LCIII

@William'MindWorX'Mariager What does creating life mean? Where did you read that only God can create it?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Well, in this sense I'm talking about the situation of making a completely self-aware machine. Upon further reading though, I've come to the conclusion that nothing really prohibits the creation of life in the sense of robots. But not because creating life is specifically okay, but rather, because it's not really life. Without that special something inside, like a soul, it's not really life, it's only just mimicking life.

bruised reed

2:17 PM

@William'MindWorX'Mariager How would you ever hope to measure the difference between something you make mimicking life and having a 'soul'? Say you could build an AI that always passes a Turing test - do you really think that would prove the AI was actually 'alive'? If not, what other possible measure could you come up with?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Well, I'm trying to go a bit beyond that. The whole "Am I alive?" discussion is extremely interesting, but beyond what I'm currently writing. :)

bruised reed

Well in answer to your original question - maybe, maybe not. There's a (repeated) verse in Corinthians that says "all things are permissible, but not all things are beneficial". In other words - if you can do it, then you've been allowed to do it; but it may not necessarily be a good idea.

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

That's great! I just need to support my opinion that it's allowed, and that verse does just that.

bruised reed

2:33 PM

Catholics tend to like making official pronouncements about such things: google.com.au/… Protestants tend to be a bit more reactive - the whole idea of authorative prohibitions etc. runs against the grain for most unless there is clear scriptural warrant to do so

Andrew Leach

There's a question about IVF, whose answer contains official pronouncements.

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Q: Should Catholic christians be obligated to use in vitro fertilisation? If not, why not?

I've been talking with friends about different methods of contraception and the relationship of the Catholic church towards them. If I understand correctly, most widespread means of contraception (birth control pills, condoms etc.) are not acceptable as they contradict God's will (e.g. see Genesi...

catholicism contraception

IVF is not opposed because it's creating life.

It's opposed because it's not sex.

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

That's interesting.

But considering this isn't actually creating life in the eyes of the creator, I'm assuming this isn't an issue with artificial robot life.

(I'm trying to be respectful here, I'm not religious myself, so if I say something disrespectful, please let me know.)

Andrew Leach

2:50 PM

I think I'd agree. Even IVF is not bad because of playing God.

(OK so far :-)

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Alright.

It's a tough subject I think. Especially with all the things that factor in, and the difficulty in determining exactly what life is as mentioned earlier. But still, it's super interesting.

bruised reed

I'm inclined to think that the part of scripture most relevant to the issue are the prohibitions against fashioning idols and whether a sentient autarchic robot would/could come under the rubric of an 'idol'. You might think the answer would be a straight forward 'no', but I think a case could be made that if we are incorrectly assigning worth to an object that is not warranted (eg. claiming something is 'alive' or 'sentient' when it really isn't) then it is conceivably idolatorous.

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I remember seeing something about idols when I was searching. I'll give it a look.

bruised reed

cf. Romans 1:18-25

There's a certain brand of fundamentalism that might argue such experiments could be a gateway to demonization - a fascinating novel somewhat along these lines (in the area of scientific research in the area of altered states of conciousness rather than AI specifically) is The Archon conspiracy by Dave Hunt.

ie What if the 'ghost in the machine' is actually a demonic presence?

fredsbend

9:59 PM

@DavidStratton I think perhaps you should have let the community decide on this one: christianity.stackexchange.com/q/35505/3961

Benjamin Jones

10:14 PM

Thanks fredsbend! The reason I started this thread, was not for political debate. I feel like there are many of us who believe in Jesus, but have found it very frustrating that we can not find a church that accepts our views. We can't ask others who we know because if we do they would rather give us a politically fueled answer. Look at Jesus, a Jew who didn't agree with the "norm" at the time and found his own path out of the temple.

The difference with my case is I don't have a following to create a new branch of Christianity but at the same time I have no where to go. So Where do I belong: christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/35505/…

fredsbend

10:33 PM

@BenjaminJones I understand. You have an odd array of beliefs. That will make it difficult.

Certainly no mainline protestant nor orthodox denomination will be happy about your non-trinitarian beliefs.

Further, your loose approach to the scripture as authoritative is also generally frowned upon.

Undoubtedly, you are looking for a Unitarian church.

You are looking for a church that is also more accepting of varying beliefs within the congregation.

There are a few of them out there.

I'm under the impression that united methodist was one of those kinds of churches.

But that one doesn't do it for you.

Your post also seems to imply that you want a church that does not stress converting the non-believer. That will make this harder, because they will have less info about themselves inherently.

Some interesting comments here: transientandpermanent.wordpress.com/2009/08/22/…

Does Elisha speak?

11:39 PM

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Q: What are the guidelines for church shopping questions?

In revisiting this issue: What should we do with "church shopping" questions? I find that we have sort of supported this kind of question, but we have not laid down any clear guidelines. There is a recent question that was quickly closed by a regular user and a Mod (so only the two): In what c...

discussion on-topic-definition allowed-questions

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Q: We should reopen this church shopping question

Following from this post about the guidelines of church shopping questions, I'm requesting that the community vote to reopen this specific church shopping question: In what churches does this set of beliefs and behaviors best fit? If you happen to think it should remain closed please explain yo...

discussion specific-question reopen-request

David Stratton

11:50 PM

@fredsbend Looks good after the edits. I just voted to reopen, thanks!

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