English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2013-01-24 (page 1 of 2)

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12:37 AM

Would a question about whether "before my grammar police friends checked in" vs "before my grammar police friends check in" (check vs checked) be an appropriat equestion here?

0

Q: Where does the word "valuable" fit best?

Which sentence sounds better or correct ? I have acquired many characteristics that will play a valuable role in my profession. I have acquired many characteristics that will be valuable in my profession.

word-choice grammar word-usage sentence-structure

Can we ship this to ELL?

@Robusto No migrations to private betas, but it seems appropriate to refer the OP there.

1 hour later…

1:50 AM

Woohoo!

It is alive!

2:40 AM

+1 The reason why though and enough can't be written *thu and *enu is obviously that they are not pronounced /u/, unlike through. I can't think of any other very common words ending on -ough and pronounced -/u/. // You might want to stress a little more that spelling thru is a really bad idea nearly everywhere, including most of the Internet, e-mails, school, etc. People may think, "oh, I'm not writing to my professor, so it's informal", whereas "informal" in linguistics is sometimes a bit of a euphemism for what others call bad spelling, ignorant, wrong, as it is in this case. — Cerberus 1 min ago

2 hours later…

4:58 AM

@MετάEd It is because it shows up in other places, and it would be nice if it were curly there too.

1 hour later…

6:04 AM

user image

4 hours later…

9:40 AM

@Cerberus nice gif.

Thanks.

I didn't make it.

@Cerberus When did the ELL chatroom open?

I don't know? Probably when the beta started.

Which was yesterday.

Oh, I found it: first message 2013-01-23

nods

9:50 AM

But the room does not have an owner?

I know no more than you!

Here. Do you know how I can apply?

user19161

@skullpatrol Apply for what?

@JasonBourne Ownership of the ELL chat room.

Oh, I have no idea.

10:03 AM

Ownership is awarded automatically.

I am the owner of this room. I never applied.

Mar 3 '11 at 10:44, by Feeds

RegDwight has been automatically appointed as owner of this room.

Oh, thanks for the information.

If you create a room yourself (you need reps for that privilege), then you're the owner, and can add other owners.

No owner is listed here?

Because that's an automatically created room. The default room.

@RegDwighт I was made co-owner of a room.

10:09 AM

It can't assign owners right from the start because it doesn't even know who will visit it at all.

Can't it be telepathic? Or propathic?

@Cerberus well now that I am an owner of this room I guess I could make you an owner, too. But first I had to be made an owner myself.

Yeah OK.

Not that there is any benefit to owning a room anyway.

You get pie and hookers.

Twice a day.

(hookers)

10:11 AM

It's a secret, though. No wonder you didn't know.

I can't even eat twice a day...

And free STDs too?

Then how often do you eat?

Once.

Why?

Lazy.

10:20 AM

I see.

1 hour later…

11:45 AM

@RegDwighт Hmmph. I get pie and hookers whenever I want. Twice a day? That sounds like a jailhouse regimen.

12:39 PM

@Reg

This might be more appropriate for EL&U. — KitFox 20 secs ago

giggles

runs away

I saw that, but not who posted it.

@Robusto well, yes.

Your point being?

Nothing. If you can manage on pie and hookers twice a day then good on you, mate.

That's inmate for you, friendo.

Jinx with @Matt on ELL in comments!

Matt Эллен

oh! ace :D

12:51 PM

@RegDwighт Don't go all Anton Chigur on me now.

@Robusto six seconds. I'll allow that.

It is not your place to allow or disallow.

11

A: "Loose" and "lose" - how to remember?

Lose has lost one of it's o's. Loose has an extra o, like an extra hole in a loose knot. (Honestly, though, remembering just the first one should be enough to get you through everyday life).

It's.

@waiwai933.

Or you could just remember it.

Depends on what the meaning of "you" is.

Matt Эллен

12:59 PM

It all depends

everything depends

You loost my attention.

Thou gelostst meyn.

That's looser talk.

Sorry, I meant frankfurter on main.

My spelling is shakeitsassy.

Frankfurter-on-Mein-Kampf.

1:02 PM

Better than Krampf.

But they frequently cook Frankfurters with Dampf.

Who is Charley Horse?

He is your uncle.

@Robusto and then they mampf.

I'm out of -mpf endings. Harrumph.

1:03 PM

@Robusto that would be Bob the Baumeister.

Matt Эллен

@RegDwighт apparently it's a part of the body

google images suggests the calf muscle

The thing with "apparent" is...

...is that it's just a misspelling of "a parent".

@MattЭллен anyhoo it's marked "(Amer.) [Coll]" in LEO.

Matt Эллен

who is LEO?

dict.leo.org/…

"Ein Online-Service der LEO GmbH".

That explains everything.

Matt Эллен

le online English

but French word ordering

1:09 PM

Better French word order than French world order.

@MattЭллен Law Enforcement Officer.

Matt Эллен

Oh, so Charley Horse is cramp in the arm or leg

Aye.

@RegDwighт That's an oxymoron: French order? Bah.

@MattЭллен He knew that. He's just string-cheesing you along. Again.

Matt Эллен

oh

1:10 PM

Egalité, fraternité, oxymoronité !

Matt Эллен

that'll teach me for trying to understand German

Das wird Dich lehren, Deutsch zu verstehen zu versuchen! Oh ja! Und Slotermeyer!

That'll teach us not to try to understand German litotes.

Das auch.

Das nicht auch.

1:13 PM

Auch das!

Um nicht zu sagen: auch das noch!

Immer Litotisch!

Litotisch ist mein liebster Tisch.

Matt Эллен

lol

That should be lal in German. Lache aus laut.

Sondern buchstabiert man das Litötisch?

1:15 PM

Rolle auf dem Boden, lachend.

Lachst du doch dein Arsch ab?

Und das Nunstuck. In Bayern! Ja, in Bayern!

Or is it lächst?

Läsch und laß läschen, so die Beatles.

@Robusto lachst it is.

Matt Эллен

1:28 PM

101 1

hmmm

someone's looking for trouble

and I don't mean JA

Hahaha. Or, in Spanish, Jajaja ...

Looks like he has accounts all around the network.

Not a prank targeted at ELL in particular.

174 4

american-english expressions grammatical-number idioms meaning

Matt Эллен

His avatar must have changed recently, then

Hm, I get the "change picture" link when I hover over it.

Matt Эллен

I guess because you're a mod? I don't get that.

1:36 PM

Yes, but I do wonder if it actually works.

Matt Эллен

you're allowed to remove offensive pics

Where's a picture of Joel? Let me try.

Matt Эллен

oh

user image

@MattЭллен I dunno, never did that. How's it supposed to work with Gravatar? Other than writing to support@gravatar.com or whatevah.

Here I can obviously click right away, but that's the new system.

I'd be changing the avatar, but not the gravatar.

@MattЭллен wow.

Where's my two million dollars? Let me try.

Well hmph.

Matt Эллен

cramp?

1:42 PM

British genies seem to work only once.

I will have to keep that in mind henceforth.

Matt Эллен

I blame the unions

You don't know Jack about the Union.

Matt Эллен

You're thinking of John Bull

I am thinking of The Hunt For Red Bull.

And by the I mean Helen, of course.

Matt Эллен

of course

1:46 PM

Oh damn, I completely forgot to ban @JohanLarsson from this chat.

He's been waiting for a whole day now.

Gotta commute. Laitheures.

Lattemacchiato.

Matt Эллен

2:00 PM

user image

Ah, I recognize my living room.

Thank you.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

2:23 PM

so reg

when you build something out of your sorted lego collection

do you have to open a million boxes?

2:43 PM

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 through an endless series of painful iterations, I am slowly approaching the point where I only ever have to open two at a time, and five to six in total.

Average numbers, that is. Of course there are sets that use literally hundreds of different parts, and if you sort by both shape and color, and perhaps Technic vs. System, then you will have to open like fifteen boxes.

And of course I'm talking about my box size. Everyone uses something different.

But basically I have a box with X-colored bricks; a box with X-colored plates; a box with 1x1 plates, round or square, sorted by color, but all within one box, which also includes all the cheese slopes; a box with Technic pins; a box with transparent pieces of all shapes and colors, it only matters they are transparent; and so on.

So if I want to make anything in color X I basically only need two boxes, one with bricks, one with plates. Perhaps a third one with the slopes, and a fourth one with the round pieces.

If I want to build a red car, I need two red boxes, the wheels box, the box with car elements (doors, exhausts, mudguards, seats, roofs), and the cheese-slope box with everything you need for the final touches.

If I want to build the Millenium Falcon, I will need OVER 9000 boxes no matter what, so who cares.

Which means that it's the smaller builds you should be optimizing your sorting for.

3:00 PM

Lego means lego lego?

Leg godt, or something. Play well.

You don't have an account on ELL, @Johan?

Matt Эллен

Marklar marklar marklar

Colored pieces of plastic that you build things with?

Matt Эллен

yes

@RegDwighт idk if I'll create one, not really interested in language tbh :)

3:03 PM

Ah okay.

I just thought you missed the train.

why missed?

And I overheard earlier today that I could invite people or something. Never did that, so need a guinea pig.

@JohanLarsson because your watch was broken, for example.

an invite is required?

Not sure if they only meant chat.

Matt Эллен

I invited someone and they signed up!

3:05 PM

On the main site?

Matt Эллен

but they've not done anything beyond that yet

on ELL

How'd you do that?

I no see link.

Back in 15', time for hot gay sauna!

CU

You're forgetting @Cerberus!

Matt Эллен

user image

it's on every page

3:06 PM

Oh. I have to read every page now?

What a letdown.

Matt Эллен

he teaches English, so hopefully he'll join in

@MattЭллен I expect he'll be there ... he feels he must keep an eye on me there.

Matt Эллен

well, he's not been around for 10 hours, so...

1

3:28 PM

Need some help with what "straining away" means in this case.

> At that moment Sir Henry put his arm round Miss Stapleton. She seemed to be straining away. Suddenly both of them sprung apart seeing Mr. Stapleton running towards them.

Matt Эллен

straining means putting in a lot of effort

on what? as per the given example? "thoughts"?

Matt Эллен

@its_me sorry, I misread the passage

no problem. please take your time.

Matt Эллен

I think it means that Miss Stapleton was tying to get away, but I'm not sure. She was straining in the opposite direction of the hug

3:37 PM

that's what I though, but the dictionary meaning is what got me confused

Matt Эллен

are Miss Stapleton and Sir Henry involved in an illicit affair?

...in the beginning of... :)

> Our friend, Sir Henry, and the lady had halted on the path and were standing deeply absorbed in their conversation, when I was suddenly aware that I was not the only witness of their interview. A wisp of green floating in the air caught my eye, and another glance showed me that it was carried on a stick by a man who was moving among the broken ground. It was Stapleton with his butterfly-net.

Matt Эллен

oh

> He was very much closer to the pair than I was, and he appeared to be moving in their direction. At this instant Sir Henry suddenly drew Miss Stapleton to his side. His arm was round her, but it seemed to me that she was straining away from him with her face averted. He stooped his head to hers, and she raised one hand as if in protest. Next moment I saw them spring apart and turn hurriedly round. Stapleton was the cause of the interruption. He was running wildly towards

> them, his absurd net dangling behind him.

What I quoted above is from The Hound of the Baskervilles.

3:38 PM

I don't have it that way in my book. Damn book!

the phrasing is different

I think mine's abridged version :(

That is plausible.

@MετάEd Must thank you. That cleared the confusion

4:05 PM

@MattЭллен It also means removing the liquid from a foodstuff, e.g., noodles.

1 hour later…

Matt Эллен

5:07 PM

kablam

Commute.

Hi

@tchrist

@RegDwighт

How are you?

1 hour later…

6:37 PM

@RegDwighт Thanks; fixed.

@Sudhir I am fine, thanks. Are you participating in the new English Learners site?

7:02 PM

I am an evil person.

I am not being nice to mcalex. Then again, he's not being helpful to the pineapples.

Alas.

Are you the one who thought it would be a good idea to include videos in the training that's inside the livemeeting that I'm in?

@aediaλ well I will say this much: I certainly am one of the people who did nothing to prevent them from being included.

Because I can tell you they are playing so well inside there over the VPN...

VPN? Very puny network?

Exactly.

7:06 PM

Well whajur problem, then — it does have to live up to its name.

Some of the videos appear to be on links that should be publicly accessible, too, but which no one sent us ahead of time so we could actually watch more than a few frames.

I'm just going to imagine that everyone on the phone who's getting told to mute is trying to point this out and is getting shouted down. Got to hold on to my sanity through this somehow.

Matt Эллен

pretend you're talking to walruses and that they're planning a tea party

user19161

Is ELL working?

Like a charm.

Matt Эллен

yes. we are solving the problem of people not understanding English

7:10 PM

Except some people talk nonsense.

And it's not the non-native speakers.

user19161

Oh guys, I am seriously contemplating whether to delete my ELU account, so don't be too surprised if I do.

How come?

And what's the point?

It's not like it's tied to your social security number.

You can just stop visiting the main site and hang out in chat. Same effect.

user19161

Well, I just want to keep one account. I just dislike having accounts lying around.

user19161

But anyway, I will think about it a few more days.

Does... not... compute.

user19161

7:12 PM

Anyway, it's not because of some problem I have with the site.

You want to have just one account on the whole of the entirety of the Internets?

user19161

And, all my posts are still here, I am not going to delete them or anything.

Yeah but all your votes will be gone.

Matt Эллен

user image

user19161

@MattЭллен What is that?

7:13 PM

Actually I recently ran into an MSO post that said pretty please change this so votes are not deleted.

Matt Эллен

some sort of test

probably in a text book

user19161

Now I just hope TPTB won't ask me too many questions when I ask for deletion.

user19161

@RegDwighт Yeah, I think people have also given reasons why votes should be deleted. One is to prevent sockpuppets.

They will. Like, and who are you? Or, WHUT? Or, what was the name of Ivan the IV's brother?

You will have three seconds to answer all questions. Otherwise your account will be reduplicated.

user19161

I mean, it's just deleting an account. What's the big deal?

user19161

7:17 PM

Nobody lost any life or money or answers or questions.

@JasonBourne the deal is, as the question explained, that votes are a crucial information. It's our currency. It's what makes and breaks the site.

You can be an evil spammer but if your account gets deleted, your spam answers still stay. And you can be a well-meaning user but if your account gets deleted, all your upvotes that we used to separate wheat from chuff are gone, never to return.

user19161

Wow, you can be a salesman.

user19161

Salesmen mess with people's minds, not shrinks.

Salesmen only sell fridges to polar bears. Noobs. I can sell a salesman to a salesman.

user19161

Why should you buy this television? Because ...

7:19 PM

Tweened again.

user19161

But do the SE folks have the right not to delete your account?

user19161

I think they would oblige anyone, just that they might ask many questions.

Well they certainly have the right to talk you out of it.

user19161

Yes, they do.

And whatever you publish, is published under a license. So I can use it forever, and make money off it.

user19161

7:21 PM

Sure, that's not relevant here.

More to the point, I can only make money off of it if I do mention your name!

user19161

Hahaha, so funny.

So it's at that point that you might as well never bother deleting your account.

Because I will spend the rest of my life going, Jasper said this, Jasper said that.

user19161

By the way, who handles deletion?

Chtulhu.

user19161

7:23 PM

They usually use a generic SE address to email about this, with no name.

user19161

I guess it's a team and they work in the name of the team.

Nah. It's the turrets.

user19161

@aedia I am sorry I mistook you for your hubby!

Hehe, no worries.

user19161

Similarly, there are some singers you can't tell is male or female until you have listened to 9000 songs.

user19161

7:25 PM

Usually males with a superhigh voice or females with a superlow voice.

user19161

@fumble Welcome to this chat.

@RegDwighт Hey Reg! Is it absolutely certain cartogram isn't just another incarnation of our old friend Norton__S?

He is very different to me.

Not better, mind you.

user19161

@FumbleFingers I have forgotten about NS, just let him be.

@JasonBourne You have forgotten about NS because we wouldn't let him be.

Otherwise he'd be in your house now, selling you a telly.

user19161

7:29 PM

@RegDwighт I see him being merged all the time. Used to it.

@JasonBourne he's alive and kicking, I'm sure. I'm guessing from the way this Q was deleted that it was him again.

user19161

He might even post less if we stop merging him.

@FumbleFingers and yeah, the IPs don't match, either.

@JasonBourne we tried that. Not only didn't he post less, he didn't even create less accounts.

user19161

@RegDwighт By the way, have you finally watched Summer Storm?

Frankly, right now it's a damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't.

@JasonBourne what?

7:32 PM

I'm still waiting to see if anyone else cares one way or the other that I reposted deleted question. Which reposting hasn't been deleted, so obviously it was the OP and not the question that caused the action.

user19161

@RegDwighт The German movie I recommended.

Hm. I was there?

I don't remember any such thing.

@FumbleFingers or people have long forgotten about the original.

user19161

@fumble Nice new picture!

> I am seeking answers to a very deep question that sincerely baffles me. Is there within language in General (English being my first language) a third area within the duality of language that speaks of neutrality? Like when blending two colors to achieve a third? If anyone can help me understand the answers to this question, I would very very much appreciate it.

Matt Эллен

woah

7:39 PM

Follow the white rabbit, Neo. Then take the blue pill.

Matt Эллен

and get the fuck out of Dodge

Yeah, in fact start with that one. Make it your top priority. NOW!

Matt Эллен

now?

I'll count down to three.

Seven.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

5 4 3?

jinx

7:41 PM

Uh. Dude. Maths. You suck at them.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

what? why

Where's the six?

Once again.

Seven.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

no I started at 5

And I said you sucked. So?

Matt Эллен

is @reg the bomb who's counter resets if you talk to him?

7:42 PM

But in my meeting they are summarizing, badly, an article I already read. I don't also have time for dodging!

@MattЭллен I have long assploded. The shock wave just takes a little to get over the Arm Channel.

Matt Эллен

ah

Yeah. That Dodge. You should really start getting out of it.

The shock wave will do it no good.

Matt Эллен

extricates himself from Dodge

"It's better explained in the article." Yes, dude. I'm glad we learned that eventually.

Matt Эллен

7:46 PM

lol

@JasonBourne I only got that pic as somewhere to hang my hat (tie, actually) over xmas here, but I've become quite attached to it now. btw - much prefer Jason over Jasper (in my dialect, that's a wasp! :).

Matt Эллен

2

Q: Ask even if the answer exists online

Should one ask a question here even if the answer can be found googling the internet? I asked myself for instance what the meaning of rain check is and where it came from. There can be found several explanations. But should the questions still be asked in order to build a nice set of questions ...

discussion off-topic

for those who aren't following ELL meta, this is quite important

I'll pass, thanks.

I have argued the point both ways, uphill in the snow, barefoot.

I have no idea what the current stance on that is.

I remember how ELU was supposed to be the first Google hit for everything, and I remember how we got Gen-Ref, and I remember everything in-between.

Matt Эллен

but nothing after, that's all a drunken blur

Yeah I am still learning to remember the future.

It's not as trivial as it sounds.

user image

Uh. I'm pretty sure that's a lie.

user image

Unless they expect me to sign up for professional wrestling?

Matt Эллен

8:09 PM

you have the "super magic invisible tags" option on

the check box for it is also invisible

and the markup is written in invisible html

No prob, I'll build me a checkbox out of LEGO.

Speaking of which, I have to resume watching that video. Only 3 hours in, still 11+ hours to go.

Matt Эллен

is it a video made from Lego?

No, a video of two guys assembling a LEGO set each, live on tape, not fastforwarding, no jump cuts.

Death Star, 3800+ pieces vs. Super Star Destroyer, 3152 pieces.

Matt Эллен

I see

The first episode, over one hour long, is just sorting. And then giving up in the middle of it because it just takes forever.

So I have watched the first four episodes now, 2:45ish total running time, one of them is on page 25 of the instructions already, the other is lagging behind.

It's an eerie experience even if you are not into LEGO. Even my wife watched one episode in its entirety. She couldn't stop.

They talk funny shit, too.

Though again, my wife doesn't understand a word of it. So it's not that relevant.

It's just some kind of weird meditation.

Give it a try, see for yourself.

You can start with the first video where they actually start building.

Oh and @Mr.ShinyandNew安宇: all of the above.

I'm at the fifth episode now, where they have an additional challenge: they have to spend the entire episode building while wearing red-green 3D glasses.

The way I understood them, there will be more challenges ahead.

So it's not all just building. It really is like a season of a TV series. With a story arc and cliffhangers and all.

And if you are an AFOL, it has an additional level to it because these guys are like total noobs. They haven't built a set in decades; they can't tell the two grey colors apart (they constantly complain how many different grey colors there are!); they constantly attach pieces in all the wrong places; and then they can't get them off again because they don't know the usual tricks; and they think LEGO comes from Sweden or Germany.

8:28 PM

"I will be out of office for a few weeks on my wedding and I will be back to office on <some_date>." How can I get rid of second "I will be" ?

@0x8badf00d "I will be out of the office from date_1 to date_2 for my wedding."

Or, if it's starting immediately, "I will be out of the office until date for my wedding."

Thanks

1 hour later…

9:41 PM

Got my car back! Finally!

Matt Эллен

"Have you ever run a quarter of a marathon?"
"I've run a half marathon."
"Well this is twice that!"

Matt Эллен

9:56 PM

bamph

I didn't know you could get marathons by the quart. I thought you guys were on the metric system.

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Jan '1324

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