English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Rhodri

12:09 AM

::wind blows, crickets chirp::

Martha

12:22 AM

There's nobody here. We're figments of your imagination.

Rhodri

It figures that my imagination would be this quiet.

Martha

I guess all the people who ought to be sleeping at this hour are actually sleeping for a change?

Rhodri

12:55 AM

They must be. Such dereliction of duty.

Rhodri

1:18 AM

Seeing as it is past 1am, and I have both a cold and work tomorrow, I should join them.

Cerberus

1:52 AM

I was actually discussing the finer points of English composition on the telephone... but now I shall be headed bedwards too. Valete!

RegDwight

10:50 AM

@Martha Pina can't change her name or move to Hungary. She died two years ago. This movie is in memoriam. It's a monument, and what a monument it is. I'm no fan or connoisseur of modern dance by any measure, but some of the choreographies quite literally took by breath away. The movie is stunning. Sometimes kafkaesque, sometimes poetic; inspired and inspiring at all times. Many scenes are just pure, distilled, concentrated beauty.

Robusto

11:27 AM

Morning.

RegDwight

Yeah.

Robusto

Sucks.

RegDwight

How so?

Speaking of sucks, every single answer to this question is wrong IMHO.

2

Q: Is the following sentence grammatically correct? It doesn't sound right.

Possible Duplicates: “A total of 10 babies is sleeping.” v.s. “A total of 10 babies are sleeping.” v.s. “Ten babies in total are sleeping.” Is “a total of 10 payments” singular or plural? A total of 315 questionnaires was received fr...

Robusto

11:43 AM

Yeah. What an awful question to start with.

I saw that yesterday and decided life is too short to get involved with crap like that.

0

Q: Understanding "The Well Below The Valley"

Hi! I have trouble understanding some parts of an English poem. I'm not sure if this is exactly a question for this site, but maybe you could help anyway? :) It's the lyrics of the song "The Well Below The Valley": http://www.kinglaoghaire.com/site/lyrics/song_603.html There are 2 things I do...

poetry lyrics

Off topic?

RegDwight

Um, yeah, very much so, IMHO.

Robusto

I voted to close.

RegDwight

I'm writing a comment first.

Robusto

You da man.

RegDwight

Hm. We don't seem to have a question about the yoda-man yet, do we?

Robusto

11:53 AM

I'm bored. Is it just me, or do the interesting questions seem to be drying up on E&U.SE?

RegDwight

Well, you could pull an Attila and ask a question yourself. "What does GAFT mean?" or "What does HAA mean?" are only two excellent questions that immediately spring to mind.

Vitaly

Hello.

RegDwight

Whoa, now look who's here.

We've been missing you. Sorely.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Yeah, I could do that. If I totally lost any remaining vestiges of self-respect.

Vitaly

@Robusto I loved Strong Motion by Jonathan Franzen, thanks for that recommendation. I can't say the same about Tom Wolfe's novels, it just didn't resonate with me very well.

@RegDwight Awww.

RegDwight

11:57 AM

Yes, yes.

Mar 6 at 14:39, by RegDwight

And yeah, what ever happened to Vitaly? We could use more Russians like him.

Robusto

@Vitaly — Which Tom Wolfe did you read?

Vitaly

And concerning the bucket vs pail question, it bugs me that those words are claimed to be synonymous. I am quite used to the idea that there are no absolute synonyms in natural languages. Settee, couch and sofa are not synonyms either, according to Kate Fox, who claims the first two words are used by the middles and working classes, and that the last word is used by the upper classes. There ought to be a difference between bucket and pail.

@Robusto A Man and The Bonfire.

Robusto

Yes, I agree on the bucket/pail issue.

As for Wolfe, maybe it's hard for him to appeal to a more universal audience as his work is always a satire of American society.

Vitaly

Yes, I found those references to American social life disturbing. I bet I hadn't understood half of them.

Robusto

0

Q: Your intuitions of Collocations of "eliminate"

Hi guys, i'm doing a short project on corpus collocations and i need some human (i.e. yours input) list 10 words that you think collocate with "eliminate"? (e.g. "sun, wave, surf, sand, bikinis, volleyball" are collocates with the word "beach") Pls remember to leave your (a) age and gender (for...

usage word-choice words linguistics collocation

More off topic stuff?

RegDwight

12:05 PM

Geez, what the what is that?

Robusto

Into the bucket — er, pail — with it!

Maybe it's even beyond the pail.

[Waits for thwack]

Vitaly

I think he means associations, and there is a thesaurus for that kind of stuff (Edinburgh Associative Thesaurus here).

RegDwight

@Robusto Stop waiting for it, and it will come naturally.

Robusto

Ah, thank you, sensei.

Vitaly

Too bad there are no associations for eliminate, or else that guy could have used a comment with a link to the EAT.

Robusto

12:08 PM

Haha.

Hey @Reg, did you ever see Tampopo?

RegDwight

Uh, what? Employment Appeal Tribunal?

Robusto

Tampopo

: This article is about the film of this title. For the J-pop group, see Tanpopo. is a 1985 Japanese comedy film by director Juzo Itami, starring Tsutomu Yamazaki, Nobuko Miyamoto and Ken Watanabe. The publicity for the film calls it the first noodle western, a play on the term Spaghetti Western (films about the American West made by Italian production studios). Plot summary Tampopo begins when a pair of truck drivers, an experienced one named Goro and a young sidekick named Gun (played by Tsutomu Yamazaki and Ken Watanabe respectively), happen onto a decrepit roadside fast food stop s...

RegDwight

I don't think so, no. I only know Limpopo.

Robusto

It's really funny.

RegDwight

Well, it must be if Ken Watanabe is in it.

Robusto

12:10 PM

It's all about life and food and death.

RegDwight

Oh. Like Eat Drink Man Woman?

Robusto

No. Way better than that.

Vitaly

"Doctor Concocter sits under a tree, He's ever so clever, he has a degree!" This hurts. @Reg

RegDwight

I have no idea whatcha talkin about.

Vitaly

Limpopo → Aybolit → Wikipedia → English adaptation.

Robusto

12:11 PM

One of my favorite scenes involves an old sensei teaching a young man how to eat ramen. Priceless.

RegDwight

@Vitaly But why?

And what's that EAT thingamajig anyway?

Vitaly

@RegDwight I am by way of being randomly curious about stuff that comes up. When you said “Limpopo”, I felt the need to check whether the English Wikipedia had an article about Aybolit.

RegDwight

Okay. New rules. Or actually, old rules. Either you tell me what EAT means, or I will go Society of Core Analysts all over again.

Robusto

"Hey! If you want to see this seventh card you're gonna stop speakin' f*ckin' Sputnick!" — Edward Norton, Rounders

Vitaly

@RegDwight They were asking native English speakers to produce their associations to English words. In the thesaurus itself, the words are sorted by frequency (how often a given word came up as an association). For example, the most frequent response to English is French (and language is the second most often).

Robusto

12:16 PM

Well, there's a big difference between English and French. Try to put French on a cue ball and you will wind up cursing, not scoring.

RegDwight

@Vitaly Okay, so I figure they never asked for associations to eliminate?

But anyhow, why not just link to COCA?

Vitaly

Correct. @Reg

@RegDwight Because the question didn't sound like he was asking for actual collocates, mostly because there are collocative and combinatory dictionaries available, so why poll native speakers? Maybe it's just me.

Oxford Collocations 2nd and BBI Combinatory are two such dictionaries I know of.

And this: ‘"sun, wave, surf, sand, bikinis, volleyball" are collocates with the word "beach"’

RegDwight

Well, you never know. There are probably at least two dictionaries that explain the meaning of the word "spouse", yet that doesn't prevent people from asking about it here.

Vitaly

Bikinis beach? Wave beach?

Those do sound like associations in his example.

RegDwight

@Robusto: now ladybug is asking me things. "Would it be ok if I only asked for the 'ringing a bell' idiom?"

Robusto

12:26 PM

@RegDwight — How does one reply to that? Eeeek!

Vitaly

0

A: What's the difference between “bucket” and “pail”?

Bucket has some interesting and amusing uses in slang: In its plural form, it can be an expression of unalloyed happiness. It comes from the slang term from having just scored a field goal in basketball. For example, if you had just won something unexpected in the mail, you might say "Buckets!...

RegDwight

@Robusto That's the thing. Right now, I'm trying to compose something along the lines of "if you asked about the meaning of the idiom in general, quoting this poem as but one example, I would deem it on-topic, though some people might object as the answer could be looked up in pretty much any dictionary". Or something.

Robusto

@RegDwight — See? This is why you get the big bucks. And why I preferred to be just another schmuck instead of a moderator.

RegDwight

@Robusto Oh I really wish, I most certainly do, that people would give me big bucks for saying "I dunno" in fifty words rather than just two.

Vitaly

No PollExchange out there?

Robusto

12:32 PM

Well, gotta get to work. TTYL.

RegDwight

CU.

@Vitaly It used to be called Programmers.

3

Vitaly

See you later. @Robusto

@Reg That made my day.

RegDwight

I am here to ~~help~~ make days.

Kosmonaut

12:49 PM

@RegDwight I thought that was the sun's job.

RegDwight

I am the Sun, I am the Moon. When I meet myself, I'm the inscription in kiamlaluno's gravatar.

Cerberus

Blerg.

RegDwight

Gesundheit.

Cerberus

Dänckchen!

Oder sowas.

RegDwight

@Cerberus If anything, it wouldn't be spelled with a ck.

Cerberus

12:54 PM

Right! Stupid.

Perhaps that was retroassimilation from ch?

RegDwight

@Cerberus Perhaps you're from Switzerland?

Cerberus

I would be odd if anglicisms crept into my German (if such exists) even though they were counter to Dutch as well.

RegDwight

Chuchichäschtli

Das Wort Chuchichäschtli [] (kleiner Küchenschrank, Hängeschrank) ist das traditionelle hochalemannische Schibboleth. Dreimal kommt das ch in dichter Folge vor, das südlich der Kind/Chind-Grenze als stimmloser uvularer Frikativ gesprochen wird. Das Wort Chuchichäschtli ist bekannt dafür, dass es von Personen, die des Hochalemannischen nicht mächtig sind, nur schwer ausgesprochen werden kann. Es wird ihnen daher oft zur Belustigung zum Aussprechen empfohlen. Die Volkssage, dass es auch zur Erlangung der Schweizer Staatsbürgerschaft diene, hält sich zwar hartnäckig, ist jedoch nicht belegt. ...

Do click on the audio link.

Cerberus

I know Chuchichäschtli!

RegDwight

Oh.

Then don't click on the audio link.

Cerberus

12:56 PM

I also (think I) know how to pronounce it, lemme hear...

RegDwight

Oh. Then do click on the audio link.

Cerberus

Yes, about as I would pronounce it, except the sch, I kinda flattened that into s.

But this is not standard Swiss German, is it?

When I listen to Swiss radio, it is just regular German with a southern accent, no less intelligible than Bayerisch.

RegDwight

It's Alemannic, methinks.

Cerberus

So it is probably dialect.

Alemannisch, ah.

That figures. My friend from the Alsace is utterly incomprehensible when he speaks that. Might not be exactly the same as Swiss Alemannisch...

RegDwight

@Cerberus Um, I dunno what radio you listen to, but Schwyzerdütsch is absolutely not the same as Bayrisch.

Kosmonaut

1:00 PM

I thought they spoke Elsässisch there.

Cerberus

Though the weird thing is, when you listen closely, Alemannisch actually sounds more like Dutch than German; it is just that I am not used to it at all.

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight He is probably hearing Swiss Hochdeutsch

Cerberus

@Kos: They call it Alemannisch, or at least my friend does, and it sounds Chuchichäschtli-ish...

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Which is even less the same as Bayrisch.

Cerberus

@Reg: Eh I meant the accent from Bavaria, not the dialect.

RegDwight

1:02 PM

Ah. Okay, that makes some sense.

Cerberus

I suppose I shouldn't have used the word Bayerisch, as that would indicate the dialect by default, I think?

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus It could be — I don't actually know.

Cerberus

I wonder what accent, say, old families from Bern use, and what dialect.

Would that be Hochdeutsch?

With a Swiss accent.

RegDwight

Never been to Bern, never met an old family from there, but for all I know, they could just as well be speaking Italian.

Bern

Bern (, , , berndt. Bärn []) ist Bundesstadt und somit de facto Hauptstadt der Schweiz und Hauptort des Kantons Bern im Verwaltungskreis Bern-Mittelland (siehe auch Hauptstadtfrage der Schweiz). Mit knapp über 130'000 Einwohnern ist sie die fünftgrösste Stadt der Schweiz. 349'000 Personen wohnen in der Agglomeration Bern. Die 1191 gegründete Zähringerstadt ist mit ihren charakteristischen Lauben teilweise in ihrer ursprünglichen Form erhalten und 1983 wurde die Altstadt von Bern in die Liste des UNESCO-Welterbes aufgenommen. Seit 1218 freie Reichsstadt, trat Bern 1353 der Eidgenossensc...

"Die gesprochene Umgangssprache ist Berndeutsch, ein hochalemannischer Dialekt."

"In der eidgenössischen Volkszählung von 2000 gaben gut 81 Prozent der Berner Wohnbevölkerung Deutsch als Hauptsprache an, je knapp vier Prozent Französisch und Italienisch."

Cerberus

Yeah, Umgangssprache, no doubt.

RegDwight

1:08 PM

That paragraph is actually excellent.

They have U-Berndeutsch, and non-U-Berndeutsch, and something in between.

Cerberus

Haha, yeah, it is funny that they have city-specific U. We hardly have that here, if at all.

So it appears berner Patrizier won't be speaking Hochdeutsch.

Then I still wonder why Radio Swiss Classic is in Hochdeutsch.

RegDwight

Well, it's like 500 miles away from where you'd expect Hochdeutsch anyhow.

Cerberus

I know, but things are often different in cities, with immigrants, governments officials, etc.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Because it's one of the four official languages and you just don't happen to listen to Radio Svizzera Classica or Radio Suisse Classique?

Cerberus

@Reg: But why would they broadcast in a foreign variant of their official language if it isn't used in Switzerland at all?

RegDwight

1:14 PM

radiosvizzeraclassica.ch/en

Cerberus

I have also listen to the French and Italian versions for fun.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Whaddaya mean, it isn't used at all? It's one of the four official languages.

Cerberus

@Reg: Well, what I mean is a question: who in Switzerland uses Hochdeutsch, and in what sitiuations?

If not even Patricians in Bern would use it, then who would?

And if no-one would, then why broadcast in it?

RegDwight

Cerberus

Based on that Radio station, I assumed that the upper classes used Hochdeutsch, but apparently that was wrong. So now I have no idea any more!

@Reg: But that map doesn't differentiate between Swiss German and Hochdeutsch, which is what I'd like to know!

Robusto

1:18 PM

@RegDwight — When the moon hits the sun the moon goes away.

Cerberus

Unless we are to interpret Deutschscheiz as all Chuchichäschtli... but then I don't get why this radio station should broadcast in Hochdeutsch.

RegDwight

@Cerberus Well, find me a place in Germany where everybody and his dog speaks Hochdeutsch.

Robusto

@Cerberus — German is the principal language of the business upper-classes in Switzerland.

RegDwight

And yet, Germany uses Hochdeutsch as the official language, too.

Cerberus

@Reg: ? I never assumed that it would be everybody at a particular place.

But it should be SOME people SOMEwhere in the country. I wanted to know who and where and when.

@Rob: Ah, you're sure? And you mean Hochdeutsch, not Swiss German?

Robusto

1:21 PM

@Cerberus — Stop whining. You can handle this news.

Cerberus

Nooooo...

RegDwight

@Cerberus Well, I do catch your drift, but I'm afraid you're asking the wrong person here. I mean, I couldn't tell you who speaks Cantonese in Mongolia, either.

Robusto

@Cerberus — Not making the distinction. My brother-in-law works for a Swiss pharmaceutical company and has to spend a lot of time there. He ranks the languages socioeconomically as German => French => Italian. And, of course, everyone above a certain education level speaks English as well.

Cerberus

@Reg: I didn't assume that you would have the answer! I was just wondering out loud, and if you didn't know, fine, of course!

RegDwight

@Cerberus Okay! Cool! Understand!

Kosmonaut

1:23 PM

I have heard that Hannover had the closest to Hochdeutsch.

Cerberus

@Rob: Right, that doesn't surprise me... well, perhaps a little bit, because Geneva is still important and French...

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Yes, that's what them Hannoveraner like to tell you.

Cerberus

@Kos: I think I've heard that too.

Kosmonaut

Ha.

Robusto

@RegDwight — What? You can't tell me who speaks Cantonese in Mongolia? How the mighty have fallen! Woe unto us! Feet of clay, @RegDwight, feet of clay.

Cerberus

1:24 PM

Well, I will gladly admit that Haarlem is the locus of standard Dutch...

Or, rather, the epicentre.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus That may be true, although I don't usually go that far uptown :)

RegDwight

@Cerberus BTW, that Deutschscheiz misspelling is dangerously close to Deutschscheiß.

Robusto

@Kosmonaut — What, not even to Morningside Heights occasionally?

Cerberus

@Reg: Heh, you mean some sort of Anschluß?

RegDwight

@Cerberus No, I mean some sort of Scheiß.

Robusto

1:26 PM

@RegDwight — Was wondering when that comment was coming from you.

Cerberus

@Reg: Oh! I didn't even notice. I thought I misspelled something else.

RegDwight

@Robusto At 14:25.

Kosmonaut

@Robusto Nah. My sister-in-law lives in the West Village so we rarely go above Central Park

Cerberus

@Kos: Wait, what might be true? Haarlem Dutch?

Kosmonaut

You wouldn't believe (or maybe you would believe) how reluctant people from the Village are to going even slightly uptown.

Robusto

1:27 PM

I was accepted at Columbia for grad school but when I saw Morningside Heights I decided I didn't need the Ivy League that bad. (Plus I couldn't afford it at the time.)

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus I was just making a joke about Harlem in NYC :)

Cerberus

@Kos: Ah! Now I get it. Sheesh.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut My understanding is that Americans are reluctant to going, period. Them prefers to drive.

Cerberus

(Silly name-stealing Americans... oh, wait, we did that.)

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight Not if you live in Manhattan!

RegDwight

1:28 PM

Duly noted.

Robusto

The same brother-in-law mentioned earlier did post-doc studies at Columbia and got robbed on the street three times in one year. Twice at knifepoint, once at gunpoint.

Kosmonaut

@Robusto I was accepted at Yale but there was a typo on the acceptance letter so it said I wasn't accepted.

2

Robusto

@Kosmonaut — Happens. They make a lot of typos. Like on the one where W's application was marked "accepted" ...

Cerberus

Aww...

RegDwight

Tipp-Ex

Tipp-Ex is a brand of correction fluid and other related products that is popular throughout Europe. It was also the name of the German company (Tipp-Ex GmbH & Co. KG) that produced the products in the Tipp-Ex line. Tipp-Ex is a trademark for correction products. It has become so popular that it has become an English genericised trademark: to tippex or tippex out means to erase, either generally or with correction fluid. History The Tipp-Ex company was founded in 1959, in Eltville, Germany, by Wolfgang Dabisch. Shortly after that a Tipp-Ex Contribution company was founded in Frankfurt, ...

Cerberus

1:29 PM

So is Central Park considered the boundary between downtown and uptown?

Robusto

Not really

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus It's more of a continuum.

There is midtown also

Robusto

Central Park is mostly uptown, really.

Cerberus

Oh, midtown too...

Robusto

But there's uptown and then there's UPtown. Harlem is way UPtown.

Cerberus

1:31 PM

These terms keep confusing me. Because generally "uptown" means expensive neighbourhoods, but it is also still a purely geographical term. And downtown also means the part of town where things happen, like business and bars and stuff... right?

Kosmonaut

But uptown is also a relative direction, so if I am at 12th street and go to 34th, I go uptown

Robusto

Correct.

Midtown starts turning into uptown after about 60th.

But you can't put a pin where midtown ends and uptown starts. It's just a feeling.

Cerberus

So considered geographically, and in any random city in general, how would you define downtown? Where business and bars are, and few residential buildings?

Kosmonaut

@Robusto Particularly if you live on the edge — if you are on the border between midtown and downtown, then you say you live downtown :)

Robusto

@Cerberus — That depends on a lot of things. It's not strictly geographical directions, except in New York.

Kosmonaut

1:34 PM

@Cerberus It's because of Manhattan's shape that it works this way.

Cerberus

@Rob: Ah that sucks, I knew it... things differ per city.

@Kos: Oh, really? Down as in down on a map?

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Not on an Australian map.

Cerberus

So did these terms originate in NYC?

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus You travel (more or less) south in Manhattan, you are going downtown

Robusto

In Chicago I lived on the North Side. So I went south to go downtown. But people who lived in Hyde Park would go north to go downtown. And in Chicago, the heart of downtown is called The Loop.

Kosmonaut

1:35 PM

north is uptown

Cerberus

@Kos: Right, I see.

Kosmonaut

In more cities, if you keep going south, you eventually start going away from the city. Not in Manhattan.

Unless you swim

Robusto

Well, not unless you can swim.

Jinx!

Kosmonaut

Ha.

RegDwight

Bah.

Cerberus

1:36 PM

Ah... but there must be more cities with similar geography, like New Orleans?

RegDwight

As if you don't have enough coke already.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus But Manhattan is also long.

Robusto

I never have enough.

Kosmonaut

So you can't go very far east or west.

Robusto

BRB bagels.

RegDwight

1:36 PM

@Kosmonaut Not if you're Marge Simpson.

Cerberus

@Kos: Right, so it is uniquely apt for Manhattan.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus So the city is confined to a particularly linear structure.

Cerberus

I wonder, how old are these terms anyway, uptown and downtown?

Kosmonaut

In general, or as they apply to Manhattan?

Cerberus

In general?

I will look them up in the OED when I get home...

I have heard them in England, but somehow they have an American ring?

Kosmonaut

1:38 PM

Mid-1800s

Cerberus

Ah, ok.

Vitaly

The OED: 1802 and 1835, respectively.

RegDwight

I have a much better question for @Kosmonaut. "Do Fahrenheit and Celsius have the same symbol?"

Kosmonaut

Interestingly, uptown came first

RegDwight

1

Q: How to correctly specify a range of temperatures in both Fahrenheit and Celsius?

Current icky wording: ... they do best in temperatures between 40 and 125 degrees F. ( 5 and 52 degrees C ) Using the "degree" symbol seems correct, but in a range should it be specified for each? Do Fahrenheit and Celsius have the same symbol? 40º - 125º F, 5º - 52º C

numbers

Kosmonaut

1:40 PM

@RegDwight The answer is: if you are talking about weather, don't waste your time with Celcius.

Cerberus

@Kos: What!! How dare you!

Kosmonaut

Yeah, that's right. I said it.

Cerberus

Freezing or no is the most important distinction to be made in describing the weather!

kiamlaluno

I usually use Kelvin, when I speak of weather.

Cerberus

Mommy broke her leg because she slipped on the ice that was on the road, because she failed to correctly calculate the freezing point in F...

Kosmonaut

1:41 PM

That's just one number. We can memorize 32.

Cerberus

Meh, too long.

0 is better.

Kosmonaut

Or you can just remember that the lowest third is freezing, the middle third is spring/autumn, and the upper third is summer.

Perfect

0 to 100

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut That's as wishy-washy as it could possibly get.

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight You're wishy-washy.

Cerberus

Yes, BUT a single degree might be of the essence when it comes to ice!

RegDwight

1:43 PM

10°F is freezing to some but not to others.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus Again, 32 is your number.

@RegDwight No, that is freezing to all.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Not to me.

Or anybody in my family.

Cerberus

Well... what would be the advantage of F then? 0 and 100 F are pretty meaningless as boundaries concerning the weather...

@Reg: Yeah, yeah, we know, Napoleon and Hitler didn't, and that's why they failed...

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight Well, then 0 isn't very helpful either for your special world where water doesn't freeze at the normal temperature.

Robusto

@Kosmonaut — Word.

Kosmonaut

1:45 PM

@Cerberus 0 to 100 gives you maximum expressivity. Every range of 10 has a feel.

Robusto

It's these silly Europeans who can't do math and have to have everything handed to them in even powers of ten.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut The water does freeze at 32°F where I live.

But I am not water.

Cerberus

@Rob: I'll give you that.

@Kos: Well, every 5 have a feel to us...

RegDwight

@Robusto Hey! What about odd powers of ten? No love for them, huh?

Robusto

Nope. We hate oddballs here in America.

Cerberus

1:47 PM

The first power would seem to be of some use...

RegDwight

See, that is the key. Hate.

Them Americans just hate stuff.

Cerberus

Oh dear.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus Yes, but instead of saying "the weather is in the 60s today. Nice", you have to say "oh it feels like 15-20 degrees range"

RegDwight

Haha.

Cerberus

As much as I'd love to discuss hate, I must be off.

@Kos: "in the sixties" v. "around 17" (that is how I use it).

RegDwight

1:48 PM

@Kosmonaut Nobody would ever say that. Nobody. Ever.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus You see? It's worse!

Robusto

@RegDwight — Yeah, so what's your point?

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut How is "around 60" better than "around 17"?

Kosmonaut

It's not "around 60"

It is "in the sixties"

RegDwight

@Robusto I'm just jealous. I would like to hate stuff, too.

Kosmonaut

1:50 PM

And then you can hone in on high or low 60s

Cerberus

@Kos: No! Because it is not the 60 and 70 boundaries that are relevant in "in the 60s", but rather the idea that it is somewhere around a certain point.

Kosmonaut

If you want.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Which is basically a shorthand for "in the 60-70 range", which you just dismissed as stupid.

Robusto

See, "in the sixties" has even pleasanter connotations. It conjures up thoughts of free love, youth culture, psychedelics ... it's not just limited to weather.

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight Where

RegDwight

1:51 PM

@Robusto So does in the seventeens.

Cerberus

Whenever you name a range of temperature, in daily use, it is a weighted continuum, if that's what it called. And if it isn't, it should be!

Robusto

@RegDwight — Ha! How much free love was in your October Revolution?

RegDwight

3 mins ago, by Kosmonaut

@Cerberus Yes, but instead of saying "the weather is in the 60s today. Nice", you have to say "oh it feels like 15-20 degrees range"

@Robusto Very. That's how much.

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight Yeah, that is stupid. You can't say "the 60s" to give that range, you have to list the lower and upper bound.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Tell that to the Romanovs.

RegDwight

1:52 PM

@Kosmonaut That is true of Fahrenheit just as well.

Kosmonaut

@RegDwight No... you say "in the 60s".

Cerberus

@Kos: No bounds necessary, because it isn't the bounds that are useful, but the center, with vague boundaries that don't matter so much.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut There is no convenient name for the 15-20 degrees range whether or not it's 15-20°F or 15-20°R or 15-20°K or 15-20°C.

Kosmonaut

@Cerberus Maybe you commie Europeans think only the center is useful.

Cerberus

Well it is about 10 degrees and sunny, excellent weather for cycling, and I must catch my train. Adios!

RegDwight

1:53 PM

Tschööö.

Cerberus

@Kos: What, the center... yes, we commies could only cooperate with Christian Democrats, not Liberals?

This is beyond my meagre comprehension, and I must go. Bye!

RegDwight

@Cerberus You have to remember that Americans only have a choice between Far Right and Ultra Super Mega Extreme Far Right. :P

Kosmonaut

It should be clear that I will never be convinced that Celcius is better than Fahrenheit for weather, and I will gladly die for the cause.

Cerberus

@Reg: Right!

Robusto

OK, I've consulted with my American friends and we have determined that @Kosmonaut is indeed correct regarding temperature. It's official.

RegDwight

1:56 PM

@Kosmonaut I knew that from the very beginning, I have no idea why Cerberus started it in the first place.

Cerberus

@Kos: And so you shall when you slip on the ice you weren't expecting, because you thought "oh, in the 30s? that will be safe, yeah, 80% chance of not dying, sure!".

Kosmonaut

I've just asked a scientist about it, and he used beakers and scales and lots of complicated things, and determined that I am correct about the weather.

Also he is a Nobel laureate.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut I just asked a different scientist and he showed me in three easy steps how every Kosmonaut is a Commie Traitor.

Cerberus

...who just couldn't accept his prize because of a spelling error in the application form?

Robusto

@RegDwight — Pot. Kettle. Black.

Kosmonaut

1:58 PM

@Robusto Yeah, like I'm going to trust a government-controlled scientist.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Also, Nobel was invented in Europe. Where they use Celsius. Q.E.D.

Cerberus

Ding! We have a winner.

RegDwight

@Kosmonaut Yeah, you prefer to trust uncontrolled scientologists.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Russians don't have real scientists. They claim they invented TV. And they still use vacuum tubes and Jacob's Ladders and stuff like that. Real 1930's Flash Gordon stuff. Plus your hero, Josef Stalin, outlawed evolution.

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