The Nineteenth Byte

Nobody Needs Names

12:00 AM

and i think it start... NOW!!!

Um...

NoHaxJustRadvylf

What are we learning (for great good)?

Nobody Needs Names

I believe it is F##

Does anyone want to start it?

emanresu A

That or Coconut

Nobody Needs Names

Ah, true

You know, what, I like Coconut. Let's do coconut

I totally didn't vote it up in the last second

emanresu A

It depends on availability. Neither @user or @DLosc are here right now.

Nobody Needs Names

12:11 AM

Oh, no

How about we do this

Whoever what to just teach us any language can do it

The first language sorted by upvotes that are both not learned and have their OP currently active is Jelly

But really, please put more into this post

CMQ: should we remove the "learned" entries of LYAL nominations? It's clutteering the page and usually those languages come at the top of the list which costs scrolling time.

9

lyxal

I'd be for that

It's hard to see how many nominations there actually are

Plus we do it with LoTM nominations

Nobody Needs Names

Who's gonna do it? Everyone vote to delete or some mod delete or they delete it themselves?

Aiden Chow

well ill be down for deleting my own lyal nomination

for desmos

lyxal

I've already deleted the vyxal lyal

Nobody Needs Names

ok. i dont think i have to do anything then

"I somewhat deliberately didn't include anything like "The highest voted answer will be used in the event", so that when the event happens we have more freedom to decide which language we'd like"

~~Ah, so let's learn Malbalge (isuckatspelling)~~

Steffan

12:32 AM

i'd say do coconut, but maybe just do nothing today if no one is interested

Nobody Needs Names

I'll start it

Aiden Chow

ye im down for coconut

found an interactive tutorial for it on their website: hmcfabfive.github.io/coconut-tutorial

Zion mycelia adamancy

@NobodyNeedsNames Yes

Aiden Chow

bruh what is pipe forward and backward, confused already

lyxal

Feels like I've seen something like that before

Adam

12:38 AM

Nobody Needs Names

print(sum(list(filter(lambda x: x % 2 == 0, range(10))))) that's terrible

Aiden Chow

@NobodyNeedsNames i mean its just an example

they trying to tell u about the advantages of the lang

Adam

It's not too complicated-- "pipe forward" just means "use this value as the input to the given function", AFAIK

Nobody Needs Names

print(sum([i for i in range(10) if i%2==0])) is quite better

Zion mycelia adamancy

@NobodyNeedsNames If you have a nomination that's been done as LYAL, delete them. Otherwise, if we decide to delete them, I'll just raise a flag on the question and ask a mod to delete the specific answers

Aiden Chow

12:39 AM

@Adam but what about pipe backward

like how do u know when to use what

Nobody Needs Names

@AidenChow that doesn't give an excuse

Adam

Uh, I assume the same thing but the operators are swapped

Nobody Needs Names

@Zionmyceliaadamancy I implied that I did not have nomination

Adam

I'm guessing they are interchangeable

Zion mycelia adamancy

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ just covering all bases

Adam

12:40 AM

@NobodyNeedsNames Personally, I think that's a reasonable bit of Python code

Aiden Chow

@NobodyNeedsNames if u really want to complain about it, print(sum(i for i in range(10) if i%2==0)) works. or what about u scratch all of that cuz its still terrible and just do print(20) ?

Zion mycelia adamancy

@Adam It's Coconut

Adam

...No, it's Python?

Nobody Needs Names

@Adam sure, but for the most important thing don't list a filter if you are just going to sum it anyways

@Zionmyceliaadamancy it's a python sample code

Adam

@NobodyNeedsNames True

Zion mycelia adamancy

12:42 AM

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Imagine your programming language not being the same in Python. *laughs in Jelly ŒV

Nobody Needs Names

~~:61802945 although I do it all the time~~

does it still support non-pipeline

Adam

@NobodyNeedsNames Yes

Nobody Needs Names

ok

> items = iter(["aluminum", "plastic", "plastic", "plastic", "plastic", "paper", "plastic", "aluminum", "aluminum", "paper", "plastic"])

this iter() is stupid

I didn't know this would work too: (print)("Number of aluminum items: " + str(numAluminum[0]))

Adam

In Python or in Coconut?

Nobody Needs Names

Python

and prob. coconut'

Steffan

12:56 AM

what's stupid about iter?

it converts a list to a generator

Adam

I think the issue they have isn't with iter, but with iter being used in this context

Because it makes the code more complicated without providing any benefits (that I can tell) in this case

OldSandboxPosts

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Radiation Hardening Koth [king-of-the-hill] [radiation-hardening]

Steffan

1:42 AM

@Adam In Python actually, it wouldn't work to use iter because of numAluminum[0]. You can't unpack from a generator in Python

Adam

@Steffan The situation that's being referenced is hmcfabfive.github.io/coconut-tutorial/Patternmatch/…

Steffan

I know

emanresu A

2:03 AM

=====ZAuij9iu

cat lol

Zion mycelia adamancy

2:16 AM

Your cat likes the enter key :P

emanresu A

Sometimes it doesn't

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Your cat isn't very good. Mine can hit all sorts of keyboard shortcuts, get devstating combos, and has a natural gift for hitting the close window button on any touchscreen device with his nose

emanresu A

lol

user

Anyone here tried a distro other than ubuntu in wsl?

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Wait, you can do that?

I should totally try that out I'm a huge Fedora simp

user

2:24 AM

Thinking about installing alpine (no real need to but i wanted to see the difference)

@NoHaxJustRadvylf yes but it’s slightly more complicated if it’s not in microsoft store afaik

@NoHaxJustRadvylf why huge fedoras? Why not small baseball caps or medium sombreros?

NoHaxJustRadvylf

@user As in like, performance?

user

yeah

and storage and memory

NoHaxJustRadvylf

IMO the storage and memory savings aren't really worth it for anything other than containers and VMs

user

Yeah but i was just interested

(Wsl2 is basically a vm anyway)

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Oh wait can you have multiple at once?

user

2:27 AM

Yup

NoHaxJustRadvylf

@user Well I mean more like, a VM where you know in advance what you're running

Since you'll probably need glibc anyway for something down the line, and you'll need to install plenty of non-busybox utilities anyway since they can be really annoyingly feature-lacking sometimes

user

Aww okay

NoHaxJustRadvylf

I mean, it's like megabytes, if you want to try it I'm not going to discourage you :p

user

Wsl’s been eating a lot of ram so i was hoping for something that has fewer system thingies running in the background

@NoHaxJustRadvylf true

NoHaxJustRadvylf

@user Yeah I feel your pain there. Crostini (which is basically an Ubuntu fork internally) leaves me with like 2 GB for Chrome OS

user

2:30 AM

Oof

I don’t think it’s that bad on my computer but it is noticeable sometimes

@NoHaxJustRadvylf how much ram total do you have?

NoHaxJustRadvylf

8 GB

Although I'm pretty sure not all of that is actually Crostini, and Chrome OS's diagnostics tool thinks that like, a soft "this is how much I'll probably need to don't use it all :3" is it's actual memory consumption or something

Seggan

3:16 AM

@AviFS i was actually considering putting it in lisp form

i am going to do it

ima make an xml based lisp

SXML

SXML is an alternative syntax for writing XML data (more precisely, XML Infosets) as S-expressions, to facilitate working with XML data in Lisp and Scheme. An associated suite of tools implements XPath, SAX and XSLT for SXML in Scheme and are available in the GNU Guile implementation of that language. Textual correspondence between SXML and XML for a sample XML snippet is shown below: Compared to other alternative representations for XML and its associated languages, SXML has the benefit of being directly parsable by existing Scheme implementations. The associated tools and documentation were...

lyxal

3:57 AM

@Seggan that just sounds like XSLT with extra steps

well actually with fewer steps

because your syntax looks way easier than XSLT

for example, XSLT fizzbuzz:

<x:stylesheet version="1.0"
    xmlns:x="http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform"> <!-- Define the XSL namespace to be "X" for brevity -->
    <x:output method="text" /> <!-- Textual output -->
    <x:template match="n"> <!-- Match the root tag n -->
        <x:for-each select="N"> <!-- For each N, which is a number in the range 1...100 -->
            <x:if test=".mod 3=0">Fizz</x:if> <!-- If N % 3 == 0, write "Fizz" -->
            <x:if test=".mod 5=0">Buzz</x:if> <!-- If N % 5 == 0, write "Buzz" -->

Way more complicated than your idea lol

taken from codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/235248/78850 btw

AviFS

5:00 AM

@Seggan Oh wow, come to think of it, I'm totally not surprised cuz I know they have HTML in Lisp for web frameworks.

But I always forget XML itself is actually a thing people care about.

@lyxal Now that just reminds me of Vue. The x-if and x-for. Better still, use Alpine.js. The king.

@NoHaxJustRadvylf Devastating combos. Sounds like Mortal Kombat or something, haha

pxeger

6:00 AM

I had a dream that I went to a hotel, and in the lobby was the server that TIO runs on. Next to it was a display case full of sliced gouda cheese with a sign saying "This is the TIO licence for Wolfram Mathematica, please take one"

9

That's what our cheese discussion yesterday did to me

graffe

@pxeger that's a great dream :)

@pxeger do you still get mathematica free with a raspberry pi?

graffe

8:05 AM

Hello all!

All comatose?

Bubbler

tomatoes

Unrelated String

so at least culinarily we are in fact vegetables

mousetail

Wouldn't we be meat in the culinary sense?

Unrelated String

it's a bad pun

graffe

@Bubbler :) it's s a great pun!

I am feeling good as I have added my first bounty in a long time (iirc)

Unrelated String

8:14 AM

my pun is bad

tomatoes is good

graffe

:)

I still want someone to do study on the effect of bounty size on the speed of new answer

@UnrelatedString currently eating tomato salad every day and wondering if I will turn into a tomato

I mean speed of getting a new answer

I am not convinced the size has any effect at all

LYaL Nominations

8:42 AM

0

A: Language nominations for the "Learn You a Lang for Great Good" chat event

Labyrinth An esolang based on the path-following mechanic. You can put a linear program path in any contiguous shape, and branching and loops are visually straightforward. A typical Labyrinth program looks somewhat like this: )" 10/{:@! .,;: _ { _ ; })"}) 10-9!@ (taken from here) Writing a ...

graffe

@LYaLNominations I am sad I missed the lean version of this

mousetail

12:05 PM

codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/251138/… +3/-3 highly contraversial post

user

12:43 PM

lol I just realized I forgot to add support for audio when I installed Gentoo

NoHaxJustRadvylf

First day of school!

user

This is actually nice, no more worrying about my volume

@NoHaxJustRadvylf :( stay strong

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Nah I like school :p

@pxeger Well don't mind me, RTO needs one of those (grabs a whole handful)

Number Basher

1:02 PM

Literally the worst code ever:

def dayoftheweek(year,month,day):
 if (year,month,day)==(1900,1,1): return 0
 if (month,day)==(1,1): return (dayoftheweek(year-1,12,31)+1)%7
 if day==1:
  if str(month) in '2468911': return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,31)+1)%7
  if month!=3: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,30)+1)%7
  if year%4: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,28)+1)%7
  if year%100: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,29)+1)%7
  if year%400: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,28)+1)%7
  if True: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,29)+1)%7

mousetail

@NumberBasher You have barely seen any bad code lol

That is pretty bad though

Number Basher

I'm actually using this for usaco. this 'might' time out...

mousetail

Why not just use the built in datetime module?

Number Basher

> Do not use any built-in date functions in your computer language.

Don't just precompute the answers, either, please.

OOHHh....

mousetail

Where is this from?

Number Basher

1:09 PM

> RecursionError:_maximum_recursion_depth_exceeded_in_comparison

hmm... :-)

@mousetail train.usaco.org

If it was a car, it would've been better.

PyGamer0

uh so i got 25/25 in my computer exam

mousetail

@PyGamer0 Impressive

PyGamer0

and my computer teacher genuinely thought that i went to tutions lmao

Number Basher

tuitons?

Execution error: Your program (`friday') used more than the
allotted runtime of 1 seconds (it ended or was stopped at 1.359
seconds) when presented with test case 5. It used 14520 KB of
memory.

Oh nooooooooooooooooo lol

thejonymyster

@PyGamer0 what does a "computer exam" entail?

PyGamer0

1:13 PM

@thejonymyster test of my java skills that are being taught to us

thejonymyster

aha

Number Basher

come on...: allotted runtime of 1 seconds (it ended or was stopped at 1.096
seconds

mousetail

"DiD yOu UsE sUfICiEnT eNcApSuLaTiOn" I assume?

Number Basher

1:28 PM

Can anyone tell me why the test case 45 failed this code but smaller ones did not? Thanks

"""
ID: 000000000
LANG: PYTHON3
TASK: friday
"""

from sys import setrecursionlimit as e
e(1000000)
def dayoftheweek(year,month,day):
 if (month,day)==(1,1): return int('01234601245602345012356013456012356013456'
'1234601245602345601245602345012356013456123456013456123460124560234501234560'
'2345012356013456123460123456123460124560234501235601234501235601345612346012'
'4560123'[year-1900])
 if day==1:
  if month in [2,4,6,8,9,11]: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,31)+1)%7
  if month!=3: return (dayoftheweek(year,month-1,30)+1)%7

train.usaco.org/usacoprob2?S=friday&a=NTIJnFIgd12

Here are the respective outputs:
----- our output ---------
78_76_78_76_78_77_77
---- your output ---------
77_78_74_80_76_77_78
--------------------------

Adam

3:55 PM

@NumberBasher It seems like you could pretty easily rewrite that to be non-recursive

DLosc

4:14 PM

So what are we calling a Coconut CMC? CoMC?

graffe

4:24 PM

@DLosc what is a coconut CMC?

DLosc

A CMC that's intended to be answered in Coconut, which we are (I think) currently learning for great good.

@AidenChow I went through the tutorial. It's... not great. (Though the fact that at a certain point the Next button takes you back to the recursive factorial example feels appropriate, somehow.)

graffe

Cool! It does look fun

CMC bubble sort in coconut (as a functional program)

DLosc

Hoo boy, I was going to start with something simple like factorial :P

graffe

Here it is in Haskell in case it helps codereview.stackexchange.com/a/198081

@DLosc Aim high!

DLosc

X^D

All right, but also:

CoMC: Write a factorial function. Must work for all nonnegative integers.

graffe

4:35 PM

bubbleSort :: Ord a => [a] -> [a]
bubbleSort = foldr swapTill []

swapTill x [] = [x]
swapTill x (y:xs) = min x y : swapTill (max x y) xs

What does X^D mean?

user

@DLosc Easy, just write a Python factorial :P

DLosc

@user All right, how many bytes is it?

Because I bet it can be shorter in Coconut.

@graffe Also written as XD

user

@DLosc Oh, absolutely

It's 47 bytes

The impl in the tutorial is 29 bytes ((n)->range(1,n+1)|>reduce$(*))

graffe

@DLosc thanks!

thejonymyster

@DLosc i love the image. hes so happy

DLosc

4:47 PM

@thejonymyster That was a big reason why I picked that article. The picture matches exactly the expression I think of when I see the emoticon. X^D

thejonymyster

:-)

do we have a pin for the lang we're greatly good for learning

user

@thejonymyster It's also the face I make when I yawn

thejonymyster

im trying to find the internrptertr

user

tio

thejonymyster

oh ok :+1:

DLosc

4:48 PM

@user which, however, doesn't work for 0

user

Oh

Hmm, does reduce take an initial argument?

DLosc

@user It does, but it's the third argument to the reduce function.

user

Ah, that complicates things

@DLosc 24 bytes: (n)->n*f(n-1)if n else 1

The docs are really detailed

*26 bytes

DLosc

You can get rid of the (n), which is quite nice for code golf

user

Oh nice, it's more useful than Scala's because you can use the same argument multiple times

DLosc

4:59 PM

The shortest I've found using reduce is 28 bytes

DLosc

5:12 PM

@graffe If I understand this correctly, it seems to work like an insertion sort. (At each stage, you've got a list of sorted elements, and you add a new element to it in the proper location.)

graffe

5:31 PM

@DLosc I think so

Seggan

5:42 PM

LDQ: should "contains" and "count" be one and the same?

DLosc

@graffe Successfully ported in 77 bytes

DLosc

5:55 PM

61 bytes by making it less Haskell and more Python

Or 58 bytes to sort it in descending order

thejonymyster

@Seggan as long as posints are truthy and 0 is falsy, yes of course :P

though i suppose that means you cant [a, b].index(x contains y) since youd get values other than 0 and 1

Seggan

the one problem i can think of is it hanging on inf lists

thejonymyster

special case it? lol

Seggan

thats equivalent to the halting problem :P

i have no idea which lists are infinite

Steffan

you should probably change it so you do know what's infinite and what's finite

at least, what's known infinite

graffe

6:32 PM

@DLosc very nice!

Steffan

6:54 PM

@DLosc ->reduce(i:=(l,x)->l>[x]and l[:1]+i(l[1:],x)or[x]+l,_,[]) for 57 bytes with --target 38 (won't work on TIO because it's too old)

New Posts

0

Q: All permutations of range from \$1\$ to \$n\$

Given a positive input \$n\$, output all permutations of either \$\{0,1,\ldots,n\}\$ or \$\{1,2,\ldots,n\}\$. Examples Outputting permutations of \$\{1,2,\ldots,n\}\$. Input Output 1 [(1)] 2 [(1, 2), (2, 1)] 4 [(1, 2, 3, 4), (1, 2, 4, 3), (1, 3, 2, 4), (1, 3, 4, 2), (1, 4, 2, 3), (1, ...

DLosc

@Steffan Yeah, I thought about that. Never got around to trying it somewhere other than TIO

@Seggan That's going to be true for both contains and count anyway, unless you have a version that assumes the list is sorted (which is probably good to have as well, but doesn't work for unsorted lists). --At least, contains on an inf list hangs instead of returning falsey. I suppose it could return truthy in a finite amount of time.

thejonymyster

7:13 PM

@DLosc really dumb idea: contains assume false, but keeps searching in the background. if it eventually locates the item, it backtracks. anything printed in the time since gets deleted with the funny del character

Seggan

7:26 PM

@DLosc no, contains will stop when it finds an item in an inf list, count wont

o apparently mathematica is included on the pi

Steffan

Yeah I noticed that

It's nice to have it for free lol

@Seggan possibly just have one as a digraph and the other not

graffe

7:59 PM

Has anyone here got a pi with Mathematica on it?

Is it a full version?

What stops you running the OS in a virtual machine on your desktop?

Zion mycelia adamancy

@graffe As far as I can tell, yes

graffe

@Zionmyceliaadamancy hmm

It's about 1000 pounds Norma

Seggan

@graffe me

graffe

So why can't you get it for free on your desktop in a virtual machine?

@Seggan does it work well?

Seggan

never tried

Neil

8:22 PM

@DLosc the query tool for the first SQL database I used turned autocommit off by default, so you learned to use commit and rollback, but most of the other query tools I've seen turn autocommit on, making people lazy.

user

8:39 PM

@Seggan As neat as it would be, no if you have infinite lists

You should see how Husk does things though, many boolean-y functions have meaningful return values that aren't just 0 or 1

Actually nvm Husk doesn't do anything particularly out of the ordinary for a golflang

Zion mycelia adamancy

8:54 PM

@graffe also never tried

NoHaxJustRadvylf

@thejonymyster You've just invented speculative execution at a higher level :p

@NumberBasher I vote yes (if this hasn't already been decided)

thejonymyster

9:20 PM

@NoHaxJustRadvylf ive always considered myself to be on the cutting edge of computer science...

NoHaxJustRadvylf

In practice it probably wouldn't be a super great option since you'd continue iterating through an infinite list forever, you'd just do it in the background. Which means the program still has to run forever (how do you know it won't be found after the rest of the program finishes), and if you contains in a loop enough times things would start getting incredibly slow

AviFS

Any LYAL today?

@thejonymyster I'm ashamed to say I was tempted to do a "your face is on the cutting edge of computer science" here.

thejonymyster

@AviFS Yeowch!

AviFS

@thejonymyster I'm so sorry, I'm a good person, I swear!

thejonymyster

Its ok it is just painful and hurting and ouching

@NoHaxJustRadvylf just dont do that then

AviFS

9:26 PM

Please accept my sincerest apologies.

@thejonymyster I ouch too, sometimes.

@NoHaxJustRadvylf Radcat, what about Trianguish LYAL?

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Oh, was it nominated already?

emanresu A

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ but we don't have much time

AviFS

@NoHaxJustRadvylf Oh, sh*************t.

NoHaxJustRadvylf

lol

AviFS

:(

emanresu A

9:31 PM

Trianguish is a work of art that only Radvylf understands

NoHaxJustRadvylf

Dw, I'm aiming for LotM instead

If it was a LYAL I don't think we'd have time to properly anguish together

emanresu A

oh no

AviFS

Damn, I actually started it. I clicked "add an answer" and it populated with it. Which is kinda crazy since it was about a week ago.

user

@thejonymyster Would be cool to have a language where you undo everything

emanresu A

~~stack cats~~

user

9:37 PM

Bonus points if it messes with user input in a really cursed way

Yeah, stack cats but you can choose when to reverse an effect

~~Haskell~~

AviFS

Feel free to ask me to edit! But don't feel free to not upvote immediately:

0

A: Language nominations for the "Learn You a Lang for Great Good" chat event

Trianguish Made by CGCC's very own Radvylf, active CGCC member and RO of TNB. Here's what he has to say: Trianguish is my newest language, a cellular automaton sort of thing which uses a triangular grid of "ops" (short for "operators"). It features self-modification, a default max int size of 21...

NoHaxJustRadvylf

LotM nomination:

0

A: Nominations for Language of the Month, Take 2

Trianguish Trianguish is my newest language, a cellular automaton sort of thing which uses a triangular grid of "ops" (short for "operators"). It features self-modification, a default max int size of 216, and an interpreter which, in my opinion, is the coolest thing I've ever created (taking over...

AviFS

@NoHaxJustRadvylf 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

LYaL Nominations

2

A: Language nominations for the "Learn You a Lang for Great Good" chat event

Trianguish Made by CGCC's very own Radvylf, active CGCC member and TNB room owner. Here's what he has to say: Trianguish is my newest language, a cellular automaton sort of thing which uses a triangular grid of "ops" (short for "operators"). It features self-modification, a default max int size ...

LotM Nomations

9:52 PM

0

A: Nominations for Language of the Month, Take 2

Trianguish Trianguish is my newest language, a cellular automaton sort of thing which uses a triangular grid of "ops" (short for "operators"). It features self-modification, a default max int size of 216, and an interpreter which, in my opinion, is the coolest thing I've ever created (taking over...

Steffan

@graffe Yes. I'm pretty sure you can't run RPi OS on a virtual machine - it requires the ARM architecture in the RPi.

The point is not that you get it for free, it's that you get it for free if you buy an RPi :P

Well... roboticsbackend.com/…

thejonymyster

@NoHaxJustRadvylf what is a SLOC

nvm i googled it i am dumb

but also wow!

DLosc

11:10 PM

@Seggan ... I think that's what I said (very possible I'm missing something, tho)

Unrelated String

> At least, contains on an inf list hangs instead of returning falsey. I suppose it could return truthy in a finite amount of time.

so yeah that is what you said

and ofc without a sorting assumption it's not terribly useful either way since it does hang instead of returning false :P

DLosc

@AviFS Coconut, although there was never an official announcement and there hasn't been a lot of activity.

DLosc

11:42 PM

@user 18 bytes if you don't mind returning True for 0 factorial: f=->_<1or _*f(_-1)

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