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11:10 AM
i am adding common jelly diagraphs as a single glyph in flax
 
which ones?
 
generate all permutations
Powerset
Split into chunks each of length 2
thats it for now
 
yeah okay I can see how that'd be a good idea
besides I can't exactly say "don't do that" seeing as how 2 of those are single byte stuff in Vyxal
probably 3 if I understand the first correctly
 
itertools.permutations?
 
looks like it
so yeah we got all 3 as one byte
 
11:15 AM
ok i am going on the right track
but i doubt one dyad
> Find up till, find numbers ranging from 1 to x in y.
iⱮ in jelly
 
what's the jelly equivalent?
oh nvm
 
@lyxal ^
 
@PyGamer0 that just looks like [y.find(v) for v in x]
which is kinda useful and might make for a good one-byter
 
oh cool
> 71 iⱮ
its used 71 times
 
because the description of is "Map a link over its right argument."
and i is "Find the first index of element y in list x, or 0."
 
11:19 AM
@lyxal yeah i saw those descriptions
do the quicks map a single atom?
like does use a single atom or a link?
 
links
they use links
 
all of them?
 
as many as they need
 
?
 
most only need one link
 
11:23 AM
@Fmbalbuena that can just be PKα
 
@PyGamer0 for example HH$€maps HH$ to each item in a list
the HH$ is a single unit
 
ok
 
and HH$€ becomes a single unit itself
 
isnt the $ another quick?
 
it is
quicks are just postfix operators
 
11:25 AM
jelly evals them during parsing?
 
it does grouping during parsing
it's like APL's operators
@PyGamer0 quick question: do you know how vyxal modifiers work?
 
no
 
ah
well I was going to say quicks are modifiers but they go after atoms
 
wait i think i know a modifier in vyxal
its the subscript equal sign right?
 
yeah, that's a modifier
 
11:28 AM
it maps the next 2 commands to the top
right?
 
sorta
it applies them to the same stack
but the point is that it takes the next 2 commands
now here's the thing: it can also take other subscript equal signs
₌₌+-* is perfectly valid, and applies ₌+- and * to the same stack
 
wat wow
 
do you see how binds it's commands together?
 
yes
 
and do you see how it can be treated as a single command?
 
11:31 AM
yes
 
that's what quicks do
they bind their commands together
and are treated as a single command
 
oh
 
so in the case of HH$€, the $ takes the last two commands (H and H) and treats them as a single command
and then takes the HH$ command and maps it to its argument
 
ok
 
and different quicks bind different amount of commands together
 
11:33 AM
and the commands are atoms?
commands = atoms?
 
almost
commands are atoms or groups of other commands
 
oh
does vyxal have a single byter (or a diagraph) for Reverse every other element
 
no
3 bytes: ⁽Ṙẇ
is a modifier that takes the next command and returns it as a lambda
pops two items and, when given a function and a value, maps the function to every second item
 
lambdas are functions which are immediately pushed to the stack?
 
correct
it's as if you wrote stack.append(lambda x: "code")
where you replace "code" with whatever you want the lambda to do
 
11:44 AM
lol i already have 23 revisions of flax.md
 
dang that's more revisions than the vyxal style guide
which has had 21 revisions lol
 
some of the revisions is just adding a single command
lol
 
12:01 PM
just another day at vyxal
 
12:27 PM
Did you literally change Vyxal to avoid getting beaten at CnR lol
 
> committed on 27 Oct
no
it was way after
and it was for the rewrite too
the CnR chain was 2.4 lol
 
@DLosc I’ve tried a couple of those out, but you gotta learn the original to really appreciate them :p
@lyxal Then what was this one about?
 
it was the commit where I re-implemented s and because vyxal now uses Rationals, the exploits aaron used would no longer work
call it a belated (no not the caird kind) troll patch
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing I feel like they’d show you the unicode code point instead of rendering the char itself in the error message, and Rust straight up tells you it’s a homoglyph
@lyxal Oh
 
Yeah, one of Rust's strongest points is the error messages
 
12:56 PM
@Bubbler yeah the messages are very informative
not like, SYNTAX ERROR: I WONT TELL YOU WHICH LINE THOUGH AND HOW, THATS YOUR PROBLEM
 
1:09 PM
@PyGamer0 I never used rust before. Can you give a example error message?
 
1:22 PM
@lyxal ngl, took me a minute to understand why you mentioned me in that message :P
 
2:20 PM
when is the next BMG?
 
@Rɪᴋᴇʀ sesy baka
I have achieved humor
 
@RedwolfPrograms lol
 
Ugh most of the flag abuse I can find is by the same user so I can't downvote it all
I've started recovering from downvotes by downvoting 8 flag abusing answers, instead of improving a tag wiki
 
2:50 PM
^ since Redwolf is online
 
I don't know much about tacit, so all I'll be able to help with is code page and built-in choices
 
@RedwolfPrograms me either
 
@PyGamer0 I think your built-ins need a lot of work
Since your language is so specialized toward arrays, you should definitely take advantage of that and increase the number of useful or slightly uncommon array operators
Also, do you have anything like map/filter/reduce? Those are a really important thing to get right in a language with so much focus on arrays
Your digraph choices look a bit odd
 
hmm its a WIP
and that gist was created yesterday
 
Do you have a power-of-two monad? That should remove the need for some of those digraphs and give lots more flexibility
 
3:05 PM
the niladic diagraphs?
 
ok
 
Do you have something like Jelly's quicks?
 
@RedwolfPrograms yes
havent put them in the document yet
 
Okay good, I'd recommend having a lot of those
 
3:08 PM
why a lot?
 
@PyGamer0 do you have an amogus builtin? That's critical for any good golflang
 
do you have user defined functions or lambdas for map/filter/reduce?
 
should be in the code page
 
@AaroneousMiller yes of course
 
@AaroneousMiller oh ok
wastes codepage space
i will add a diagraph that prints it though
 
3:15 PM
You probably shouldn't, people won't take it seriously lol
 
3:47 PM
CMQ: Feature/syntax suggestions for a new Markdown flavor?
 
@AaroneousMiller better table syntax please. I never managed to write a markdown table myself
 
@AaroneousMiller <script>s
<aside>s
<marquee>s
@AaroneousMiller inline pngs
 
How do I get F(x) + G(y) for monads F and G and dyad + (basically an APL fork) in Jelly?
 
4:07 PM
At the start it’s the same as APL but I think it’s an exception
@AlanBagel I quite like md tables lol, html and latex are so hard
 
anyone used tweepy (the v2 api)?
 
Actually latex not too bad
 
@rues doesn't seem to work; at least, not with FG+HJ (with two monads)
 
@rues what is the table syntax in latex
@Anush Not me.
 
4:16 PM
@pxeger Try F+GHJ
Disclaimer: I no know jely
 
@rues same
@rues Yeah it isn't too bad
@rues I think it's better then markdown.
 
More powerful, but MD is nice and simple
 
nah i think latex is simplex
 
@rues I can't see any way to ever apply a monad to the right argument without starting a new chain
 
is the thing discord does markdown?
 
4:18 PM
and I don't really understand chain separators
 
like when you asterisk bold n stuff
 
@thejonymyster more or less, although it's a variant
 
right i figure
 
(everything's a variant though; the original spec is ridiculous)
 
but if you use the app and select "copy text", you get the original text with all the formatting elements
where im going with this: can i unescape these asterisks for a valid answer here
 
4:20 PM
@pxeger actually, FG+HJ$} works (but it's long)
 
the output would look wrong, but if you copied the text itd be the exact right answer
 
@pxeger ridiculous jow?
 
since the asterisks get formatted by discord's markdown, but the raw text should be right
 
*how
 
@rues very picky and complicated with loads of exceptions, so almost all implementations are spec-incompliant in some way
 
4:21 PM
Lol
 
@pxeger yeah you pretty much just do that lol
 
ugh
@PyGamer0 can you give Flax a better solution to this problem? lol
 
if you can get away with using chain separators there's FG+ɓHJ
 
CMQ: Should I use JS or Python?
 
4:31 PM
yes
 
depends on the use case
 
@AaroneousMiller def python for readability
 
@AaroneousMiller I suppose I could also use Vyxal...
I kinda like that idea, actually
 
@AaroneousMiller I sometimes use Japt
 
4:37 PM
@AaroneousMiller Did you mean: ruby
 
@AaroneousMiller Use Jython :P
 
Jython runs on the JVM, not in JS
 
But it has the "J" from JS and the "ython" from Python. My logic is irrefutable :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing Javaython
 
JythonScript
 
4:46 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing C++Script, VyxalScript, JellyScript
 
JellyScript is just Jelly but with JS's weak typing :P
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing How about Dyalog Unicode JellyScript++?
 
Dyalog JellyScript++ on Rails
 
”1+1⁼⁾11
”1_1⁼0
@cairdcoinheringaahing ^ A couple of examples :P
 
@RedwolfPrograms Dyalog Unicode JellyScript++-- on PythonRails ™
 
5:08 PM
Do y'all consider the year 2000 to be part of the 2000s or the 1900s?
 
2000s
 
> 2000 to be part of the 2000s
> 2000
> part of the 2000s
 
Interesting, so would I. So the 2000s != the 21st century
Since technically 2000 is part of the 20th century
 
Depends how you define a century
Is the 1st century 0AD-99AD, or 1AD-100AD?
 
There is no 0AD
It goes 1 BC -> 1 AD
 
5:10 PM
2000s
 
1st century is 1-99
then 100-199
 
@hyper-neutrino That's not a century
 
:p
yeah but it makes more sense in the long run
 
how
 
For the sake of convenience, assume that 0AD exists :P
 
5:12 PM
cuz i think it only makes sense for all the years in a century to have the same hundreds' digit
ez: first century is 1BC - 99AD
 
no first is 1-100
 
Therefore, zeroth century is 101BC-2BC
 
I think calendars will always be janky and we should do as much work as possible to make them consistently bad
 
I say the year the century starts should depend on your timezone
 
@RedwolfPrograms are their calendars that are decorated with sheep and help you sleep?
@cairdcoinheringaahing me too
 
5:17 PM
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

pxegerWrite a number in overflowed binary code-golf math number binary combinatorics We all know how binary conversion works: the sequence of bits $$ b_1, b_2, ..., b_{n-1}, b_n $$ encodes the number $$ b_1 \times 2^{n-1} + b_2 \times 2^{n-2} + ... + b_{n-1} \times 2^1 + b_n \times 2^0 $$ This gives an...

 
^ any feedback?
 
CMQ: Do y'all still wear masks in public?
 
yes
 
it's the law again here now, in shops and various other places
 
5:18 PM
@RedwolfPrograms Depends where and how crowded
 
but I've been wearing them in shops even when it wasn't required
 
If I'm inside a public space, yes. If I'm outside, only if I'm in a crowd
 
@RedwolfPrograms i think it's a intresting challenge
 
I never wear them outside. Should I?
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing this except I'm never in a crowd
 
5:19 PM
If I'm around a lot of people (which happens from time to time, as a major bus stop is outside my flat), then I'll put one on while I walk through
 
A worryingly small number of people still wear them at my school
 
@RedwolfPrograms if i'm just on a walk no, but if i enter a store or go on the bus or go to uni then yes (and also it's mandated on at least the latter two)
 
It's hard to get a good estimate, but I'd guess about 1/8
 
They're required in all of my uni's buildings, unless you are eating, drinking or far enough away from other people
 
a lot of people don't wear masks on campus outside which is whatever but everyone does inside (cuz you have to). also we have to submit proof of vaccination to go to campus lol
 
5:23 PM
We don't really have a "campus", as it's a very city-integrated uni, but for a lot of uni events we need to show vax-proof
 
Wish we had vaccination requirements, or at least just mask ones
Because of course we can trust a bunch of middle and high schoolers to decide whether or not they should care about other people's health and safety
 
@pxeger 10013 in binary is 21 (3 + 2 + 16) not 18
 
my school has just the mask requirements (DC area)
 
Not only are masks not required here, there's a law making mask mandates illegal
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing oops, I put the wrong number through the test-case-generator
 
5:26 PM
In fact, I think a lot of your list is wrong
That'll explain it :P
 
lol
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

GingerIndustriesFollowing the theme of strange kitchen appliances, let's talk about my microwave. Introduction My microwave has a keypad that is laid out like this: 30 > 15 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 +/- 0 S/M I can press the +/- and S/M keys to switch between adding and subtracting minutes or seconds. Th...

 
@SandboxPosts Giving it a first pass in Jelly, I get 10 bytes, so it's clearly not super trivial or super difficult. It looks well specified, tho I'd suggest limiting n to positive integers only, as 0 in base conversion can be a weird edge case in some languages . Other than that, it looks good
Maybe instead of or ?
 
I assumed was basically a subset of so it would be redundant
but maybe I'll swap for
since definitely implies
 
in Tavern on the Meta on Meta Stack Exchange Chat, 10 mins ago, by Smitop
winter bash 2021 site is up: https://winterbash2021.stackexchange.com/
3
 
5:33 PM
Wish we had tag hierarchies
Oh cool!
Huh, I don't remember it starting that late in December
 
IIRC it usually starts in the December teens
 
Does that seriously need to be pinned?
 
no
 
Fair enough
 
@pxeger sorry maybe that was a bit blunt lol
 
5:35 PM
Nah it's fine. Just thought people might be interested in it
 
I think pinning should be reserved for either very important or CGCC-specific announcements
 
I did realise as soon as I pinned it that it doesn't actually show the message, just "chat.meta.stackexchange.com/transcript...", which kinda impacts how useful the pin is
 
Userscript time
 
At least on the starboard, people can click through if interested. Pins should have the relevant info clearly stated
 
@RedwolfPrograms s/or/*and*/
 
5:37 PM
No, I think that important non-CGCC announcements are fine to pin
 
nah network wide things might sometimes deserve pinning
probably only if it affects cgcc, but not necessarily specific to it
 
Speaking of network wide stuff, SE is still looking for feedback on the changes to the Activity page on profiles
 
@hyper-neutrino But only like...if it's life or death lol
 
Fun fact: ROs can find posts they pinned by looking for their own messages in the "starred by me" section of the stars :P
 
@rues As someone whose favorite non-English language is 2000 years out of date, I can't disagree
 
6:03 PM
Interesting, if you try to send a message that's too long and override the JS, it gives you a 500 and not a 4xx
 
If you look at the time between a user's first and most recent Jelly answers, the user with the longest time is actually DLosc :P
Essentially, the user who has been using Jelly the longest is DLosc :P
 
Wait, I have more than one Jelly answer?
 
Apparently, you have 9
 
Link?
 
But I suspect my query may be off a bit, as looking through your answers only shows 1
Run with "Jelly" as the language, and sort by "Tenure"
 
6:13 PM
Yeah, I don't know what it's finding for 2015-03-04.
Especially since that's months earlier than Dennis's first Jelly answer. :P
 
It must somehow be including one of these
 
I bet it's the QBasic showcase
Yep:
- The SEDE query just checks if the word "jelly" occurs somewhere between <h_> and </h_> tags
- It doesn't matter if there are newlines or other <h_> tags between the opening and closing tags
- My showcase post uses lots of <h3> </h3> tags
- I included the following whimsical caption for a screenshot: "0 donut filled with blue(berry) jelly" :P
 
I blame regex :P
 
I blame SQL not having regex. At least if SQL used regex, it would be possible to avoid this error (though not straightforward).
 
I'm tempted to change the html tag thing to only do <h1> and <h2> tags, given that those are 99.9% of the ones used for lang headers
 
6:24 PM
Probably a good idea. Another way to avoid this particular error would be to delete the % after the opening tag. Though I guess it would cause issues for some languages (like not recognizing "Pure Bash" as matching "Bash").
Oh, wait, never mind, that's a bad idea if the language name is a link
@DLosc The initial commit in the Jelly repository is 2015-12-03 :P
 
You're clearly a time traveller :P
 
Dang, busted :P
 
Tell me, where have you hidden the DeLorean? :P
 
Where is the El Dorado? :P
 
6:45 PM
How does it look?
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

GingerIndustriesFollowing the theme of strange kitchen appliances, let's talk about my microwave. Introduction My microwave has a keypad that is laid out like this: 30 > 15 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 +/- 0 S/M I can press the +/- and S/M keys to switch between adding and subtracting minutes or seconds. Th...

 
6:57 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing I don't use a DeLorean ^_^
 
@cairdcoinheringaahing What about the old-style **Lang**?
 
7:09 PM
@pxeger They use <b> tags, I believe, so wouldn't get caught with the current version
@DLosc Do you use a DLoscean? :P
3
 
I just heard somebody, inside my school's (obviously very indoor) cafeteria say "bro, once I get my truck, we won't have to do any more walking in here"
Like yes that's how trucks work
Definitely
 
lol that was fast
 
yeah, i get pinged for that in the mod office :P
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

SpitemasterSum powers to n Each natural number (including 0) can be written as a sum of distinct powers of integers (with a minimum exponent of 2). Your task is to output the smallest power required to represent \$n\$. For example: 2 = 1^2 + 1^3 // Output 3 9 = 1^2 + 2^3 = 3^2 // Output 2 15 = 2^2 + 2^3 + ...

 
Wait no way was the SMP a year ago
Oh my, time's not on drugs, I am
 
 
1 hour later…
8:21 PM
...
(and I can't even vote either way on that flag, so it's pointless showing me that anyway, SE chat!!)
 
oh I missed the flag so I don't know who did that
i should try to modify popcorn SE to show me the flaggers
 
@hyper-neutrino what is popcorn SE
 
I'd guess it was speedstyle, because noone else would really have a reason to be watching that room
 
@pxeger Was probably flagged as spam
Which, it's not, but I could see how someone would see it that way
 
I totally understand that it looks like self-promotion, but I pretty clearly disclosed that it's mine (my username is even in the URL), and it's totally free so it's not like I'm really spamming anything
 
8:34 PM
@AlanBagel it's a userscript that logs flagged messages and lets you see them after the flags disappear
 
@hyper-neutrino then why is it called popcorn? i think flaglog would be a better name
 
@hyper-neutrino Does it do anything other than that?
I have a script that does that exact same thing lol (for personal use)
Why am I getting a "what hot sauce are you" quiz from a college
Is this buzzfeed university or something
 
@RedwolfPrograms dunno
@RedwolfPrograms what search engine is that
 
Gmail :p
 
Gmail the search engine :P
Is it spam?
 
8:42 PM
College spam yeah
 
Trash it
 
One step ahead of you :p
 
Or can you flag Gmail stuff?
 
@AlanBagel popcorn cuz like, you grab popcorn to watch the drama unfold :P or something like that
 
@AlanBagel You can mark it as spam, but I don't want to do that with stuff that's even slightly legitimate
 
8:44 PM
@RedwolfPrograms What is the step you are ahead of me?
 
Trashed it before you said that
 
@hyper-neutrino why not buttered popcorn
 
Nobody said it wasn't buttered :p
 
Salted and buttered popcorn
 
because I fed all of the butter to the bots
 
8:47 PM
@hyper-neutrino hotfix: buy more butter
 
We use our whole butter budget on the bakery
We're gonna make a gingerspam house
 
Make butter
wait gingerspam house?
 
Yep, a house made of gingerspam. A traditional holiday thing.
You decorate it with frosting and gumdrops and stuff.
 
gingerlamb house :P
 
You eat it by breaking bits off and dipping them in liquified spam
 
8:52 PM
You eat it by breaking bits off and dipping them in liquified spam
Why does italicized text only require 1 symbol to delimit it, but -strikethrough text- requires 3?
 
Because chat markdown is big dumb
It should be --two--
Three is just excessive
One might conflict with other stuff though
 
and really for consistency with other markdown syntaxes (?) it should be ~~tildes~~ not --dashes--
 
Would ~one tilde~ conflict with anything?
 
it would conflict with ~uwu~
 

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