The Awkward Silence

A J

5:23 AM

→ 59 messages moved to Trash

Morning!

ONIM

But I got a day off tomorrow, so yay!

avazula

6:08 AM

@AJ :'(

yay for tomorrow!

dhein

6:39 AM

ONIM!!! :D

@AJ Isn't it Morning for you rn? Is it? :P

And Hey to everyone :)

avazula

heya :)

dhein

How was your weekend? :)

avazula

too short :p yours?

I visited a house but I wasn't sure it'd be the one we picture ourselves living in

dhein

Hahaha... too short, too. I did some planning on how to get my plans on track for the upcomming 2 months so I have enough time for myself. x)

@avazula Ahh, any imminent plans of moving already? Or just looking around?

avazula

@dhein ooh, good news then! :)

@dhein I'm planning on buying a house by the end of 2020.

dhein

6:56 AM

@avazula Well, yes and no ^^ Its doable to get to a acceptable point for the upcomming 2 months. I just have to cancel 1 of 2 meetings to get there... Can't really decide which... And for after februrary, I'll just keep writing down "me-time" on some weekends in my planner. It seems to do a really good job, at least so far in theory :)

@avazula Ahhh cool I guess :) Don't forget to check if there are enough plug sockets available :P

avazula

@dhein you know what? I haven't even thought about that. I can't think it couldn't get any worse xD

dhein

@avazula Well.... you are welcome :P

A J

@dhein It was when I posted that message. :P

avazula

@dhein You're right, when it comes to such lengths, planning "me time" in the calendar is more than needed :)

JAD

7:24 AM

good morning

dhein

@avazula To be fair, Tinker (and you?!) is right here, not me. I wouldn't have come up with that myself. And I think this is gonna help me a lot now I considered it :)

@AJ So what time is it for you now? :P

avazula

7:40 AM

@dhein blushes glad it helped :D

CaldeiraG

8:04 AM

Morning :)

avazula

@JAD ooh super cool!

A J

8:16 AM

@dhein timeanddate.com/worldclock/india/new-delhi

Extroverted Main Man

0

Q: How to get relative to respond without coming across as overly nudgy?

About two weeks ago, I reconnected with a second cousin of mine. She was visiting with her family, and although our two families are close, I never had the opportunity to really communicate with her (we live in two different countries). She seemed really eager to reconnect and we started talking ...

Belle

8:50 AM

Morning

Tinkeringbell

Morning!

avazula

Morning all :)

A J

9:14 AM

Afternoon!

Belle

Got to work, felt sick, realize I don't have my medicine on me. Go to lidl, they don't sell it... :\

And there's no other supermarket close-by. Guess I'll have to wait till lunch break.

Extroverted Main Man

9:42 AM

0

Q: How do determine if a girl is willing to invite me home on a first date?

I had a date with a girl. This was a first date. We were in a restaurant in a city centre. As she lives on suburb we agreed that I'll drive her home after restaurant. I left a car 15 min from the restaurant. So I kissed her during a trip to the car. When we arrived to her home I kissed her once a...

dating

Ælis

@Belle Ouch :/ Lot's of courage to you <3

@chump let's have a cat

chumpbot

Ælis

There currently are construction in my office building and it's driving me crazy. It kind of makes me want to bang my head against the walls ><

Tinkeringbell

@Ælis Perhaps better to ask for a hammer and a wall that can go :P

Ælis

10:00 AM

@Tinkeringbell It would be fun to do that :P But I don't think they are actually removing walls. More like they are making a whole lot of holes (don't ask me more details, I have no idea)

Also @Tink, we are the 13th of January and a coworker just said "Happy New Year" to someone on the phone

Belle

@Ælis Thanks <3

@Ælis Heresy! On both fronts!

CaldeiraG

@Ælis It's alright if you haven't spoken since the start of the year to someone

Ælis

@CaldeiraG I know. At least if you are in France and still on January

CaldeiraG

@Ælis yeah :) i mean, if you wanna wish someone happy new year just take the step forward :)

Ælis

Well, I don't like wishing people "happy new year", so ^^

CaldeiraG

10:06 AM

by this time, if someone you know still didn't say anything, 90% of the times there are not friends, 5% they're lazy to start conversations/shy/(insert reasons why not to) and the remaining is they're totally no way to connect to the person :p

that's how I feel

you never know if your neighbor is working on the CIA :p

Ælis

I guess people would feel I'm not really a friend then ^^

Tinkeringbell

@ExtrovertedMainMan Strange question... is that really asking how to determine if someone is willing to invite them? I'm wondering why they think people won't do so if they want to?

Extroverted Main Man

10:23 AM

0

Q: How to have someone work on being on time and communicate it if they're late?

I have completely rewritten this question and deleted the old one. I have a group of friends and one person is often late and gives misleading communication. Twice he made it sound likes he's close and "just parking his car" but takes another 20-30 minutes to arrive. He also tends not to reply ...

united-states friend-groups verbal-communication

Tinkeringbell

@ExtrovertedMainMan Pfft, that's a lot of questions, some of them primarily opinion based, one what should I do..

Ælis

11:15 AM

What do you do when a coworker doesn't want to add tests but their (really crucial) app keeps breaking? And thus, every other apps of the company is unable to perform.

Tinkeringbell

11:38 AM

@Ælis That sounds like a job for managementman!

JAD

@Tinkeringbell managementman uses Meeting!

2

Tinkeringbell

It's super effective! Tink fainted.

Ælis

x)

JAD

managementman uses Team Player to wake Tink up

Tinkeringbell

Tink fainted, so is unable to wake up :P

Ælis

11:42 AM

@Tinkeringbell So, I should ask my N+1 to talk with the N+1 of this coworker, so that they can agree that tests are important?

JAD

@Ælis too specific. Communicate the problem: "no tests", let management deal with how to solve it

Tinkeringbell

@Ælis Probably just tell your N+1 that things keep breaking because X doesn't add tests,? But I'm not sure how much of that is your problem to start with, do you have to a.) fix the broken things or b.) repeatedly spend time figuring out it's this coworker's untested code that broke things to begin with?

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell No to a) but yes to b)

Plus, I'm suppose to make sure that all our app are in top quality. This one clearly isn't...

JAD

so kick it back to development, let them deal with it :P

Tinkeringbell

Ah. Then it's probably a good thing to tell the N+1 that, and like JAD said just say there's no tests and maybe that that's repeatedly asked a lot of your time... then let them deal with how to proceed.

JAD

11:45 AM

how are you organised? Separate team from developers, or are you in the team?

Ælis

I am in no team

@JAD I would. But things tend to break when they are in prod which is really bad and I would like to be aware sooner that there is an issue, rather than later

I'm working on a solution to monitor the bl**dy app, but I would prefere it if I (or the dev) could just add test to it so that it doesn't break in the first place

JAD

tell that to your manager. It's a good explanation why it's needed. If you're not in the same team as the dev, you don't really get to tell them what to do per se, so let the manager deal with it.

Ælis

I'll do and hope it works. I'm not very confident though, I already try that with this same coworker but it didn't give result (it did work great with other coworkers though)

Belle

12:00 PM

Tough situation, @Ælis. Good luck to you.

Extroverted Main Man

0

Q: What do I do with an unsettlingly creepy roommate?

I live with a close friend from high school and a student there to pay rent (let's call him Joe). Joe is a very socially awkward person and comes from a very wealthy family, is addicted to the high of smoking cannabis, and has never done a chore in his life. All that is fine, however, these past ...

roommates mental-health

Tinkeringbell

@ExtrovertedMainMan ^ What should I do...

And interpersonal.stackexchange.com/q/23930/1599 I don't really know what this person is trying to say in the comments, it doesn't really explain much to me. So, eyes-please?

Belle

12:58 PM

DERP. I fell for a phishing mail

Tinkeringbell

Oh no! And now?

Belle

I hope nothing. I'm not sure what the attack was. It didn't seem to be targeted at me.

Tinkeringbell

Fingers crossed!

Belle

It was an email from what seemed to be Sharepoint from a colleague from another department. It linked to the actual Sharepoint website, so I assumed it was just a work thing.

But I didn't have access to the file, so I'm not sure what happened. One of my colleagues that works in the same office as me but it part of the other department got an email saying we shouldn't open the email. I think I'm okay because our department is on a different domain and they targeted the other department's domain.

I thought I was too smart to fall for phishing attacks. Reality check received.

avazula

1:30 PM

@Belle It sounds like a well-done scam. Don't be too hard on yourself.

Ælis

I think my brain doesn't want to work today. It's kind of annoying

Tinkeringbell

1:51 PM

Mine isn't very up to it either... at least not programming. Been discussing a lot of 'how scrum is supposed to work' with our new scrum mistress though ;)

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell That seems interesting. I like discussing good practice with people.

Tinkeringbell

It is but it's also slowly making me think I know more about how scrum is supposed to work than our scrum master and I'm constantly just explaining stuff...

Which should be the other way around, technically

Ælis

That sounds a bit scary IMO ^^' I hope they are open-minded then because some people tend to be very stubborn when it comes to changing their habit (even if the habit is bad)

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, we had a whole discussion about 'Definition of Done'.

avazula

@Tinkeringbell ... of done ?

Lol

Tinkeringbell

2:06 PM

One colleague only wants to put stuff in JIRA on 'Done' if 'it is running in production' because that way 'we can keep track of what is running there'.

But this does mean we lose a whole lot of work that is getting done each sprint, just because it's not something that a.) Will end in something that runs on production or b.) is fit to be released to production (think a feature with development spread over several stories, that will get one big manual test here so ...)

avazula

in Agile methods, 'done' is a synonym for 'never'

Tinkeringbell

XD

But anyways, we have stories that will be developed, but are dependent on other teams so we'd develop stuff this sprint, then set up a test environment and do tests the next... only to finally deploy it to production maybe the sprint after that.

That's indeed a definition that will get us 'never' then, and it's messy and doesn't really give us an idea of how far along we are with stuff.

A story that's on JIRA as 'Test' can simply mean 'not being worked on by a dev'... but it doesn't mean it's already being tested because our tester may still be waiting on people to deploy it to the test environment, or it might mean we're waiting on another team to send us test data (we're only a small part of a chain, and sometimes we need to test the entire chain....)

Having a story that says 'development is done' and one that says 'testing is in progress' might help us keep better track... but that will ruin someone's ideas of using the 'done' column to essentially function as release notes..

And I just had to explain all of that, and we're going to have a meeting about it... but ugh. I'm already tired thinking about that meeting and explaining several old farts what scrum/agile actually means ;)

I'm also a bit worried our scrum master may let them override her too easily because she seems to not understand scrum a lot... so she might just go with 'if that's what the team wants'...

Okay, rant over I guess :P

Rainbacon

The problem with agile is that most places that run it don't really run agile. The very first line of the agile manifesto is: Individuals and interactions over processes and tools

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell "explaining several old farts" -> That's an interesting way to phrase things x) But yeah, I completly understand why you are tired already about this future meeting. I hate having to convience people of stuff when I have way more knowledge in something than they do

Rainbacon

Most people want agile to be a very rigid set of processes, but the first tenet of agile is that if a process doesn't work, get rid of it

So, I started reading a new book and it's really good, but it's also really hard to read. It's a book about the history of autism. The first few chapters are the story of how the first person to ever be diagnosed came to get the diagnosis. There's a lot of backstory about how awfully people with any sort of nuero difference were treated at the time (1930s)

Tinkeringbell

2:17 PM

@Rainbacon This is true too. So my coworker wants this very rigid definition of done, while a more high-level/open-ended one could get us much more insight into our sprints and progress ;)

And yes, it's hard to work agile here, as there are a lot of processes we need to keep in mind...

Belle

My mum works in an agile factory, it's pretty cool stuff.

Tinkeringbell

@Rainbacon Sounds interesting, what's it called?

Rainbacon

In a Different Key: The Story of Autism

I like the cover on my book better than the one shown on Amazon though

Belle

They use scrum as well. They even have velocity and definition of done!

Tinkeringbell

@Belle That sounds nice! And it may actually work very well for a factory, given that we 'practised' agile working in school by folding paper airplanes ;)

avazula

2:24 PM

@Rainbacon 'm currently reading a positive psychology guide on how to best live in this society as an autistic person. It's really well written and has a lot of advice, but unfortunately it's targeting people with severe struggling (which I "don't have", since I've always been taught to mask and accommodate). So I'm not learning much because I don't have to get a job, get a partner, and so on. I'm a bit disappointed I shall admit. But it's still a great book

Belle

@Tinkeringbell I interned there to learn more about management and scrum and such. My school was like "but it's a factory!". Yeah, one that does agile better than any software company I've ever seen.

Rainbacon

@avazula I understand that struggle. I think that you and I (and probably many other regulars of this room who are on the spectrum) are done a bit of a dis-service by the common understanding of autism. Most people see autism in one of two ways: an extreme disability (non-verbal, etc...), or you're a genius with poor social skills. I don't personally know anyone on the spectrum who fits either of those

Most "help" books are aimed at the former group

Tinkeringbell

@Rainbacon I know one of the 'genius with poor social skills' category...

Rainbacon

And most people put you into the latter the second you tell them you are on the spectrum

Tinkeringbell

And a few that weren't non-verbal, but disabled enough to get government jobs/support...

Rainbacon

2:30 PM

@Tinkeringbell I think you've mentioned them in one of your older questions on IPS

Tinkeringbell

@Rainbacon Might be, though if you're thinking Alice that used to ignore me, she wasn't the genius with poor social skills, she was on the disabled and government funded list ;)

Though I might've mentioned him somewhere, now that I think of it...

Rainbacon

I remember a while back @Ælis shared a really great article that explained the autism spectrum like the colors. You would never say that purple is more or less colorful than yellow, they just appear different

Most people think of the spectrum as being a continuum from disabled to rainman

Tinkeringbell

magenta isn't a colour though :)

Noooo! The site is offline for maintenance without first informing me!?

avazula

@Tinkeringbell HTTP 500

Tinkeringbell

Belle

2:34 PM

@avazula http.cat/500

avazula

@Belle It used to be my desktop background image

Belle

@avazula My favourite is probably http.cat/406

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, refreshing gave me an 'oops something bad happened' now.

avazula

Mine is 417

It's actually my GitLab pfp

Rainbacon

418 is pretty good

avazula

2:52 PM

@Rainbacon I love a good code 418 :D

#autoAdOff

Ælis

@Belle xD

This one is funny too: http.cat/412

avazula

El'endia Starman

Any y'all ever seen a 414 in production?

Belle

That black one is just eyes *-*

avazula

@El'endiaStarman only on preprod

Ælis

2:57 PM

@El'endiaStarman I didn't even know that an URI could be too long ^^

El'endia Starman

True story: my coworker and I once looked at a particular client's failing requests to our servers and we saw that 414 error code, which we'd never seen before. We googled it and immediately understood the problem...

Belle

Love those type of problems :P

At my previous job, all the setting up clients needed to do to use our software was kind of complicated. Routers needed setting up etc. (It's legacy enterprise software so not that strange.) At some point a client asked for help because they couldn't use the software anymore. We sent a small team to investigate. Turned out, they had been hacked by Russians and were being used as a VPN...

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman Production no, but I have seen it in a test environment

@Belle "Turned out, they had been hacked by Russians and were being used as a VPN..." I don't know why but this is one of the funniest sentences I've ever heard

Ælis

@Belle Oo

El'endia Starman

@Ælis That's because the limit is in the thousands of characters. :P

So when a request URI is 414 Too Long, it's heckin' long!

@Rainbacon That's hilarious yeah.

Rainbacon

3:08 PM

Here is a good SO post describing the length restrictions on URIs

El'endia Starman

Yep, I remember reading that exact post.

Belle

@Rainbacon That's URLs in browsers. URIs can be a lot bigger. Apache's default limit is 8190, but can be configured to be larger. So it all depends on what your web server is using.

Basically, what I'm saying is, you're very unlikely to run into a 414 in a browser, because your URL length is likely lower than the maximum URI length, but you can run into it when sending API calls.

avazula

@Tink about the shutdown, just saw this

Tinkeringbell

Yep, saw it too...

Still wondering what GDPR has to do with it though :P

Rainbacon

@Tinkeringbell Maybe there's an inefficient query that runs for GDPR requests

Tinkeringbell

3:19 PM

Maybe...

No clue, I liked the tweet that asked for more details... now I can only hope ;)

Belle

3:42 PM

Dunno if you can access this link, I hope so. My cat loves the belly rubs: cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/637751853807042566/…

Ah it automatically downloads, it doesn't go to a video player :\

Tinkeringbell

We're down again.

Rainbacon

@Tinkeringbell Looks fine to me

scohe001

Maybe she meant emotionally? :/

Rainbacon

@scohe001 I hope not

Belle

-insert comment about a rollercoaster-

Tinkeringbell

4:06 PM

Hahaha no, the site was down for a few minutes again...

Belle

It's kind of scary how much google knows about you, even if you don't have an account...

I just googled "tiny int" and the first hit was the Transact-SQL documentation. It knows I use Transact-SQL :O

scohe001

Same with Facebook unfortunately

Just a bummer that convenience has to come at the price of privacy :/

Belle

Oh, my bank just announced that I'll have to pay interest on any money over €2.5 million in my account. Thanks for the notice, bank. We'll talk again when I win the lottery.

Rainbacon

@Belle Wait, why would you have to pay interest on that money?

Belle

@Rainbacon The ECB decided so :\ ecb.europa.eu/stats/policy_and_exchange_rates/…

Rainbacon

4:25 PM

@Belle That seems very complex. I don't see anything in there that explains why the bank would be charging the their customer interest, but I also don't fully understand most of the information on that page

Belle

@Rainbacon The top left number is the deposit facility rate for the ECB. It's how much interest the ECB pays out for their banking services. Smaller banks generally follow that. (ecb.europa.eu/explainers/tell-me/html/…)

You can of course still 'lock' your money in a time deposit, as they still pay positive interests. Or you can invest. It's generally not a good idea to just have €2.5 million sitting in your bank account doing nothing anyway.

Ælis

5:38 PM

106

Q: Thank you, Shog9

@Shog9, a longtime Community Manager here at Stack Exchange, has just Tweeted that he is no longer working at Stack Overflow: @shog9: Well... I suddenly find myself in need of work. If anyone's hiring: C++, JavaScript, C#, SQL + solid background in social software, community-driven developm...

discussion stack-exchange-team thanks community-managers

It feels... very weird :/

Rainbacon

@Ælis Whoa

That is indeed very weird

Ælis

Yep...

Rainbacon

@Belle Ah, and they're paying out a negative rate. I suppose that makes sense. It certainly makes more sense than someone keeping that kind of money in a bank account

Tinkeringbell

@Ælis It is. For what it's worth, Robert Cartaino also seems to have his diamonds removed (there's not yet a public statement from him yet though). And that's really all we know too... I hope to have more for y'all someday but right now I won't even say 'soon' :/

I asked this on MSE chat too but: while it's very natural for people to speculate on what this may mean or why this was done... I ask you not to start any rumours.

I'll be back in an hour or two, I'm almost getting off the train, walking home and eating dinner. If people want to talk, I'll be there after dinner.

Rainbacon

5:53 PM

@Tinkeringbell It seems from the tweet that Mith quoted in the post this was the decision of the company. Do you know if that is indeed the case?

El'endia Starman

@Rainbacon Catija confirmed it was not Shog's decision in the Teacher's Lounge.

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman Yikes

MSE is probably in for a rough stretch then

Ælis

@El'endiaStarman :'(

El'endia Starman

6:16 PM

@Rainbacon I'm pretty sure it's all downhill from here.

Rainbacon

Just saw this comment on a meta post "Another thing, the official Stack Overflow twitter account tweeted to Evan Carroll (who called for @shog9 to be removed on twitter) shortly after, quoting his tweet and claiming that they "finally got it done". The tweet was quickly removed but not before I and others saw it."

user15026

@Rainbacon that is very a screenshots or it didn't happen thing I think

2

user15026

That's very very very speculation.

Tinkeringbell

@El'endiaStarman Heh, and here I was being careful and first checking if I was allowed to say that :/

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell To be fair, shog tweet kind of made it obvious

El'endia Starman

6:36 PM

@Tinkeringbell Yeah, sorry, I saw your question in the TL after I'd already said that here.

Tinkeringbell

6:50 PM

@El'endiaStarman No worries, I'm kinda glad you answered :)

Mithical

@El'endiaStarman Welp.

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell "If you don't want to leak information, make an other mod do it". Is that it? :p

Tinkeringbell

@Ælis Hahaha perhaps ;)

SE put out an 'official' statement...

-27

A: Firing Community Managers: StackExchange is not interested in cooperating with the community, is it?

You all should know that this is very hard for us. This is what I am able to share: As you have seen, today there were some changes on the Community Team. Out of respect for their privacy, we aren’t able to comment on any specific current or former employees. We’re seeking to align the company...

brug

8:05 PM

@Mithical I don't have an account on MSE any more so you only get an uncounted upvote from me.

Mithical

I'm hardly concerned about the votes now... not exactly how I want to be getting gold badges :|

brug

Yeah, I suppose not

Tinkeringbell

8:30 PM

Well, I'll be sleeping. Keep it nice, keep it kind... And see ya in the morning, I guess. :)

Rainbacon

@Tinkeringbell Good night! Hopefully you don't wake up to the world burning

Ælis

8:57 PM

My dad sent me and the rest of the family this link and now my heart is melting. Not because of what the article says (even though it's a good article), but because it shows that my dad in interesting on how having anxiety and depression is affecting my life and because it shows that my dad wants the rest of the family to know that. Basically, it shows me how much my dad cares about me

If someone you love is facing challenges (health issues, discrimination, etc..) that you don't know about, making research on your own and helping educate the people around you is one of the best proof of love one could give

Rainbacon

9:12 PM

@ankii your profile picture is gone. I miss dumbo :(

ankii

@Rainbacon <3 <3

I posted some screenshot somewhere, with my login active, thus the picture visible

once that post dies out, I'll put it back up

or even better one if could click

Rainbacon

Ah

ankii

this too chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/53071321#53071321

sorry for the zoomed in picture, if I went close, they'd look up

They have a sibling like relationship or sometimes mother-child -

Rainbacon

I just want to pet them

ankii

I'll do when I go back to my room.. It's time for bed!

Good night! I'll take a walk from cafe to my room, with Mogwai playin

Rainbacon

9:22 PM

Good night!

scohe001

Another one bites the dust...

Transcript for