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2:01 PM
Q: What to do if the DM ignores all but one player character's backstory?

VarisThe title sums it up but my current DM in their homebrew campaign has centered the campaign almost entirely around the barbarian in the party. The reason this is annoying (or however you would prefer to interpret it), is that they don't actually take any note of any other character's backstory ...

I feel like this question needs some more drilling to understand the situation more. I have so many questions.
@Rubiksmoose I think I disagree (and I'm usually on the Shut It Down side of things)
I am here to answer
@Varis Welcome!
I put up an answer, but @Rubiksmoose's questions are good and I think I can probably improve my answer with more information.
Hello, thank you. I will try to answer as best I can
@NautArch I don't think it is to the point that it is Unclear.
@Varis Hi!
2:04 PM
@Varis But, as a side note, I'm currently at a table as a player where backstories are pretty much not a thing at all (and we're basically players in the DM's story) - and I made the decision to still have fun even though I have problems with how it's run.
@Varis So, did your DM ask for or require backstories?
Yes he has actually asked for backstories to be done
That was the part that irked me, he wanted the backstory but ignored it pretty much
@Varis My Dm was the same way. You can still use your backstory for how you play your character, though.
@Varis Interesting. Ok, have you asked the DM about this or has he said anything about what he intended to do with the backstories if anything?
The biggest thing that has happened with a character's backstory was that they were the only person capable of certain things in the city so when they wanted to go find some specific supply they couldn't actually get it
2:09 PM
@Varis In this case, not the barbarian correct?
@Varis I'm not sure I understand that.
@Rubiksmoose I haven't asked my DM yet but I didn't know how to approach it to begin with
Not the barbarian
Another player
@Varis Sure that is not an issue, just trying to get a feel for the issue and where things stand at the table to inform answers. :)
@Varis What did they have that made the only person capable?
They were playing artificer wizard, so they were the only one in the town
Artificer class*
2:11 PM
@Varis Oh, it was just that they were currently in the town? It's hard to know what was going on in the DM's head, but it sounds like they just didn't want that item found (yet).
It was like alchemy supplies or something, but they were the only one that did that so they couldn't actually buy them anywhere
Yeah who knows, since this is a homebrew campaign/setting there could be lots of DM reasons for that.
@Varis Gotcha - but maybe the DM had a reason for withholding those supplies (or maybe that town wasn't big enough for an alchemist shop?) Not making excuses for the DM, but there may be a larger plan that you are not yet privy to.
But I'll step back and let @Rubiksmoose ask his questions :) We can discuss how to move forward after.
@Varis Given this info, I think that is all that is needed to find out. But, for an answer to be helpful to you, would you want help in how to approach a DM about this and how to ask about the backstory?
@NautArch I think your answer may be improved by coming up with maybe a bit of a script or at least specific topics to focus on?
8 mins ago, by Varis
@Rubiksmoose I haven't asked my DM yet but I didn't know how to approach it to begin with
Just my 0.02 though.
Oh just to mention in relation to the session zero stuff, I am not sure if they had one but I didn't actually join until a little while in due to other commitments
I was given a rundown of what was going on
2:22 PM
@Varis Did the DM have your character sheet/backstory at the same time as the others or did you give those when you joined as well?
He helped me make them when I joined
As it was my first game
Ah ok cool.
That is good background to have. Thanks for popping in here and answering :) I'm hoping this will help some answers. I can't think of anything else I see that would help add clarity or context to the issue.
All good, I'm just glad to have outside opinion on how to approach this
Your judgement can be a bit clouded sometimes when you are too involved in something you know
@Rubiksmoose good idea - i put some in. Do you have any suggestions?
@NautArch all yours if you had some discussion
2:27 PM
@Varis Definitely! Ultimately, I think it may come down to "Am I having still having fun if my initial expectations for the table were wrong?"
@NautArch Looks good to me. Though you may want to ammend the 1st sentence of S0 section because we know that they did not have an S0 with this player at least.
@Rubiksmoose done!
@NautArch Looks good to me! updoot has been shipped your way.
With a bonus checkmark it seems!
@NautArch Yeah that answers the question and it is a great help to have the example questions too
@Varis Thanks for the accepting answer - but I'd definitely suggest waiting to see what other stackizens have to say before handing that out :)
@Varis No worries. Your concerns are very similar to ones I've had.
2:32 PM
@NautArch I'll probably end up checkmarking your answer again in a day or two but for now I will leave it open then :)
@Varis Yeah you may receive additional answers throughout the day. Generally waiting 24 hours is good so as to encourage as many people as possible to answer! Completely up to you though.
I'll definitely see if there is anymore great advice waiting to be posted
argh, love getting informed that it's time to replace our server at work :/
Usually if I get a bad server I just leave them a lower tip. Have you tried that?
@Rubiksmoose It's not bad, just old. Are you practicing Ageism (or am I?)
2:37 PM
No reason we both couldn't be!
@Varis Oh and just so you know, I edited in the information that you told us that I thought would be good to put into your question. In the future, you can enter that kind of information yourself of course! Feel free to change or delete anything that I got wrong.
Yay, looks like helpfulness happened!
@Rubiksmoose I did do an edit with some of the stuff but you seem to have gotten the essence of everything I said, probably summed it up better than I did
Or could have
@Varis I saw that! Yeah I just thought it would be easier for you in this case since you were getting hammered by questions if I helped out a bit.
Happy to have helped and that you approve :)
I feel like I need to take the answer I wrote for @Varis and turn it around to answer this question
Kind of ironic the the inverse question would be asked so soon
2:45 PM
What's the magic sauce one can append to a YT link for it to start at a particular point in the video?
@Rubiksmoose Yeah I appreciate it, I was getting so many questions for info that I hadn't even thought of initially that I definitely couldn't keep up aha
@nitsua60 #t=xxmxxs
@nitsua60 you can hit the share button on the video and then choose for a time to start at
@Varis For some reason this video's share button isn't giving me that checkbox =(
@Rubiksmoose ty
@Varis Yeah I was going to say that as well.
2:48 PM
Yup. Thanks.
@Varis Welcome to chat!
@kviiri Hi! Been here for a little while now though but thanks for another welcome aha
Also, yous username is my second-most favorite bird
Awww not the first most? :(
Crows are the top :)
No wait, that is a crow.
I've clearly been spending too much time looking at my thesis
2:55 PM
A type of crow right?
Can't be faulted for not knowing everything off the top of your head
Howdy folks, I made a custom pathfinder item for my players, and I'd like to get a sanity check to make sure it would function as intended.
Eye slot, divination aura. Resembles a pair of thick spectacles. The wearer can focus on a written spell and they count as knowing that spell for the purpose of item creation feats.
The goal is to let someone (non-wizard) copy a scroll from a spellbook or from another scroll.... Am I missing anything?
> Here's the thing. You said a "jackdaw is a crow."

Is it in the same family? Yes. No one's arguing that.

As someone who is a scientist who studies crows, I am telling you, specifically, in science, no one calls jackdaws crows. If you want to be "specific" like you said, then you shouldn't either. They're not the same thing.

If you're saying "crow family" you're referring to the taxonomic grouping of Corvidae, which includes things from nutcrackers to blue jays to ravens.

So your reasoning for calling a jackdaw a crow is because random people "call the black ones crows?" Let's get grack
... Dear god, I forgot how long that thing is.
@Varis Hooded crow. I've been the one to always confuse varis and harakka and I thought I was over it already but apparently language context switching between Finnish and English still gets me, heh.
argh, I know this shield question is a dupe but can't find it!
@NautArch Yea, seems familiar to me too.
3:05 PM
@MikeQ I am not sure about pathfinder in detail, but my go to questions would be: is there any way already for them to do this? (I'll assume no though)
Would this cause any problems in your game/setting?
@Varis By RAW there isn't a way to do this. To write a scroll, the character has to know the spell, either spontaneously or by preparing it that day. In game, it would give the spontaneous casters more versatility and more ways to create scrolls for the others to use.
@kviiri Still a crow though right?
@Varis Yea!
I once did that "walk towards each other and try to give way to the same direction and shift back and forth awkwardly" with a jackdaw. I wouldn't mind doing it with most birds but corvids are socially smart enough to feel awkward about it too.
@MikeQ Personally I feel that if as DM it is something that you want them to be able to do then go for it, but in terms of maybe balancing it you could chuck a limit on how often they can do it
@Varis Well they can only work on one item at a time, and at most one per day. I may restrict it to creating scrolls, rather than any crafted item.
3:09 PM
@NautArch Sounded familiar to me as well, but I could not and cannot find it. I think I was thinking of one that discussed what wielding meant.
@Rubiksmoose same, and can't find it either yet
@MikeQ Well, scrolls only I might argue makes more sense than crafted items so that could be a good move. With one at a time I am assuming you mean like there can only be one "active" copy?
@MikeQ If it's scrolls that other's can use, just ask your self if it's a problem if (just for example cos I know 5e mostly) the barbarian is now able to chuck out a cheeky fireball during combat
@Varis No, pathfinder has an extensive but consistent item crafting system. Item crafting takes time, and a single crafter cannot be working on multiple items simultaneously.
@Varis That's also different in pathfinder. There are prereqs to using a scroll.
5e has prereqs too I'm just making a hypothetical
3:15 PM
@Rubiksmoose @kviiri Wow, I do not like Crawford's Disarming a Shield option.
Since you said other players
^Cheeky fireball
Thank you Rubiks
I see that you are a barbarian @Rubiksmoose
Someone had to do it. :)
@Varis hah! was it the loincloth that gave it away? I just thought they were "in" now.
@NautArch Why not?
3:18 PM
@Rubiksmoose Mostly because I read it as Donned Armor. If you can Disarm a shield, why can't you disarm Plate?
@MikeQ You could always just say to your players that you may need to "fine tune" the item if it doesn't work quite as you intend, but I kinda go back to my opinion of "if you want them to have it, then just give them it" it's your choice as DM
@NautArch Plate takes like 5 minutes to get out of it. If you could hit it off that would be a very entertaining time hack.
And also shields aren't really actually armor. They are sometimes considered it sometimes not.
@Rubiksmoose I think full plate is like 10 mins in 5e to take off
@Varis That seems more correct. (I was just shooting from the hip there)
@Rubiksmoose It's not like it comes up often anyway
3:20 PM
@Rubiksmoose Hmm, that's a good point. The FIghter is still basically using their Action to Attack and within that Action using a limited resource.
@Rubiksmoose ghost pepper?
I guess the single action cost makes it okay (in that the Fighter is using their action to doff it.
@Varis I figured, but pathfinder has a lot of rules and I wanted to make sure there wasn't some loophole that effectively makes everyone a wizard
@Varis Very true. It has never come up in out campaign and several people wear it.
@MikeQ That's the reason I said that you might need to clarify that you may need to "fine tune" the item, because like you said you don't want to let a loophole in rules make everyone a wizard. So just make it clear, if they are understanding there shouldn't be an issue as they will also realise that you can't account for every situation
@Rubiksmoose The DM really has to be like targeting it for some reason tbh, because off the top of my head there is no real threat that will come up in 99% of cases
3:30 PM
@Rubiksmoose We have a lot of combat encounters during Long Rests - it comes up often for us. And by comes up, I mean I often have to fight with my paladin without armor
My DM probably wouldn't even consider the whole don doff rules for armor if he did throw and encounter at us mid rest
@Varis They'd hand waive and say you're all wearing armor/shields?
But that's more he doesn't know about it
@Varis While I hate it when it happens, it makes more sense than handwaiving. WHat's the point of a night encounter if everyone is prepared as if it's day?
@NautArch That would probably be his first assessment, I would likely then make a comment along the lines of "there's something about it taking time to put on armor, so technically we shouldn't have it on right now"
Unless we all sleep in armor like weirdos
3:35 PM
@Varis pajarmor = pajama armor
@Varis Xanathar's covers this a bit
>Sleeping in light armor has no adverse effect on the wearer, but sleeping in medium or heavy armor makes it difficult to recover fully during a long rest.

When you finish a long rest during which you slept in medium or heavy armor, you regain only one quarter of your spent Hit Dice (minimum of one die). If you have any levels of exhaustion, the rest doesn’t reduce your exhaustion level.
@MikeQ I got it, and I like it enough that I may well put some kind of joke about it in a game from an NPC that's selling armor
One of my army mates did spend almost two weeks without taking off his snow camo suit. Then he emerged as a beautiful butterfly. That stank like a barrel of dead rats.
@NautArch So if you don't need to recover hit die or have exhaustion then it shouldn't be an issue to sleep in medium/heavy
@Varis Yup, but those are guidance for how to treat and not actual rules. Before that came out, we generally ruled you could do it, bu tyou'd have a level of exhaustion.
3:39 PM
@NautArch Huh, am I reading that right? One quarter of your spent Hit Dice? As in, a quarter of the dice spent as opposed to a quarter of one's HD total, but up to the number of spent dice?
Hmmm, gain a level of exhaustion for doing it?
@kviiri Right, instead of getting half your HD back, you only get a quarter of your spent dice back...which does seem odd.
@Varis Minimum of one die implies yeah, you have to spend 8 dice to get two, but one die to get 1?
Oops, meant @kviiri
Yea, I'm surprised at the inconsistency
@kviiri Unless it's just poorly written and what they meant was isntead of getting half back you get 1/4 back.
3:41 PM
That is an interesting kinda loophole
@NautArch I would assume it was as total not spent but who knows
@NautArch Yeah, that's how I'd rule.
@kviiri I'm pretty sure that's the intent, it's just poorly written (shocking!)
Also ffs, two'd think I was good enough of a programmer to no longer have off by zero errors but here I am still struggling with these.
Off by zero just means correct though!
Unless "off by zero" is "off by one" which is off by one :<
3:44 PM
mind = blown
To reiterate an old joke, there are no hard things in computer science: 1) off-by-one errors
There's 10 kinds of people in the world: Those who know binary and those who don't
@Derpy It saddens me the lengths we must go to create rules for simply being respectful and kind to others.
@NautArch I said it on the main chat site just a little ago. This "Be Nice" movement that has probably been started by that infamous Twitter incident is causing some very odd effect
like... I saw people arguing more about which gender specific pronoun an user used when talking about an unknown-gender person than worrying about far more worrisome things.
actually... since we are at it...
@NautArch could you please tell me what you think about this answer on interpersonal.SE?
Especially the suggestions it gives. I think it is very bad, but I had found others doesn't seem to think it that way...
3:58 PM
@Derpy "Don't like your neighbor? Threaten them with violence." Accepted answer. Yep.
I think they've got the right idea about the seriousness of the situation, but... implicit threats of violence aren't any better than explicit.
@Derpy I agree with @kviiri. Calling Animal Control is the best bet, but lying and threats to the woman are 100% the wrong thing to do.
That answer is pretty good up until that point where it makes it terrible.
@NautArch I'm not actually sure if the first one is lying. The fact that she is feeding and caring for the animals might be enough to consider them "her" dogs.
so at least you agree that that is a personal threat... I was thinking I was getting mad when some people told me they don't see any problem with the answer
@Rubiksmoose Not sure, but I'd just tell Animal Control that. Let them tell you what to do.
Whether they are hers or not I don't think is something Animal Control really cares about. In fact, it's probably easier for them to round them if they aren't hers.
4:03 PM
@NautArch For sure. And I mean animal control will come for dogs whether or not they are owned so it really just seems like a spiteful move.
Also the edit to that question just ups the spite. How is this upvoted so much?
@Rubiksmoose can't answer due to Be Nice policy
@Rubiksmoose Because it's Interpersonal SE, the stack's version of Yahoo Answers
@NautArch So should I flag this as Rude/Offensive or custom report since it advocates violence?
@Rubiksmoose Oh, hmmm. I have no idea what standard is on that stack. But I personally think it's flag-worthy because these are real world people and problems.
I guess now that baby eagle is teen eagle, they don't really need the nest anymore?
4:07 PM
@NautArch Yeah I'm going with a custom flag since there are several aspects and I wanted to be specific about which were the ones.
@Derpy Yeah, that's sadly a common thing in internet discourse in certain circles... the assumption that only very explicit threats count. As if "someone should/will beat you up for that" isn't a threat.
So they run around making these vague invocations of harm and when confronted, they step back with their hands up like "whoa whoa, I never said I was actually going to do something like that, I mean, I only said it'd be good if someone did".
But honestly I thought Stack people were above that.
Stack people are still people. We can suck just as much as the rest of the normies.
Yea, I meant more in terms of culture than in individual people.
@Rubiksmoose And much worse on some stacks
RPG stack does teach rather unrealistic standards, yes.
4:11 PM
@kviiri because our focus in unreality
The world where everyone talks to their GM and players
@kviiri I don't though. I usually just call the police on the DM or threaten him with violence. Seems to work well for me. /s
Ugh, I don't play D&D for social interaction. If I wanted to talk, I'd play some multiplayer game at home and hear about how sexually active my mother is.
It's a gamer trope, I guess.
4:13 PM
@Yuuki If that is the level of social interaction you expect/receive then no wonder lol. But if you get the right people with the same goals it can be so much more than that.
tl;dr people are incredibly toxic in online multiplayer games
oh god, i had to mute the eagle cam because teen eagle is so loud during eating time
> "911, what's your emergency?"
"My GM keeps railroading the party."
"Ok. Where are you? Are you somewhere safe?"
"No we're in a dungeon filled with ghouls."
@MikeQ "Have you tried leaving the table and coming back?"
> "I'm sorry what railroad did you say you were by?"
@Yuuki It's 911, not tech support
4:15 PM
@MikeQ Oh my bad. "Ghouls? Undead are a violation of my religion, I'm hanging up now."
911 is like tech support, but for people's lives.
Although I'm not kidding, there was recent news of a 911 operator hanging up on someone who called in response to a friend being shot because the caller used profanity.
That IPS answer is bothering me so much.
Oh and they also arrested her (the caller) for "abusing 911".
This answer seems like it belongs on r/iamverybaddass and as an example at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Think_of_the_children. The answer is quite complete without the veiled threats or the appeals to emotion. — Sam 18 hours ago
4:21 PM
@Rubiksmoose Sounds like the Underground railroad if it's a dungeon
@Rubiksmoose Well I've DV'd it, flagged, and commented. Dunno what else I can do now.
I dunno, I've never liked advice stacks. Wasn't a fan of Lifehacks.SE either.
And that one also went to pot.
Although for arguably different reasons.
We are an advice stack aren't we? (under all the rules questions)
RPG is a weird hybrid (so I can tolerate you guys :P) but also there seems to be pretty good moderation to where bad answers are mitigated rather well.
Lifehacks.SE definitely wasn't moderated well, imo, though it wasn't the fault of any particular diamond.
Interpersonal.SE might be going the same way.
Lifehack.SE's big problem was that it seemed the diamonds didn't really have anything close to a unified vision of what the site was.
In particular, what exactly was a "lifehack" and what were the issues they wanted to handle.
4:28 PM
@kviiri Isn't SO itself an advice stack?
I think that there's a difference between "advice" and an "answer".
@Rubiksmoose Done.
@GreySage Yeah, but I think the implied meaning is more like "life advice" than tech advice :)
@MikeQ Excellent. I can't vote but I certainly reported.
4:31 PM
Like the rules questions have answers whereas most of the "how do I deal with <troublesome person>" questions are given advice.
Sigh... Time to focus on something positive
@Yuuki They're asking for advice, but the stack has standards such that the answers should be based on evidence and experience
@MikeQ Protons, ey?
@MikeQ I'm not sure whether it works for everyone, but when I feel down, I look at this gif of otters under a tree and usually feel better afterwards.
@kviiri Isn't a proton just a neutron pining for its lost electron and antielectron neutrino?
4:43 PM
Finding your missing electron is hard. You either know where it is or where it's going. :(
@Yuuki I've got to admit, I'm a big fan of the high-quality group dynamics/social troubles Q&A we have. The good ones are really good, and we don't really field ones that aren't good.
@Maximillian You don't know much, but you know it loves you.
@Maximillian mumble mumble Schrodinger pulled over for speeding mumble mumble but officer! quantum quantum.
@Yuuki and that may be all you need to know
@Yuuki well at least 95% loves you. It's in a superposition of love and unlove (but is any relationship otherwise?)
4:47 PM
Okay this is a weird line of thought. I tried to picture quantum entangled parents. This would partly explain how my mother knows things I did she wasn't even around for.
@Maximillian I mean for that the neurotransmitter chain in ur brain would have to be entangled with the chain in your mothers (or some other process to ensure accurate copying)
@Maximillian I walked in on my parents quantum entangling once.
If you can entangle whole atoms that could make them "heliocopter parents"
@Yuuki is that like tessering?
@DavidCoffron I don't know what the kids call it these days.
4:51 PM
@Yuuki I think we call it tide pods but I'm not sure
Coming soon: Tide Tesseract. Clean your clothes in dimensions you cannot perceive.
@Maximillian that seems like a colossal waste of energy
@DavidCoffron What if you're meeting up with an eldritch abomination? You have to look the best at your job interview otherwise you won't become a Warlock.
Honestly I'm shooting for Senior Warlock at my level of experience.
@Maximillian I still don't understand how they can expect 5 years of experience with Hexblades when they only just came out.
4:57 PM
@Yuuki just convince a friendly wizard to clone yourself a few dozen times and it'll only take you a few months (#NarutoLifehacks)
rpg.stackexchange.com/q/125588/28591 What....is the question here?
@Rubiksmoose heh, just asked OP that :)
DM thinks Tasha's Hideous Laughter is an overpowered spell since this player has been using it to easily overcome every combat encounter.
Or at least that's what I gathered.
So I'm guessing they want advice on how to handle someone who keeps casting that spell so they trivialize the experience for everyone else or something?
@Yuuki I think they're misunderstanding what the Prone/Incapacitated conditions mean (more specifically Prone and OA)
At least I think that's the question they actually want to ask.
4:59 PM
"I have watched a few games were it has been used before and the DMs there didn't count the creature completely out of the fight"
They think THL provides an OA (it doesnt, right?)
He's asking if a target affected by THL can make an AoO
Also i think maybe they should be told that spellcasts in melee range are made at a penalty as well?
@DavidCoffron Yeah this seems like it to me.
ARgh, I don't think it's about prone/OA. That was a misread on my part.
5:01 PM
OH< youre right. Does an incap target get a OA? No they do not
@SirCinnamon Well they do, they just can't take a reaction to use it
@DavidCoffron I'm not sure I understand the distinction...
@SirCinnamon I don't think it matters in the core game, but I've seen some homebrew that make OAs no longer cost a reaction (which is dumb bc everything is either an action, reaction, or part of one or the other)
But it costs spell slots - If they're fighting bandits they must be level 1-3 or so.... The bard could only cast it... 6 times at level 3, only 2 at level 1
@SirCinnamon and they get a save
5:04 PM
@DavidCoffron Free action OAs? I guess better homebrew would be "Requires but doesn't consume a reaction"
It's a save or suck spell but that's it
Yeah THL shouldnt be OP
Need more details I think
@SirCinnamon that's what i did for my players homebrew monk I helped him design in my current game (limited to wis uses per day)
@DavidCoffron That seems totally reasonable
Well that guy says problem solved, so I guess we will never know
i guess the confusion was whether the target goes prone AND incap or just one
Multiple conditions often cause this kind of confusion, even with experienced players
5:07 PM
@MikeQ yeah. Don't get me started on 4e condition stacking
Well I cut down that question's body a lot lol.
@DavidCoffron One game, we had a trip character and a grapple character, and we had to keep track of the separate effects of prone, grappled, and pinned for various NPCs
4E. Acquire statuses like web pages gain HTML tags.
@MikeQ I mean I'm still confused about how encunberance works with exhaustion (do I half speed before or after the flat reduction)
I don't see a similar question, but I want to double check before posting.

Does Magic Initiate in 5e allow one to craft spell scrolls?
5:13 PM
@goodguy5 I swear that's been asked before (might have been on JC twitter that I saw it tho)
@goodguy5 I'm pretty sure this has ben asked but maybe not all in one question...
yea, that's what I thought, but I couldn't find it
@goodguy5 XGtE scribing rules or DMG crafting rules?
either, though I'm not super versed in XG
@goodguy5 nein
@goodguy5 do you own it?
5:16 PM
I have a pdf at home
maybe on my phone as well, now that I think of it
@goodguy5 Hmm, well this may be the difference between being a Spellcaster and having a spellcasting ability.
@goodguy5 well, DMG requires you to have spell slots
@goodguy5 if you'd like a legal copy, you can email me and I can send you a link to DNDbeyond under my Stack campaign.
who says my pdf isn't legal? :P

I do not condone the theft of intellectual property.
also According to the newly errata'd DMG under attunement (p.136):

If the prerequisite is a class, a creature must be a member of that class to attune to the item. If the prerequisite is to be a spellcaster, a creature qualifies if it can cast at least one spell using its traits or features, not using a magic item or the like.
5:19 PM
(copy paste, so not new anymore)
Q: Can you create a scroll by using a spell cast from a magical item?

Ringo_St RIn the DMG it says The character must also be a spellcaster with spell slots and must be able to cast any spells that the item can produce. Many magic items let users cast spells. For example Crystal Ball says The typical crystal ball, a very rare item, is about 6 inches in diameter. Wh...

@goodguy5 because there are no legal PDFs.
@NautArch not true. I could have scanned my own book for non-distribution
@goodguy5 True, you could. But if you do want a legit access on dndbeyond, I can give you that.
appreciated. already have it via one of my DMs.
and can't get to dndbeyond at work for because reasons
5:25 PM
@goodguy5 Ok, mine has all rules compendiums in case you're missing anything.
I just realized how poor the answers on that question are...
I think he got the full package, as well, but not 100% sure
and @DavidCoffron I still think that question answers "can a Magic Initiate craft magic items with their one spell" as a "yes, they can"
But is it clear enough that the stack wouldn't benefit from the question being expressly asked?
@goodguy5 I think I'd put up an opposing answer
then "no"

then I'll put up the question.
what's a first level spell that would be drinkable/potionable?
@goodguy5 yeah. I'd say no using DMG rules. No spell slots no crafting. But in XGtE you just need to know the spells
5:32 PM
@goodguy5 Cure Wounds? Mage Armor?
Mage Armor, Perfect
@goodguy5 you mean one that already has a potion?
if you wanted, just something that made sense as a potion
@DavidCoffron And rules-lawyering I think there's a difference between having a spellcasting ability and Spellcasting.
That, and you with Xanathar, you still need to be proficient in Arcana in order to do it.
@NautArch It specifically says you need spell slots though
5:33 PM
yea, you have one
(In DMG)
you have one spell slots
@goodguy5 not from.magic initiate. That is not a spell slot
It's a daily casting of a level 1 spell
you're technically right
@DavidCoffron Ah, then that too :)
So you definitely need arcana proficiency and spell slots and MAYBE there's a difference between having a Spellcasting ability and Spellcasting.
5:35 PM
It doesn't add a new spell slot for use with other spells, or work with Flexible casting, or allowed to be restored with arcane recovery/natural recovery
@NautArch you don't need spell slots in XGtE
They are different fundamentally
> Scribing a spell scroll takes an amount of time and money related to the level of the spell the character wants to scribe, as shown in the Spell Scroll Costs table. In addition, the character must have proficiency in the Arcana skill and must provide any material components required for the casting of the spell. Moreover, the character must have the spell prepared, or it must be among the character’s known spells, in order to scribe a scroll of that spell.

If the scribed spell is a cantrip, the version on the scroll works as if the caster were 1st level
So I think you could make cantrips scrolls using XGTE downtime but not the level 1 scroll
that seems silly
Unless MI says you 'know' that level 1 spell
> You learn that spell and can cast it at its lowest level.
n addition, choose one 1st-level spell from that same list. You learn that spell and can cast it at its lowest level. Once you cast it, you must finish a long rest before you can cast it again.
"learn" seems the same as "know"
I'm not sure if that counts. It should with plain reading. Is there a variant definition of learn that doesn't include know
@goodguy5 my thoughts as well
@DavidCoffron Ah, so there are two different item creation options. DMG (Official Rule) and XGtE (optional rule). Each have different requirements.
5:41 PM
@goodguy5 yeah I think you are good asking in general, the answers can easily cover both rules without issue.
sorry, multitasking
@NautArch correct. DMG requires spell slots but not arcana prof (iirc), XGtE only requires spells known or prepared AND arcana
@DavidCoffron thanks wizards
I'm repcapped for the day, someone can take this one :)
Also not that JC has clarified that one ruleset is a complete replacement for the other. Not like an errata or stack-on-top use both kind of thing.
is that supposed to be "not" or "note"?
5:44 PM
@Rubiksmoose what do you mean?
What ruleset is completely replacing another?
Let me just find the tweet. Probably actually not even about the same thing. It may have been about crafting.
classic JC
@Rubiksmoose So he really said "hey, we just released this book of optional rules. But one of the optional rules completely replaces the official rule in the DMG?"
@NautArch IF it is decided that they are being used. In other words if one is being used the other isn't.
If that makes sense. I think I just phrased it poorly.
@Rubiksmoose I don't see how you could use them together. One uses workweeks instead of days
5:48 PM
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I think this is the one I was thinking of. Not relevant at all lol.
@DavidCoffron and, as you say, they are incompatible anyways.
@nitsua60 [Doge Meme] :thumbsup: Kreygasm
In that order
(Would that be a good answer? :P)
I mean, only if you include the nits mention
otherwise, it's just a ramble
@DavidCoffron If I knew what any of those things meant? (I mean, I can puzzle out :thumbsup:, but I'm at a loss as to what the line is meant to communicate.)
@NautArch in not sure what you mean by that comment. We have questions that show that you qualify as a 'spellcaster' if you can cast any spell (possibly on your own)
5:59 PM
@DavidCoffron It had come up on another question that I htink I answered and I wasn't sure. But Crawford specifically did state Initiate turns you into a spellcaster.

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