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12:43 AM
Q: How can I tell my girlfriend to deal with her anxiety?

AnonymousMy girlfriend of 9 months has nearly crippling anxiety, which has gone untreated until the middle of last year. She started taking a new medication a few months ago, and it doesn't seem to be working. She started having panic attacks, which she never had previously, and she is far more moody and...

2 hours later…
3:11 AM
Q: Responding to people questioning my single status?

DavidBackground I am a computer programmer working as a graduate student under a biochemistry department in a university affiliated hospital. So far I have had a very successful career, writing novel and published data mining algorithms on top of programming hardware for spectrometers. I am also tall...

1 hour later…
4:19 AM
Q: Tactfully declining a "let's be friends" from a former partner

apaulA former partner reached out to me today with one of those... Sorry that things didn't work out, let's be friends ... sort of things. Which in most cases I wouldn't have a problem with. I try to maintain friendships with former partners where possible, in cases where it seems like we could ...

2 hours later…
6:11 AM
Silence of 6 hours.... breaks now....
Morning y'all!
30 messages moved to Trash Don't mind me just housekeeping
6 messages moved to Trash
6:34 AM
Q: Can I make a plus one I didn't invite feel welcome while still being honest?

Theo BenditI'm currently organising a board game night. This is an iteration of a weekly board game night amongst a rather loose group of friends, but this one is something of a bigger deal: it's happening at a friend's place on the weekend, instead of at uni on a weeknight. There might be drinking, and par...

2 hours later…
8:14 AM
8:32 AM
8:52 AM
Q: How to suggest someone to find a hobby without offending them?

aMJayAs for the topic, if possible I'd be greatful for general answer and more specific one regarding following situation: My girlfriend has a clinicly diagnosed depression (she attends visits with psychiatrist and is taking medications). Because of that she often has very bad mood (nowadays it's les...

A: I'm 24 with a 4-year-old son. How to handle uncomfortable questions from people?

Kate GregoryNormally, the way to handle overly intrusive and rude questions is by staring a little and then saying Excuse me? Should they happen to repeat the question again, you can then ask Are you seriously asking me why I have a child? And then just stare until they apologize. You are not an...

Some of the information contained in this post requires additional references. Please edit to add citations to reliable sources that support the assertions made here. Unsourced material may be disputed or deleted.
Why is this there
I don't see any stuff cited
Or need to be cited
@AvnishKabaj Exactly. Since it doesn't cite anything, that's not good. We've recently started pushing for more backup of answers here, with either external sources or personal experience.
For some more info, check out this and related meta posts:
Q: Can we start enforcing the "back it up" policy?

apaulWe've had the "back it up" policy for almost a year now. It was one of the earlier things we seemed to think important for the quality of answers on the site. We've had more than a few discussions about supporting answers with experience or references, as well as a few discussion about the prob...

9:23 AM
I just tried my hand at another 'not an answer' flag...my last one got declined on some arcane reason
My impression was that this flag is supposed to be used when an answer should have been a comment, but apparently in the previous case that was challenged :P
9:35 AM
The heck? It just started pouring like crazy
Q: How to stop partner talking?

CloudMy partner talks to me a lot (about their day, work etc.). We have been together 10 years but I don't like to talk much. How can I stop them talking to me? More info: we used to talk more at beginning but now I am bored of same conversation all the time.

9:52 AM
@Cronax That's not declined.
@Mithrandir Good Luck
Seems to be a difficult task though
@AJ One was declined, one was disputed. In both cases, it concerned an answer that should have been a comment, as I recall.
10:53 AM
Q: How can I handle my father challenging everything I say?

Belle-SophieI live with my parents. My father likes to challenge nearly everything I say, up to the point of ridiculousness. I can prove many of the things he challenges but not immediately. In most cases his disagreements with my comments are off-topic. They seem to stem from a psychological need to be righ...

Q: How to deal with frienimies?

Bilal ShaikhWhen it comes to people in our life I really believe in the rooms concept. Who ever is with us, is just because we have daily or repeated connection to that particular room say it college, school, work place office etc. I'm not counting social media people because I understand these friendships a...

11:16 AM
Q: How to respond to "Where are you?" as the only question

Sean WalshA couple of friends and colleagues, who have the habit to ask me this question, without providing any context of why they ask. If it was the case of "Where are you? Are going to X and we can pick you up", I'll gladly respond if I'm available, but a simple question just for curiosity is uncomforta...

1 hour later…
12:44 PM
Q: Question 15411 had a high rated answer disappear - how do I determine why this happened?

Dave GoldbergYesterday Question 15411 had a fairly highly rated answer that I thought was the best answer. There was a "please back this up" comment on that answer. Today that answer is completely gone. Is there any way to determine why this has happened, or to request a "re-review"? Or to see an earlier ...

1:14 PM
Can someone explain to me why this deserves a downvote? interpersonal.meta.stackexchange.com/a/3077/1932
1:26 PM
@Cronax I can't say for sure but that looks more like a comment than an answer. It technically answers the OP's explicit question but it doesn't do a good job of answering the real question that they are asking.
@sphennings I'm normally quite happy to do frame challenges, but in this case it seemed better to just explain how the delete system works since that's what also tripped me up about the issue in the past...
It seems legit to me. I upvoted it.
3 hours later…
4:45 PM
12 messages moved to Trash
:o @IPSCommentBot is being oppressed!
@TheTinyMan We're all being oppressed: meta.stackoverflow.com/q/369352/6380541
Oh wait, I can access stuff again :D
@Tinkeringbell haha, curse our benevolent overlords! ;-) How have you been?
@TheTinyMan Quite busy, new project has finally started for me, so I'm having a lot of catching up to do... Which is quite bothersome with only half of my accounts and permissions arranged.
5:40 PM
@LordFarquaad Yup, hence the disclaimer. It heavily depends on the company/employer. Here in Germany it is not unusual for a small firm to not have a dedicated HR department at all. In general, our corporate culture outside the international players is not really comparable to the US. I agree that getting into a poop throwing contest is generally not a good idea. However, if there is no one to stop said contest, you better not just stand there and take it. — Randolph Carter 19 secs ago
#15452 Randolph Carter (1678 rep) | A: Responding to people questioning my single status? (score: 25) | posted 12 hours ago by Randolph Carter (1678 rep)
Matched regex(es) ["chatty"]
6:08 PM
@Tinkeringbell That sounds frustrating!
@TheTinyMan It is... but it'll be alright soon, hopefully
We can hope! :-D
@TheTinyMan They'll have to hurry, if they want me to be productive XD
hahaha, well, if not, it's on them. :-P
6:50 PM
Just stopping in to say hi
7:29 PM
Q: How can I reassure others that I'm not offended by their teasing?

kumikanI have a group of friends who I sit with on the bus. Usually, they have fun talking while I watch and listen, which I'm perfectly fine with. From time to time I join in to their conversation, which usually involves a fair amount of teasing ("banter"), which inevitably involves me at some point. O...

8:29 PM
Q: How to deal with a close friend moving to another country?

runaway57A friend I work with every day is moving away to another country. My workday gets bearable because of that friend and I am not really close with other people at work. Now that I know that the friend is moving away, every time we hang out I can't help but feel sad about the future and even wonder ...

8:40 PM
@EmC You really should prefer my answers and questions on other sites for reading, not my comments. I am not excelling in chat comments.
@ThorstenS. Hmm? Did we miss something? You two aren't getting into fight now, are ya? :)
Kiss Kiss Kiss Kiss
@Tinkeringbell Nope. Everything is all right.
@ThorstenS. Okay great! And you're always welcome to come kill some awkward silence in here with practice ;)
I can't. I suck at chat.
8:46 PM
You seem to be doing great at the moment? :P
Do I?
Well, you're chatting XD Chatting isn't that hard, is it?
@RandolphCarter ?
What part do you find hard?
No feedback. It could be seconds, minutes, hours or days if something comes back and you have no indication if something comes back.
No immediate answer. If something comes back from several people, you cant answer at once.
8:49 PM
@Mithrandir Im sorry, might have been inappropriate. Classic response when two people get into a fight on the internet. Could not resist.
No fight here. Everything peaceful.
@ThorstenS. Hmm... true. But the 'not immediate' part makes it easier for me (I just typed something, deleted it, and rephrased it, for example).
@ThorstenS. I know :)
@ThorstenS. The all at once can be annoying, that I agree with ;) People might want to remember not to shout all at once in chat :P But by using the reply function you can just pick 1 person to continue conversation with ;)
@Tinkeringbell but that comes at the price of body language and vocal cues. If I had a penny for every time I typed something that was later misunderstood...
8:51 PM
(Like I'm sort of reading Randolph/Miths messages but not replying/reacting to them now)
@scohe001 That was my third problem.
@scohe001 Smileys help, and yeah, being a bit careful might help too :P
And for the rest, there's question marks :) As soon as you think there's a misunderstanding, start asking questions ;)
@Tinkeringbell No one enjoys a smiley as much as me :) but I've had instances where they're taken as sarcastic (who would do that to a smiley?!)
4. If you have a train of thought, someone comes with something completely different and poof, the talk is derailed.
@ThorstenS. Oh yeah, it's cloudy with a chance of meatballs here... That does happen in chat ;) To be honest, I think entire trains of thought might be a better fit for meta or blogs instead of chat ;-)
8:54 PM
5. Several people talking together and trying to say something gets hopeless at a point.
You see, the numbers are climbing.
On that note it's more tone that doesn't get across well over text. Especially here on SE I feel like people don't take criticism or questions well most of the time.
@ThorstenS. I'd argue with Tink on this one that replying to specific messages clears this up. As long as you can keep the conversations straight in your head :)
6. I cannot multitask :(
@scohe001 Most ppl use smileys as an extend of their body language. When I am sarcastic, which I am quite often, I often laugh or smile. I specifically try to not use (normal) smileys when I am sarcastic for that very reason.
Hey... there's also some good stuff:

1. It gives people a place outside of comments, questions and answers to talk (which is why sometimes comments are moved to chat)
2. People are actually trying to be nice in here, they can help you, explain stuff if you have a question, and link you to relevant posts
3. If you have a 'what should I do' type question, people are usually happy to give a second opinion in chat :P
4. It's a great way to kill time
5. We have 'regular' mutinies? :P
@ThorstenS. That can be difficult. Are you at/trying to work now? :)
@RandolphCarter I'm the same way. I'll smile sarcastically in person, but I wouldn't use an emoticon for it. My issue is other people interpreting my questions or suggestions with hostile intent and then seeing my smileys as sarcastic and mocking (which isn't the case I promise!)
8:59 PM
@Tinkeringbell No, but I am a bit surprised. You are sounding like that you received a really, really big dose of good temper.
@ThorstenS. Sometimes, sometimes not ;)
Depends on the chocolate content of my blood?
(which I must admit is high right now, since I want to stay up until 1am or something XD)
@Tinkeringbell Not on the number of plushes you're surrounded by?
@scohe001 Hmm.. those help too :) I'm making a new addition XD
@scohe001 Those people will usually assume malintent no matter what you say.
@Tinkeringbell Ooh another dino??
9:01 PM
@scohe001 Nope :P The dino will have to wait for a while ;)
I'm getting rid of some yellow yarn ;)
@RandolphCarter I agree. It's just a bummer. Makes me wish I could have a one on one with them in person and actually get to a point where we could understand each other.
@Tinkeringbell Hmmm what are you making that's super yellow?
I'm going to give it longer legs and wings, to try and make it look like big bird
I would estimate your chocolate level it is currently 4 tony's.
@Tinkeringbell Awwwww!!
@ThorstenS. Actually, I don't eat that many Tony's... it's 2 Milka's :P
9:02 PM
@Tinkeringbell If you ever start doing commissions, you have to let me know :)
@scohe001 Hahaha, only if you're the one paying for shipping XD
It'll easily be 30 euro's just to ship something
7. Sometimes finding a nice answer is hard.
@Tinkeringbell you made that yourself completely?
@Tinkeringbell Whaaaaat?! There's no cheaper way?
@ThorstenS. What, in chat? :P Or on the site?
9:04 PM
I'd have to just pick it up when I'm in the Netherlands then :P
Especially in chat because of the time constraint.
Other people are also entering something in their keyboard.
@RandolphCarter That one is the pattern one...
@Tinkeringbell You are not currently in the Netherlands?
Mine is about this far done:
@ThorstenS. No, I am :) Scohe is not ;)
@Tinkeringbell Haha throw a few meatballs in there and it'll be perfect!
9:07 PM
@scohe001 I think I'll stick with fiberfill.. meatballs might get smelly!
8. You are likely to misunderstand or conflate something.
@Tinkeringbell Well I dont know the first thing about doing what you are doing
but it looks like a lot of un
@RandolphCarter It's called crochet, and you can make great stuff with it :)
@Tinkeringbell Not if your meatballs are made of more yarn ;)
9:08 PM
@ThorstenS. Hmmm? That's okay ;) Just wait and see other people's reactions, or ask what was really meant :P Where did nr. 8 come from?
@scohe001 That'll make it non washable: Stuffing stuff with yarn makes it dry too slowly after washing and mold is likely to grow inside :P
@ThorstenS. I don't go stalking random users in chat, no worries
@Tinkeringbell well maybe YOU can, I have two left thumbs when it comes to manual craft like this
I thought scohe001 was in the Netherlands and needs chocolate
(sorry, I went afk right as you sent that original message)
Overspecific denial, overspecific denial.
9:10 PM
@ThorstenS. One of those things is true :)
@ThorstenS. (Oh that, I think no-one knows what that's about except scohe and me :P if scohe wants to tell, it's their 'secret' :) )
I don't feel random >:-)
But anyway, everything is allright.
Great. So keep it that way, while I go afk for a little while :)
9. Suddenly an awkward silence comes and nobody knows why...
Your questions sounds like it requires intrapersonal skills to answer, still not interpersonal. We could potentially help you if ther'es something you're wanting to communicate with your friend, but we can't help you with "self" issues/problems. — Jess K. 1 min ago
#15497 Jess K. (13361 rep) | Q: How to deal with a close friend moving to another country? (score: 0) | posted 59 minutes ago by runaway57 (1 rep) | edited 35 minutes ago by runaway57 (1 rep)
Matched regex(es) ["possible-aic"]
9:15 PM
@EmC For the comment itself: I have said this because there is frustation and I simply need to say it sometimes.
And I really not the only one who feels that IPS...has its troubles.
IPS has its issues, but we're working on fixing them.
BTW, fun fact about the IPS Comment Bot:
@ThorstenS. Sure. I'm not sure it's really good form to vent frustration elsewhere, but either way, I only got specific because a mod asked.
@Mithrandir Shame on you for not taking the tour! :P
@Mithrandir Stackoverflow has a Data Explorer where you can make database queries.
I tracked for curiosity how the userbase is developing.
Sure, you got also the one-timers, but it should give at least a hint how IPS is developing.
@ThorstenS. Do you want to share your insights?
9:21 PM
The highest increase of users was August 2017 with 2513 users and the numbers of users joining is steadily declining.
that's about normal for this stage in beta
But I also heard a short time ago that the number of questions is declining?
@ThorstenS. That happens a lot with beta sites - you get a lot of people going "oh new thing yay" and then it kinda all tapers off after that to people who are genuinely interested in long term participation
And that several high-rep users have deleted their account last months?
@ThorstenS. Also normal. Normally, betas go through a spike of activity at the beginning, then levels off and decreases for a while. Then it begins to build up activity - but that stage can take years.
9:25 PM
@ThorstenS. several?
It happens. It's actually not an usual occurrence.
@Mithrandir You know that your answers sound a bit like whistling in the dark?
*shrugs* I'm really not concerned if the activity is dropping off.
A lot of betas go through stuff like this.
9:31 PM
IPS has had an unusual level of activity that at first didn't come with the people who can and want to help moderate the site. A slower trickle of activity would actually make a lot of things easier and more manageable for those interested in maintaining site quality.
(I have to take other people's words for this, since this is my first beta, but I've been told that before too, and I believe it :) )
@Tinkeringbell As an example, I joined Artificial Intelligence on the first day of private beta. The private beta was relatively active. After that, things slowed down tremendously. Now, the pace has started to pick up again.
Ah, several sentences before I hear that "we are working to fix IPS". Now I get "shrug if the activity is dropping off". How exactly do you work out how to fix IPS if you are uninterested if the activity dropss off?
I mean, you must have some kind of measurement for fixing.
@Mithrandir area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/118029/… I'm following that one now. I do hope they decide to accept all sorts of archaeology questions, then I can post a lot, and maybe even get some facebook/uni friends interested :D
@ThorstenS. the activity dropping off actually makes things easier to keep track of and work on the issues with individual questions.
It's much easier to direct a creek than a raging river.
9:35 PM
"working on IPS's issues" in no way contradicts "activity dropping off isn't necessarily bad".
Until the creek dries completely out. What happens if IPS dies?
@HDE226868 I wonder what IPS's looks like ;)
@ThorstenS. I think that's more likely to happen if the site doesn't get some control over the scope than that people stop asking questions at all.
I don't think either is likely... to be clear.
9:37 PM
Slightly different.
Although keep in mind that there are a dozen stats displayed.
I'd rather have 1 question a day, and 5 people commenting/editing to keep it open, than 10 reaching HNQ out of which 5 annoy the rest of SE :P

Basically, a site only 'dies' once there's too little participation to close questions that should be closed, or cast enough spam flags to delete a spam within a day, that kinda stuff (as far as I know). Having some fewer questions or even 2/3 answers instead of >15 won't make the site die, like Mith said, it'll be easier to track this site
You can fool around with the data there ;)
@Catija That you are thinking that it is more likely to happen does not make it true.
@ThorstenS. Any more than you. Neither of us can see the future.
The thing is, I see doom and gloom stuff all the time, all over the network. Very few (if any) of them come to pass. "This will ruin the site"... "usership will drop"... nada. Nothing... no change.
Yeah, but we can look at the data. I did not have this cool database view from HDE, I got it monthly. In the HDE view the site participation looks almost constant, only slightly declining.
9:42 PM
@Thorsten I've been through 10-12 early betas and I can tell you that in terms of activity, @Catija's right. We're fine.
early beta? The site is one year old.
You see usership dropping because of users feeling like we're too picky about how to write questions or answers... I see usership dropping because we're not picky. No one wants to use a site for "experts" when everyone's an expert and there's no quality control.
@ThorstenS. Yup. That's early.
Especially early for a site like this. It took TWP around two years to settle in.
Some sites have been in beta for seven years.
9:45 PM
OK, let's not talk about "beta" in relationship with "Graduation"... That's a false correlation. A site having the "beta" label is not the same thing as a site actually being in a formation phase.
Ok. Under what circumstances would you say: "Ooops, ThorstenS. warning was spot on. We cannot continue this way."
@Catija Unfortunately, that's kinda the technical term at the moment. IPS is definitely in beta in several ways.
Being "technical" about it doesn't really help the discussion, though. If the only thing they're looking for is 10 QPD, lots of "graduated" sites would have been demoted.
@ThorstenS. Probably once the CM puts up the 'we're going to close this site since there's a lack of moderation' notice...
Lack of participation isn't a reason to shut down a site, though. Only lack of moderation.
9:49 PM
Let's lay aside that minefield for a moment. What I mean is - a year is still relatively early in a site's history.
I'm not arguing with that.
@Catija Messed up the terms, sorry
@ThorstenS. Someone could ask the converse question. Under what circumstances would you say "Oh I guess I was wrong"?
I know. I was clarifying my response to Thorsten, because apparently the term "beta" is confusing.
@Tinkeringbell No worries :)
9:51 PM
If the site maintains a constant or increasing userbase over time.
Decreasing is problematic.
That's sort of inevitable. A couple of users leaving isn't really an issue. I think I've heard of 3 in the last couple of weeks. I'm sure we've added 100 times that in the same amount of time.
It's almost certainly not. A couple high-rep users leaving doesn't nullify the many new ones who join each day.
We've gotten ~40 in the past 24 hours.
@Catija not to detract from the issue at hand, but isn't lack of participation why the productivity SE got closed? (not that we're anywhere near their stats)
You are still not answering the question. When will you say: ThorstenS. is right and we cannot continue this way.
@EmC Nope. Lack of moderator candidates. They tried to find replacement mods for two spots and got zero response after about 2-3 weeks of waiting.
9:53 PM
@Catija interesting, I didn't realize that
Look at the site stats for ... say... Community Building... really, really low... plenty of mods (active ones).
the area51 banner just says "didn't have enough activity" and.. clearly I wasn't active enough to notice what happened, lol whoops

Beta Q&A site for people building, administering, managing and cultivating digital communities

Currently in public beta.

that's encouraging to know, as long as we have people invested in the site it should stay alive :)
See, now, if the site originally named "Moderators" failed for lack of moderation, that would be funny.
9:55 PM
haha, indeed
@ThorstenS. Are you asking for how many users to lose each week/day before we say 'you're right'? Because that's hard to put a finger on, it depends on how many users you have, and which ones quit, if the ones that actually want to moderate the site stay, there won't be a problem...
It's also pretty impossible for us to track since only the CMs (if even they) can see how many "high rep" users delete their accounts on a regular basis... and many users create and delete accounts for anonymity reasons.
We don't get any sort of notification about it.
No, I am asking for the personal judgement of the participants. At what point will they be convinced that my warning is really a problem and their optimism was wrong. What will sway their minds?
@ThorstenS. Well, in that case, I personally stand by my previous answer :)
9 mins ago, by Tinkeringbell
@ThorstenS. Probably once the CM puts up the 'we're going to close this site since there's a lack of moderation' notice...
@Tinkeringbell That is a bit late. I would prefer that people can counteract while it is still possible.
10:01 PM
Okay, then maybe once I notice I'll have to handle stuff like close and delete voting because there aren't enough community members that actually do that stuff, and I see close votes expiring, questions that should be closed staying open and spam posts staying up for more than a day, and the chatroom awkwardly silent for days at a time
But I don't think there's anything to worry about now, except 'how are we ever going to reach and educate everyone here about what's already in place'
@Tinkeringbell The "what's already in place" is a very confusing thing tbh
@RandolphCarter I guess it often is on beta's (that's what I am being told)
The back-it-up policy being basically revoked a short time after ppl started enforcing it
@Tinkeringbell Ok, work gets not done and the site goes unmaintainable. What about the others? Mithrandir, Catija, HDE 226868?
was horrible
Resources are hard to find, mechanics work counterintuitive and are not properly explained at first sight
10:06 PM
@RandolphCarter I personally feel like you can still ask people for that back-up, whether they are willing to provide it to explain where their reasoning is coming from... If no-one leaves such comments at all, newer users don't even get attended to the fact that those are the best answers?
My point is, you have to be pretty invested already to have a chance at being educated. And this is not a good thing.
@RandolphCarter Revoked? Since when? It's not an answer free-for-all or anything.
@Catija well certainly there has been a shift from "provide personal xp or delete" to "giving good reasoning is also ok"
@RandolphCarter I guess I joined at the right time, because when I joined, there were people here to tell me what was best, to point me to meta, and stuff like stackoverflow.blog/2010/09/29/good-subjective-bad-subjective...
@RandolphCarter Yes, good reasoning.
10:08 PM
@ThorstenS. Yes. I got in a long argument about this, arguing pro good reasoning
@ThorstenS. And even then, a comment asking where that reasoning is coming from or under what circumstances it was learned (and how that parallels to the situation in a question)... wouldn't be out of place. It's just the deletion part that people seem to be against?
@Tinkeringbell Guess that it comes down to semantics. Policies can be violated and measures (deletion) enacted accordingly. Guidlines, not so much.
@RandolphCarter Which is why I'd much rather have a policy than a guideline, but lets at least try and tell people there is a guideline? Because if I never had a comment (or was it a chat message?) telling me that explicitly stating where my answers come from turns them from opinion into expertise, I might have answered a lot more questions...
So, there's a huge difference between enforcing policy that the site userbase actually supports and writing edicts and forcing people to toe the line.
@Mithrandir No answer?
@Catija No answer
@HDE226868 No answer?
10:11 PM
@Tinkeringbell Pointing to meta is not a bad start. However it still is not properly explained (the way votes work) and especially regarding the back-it-up topic, there is a multitude of different voices. Also there seems to be no common rule about when something becomes "binding" and when it is still "under discussion"
@Thorsten, that's a great thing about chat too, if people don't want to answer, they don't really have to... maybe stop pushing now ;)
It's much better for us to gradually work towards a policy that works for the site both in that it has broad support from users and is shown to increase the quality of the posts here. We don't have to do it all at once. Sometimes, a site needs to break a little bit to see what needs to be fixed. Right now, many users don't see the site as broken, so we wait until they do.
@RandolphCarter I actually like to link to either the blogpost I just put up a few messages above, or the meta answer on 'how to write an experience based answer' (or both) in a comment... Especially since meta can be confusing
The thing is, we don't actually have one good explanation about back it up to even link to... regardless of where - blog or Meta...
@Tinkeringbell and I certainly agree with what you are saying. Asking people to back stuff up is what we should do to increase quality. But that is not what happened. "Back it up or flag for delete"
10:14 PM
@Catija Write one up? I wouldn't mind trying, but it'll be biased probably...
@ThorstenS. For some reason, I didn't think my phone would appreciate me chatting while in the shower.
@Mithrandir Zip top bag?
@RandolphCarter interpersonal.meta.stackexchange.com/a/3061/1599... seems to suggest that that was a mistake...
9. I don't know what other people are doing when I chat.
@Mithrandir They have waterproof phones nowadays :P
10:16 PM
@Catija Of course, we also CANT do it all at once. People have to accept a standard in order to enforce it. And exactly that was the issue. I got the impression that a lot of people jumped the "policy wagon" in their righteous zeal to finally have a standard, no matter how much sense that standard made.
@Tinkeringbell Mine isn't, and a new one isn't in my budget right now ;)
@ThorstenS. Don't worry, you're surviving great. :)
@Catija How many users are needed to sway your mind? 1, 10, 100?
@RandolphCarter That's sort of what happens. People get excited about something and how awesome it will be and decide the change needs to happen now... that's just not really how it works... particularly since meta doesn't really indicate much of anything of value.
@ThorstenS. One of the things I like best about text-based conversation platforms is that they're asynchronous.
10:17 PM
@ThorstenS. Not really sure what you're talking about but if you're still looking for an answer to your question, I strongly suggest you stop.
1 hour ago, by Thorsten S.
No feedback. It could be seconds, minutes, hours or days if something comes back and you have no indication if something comes back.
That's how we started this all :P
Pushing users for an answer is a good way to end the conversation in a non ideal manner.
We need to keep going for another 20 minutes at least! :P
I need to be kept awake.
It's 1:20 in the morning...
00:20 over here... and I'm waiting for my brothers to arrive from the airport, they went on a trip to England
I usually am in bed by 10-ish
10:22 PM
Something I learned this week: Switching pedals to the clip-in pedals when you're not riding with the cleats full time has its hazards.
@Tinkeringbell now got to read the link you provided. And while I have to agree with the conclusion, I still think his premises don't hold up. But thats not the place to discuss this
The thing is: We have many people here who say that they are working to fix the site. If I fix something, like e.g. the TV, then I have a feedback if the fix is working -> the image is up again. If I have a firm, if it goes bankrupt, then I did not fix it. So I want to know how exactly some people here who are claiming that they want to fix IPS measure their success. And I want to know at what point they are admitting that the fix does not work.
Jun 4 at 13:41, by Em C
I am 2/2 today on people improving their posts after a comment though :)
@ThorstenS. Maybe, though, they're measuring the "fix" differently than you, so they feel it does/did/is working?
@ThorstenS. I guess people refer to their overall perception of "fix" or "broken" which is not exactly quantifyable
10:23 PM
Can we perhaps agree to disagree on this?
@Ash For that reason I would like to know how they measure it?
“Because of my poor word choice she took it as if I were telling her that she is boring.” Your wording is fine. Her response isn’t. As we say in New York, “And what else do you do?” Seriously, she’s depressed and not helping herself. Sorry to sound cold, but you need to be realistic and I would recommend that you—yes *you*—take care of yourself before getting any deeper into this level of codependency. Because honestly, it sounds like she is growing co-dependent on on you. — JakeGould 1 min ago
#15462 JakeGould (611 rep) | Q: How to suggest someone to find a hobby without offending them? (score: 25) | posted 13 hours ago by aMJay (228 rep) | edited 9 hours ago by MiniRagnarok (103 rep)
Matched regex(es) ["possible-aic"]
@ThorstenS. It might just be a gut feeling thing, there might not be metrics
I feel like it's a hard thing to objectively quantify and people will look at it differently
@ThorstenS. I was walking back from work.
10:25 PM
@ThorstenS. You really seem hung up on getting other people to commit to some form of concrete metric. This feels like a rhetorical tactic to pedanticly argue about the success/failure of that metric down the road in an attempt to shoot down policy you don't like rather than an attempt at fostering clear discourse.
but like...the site still gets questions, people are still actively here and engaging....I don't see a problem
Although I kinda agree with @ThorstenS. here, if you want to bring people together for a common goal, you have to define that goal and when it is not reached.
Seems like a minor succes. Generally, it's the newer users that are more open to actually improving their post (as I've experienced)... If you ask all answers on a question to provide some experience or sources, the newer users will think 'hey, guidance!'.. while the more established users that have never heard of such a thing might think 'my previous answers did just fine' and leave it at that...

Like I said, I think my first answer here got pointed to adding experience/sources and it was welcome feedback. I don't know how I'd have reacted if I was at 2/3k rep already
We're trying to avoid legalese and pedantic arguments about the specific wording of policy.
I'll let you know if I feel that things aren't working out. Or if I feel things could be changed for the better.
@Ash Yeah, I might have the gut feeling that I IPS is going down and you find the gut feeling that IPS is doing great. But IPS going down or up is objective, so we need some kind of intersubjektive agreement that the site is going great/not good.
10:26 PM
Trust me, you don't want to get to a "you have to use this wording specifically" for things to count
Pro interpersonal tip I've learned over the years. Most people don't enjoy constantly litigating the same points over and over again.
@sphennings Thats one way to do it. But you cannot be vague on definition but hard in punishment. People get very unhappy about that
@RandolphCarter I'd suggest starting with something vague. When the vagueness starts causing problems, discuss how to make the policy less vague.
@ThorstenS. Then probably one or both of you should see a doctor about that gut :)
@sphenning site traffic, participation, user accounts are not vague.
10:28 PM
Its like government not disclosing the actual speed limits and randomly citing people for going "too fast"
No reason to argue over hypothetical situations that haven't happened. The older I get the less I'm interested in naval gazing.
I'll stop making bad jokes now and probably head to sleep. Night o/
Good night.
@ThorstenS. Those are metrics but we aren't here to maximize site traffic, participation or user accounts. We're here to create a repository of quality questions and excellent answers about interpersonal skills.
@sphennings the obvious question being the measurement deciding on the excellence of an answer
10:30 PM
If we were attempting to maximize traffic the obvious way to do it would be to explicitly encourage contentious and inflammatory questions. This is a horrible idea.
@sphennings If you want to have a repository of quality question and excellent answers: A site with 0 questions and answers cannot provide that per definitionem.
@ThorstenS. Well we've passed that point so we're good.
@sphennings And if IPS dies?
Is it in danger of dying right now? I don't think it is. I'll worry about that hypothetical when it looks likely to happen.
@ThorstenS. Then it dies, not every site works out. Although IPS has been around long enough and is growing a decently active community so I don't think that's all that much of a danger - there are lots of warning signs before that happens
10:32 PM
@RandolphCarter It's a subjective quality. There's no way we can litigate a more precise definition than that.
"looks likely to happen". The problem is when this point is achieved, saving IPS is likely not possible anymore.
(None of which, I think are all that apparent - lots of peopel asking/answering, a decent size community working to curate/police/edit content and teach people what were about, etc
@ThorstenS. You act like it will just go from current state like it is today and then boom closed tomorrow
and that's not ever how it happens
I'm pretty sure there'd be some warning from community managers, fewer questions coming in, fewer people helping out new users, fewer answers.
10:35 PM
... moderators quitting...
It doesn't happen in a vaccuum
(I've been a moderator and a user on a few sites that didn't make it. Trust me, you know when it's likely)
When there are real warning signs we can start to talk about how to address those warning signs. Right now we're doing is talking about hypothetical solutions to a problem that hasn't happened yet. Let's instead try to make the site better now than worrying about a potential future.
@Ash No, what happens is sometimes that warnings are ignored, everybody seems to say everything is ok until suddenly: Ooops, the site is not working. And if they look why that happened: It looked like the people did not want to hear anything problematic.
@ThorstenS. If people put their heads in the sand, we can't stop them
10:38 PM
@sphennings Yeah, that's exactly the problem: How do I know the site is going better.
@ThorstenS. Why do you think this is how it happens? Have you seen this happen before on SE or on another site?
I feel like we are going in hypothetical circles
@ThorstenS. If there are actual problems I trust you'll very loudly advocate for fixing them with as much vigor as you're arguing for hypothetical future problems.
I suspect we just need to drop this at this point
Or, we're at a hypothetical dead end. If very experienced users and moderators right now are telling you that this isn't something to be worried about right now and all you want to do is force the issue, then maybe let's end this discussion.
10:40 PM
If there are problems, bring them up on Meta etc and clearly explain what the issues you are seeing look like and then we can tackle them
Putting on my Room Owner hat I'll second Ash on that.
this "but what if the sky falls" stuff isn't helping.
2 messages moved to Trash
I'd love to stay and chat more but I just got word that my Grandmother's in the hospital with a stroke.
@sphennings I hope things are work out okay!
10:45 PM
@sphennings Oh no :( I hope she's okay <3
@sphennings Oh no! I'm so sorry to hear that. Best wishes to her and your family.
Good healing, my blessings.
@sphennings Sorry to hear that, hope she recovers well!
@scohe001 @Ash @Catija Thanks. Luckily I can drive there in an hour.
@sphennings Hope she is/will be OK :/
10:46 PM
We'll see, at 91 she's not the spring chicken she used to be.
Thanks for all the support and well wishes. That's pretty helpful right now. :)
@sphennings That's those really heavy things...parents and grandparents. Have a good night.
I am also leaving. Goodbye to all.
11:05 PM
And everyone's home safe here too, so that's an 'I'm off to bed' for me too :) Night!
11:55 PM
Q: What questions should I ask in a Truth or Dare game?

ChaoticIn the past I was invited to a game of truth or dare, where you need to either answer a question truthfully, or perform a "dare", both of which are set by other players. I was selected first, and as I did not know almost anybody there, I asked this girl what was her best friend. Then everbody lau...


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