TRPG General Chat - 2017-08-07 (page 3 of 3)

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10:00 PM

im honestly not sure how i'd use those spells, she isn't exactly one to be mean

@Adam And I think I've had this discussion here before where I was on @MikeQ's side and it was brought up that you can roleplay frailty without needing a <8-9 CON score.

G'nite!

Vulture Red-Beard, inspired by...well, the red-bearded vulture. Nature is awesome. #characterdesign #prettybird https://t.co/g9UgUymq8U

Tweeted by AvivOr on August 7, 2017 at 9:35 PM

@kviiri ttfn

@Yuuki As I said. I myself wouldn't go lower than 8 either.

@Yuuki Yeah, I'd say 8-11 CON as a spellcaster in 5e is frail enough. Below that, the player should basically expect their character to die at any given moment where safety is not 100% guaranteed. And I would never recommend that.

10:01 PM

@Clarus_Nox So, if she doesn't want to be mean, wants to avoid any conflict or fighting, is physically frail, and has a loving & noble (landowning?) father... why is she adventuring?

Frailty could also be represented by having low strength and/or dexterity

family succession reasons, both parents dead

she is only 17(while harpy are adults by 3 and live to 40, most humans wouldn't accept that)

so making a name for herself or somethign along those lines

str 5, dex 14(+2), con 10, int 8, wis 16, cha 15(+1)

?

You can make a name for yourself without adventuring.

Because as a frail 16-charisma character, politics and courtly persuasion would be the obvious choice to make a name for herself.

that is the main idea, going from one noble house to the other to ensure she is the one they'd be trading with

10:05 PM

@Clarus_Nox I think that character could make a fine adventurer.

Because she might not be smart or strong, but she knows how to get people to do what she wants (16 Cha), and to avoid being manipulated herself (16 wis)

she is from a very wealthy merchant family, so monitary gain is not her goal

But that's like the big reason to be an adventurer, looting massive dragon hoards and getting stupid rich.

she kinda already is

though no access to it while on the road

When you're an adventurer, there's no such thing as "stupidly rich enough".

10:07 PM

she was kept sheltered most her life, few who knew about her among the noble circles know she is a harpy

To be frank, I'm mostly joking around right now, not trying to make any serious commentary on your character.

ah

@Clarus_Nox The desire to be free out in the world is plenty of reason to be an adventurer. People being "true to themselves" leaving and heading off into the wilderness isn't unheard of.

Yes, but that doesn't seem to be her motivation.

i gotta deal with some dms insisting that my harpy character cant be charismatic because based on greek mythology they are born from literal feces

10:09 PM

@Clarus_Nox Just show them a picture of the 45th President with the caption "President of the United States". /s

@Clarus_Nox Are you dealing with a Greek mythological setting?

rogues can only be criminals

those kinda things

@Clarus_Nox Perhaps she knows people think that, and so wants to go out and get glory being an adventurer? Glory often commands respect in fantasy worlds.

@MikeQ no but neither is the campaigns the dm runs

@Clarus_Nox Okay, so tell that to the DM :)

10:11 PM

others have told me that dm is very narrow minded

im not telling that to my mother :L

If that isn't good enough, then you could also point out that charisma isn't necessarily "likeability", but can also represent the intensity of one's personality

@MikeQ see: Paladin

Daily mandatory "5e paladins != 3.5e paladins" announcement.

The Intimidate skill is Charisma-based, right?

@MikeQ Unless you picked a certain trait in Pathfinder that turns it into STR-based.

10:12 PM

well still the campaign for which i get to use my harpy is a way off... unless our current one meets with a tpk which has nearly happened 3 times since we started?

@Clarus_Nox if rogues can only be criminals, then what class is the local locksmith?

@Yuuki Right. I meant to say "See: 5e Paladin whose power is based purely from intense devotion to an oath reflected by their Charisma score"

oh miniman is here now

@Adam I always wonder whether "intense devotion" should be represented by a high Charisma score or a high Wisdom score. Since Wisdom is almost always interpreted as mapping onto willpower.

@Yuuki IIRC Paladins used to be wisdom-based in an older edition

10:15 PM

@Yuuki wouldnt that make sorcerers use wisdom too? they use their will to enforce their magic right?

Which is why I've always wondered about where Charisma stops and Wisdom begins. And vice-versa.

Also, there is no rule anywhere that says rogues have to be evil backstabbing criminals. For example, the lawful good royal agent, James Bond.

@MikeQ actually, the 3.5 Pally was split between WIS and CHA

they cast using WIS but their turning worked off of CHA

totally MADdening

@MikeQ quite! some of them even hold desk jobs xD

@MikeQ Or really any military intelligence or a scout.

@Shalvenay Don't forget the 2 skill points per level so dumping Int screwed you out of either Concentration or Perception (not to mention spot/listen not being class skills)

10:20 PM

Heck, one could argue that a honest-working locksmith could be a "rogue".

perception is wisdom

investigation is int

@Clarus_Nox 2 + INT skills per level though meant even with the stat bonus, you couldn't keep your Spot/Listen up in pace with the game progression if you dumped INT.

why not?

at lv 4 my passive perception is 17

3.5e didn't have passive perception, IIRC.

we 5e

did i not mention that?

10:25 PM

Yes, but the person you're replying to is talking about Paladins back in 3.5e.

Yes, but for reference, in earlier editions, skills were based on a point system, which depended on intelligence. So characters with low intelligence generally had poor skills, including the skills that they needed.

I think.

@Delioth no kidding

@Yuuki yeah -- like I said, some hold desk jobs (think "intelligence analyst")

she still has 23 hp at lv 4

and 13 ac

Anyway @Clarus_Nox the takeaway is that nobody force you into a play style you don't want, such as saying your character can't have certain personality traits because of their race.

10:29 PM

but at level 6 i'll have access mage armor and shield spells

(The exception being a character whose sole purpose is to harass other players, that doesn't seem to be the case in your situation)

23 HP is not a lot, tbh. I lost 16 HP in one hit just a week ago.

Granted, it was a crit, but it was enough to turn "stand and fight" into "run like a chicken with its head cut off".

i lost the same while saving from the ranger hail of thorns as he attacked the enemy i was engaging

i was not happy about that

@Clarus_Nox Pro tip, get Mage Armor earlier. Part of the reason we panicked after I got crit was because shortly afterwards, our sorcerer got knocked unconscious because 12 AC is not much.

bards cant learn mage armor

i have to use college of lore

10:32 PM

Scrolls?

Can bards use scrolls?

magic items are rare~

You can increase AC by taking (partial) cover

Then leather armor until you can get Mage Armor.

i plan to take cover and use illusions for extra cover

cant

unless i can get it specially crafted to my harpy

and how often will that go well?

As the sole character with a hit die above d6 in my party, I'm terrified if anyone goes into battle with low AC.

10:34 PM

@Yuuki That's a contested interpretation in some circles. Some will say 9-12 is average for all, therefore adventurers are probably self-selected higher. Some will say that 9-12 is average for adventurers, though. (5e, with a commoner statted out at straight tens, seems to shoot the gap between either extreme. As was its goal.)

Oh wait, rogues have d8 hit dice.

Still terrifying though.

I guess it seems like he has d6s because I think he took low CON.

well my sorc/pal has 27 ac so i know my dm is gonna be very careful giving me any more ac buffing stuff

But yeah, being the only one in my party who can actually absorb more than one hit before fleeing this hopeless mortal existence terrifies me.

well i changed it to str 5, dex 14(+2), con 10, int 8, wis 16, cha 15(+1)

@Clarus_Nox Sorc/Pal? Did he get some kind of Charisma to AC thing? Because heavy armor should interfere with his somatic spells.

10:37 PM

nop

And wouldn't stack with Mage Armor anyways.

@Yuuki Does heavy armor interfere with spellcasting in 5e if you're proficient with it?

13(mage armor)+4(dex)+3(+1 shield)+2(shield of faith)+5(reaction cast shield spell)

no it doesnt

i was informed that here

Something about that doesn't feel right but then I remember bonus types are a 3.5e/PF thing.

@Delioth anydice agrees with your SD=3 for 3d6.

10:40 PM

but for my harpy it is just 10+3(dex) until i get mage armor and shield spell

@Clarus_Nox Oh, you shouldn't able to reaction cast shield spell if you're already holding concentration on Shield of Faith.

I think.

nobody told me that was a thing here

and my dm didnt find anythign against it either

he looked

@Baskakov_Dmitriy I forget! A message or two before I pinged you someone had mentioned wanting to bounty something, but feeling tight on rep themselves. "I know someone who's always trying to shed points," I thought....

You'll have to ask someone else, I'm not entirely clear on how reaction spells interact with concentration spells.

@Shalvenay Hey, sorry I wasn't really "in" yesterday... Pretty severe migraine. My housemate was just borrowing my phone a couple of times, and I have the rpg chat window open

10:42 PM

ah

So how're things?

@Yuuki 5e? then HA doesn't interfere with casting provided you're proficient in it

17

Q: Can I cast a no-concentration spell while concentrating on another?

Is it possible, while concentrating on one spell, to cast a different spell or cantrip that do not require concentration without losing that concentration?

dnd-5e spells concentration

alright here

@Shalvenay And given a Sorc/Pal multiclass, heavy armor proficiency depends on whether he started Sorc or Pal.

10:43 PM

@Yuuki yeah

Because I don't think multiclassing into Paladin grants you heavy armor proficiency.

I think only Cleric gives you armor proficiency when multiclassing.

it gives medium

@Yuuki Wait... why?

So it looks like you can cast a spell while concentrated on another spell. Maybe.

@Ben Because that's how multiclassing works.

but unless there is a medium armor that gives more than 15 ac, mage armor and my insanely high dex(19)(rolled) are better

10:45 PM

@Yuuki It would appear that I am unfamiliar with the rules of multiclassing then

@Ben 5thsrd.org/rules/multiclassing

Never mind, multiclassing into Paladin does give you armor proficiency, but medium and not heavy.

user image

but im using no armor to use mage armor +dex

@Ben As for why, it's mostly likely to keep "dip 1 into a few things so you can become proficient in everything" builds from being a thing.

Multiclassing also doesn't give you any save proficiencies of the class you're multiclassing into.

That makes sense.

Just never seen/heard this before. Is this in the PHB/DMG?

10:48 PM

Yes.

Incidentally, you have stat pre-reqs to multiclass into and out of a class.

If you're a Paladin, you need a 13 in either STR or DEX to be able to multiclass.

@Yuuki no

Or was it CHA?

you need both

str and cha

Oh, I'm thinking about Fighters.

yeah fighter is one or other

10:49 PM

@Yuuki Fighter is STR and DEX

No.. it is or

my b

"Stranddex" would be a good name for a drow anti-hero, or an industrial cleaning fluid.

Why not both?

@BESW "They call me Strandex... I prowl the night, cleaning up the streets"

probably because you can have fighters that are tanky and glass cannon

> Named after an industrial cleaning fluid: Your parents were never the most creative of people and it kinda showed when you were born. You have disadvantage on interacting with schoolchildren and janitors.

10:52 PM

@Yuuki need I remind everyone of North West

i wihs you hadn't

@Ben And Gwyneth Paltrow named her kid "Apple".

At least North West is a pun.

I actually feel proud that I didn't realise her last name was "west"... I thought that was her first name... I was thinking "North West what?? Dakota?"

Unless Paltrow was going for some weird "apple of my eye" pun.

Apropos of nothing, please allow me to remind everyone that Be Nice applies even to off-site persons such as celebrities or politicians.

7

10:55 PM

well, ichigo is a name in japan and that means strawberry, so i i think some people might be named ringo(apple)

Well, all names mean something. It's just that these days in English culture, names have become more reserved as names and not used for other things.

I had a friend go over to Japan recently (she's a translator), and she recently asked what size my daughter was (clothing). I am curious if she'll return with a Kimono or some kind of Moogle outfit

i liek how my name means 'little king'

I would accept either of these things

@Clarus_Nox My last name is "Hall". When I was born, my father (as a joke) suggested my first name should be "Ben". My mother, thinking of the bible, followed through. So now I am named after a famous Australian bushranger

On the bright side, you weren't named "Study".

11:01 PM

that'd be mean

@Yuuki or Kidsinthe

Kidsinthe sounds like some kind of weird alcohol-free drink made from wormwood.

Funnily enough though, after the turn of the new millennia, seemingly everybody has forgotten that connection. It's now "Ben... you mean like Ben 10?"

@Yuuki Hey. Don't say that about our Ben!

i can say i've never heard of whoever this ben hall guy was

11:03 PM

@Yuuki Or some 80's pop-synthe band

but i wouldn't assume a cartoon character, ben is a normal enough name

Ben Hall (bushranger)

Ben Hall (9 May 1837 – 5 May 1865) was an Australian bushranger. He and his various associates carried out many audacious raids across New South Wales, from Bathurst to Forbes, south to Gundagai and east to Goulburn. Unlike many bushrangers of the era, Hall was not directly responsible for any deaths, although several of his associates were. He was shot dead by police in May 1865 at Billabong Creek. The police claimed that they were acting under the protection of the Felons Apprehension Act 1865 which allowed any bushranger who had been specifically named under the terms of the Act to be shot and...

He was a lesser-known bushranger, but after Ned Kelly, most were

I should try absinthe some day.

I have also been compared to a cat. "Oh, that's my cat's name!"

Gee... Thanks

@Yuuki Enjoy that

There was also a book written about him: Dancing with Ben Hall. The writers grandmother (I believe), had a dance with him when she was a young girl.

i got nothing else more i can think to add to my harpy bard at this time

was he a wanted man back then?

11:07 PM

Technically, everyone in Australia was a wanted man.

Technically, Australia was a gaol

even in the 1800?

(Jail, in the original English which was used at the time :P)

@Ben youtube.com/watch?v=haImi4cWau0

i thought that was further back

11:08 PM

@Clarus_Nox Doesn't mean people (Australians included) don't still joke about it.

true

I never really paid proper attention in history class. All I know is that we still carry on about how we used to all be convicts

hey if being a criminal gets you a continent who wouldnt be one?

@Clarus_Nox Fun story... My first ancestor in Australia was a convict that earned his freedom :)

Baskakov_Dmitriy

@Trish Done, sorry again for making you wait too long. :)

11:12 PM

He then proceeded to waste the entire family fortune attempting to clear the Chonky Apple (native tree-weed)

did he do it?

i guess not

@Clarus_Nox He bought a concentrated poison, and then proceeded to use it (undiluted) on about 1/20th of the growth

So no. He didn't haha

well you cant say he didnt give it his all

...jumping back to 5e dnd; why does spell concentration use the constitution stat and not wisdom or the class's spell casting stat?

wouldn't focusing on a spell be a mental stat thing?

@Shalvenay Yup. And the fact now that the NBN has taken ownership of their part of the lines makes this an even worse conundrum. If a fault is found at the exchange, both the Telstra tech and the NBN tech have to go out and fix it. You'd think that one might simply be able to charge the other for work done on the other side of the lines, but noooope. NBN wants to be "indepent"

@Clarus_Nox Constitution counts for the ability to "keep your constitution".

constitution is strickly physical aint it? i dont think it implies mental fortitude

11:23 PM

Wisdom and Intelligence count for your knowledge and insight

@Clarus_Nox I don't see why not? Constitution can count toward focus

uses one's beauty(charisma) to cast spells

Oversoming poison, holding your breath, not being distracted by physical attacks

the last one sounds like a mental thing to me

@Clarus_Nox speaking of Charisma... @Miniman that might be a better way to intimidate people.

@Clarus_Nox It's basically fortitude. But since fortitude doesn't exist in 5e, that's been put into con

a sorcerer who puts points into intimidation could use investiture of fire to perhap bolster one's intimdation

11:27 PM

Think of it this way: Can you use your instincts to keep your focus? Not really. You can't use your knowledge to do so eaither

@Clarus_Nox It's not exactly about focusing on a spell. It's about focusing on a spell while someone stabs you in the face.

While yes, it is a mental thing, it's not about resisting things with your mind

true, i forgot that nearly everything that breaks concentration in 5e is physical

Yes. What Miniman said

Serious pain makes it extremely difficult to concentrate.

11:28 PM

though my dm inscludes explosions happening elsewhere as potential ones too

@Clarus_Nox Loud, unexpected noises can cause a lot of people to break focus

but that onw would be more mental, right?

If the cubicle beside you just exploded you'd probably just instinctively drop everything and duck for cover

what would the dc be for that? telling someone to back down with intimidation and then becoming a being engulfed in fire?

not if it was ONLY the noise of an explosion

An unexpected explosion, depending on how far away it is, and the situation you're in

11:31 PM

and it wasn't unexpected

@Clarus_Nox There wouldn't be a DC for that.

in game cleric lost concectration check even though his spell was the source

In the middle of a battle, multiple explosions going off around you, it's likely drop down in DC after the first few

Unless you cast the spell from a scroll that's too high level for you, I guess.

either of you familar with little shrine of horrors?

5e quest module

11:32 PM

Negative

basically there is a room along the way that is filled with boiling wax and a golem of some sort on the other end, if an open flame touches the air inside an explosion goes off

our cleric decided to cast fire sphere and move it into the room to avoid activating the golem and damage it that way

Baskakov_Dmitriy

@nitsua60 Turns out like my rep is not too far to be quickly helped this way :D

the sphere caused a infinite explosions until half way into the room he lost concentration from the explosions

we already knew the open flame would cause the explosion thanks to the ranger tossing a torch in as i was looking inside the room

because he wanted to see what would happen if the torch touched the wax... or something like that

still i just feel that wouldnt be a con save knowing there is gonna be explosions and the only distraction being loud noises

@Shalv so yes... the internet is a sham.

@Clarus_Nox I would say in that case it'd possibly be an edge case you could talk to your GM about. Losing track of the spell among all the vibration etc

Rather than being punched in the face

@Clarus_Nox I have to ask, do you envisage your harpy bard as being fun to play?

11:38 PM

very much so

but only in a roleplay campaign

i am not expecting her to be more than pull her own weight in combat at best

It's just that it kinda seems like you've set out to make combat as boring for yourself as possible.

@Shalvenay after watching this, when I can't even get a decent, stable NBN connection at my own home, and then the existing providers come in, and install all of their hardware, then refuse to connect it properly, is a very accurate in Australia

i did not make her to be a power house

I've seen a lot of "bad at combat" characters, and people always end up being bored and dissatisfied.

it'll honeslty depend on if the campaign is equal parts roll play as it is combat or if it'd be full combat

i have another character for if the latter is the case

11:41 PM

Plus, too, consider the effect this has on the rest of your party. You're making a character who, frankly, won't be contributing much, but will need a lot of work on their behalf to keep alive.

@Clarus_Nox "Equal parts" in D&D still means you spend most of your actual time in combat.

Combat, unfortunately, just takes longer.

well having to pick others up aint new to my party

im literally the only one who hasn't gone down midcombat yet

even with a javalin in my gut :L

was lv 3, only had mage armor, took a crit and somehow survived

then proceeded to kill 4 enemies at once with a well placed max damage burnign hands

nobody cared for my well being after that now that i think about it

@Clarus_Nox I'm not talking about healing a downed character - that's perfectly normal.

then i dont follow

Ok, let me put it this way. When you go down, why would I bother healing you, knowing that you're going to go down again pretty quickly, and that you're not going to achieve much of anything in the meantime?

@Clarus_Nox I'm going to heal this guy.

fair point, but i don't plan to just sit there and be a target

11:48 PM

@Clarus_Nox I had a similar situation (though a little different - it was a warlock). They were using all their big spells on the goony fights, and by the time they got to the BBEG at the end, all they had left was cantrip spells. The fights went a lot slower than they needed to be, and everyone else had to put all their effort in to make up for what the warlock was lacking, just to even out the fight

actually i burn my spells becasue everyone just has terrible luck with damage until recently

@Clarus_Nox Unless you're planning on using your (overpowered) flight abilities to basically avoid combat completely, you have to accept that you're going to take some hits.

cover

invisibility through illusions

greater ivnisibility

all let me attack while staying out of sight

using short bow and some spells

@Clarus_Nox Enemies will still know exactly where you are.

the plan is to not get targeted over survivng getting hit

not if they fail to see through illusion or if im moving while invisible

and i have roleplay reasons to not use flight

11:52 PM

@Clarus_Nox So, basically, you're relying on your DM being nice to you.

I fit works for you and your party, I won't really argue. But I'd suggest talking to the party about it. How do they feel about your contributions to combat? Going back to Miniman's point about combat being a major part: D&D is a game where a 3-day walk takes 20 mins, and a 30 second fight can take an hour

@Clarus_Nox As far as the rules are concerned, if you don't use Hide, everyone knows where you're at.

@Ben You mean D&D, not RP, but yeah.

Yes. Sorry haha

i know my dm wont give me special treatment, but i also know how the other players like to play

all of them like playing tank

im pretty sure unless the dm targets me specifically, the mobs are gonna target the beefy guys charging them over the scrawny thing ducking for cover

@Clarus_Nox Do you find that interesting?

11:57 PM

at least as interesting as stanidng in 1 spot swinging at each other until one goes down

my combat plan will require alot more thought on my part and i fidn that stimulating

...not sure if that's a yes or no...

@Clarus_Nox Also, in a world where, generally, the scrawny guy who's not wearing armor is the one who can unleash seven kinds of magical asskicking on them and is easier to kill, I think most people are going to try to kill that guy first.

because im tryign to remain hidden ima be constantly moving slowly with illusions or invisibility between attacks

@Clarus_Nox You don't even have Invisibility.

@Clarus_Nox I mean, I like having interesting choices to make in combat, too.

silent image, major image and minor illusion

can be used to conceal yourself

11:59 PM

Going off @Miniman's point, if you don't find that interesting, perhaps you can up the ante by suggesting having someone like yourself in the fight. rather than just firing pot-shots into the fray, there can be another enemy, like you - a caster, firing into the fray, or even at you

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