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6:01 PM
@DavidWilkins It's short, won't take you long at all.
 
@LegendaryDude Thanks, I'll start with that!
 
@LegendaryDude been trying to figure out what spells I should start with. Our group is really combat centric, but the guy who is going to DM says he wants to do more with non-combat. I'm not sure It'll eventually go that way, so was thinking of a standard selection:
 
@DavidWilkins I would also recommend the Dunwich Horror, but that's more of a novella (10 chapters or so). I think those two will really give a feel for the type of story you're in for.
 
shocking grasp, firebolt, minor illusion, mold earth, shield, comprehend languages, catapult, chromatic orb, sleep, magic missile.
 
@LegendaryDude Not to be confused with The Text of Cthulhu: "new fone who dis?"
 
6:03 PM
but have been mulling over taking something out for Disguse Self
 
@NautArch I would probably not take shocking grasp because you don't ever want to find yourself in melee range if at all possible, and if you're using it to escape you're better off using a disengage action since there's no chance at all of getting whacked.
But personal choice and preference matter too.
Catapult is fun but it's a dex save. Chromactic orb won't be useful until you get 50g and can buy the component (might be better as one of your level 2 selections).
 
@NautArch I might also take Ray of Frost or chill touch over fire bolt since they have secondary effects, even if they do slightly less damage on average
 
If you want two damaging cantrips, you might want to look at ray of frost or chill touch, both do 1d8 like shocking grasp but are ranged spell attacks
@Adam jinx
 
@LegendaryDude Hmm, not sur which cantrip I'd switch out for. Didn't realize that about chromatic orb, maybe i'll swap out chromatic orb for disguise self.
if I'm dropping shocking grasp, i can pickup ray or chill and stil lkeep firebolt.
 
@Adam I took chill touch over firebolt because of that exactly. "You mean I can prevent any target I hit from healing at all for an entire round? Where do I sign up?"
 
6:07 PM
And I just like the fluff of catapult :)
 
Acid splash has the benefit of hitting two creatures, but they have to be within 5 feet of each other, it's a dex save, and it's one of the weakest cantrips as far as damage to a single target goes
 
Poison spray does the most damage for a cantrip (d12), bar none. But it's a CON save and poison is one of the most common resistances
Also the range isn't great, 15' I think
 
10'
 
yeah, i think i'll go with chill touch over shocking grasp
and disguise self over chromatic orb
trying to think of out of combat utility stuff, and comprehend languages and disguise self seem good. the former fits in more with my character's background and knowledge search.
and latter could be part of that as he's learned to sneak into places to learn things
 
@LegendaryDude And it's super effective against undead
not damage wise perhaps, but disadvantage on all attacks rolls against you is nice. especially if you are an up close guy who grabs the cantrip with a feat/multiclassing
 
6:10 PM
@Adam "Wizard used chill touch. It's super effective!"
 
@Adam although if it's close enough to attack me, that range attack is very likely going to be at disadvantage
 
@NautArch It's more of a deterrent; if your DM is smart he will make that undead attack someone else instead of you now.
 
Or, if he likes to roleplay dumb undead, the creature will attack you anyway, not realizing that it basically has no chance to hit you
 
Zombie is 20 feet away, chill touch him so he is disincentivized to attack you when it comes to his turn.
@Adam The alternative is that.
I'm a mean DM so I make my dumb monsters use smart tactics. I think it makes combat more exciting than, "the dumb zombie attacks the impenetrable fortress fighter and misses again."
 
what bugs me is when mosnters that are dumb make unrealistic strategic combat maneuvers
 
6:14 PM
@DForck42 :P
 
@LegendaryDude what's funny is that we both posted that at almost the same time ;-)
 
@Adam My current AC of 10 says otherwise :P
 
@DForck42 And a fine line between verisimilitude and your combat being really boring
 
@NautArch Well, disadvantage in that case bumps it up to roughly 15 AC. Cast shield and you're at 20.
 
true dat
 
6:15 PM
@Adam yes. I expect there to be some moving and shaking, but it's irritating when monsters just automatically flank you at the start of combat (we're playing with flanking rules)
 
I just wish there were more commonly used divination spells
 
@LegendaryDude Or have cast mage armor early in the day and you're at 18
 
@NautArch IIRC there are only 16 to begin with
 
@DForck42 Do your martial PCs automatically try to flank opponents?
 
Flanking is a pretty standard tactic, I'd think that anything that isn't mindless would automatically try to do it
 
6:17 PM
@LegendaryDude yeah, it makes that expert divination 6th level feature kinda useless
 
@Adam when they can, yes. however, it's a lot easier when there's a mob of monsters going at one time versus 1 players at a time
most of the time my bard gets flanked, so the fighter ends up flanking someone trying to get me out of combat
 
@NautArch Well, there's more than 16. Maybe conjuration is only 16? I don't remember.
 
@DForck42 True, but if you play with the flanking rule, then flanking is going to be a well known, common strategy, and even the most primal creatures are going to have the instinct to use it.
 
@DForck42 Doesn't it work out to be the same as a mob of monsters going, then a mob of PCs going?
 
@LegendaryDude there are 17, but they also aren't as commonly used.
 
6:20 PM
@DForck42 What they're doing just makes sense. Surrounding an enemy with overwhelming force has always been effective strategy. Consider it an opportunity to prove your superiority with good positioning to prevent getting flanked at all
 
@LegendaryDude not if there's a mix of types, which there usually are
 
@Adam yeah, I guess it's just hard because in a lot of the situations in this module he's basically playing it that the mobs kinda come from whereever
for a lot of the situations there haven't been real fall back points
 
Life isn't fair. The Dungeon doesn't care that you are the players, and the enemies want to win.
 
so it's almost impossible to have a front line
 
6:23 PM
I don't mean to sound harsh, I just mean that you're describing what should be the fun in the game, overcoming the odds and being really awesome dudes. At least that's my take on it. I'm sure there is a lot of nuance at your table that I dont know about
 
@NautArch Oh, yeah. Y'know, I was looking at all divination spells not filtered by class.
 
And nuance can make all the difference a lot of times
 
@Adam it's probably because I find repetitive combat a bit boring when there's nothing really in between fights, and that's basically what this temple has been reduce to: one fight after another after another
and when you're automatically surrounded on all sides with no real chance of maneuvering except for the first turn, it also gets repetitive
 
Ah! I know exactly what you mean! And then, yes. Seeing the same thing over and over around every turn and in every combat can be rather...blech
 
there's not much you can do to change your DM's ways, but it seems like the problem is your combats are centered on "monsters fight until they die."
Combats are a lot more fun when the stakes aren't "fight until it's done"
 
6:26 PM
People do crazy things to chase down that one guy who got away because "we can't let him warn the others" or something like that
 
@LegendaryDude that's our table, too. it kind of sucks as it makes things very predictable.
 
yeah, we're in the water temple, on our way to destroy the... water weapon thingie
 
@LegendaryDude Combat is even more fun when the steaks are beef.
 
Now I am hungry!
 
we're basically in an elevator
it goes ding! then more baddies show up
 
6:26 PM
> we're in the water temple
shudders
 
@DForck42 Do you have to fight dark versions of yourself in an improbably large room that has only a single island surrounded by foot-deep water?
 
@LegendaryDude hmm?
 
Have you retrieved the grapple hook launcher yet?
 
@Yuuki ...not yet? not as far as I am aware of
 
@DForck42 You made me think of the Water Temple in Ocarina of Time. I shuddered at the thought.
 
6:27 PM
@LegendaryDude ahh
 
And that's why @Yuuki is asking if you have the hookshot. Obviously you'll need it.
 
Serenade of Water was pretty good though.
 
@LegendaryDude yeah I put that together afterward
 
@Yuuki Death by snu-snu!
Oh, different Amazonian warriors than the ones I was thinking of.
 
6:31 PM
but yeah, I've think we've had... 8, 9 fights just in this stupid elevator thing
and we've got like 5 more
 
@DForck42 woof. well, I did put my players through a similar gauntlet of moving through a maze that had traps and roaming monsters. It had about 8 or so encounters within it (basically to wear them down before the final showdown.)
 
@DForck42 Definitely not a fan
@DForck42 What do the other players think?
 
@Adam shrugs
 
Would you guys be up for talking with the DM? If nobody is having much fun, maybe you all can agree that this is just dragging on and it would make sense to just skip to the last floor? Or the next combat will have the magic mcguffin that you need, and then you can skip to the last floor?
 
@Adam maybe. I'd just like the fights to be a little bit more memorable
we fought a hydra, but even that was a bit meh
 
6:46 PM
Fighting a hydra was meh? Dang.
 
@Adam yeah
 
@Adam that should NOT have been meh
 
probably because we got nature checks that said "do the thing with fire"
or, he didn't run it correctly
what's the CR for a hydra?
 
@DForck42 8
 
> Book of Misspellings. Cursed item that, when read, lets the DM change one letter of any spell cast by the player for the next 2d4 days for an entirely different effect. Created some hilarious spells. Like sconeskin.
3
> Melf's Acid Arrow, now Melf's A Kid Arrow
Cause Fear, now Cause Bear
Hold Person, now Gold Person
 
6:49 PM
@diego yeah, that should have been more of a challenge, I feel
we're level 9, there's 4 of us
 
@Yuuki ...I'm going to find somewhere to use this if it kills me
 
> Summon Nature Sally
 
we have: a fighter, a cleric/sorc, an artificer (dunno the actual class), and my bard
 
> Commend Undead
 
shied
 
6:51 PM
@Yuuki Any adventurer worth their salt can find a use for a gold person. Maybe even more use than Hold Person.
 
> "I cast Infestation of Maggots on the dragon!"
> "The dragon, clearly not a maggot, suffers no effect from the casting of Infestation, If Maggots."
 
@DForck42 A CR8 encounter should be Easy for 4 level 9 PCs according to encounter building guidelines
 
@diego ahh, well then
 
@diego Perhaps easy, but easy doesn't have to mean meh
 
there was another monster, but it died before the hydra joined the fight
 
6:53 PM
@DForck42 First question that popped into my head is, why? Send them both in at once
 
"I cast firebolt on the goblin!"
"Your boot catches on fire."
 
@Adam shrugs and it was the third fight of that adventuring day
so we got a long rest afterwards
 
> Ring of Sexiness - basic cantrip that causes a light breeze to constantly be blowing against the character who wears it. Worn by a male elf who looked like fabio complete with half unbuttoned shirt and long hair. He would strike a pose and have that wind blowing shirt/hair thing happen from the commercials and movies. Note - the ring did nothing else and didn't give any actual bonuses. Classic.
 
@DForck42 You should not get a long rest after 3 fights!
 
@DForck42 Do you get any treasure from these fights? or are they just roadblocks?
 
6:54 PM
@Adam we're delaying getting treasure until we're past all of these
player choice to do that
with promise of "moar goods!" if we do it that way
 
> Blood to Waiter: Thoroughly exsanguinates a target and animates their blood to become a liquid homunculus. The homunculus, once formed, immediately leaves, and returns 2d10 rounds later with a gourmet meal, which it presents to its caster before disappearing again.
 
@Yuuki love that one
 
7:19 PM
@Adam no
 
7:36 PM
@Yuuki Melf's A Cod Arrow
 
@doppelgreener very fishy
 
SCOWLBEAR JUDGES YOU. #scowlbear https://www.teepublic.com/t-shirt/1364189-scowlbear?store_id=115239
 
so, just ordered SKT off of amazon
gonna start giving that a read through
 
@BESW well I judge that freak right back, so there :P
 
I have yet to play a published adventure
or DM one
 
7:47 PM
@NautArch we're doing princes of the apocalypse
 
@DForck42 I don't think you will be disappointed; all accounts point to it being the best published adventure so far for 5e
We just started it about a month back
 
@LegendaryDude cool. once my game dissolves in august (planned ending cause dm going back to school) I intend ot run SKT
 
It's been fun so far
A very welcome change from the grimdark depressing Curse of Strahd
 
@NautArch Maybe Scourge -> Fallen.
 
CoS is really neat but it can drag on and also it can be a bit heavy, and is very light on the whole adventuring and finding treasure experience you expect from D&D
 
7:50 PM
@LegendaryDude that's what I really want in a campaign
 
@LegendaryDude Jokes on you! two thirds of the games I play in don't really even have treasure!
Seriously though, playing in a game with no adventuring or treasure really bites
 
The biggest problem I had with CoS was that it's a really small area with only three towns
Trying to make adventure exciting when the players have walked the same 4 roads 20 times already is not easy
 
@Yuuki i liked the protector because it seemed that was kindea what you're doing. defending the weak, not destroying the evil. Moving from destroying to evil to partnering with evil seems more of a stretch.
 
Hmm... yeah, that makes sense.
 
@DForck42 i'm not against doing a published adventure. it's more that my table likes to develop our own stories. the bigger problem (which I know understand) is that we are all generally living in the world the DM creates, rather than doing that AND having the DM develop our characters
 
7:54 PM
@NautArch Usually happens with an "ends justify the means" attitude. Or perhaps "Lesser men would be corrupted by this power, but I can handle it"
 
and that's not just the DM i have an issue with. it's me and the other main player that often DMs. I'm trying to figure out a way to talk about it without being accusatory or negative. It's not the the world/story has never reacted, it's that it was a minor part rather than an equal part. and i think the table suffers from it.
@adam
darnit, i meant @Adam yeah, that's a good point.
my own thought process isn't making as good of a connection there, but if it works for @Yuuki that's more important than if it works for me :P
 
Making a deal with Lucifer to defeat/kill Mephistopheles?
 
@NautArch You did a pretty good job explaining it without being negative there.
 
Although I think my character is more focused on smaller-scope villains and matters.
 
@Yuuki although isn't yours more making a deal with a fiend with power to help you defeat the corrupt religious leaders?
 
7:57 PM
Reading over the aasimar page, the part about the angel guide really interested me.
 
@Yuuki We had the paladin in one of our games make a deal with a pit fiend: free the pit fiend from his magic circle and he would grant the party one wish.
 
How the angel guides tend to focus on the bigger picture and the greater good.
 
@Adam Thanks :) I was going to message him the guy who will be leading the new campaign about it, but i think i'll save it for an in person discussion.
@LegendaryDude was this a vengeance paladin?
 
It'd be interesting to see that conflict with the character focused on small-scope villains and "unable to see the forest for the trees".
 
@NautArch No, this was in Pathfinder so it was bad times for him
 
7:58 PM
hahaha
 
The wish was to resurrect the cleric (who appropriately had just had his head ripped off by a skullripper)
Still, making a deal with a devil is verboten, sooo...
 
@LegendaryDude yeah, i meanmy vengeance paladin may have done it if pit fiends weren't his target. but old school paladin? no way.
 
@NautArch my intention is to use the module as a guide, rather than a bible to follow
 
Hey guys, anybody here run an interesting day in a coliseum. I've got my idea about how to keep the combat commitments short, but I'm trying to think about interesting story elements to populate the rest of the day
 
basically, it's there to do a lot of the leg work for me, but at the end of the day if the table's going one direction they're going that direction, module or no
@Skyler I haven't personally done it, but some ideas that pop into mine; keep non-player fights brief, usually narrate the fight rather than rolling actual characters. side bets and political intrigue can be fun as well.
 
8:03 PM
@DForck42 My table has an unspoken rule that if somebody runs a module, the players do their best to stick to the story and not go off in a totally random direction for no reason. But if we take a misstep and end up naturally diverting from the path, so be it.
 
also, people trying to rig fights
@Adam seems fair
 
@DForck42 Yea, this place thy are at is sort of like a league of nations island after a Great War. I can try to introduce characters to the politics of this world
but how should i go about that
first time trying to weave politics into the story,
 
@Skyler Rule number 1 for gladiatorial combat, if player versus player combat is an option, do not let any PC kill another PC unless everyone at the tables agrees to it
 
@Skyler Flood the coliseum and re-enact naval battles.
 
@Skyler what kind of politics we talking here? monarchy, feudalism, republic? etf?
 
8:10 PM
@Adam I'm thinking about actually making it possible to die in the qualifying stuff, but for the actual tournament your goal is to remove a mark from the other player, and they make killing disqualifications since people who make it to the tournament are sort of valuable entertainment
kinda likea martial arts tournament blended with collisuem
and for politics
its a smorgasboard of options, picture League of Nations, the island
 
could be that the more popular fighters are backed by politicians
so when one gets bested, either the politician gets mad that they lost and "come after you" or approach to offer you money to be in their employ
 
I don't remember if it was common for gladiators to kill each other.
 
@Yuuki Not sure about how common it was. but it was my understanding that not every gladiator fought to the death. Gladiators were a lot like modern TV wrestlers from what I've heard
 
I have an empire of bug/reptilian hybrids that are expansionary, cool-headed, and hyperational to their detriment. Humans are split into 5 ethnocultural societies, which are split into societies like Natives, 2 Asian Empires, european steam punk city states, African-Egyptian, and a Inuit/Russian hybrid
 
Given that you needed to feed and train a gladiator to get a good show (unskilled rubes aren't particularly fun to watch), I doubt to-the-death battles were common. I don't think they were really a thing either.
 
8:18 PM
(all civializations are in a medieval styled steam punk revolution atm btw)
 
@Skyler That sounds like quite an interesting world.
 
@Karelzarath thanks, admittedly its still tough for a noobie GM like myself to keep things organized
I want the tournament head to be something like a well connected Shadow Broker/information master, the parties want to draw his attention to help them figure out why on Day 1 they woke up in cages on a massive ship filled from people all over the world
 
@Skyler as long as you and your players are having fun, i wouldn't sweat the small stuff :)
 
@Skyler Meh. Consistency is more important than organization. So long as whatever you make up is the same the next time, you're good.
 
@Skyler X-Files theme
 
8:22 PM
@Yuuki tbh the final answer is going to really be X-Files level stuff
X-files season finale
@DForck42 for politics see the last few
I have a few other civilizations but im leaning for their next excusions to take them to a human or Gurga (bug-reptilian) lands
not quite sure yet
 
@Skyler well, you've got the cultural "influences" but several of those influences have had remarkably different governmental structures throughout their history
or, in the native's regard, vastly different depending on the tribe
 
@DForck42 yea, its so that I can have a bit of a wait and see where the players go to fill in the details. There are urbanization roots flowing into each of the general cultures so you're getting cities and societies trying to cope with them
 
@Skyler ahh
 
9:02 PM
> If you ever want to feel superior to an elf, go see an expectant father while his mate is in labor. "High-strung" doesn't even begin to describe the state he will be in - bloodless, twitchy, hypervigilant and oscillating during trance like a caffeinated kindergartener. Elves with children spend many years planning for what is known as "the Eon" - the longest and richest period of long-time an elf ever experiences.
> Why elves with children? Simple: they've been waiting a century for a chance at some decent long-time. Elves hear members of other races talk about missing their grown childre
 
@Yuuki lol
 
Even if it's homebrew, I do enjoy this elf flavor guide.
 
9:26 PM
@Yuuki I like the idea of orcs being a hermaphroditic plague created to infest and destroy worlds
 
I'm watching an epic 3.5e spellcasting battle in a play by post game (without epic magic). It starst with "I daze the enemy for a turn and next turn, if he fails a Fort save, he takes over 300 damage" followed by another player: "I cast a spell that deals 2d6 Con damage, Ref saves, but he's dazed so he can't save". Which lowers the enemy's Fort save.
 
@Yuuki long time?
 
@Yuuki Oh, Afroakuma ;)
I remembered the "...with an arrow?" quip.
 
9:43 PM
> Ok, so John Wick has launched the 7th Sea Explorer’s Society today.
Wait, retired international hitmen run tabletop games?
 
@Yuuki "retired"
 
@DForck42 He hasn't really had time to think about it. But yeah, he's thinking he's back.
 
10:24 PM
> Natalie Portman is the reason I work out. I have this fantasy where we start talking at the Vanity Fair Oscars party bar. We exchange a few pleasantries. She asks what I do. I say I loved her in New Girl. She laughs. I get my drink.
"Well, see ya," I say and walk away. I've got her attention now. How many guys voluntarily leave a conversation with Natalie Portman? She touches her neck as she watches me leave.
Later, as the night's dragged on and the coterie of gorgeous narcissists grows increasingly loose, she finds me on the balcony, my bowtie undone, smoking a cigarette.
 
hey there @Yuuki
 
Hi!
 
@Yuuki -.-
 
10:37 PM
@Yuuki Nice episode 2 reference
 
how're things going?
also, hey there @JuneShores
 
10:57 PM
Met her at a bar in NYC once, she's tiny
And was with Macaulay caulkin
 
hey there @NautArch and @CTWind
 
Howdy @Shalvenay
 
how're things going?
 
11:35 PM
Hi hi.
 
whaty's up?
 
11:54 PM
@Shalvenay hey shal
 
hey there @Skyler, how're things going?
 
trying to figure out something
but pretty good otherwise
earlier i was asking folks about what interesting things to do in a colliseum like setting
i am going to do this large battle royale vs creatures as a qualifying round, and also a chance to gauge my players combat speed
but i dont know how i should inject story into the time spent in the colliseum prior to the qualifying, probably political introductions to the region
 
@Skyler It's a good chance for the players to relate their backstories, at least.
 
its like League of Nations the Island, and Im going to make politicians backing certain fighters (who are in the tournament already) while the PCs are trying to draw attention from the colliseum owner becuase he is kind of like the shadow broker in mass effect, super well connected and powerful in the upper and lower world
they are trying to gather intel on how they were abducted on day 1, where they woke up in cages in a sinking ship filled with people from all over the world with no memory of the last month
 

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