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01:00 - 13:0013:00 - 00:00

1:19 PM
> Annulenes are monocyclic compounds containing alternating ring double bonds, such as benzene, but of different sizes.
 
1:40 PM
@DHMO In IUPAC nomenclature, [n]annulene is only used for n>6.
 
@Loong so that page is basically worthless?
 
@DHMO
 
@Kaumudi so, the two electrons in that bond would have to be assigned to O
right?
 
Which bond?
 
@Kaumudi the bond between the top hydrogen and the oxygen
 
1:52 PM
@DHMO Those two electrons belonged to O to begin with, right?
 
@Kaumudi well, in the formal charge system, they are split equally
 
@DHMO can't we think f.c. as atom having (more or less) elections relative to original atom elections?
 
@Ramanujan yes
 
Then O should have 0 FC?!?!?!
 
@Ramanujan why?
notice that we are only drawing the valence (= outermost shell) electron
O originally has 6 electrons in its outermost shell
 
1:55 PM
@Ramanujan Dude, no, look at the diagram. It's one electron short (Remember that as @DHMO has kept reminding us, the electrons are split equally, so it has only one electron for each bond)
 
@Loong two question:
1. why is there only 15 orbitals?
2. where is the lowest energy orbital made by 5 s orbitals in phase?
 
@DHMO OK..? What is that other system?
 
@DHMO now I know iam reply tired and need some sleep ( I was thinking O has 8e)😨😈😫😴
 
@Kaumudi so now, the 2 electrons in the bond belong to oxygen
@Ramanujan ok
@Kaumudi I thought you already told me what the other system is. That's the system which accounts for the electronegativity
 
@Ramanujan It does have 8 e-, but only 6e- in its valence shell.
 
1:57 PM
I don't think it has a name, if a name is what you are trying to find
 
@Kaumudi yes,feeling sleepy
 
@DHMO Right. OK. So, wait, what I've learned from this discussion is that a. I gotta figure out what kind of rule to use (expanded octet etc ) eben BEFORE drawing the diagram
b. Coordinate bonds are to be introduced only when the atom in question can't expand its octet.
But when I was asking about the charge thing, I meant how to know which atom has the charge even before drawing the structure and figuring out the formal charge..?
@Ramanujan Shubh Ratri.
 
@Kaumudi you don't need to know which atom has the charge before drawing the structure
 
Hello
 
@DHMO OK. I think my brain is dying again (Symptoms: I'm turning blind etc.) I'ma go and get a lot if practice. Thanks so much for all ur help :-)
 
2:03 PM
@Kaumudi not going now,after. Some time
 
@Kaumudi you're welcome
 
What are you speaking about ?
 
@9-BBN we were talking about charges in a molecule/ion
 
Jan said "The number of question marks is inversely proportional to the question's perceived seriosity." I found something which is true in economy, the amount of money exchange between two town is proportional to the product of their population and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them
And then newton is back and can have a Noble prize in Economy :P
 
@9-BBN hm, "inversely proportional to the square of the distance"? That's a bit surprising since the inverse-square law usually applies to point sources in three-dimensional space, but towns are only distributed on a surface.
 
2:15 PM
It was a study made in France I found it fun
 
So, in France, they also throw money into the air and dig it into the ground. ;-)
 
@Loong Could I ask you a question?
 
@9-BBN And what does "between two towns" mean in France anyway? There is only Paris and province. ;-D
@DHMO You can try. :-)
 
@DHMO: Are u busy? I have another question (regarding the charge thing; I'm so sorry :'-()
 
@Loong so, (trans-)butadiene, being in symmetry group C2h, have the py orbitals combine easily
I'm wondering how the px and pz orbitals combine
@Kaumudi go ahead
 
2:20 PM
@Loong LOL
 
@DHMO Are you thinking about a hybridization or an MO model?
 
@DHMO Why I asked about how to find the charge of an atom is 'cause of situations like when I attempt to draw the lewis dot structure of molecules such as $ClO_3^-$. Can u help me with this?
 
@Loong MO model
@Kaumudi just use the electronegativity model
the formal charge model is worthless (trigger warning)
 
@DHMO And then...what? OK, I follow the steps; count the number of valence electrons and it comes out to be 26. Then, I need to make the bonds but how to do that w/o knowing about this charge thing? ie. How many bonds should I make to the oxygen atoms?
 
@Kaumudi determine the charge beforehand
using the eelctronegativity model
@Kaumudi the total valence electron number is useless
 
2:27 PM
OK, so I figure that it must be one of the oxygen atoms that gets the charge...so...? Hang on, what are the steps that u follow to write Lewis dot structures?
 
how many bonds do each atom need?
I virtually ignore the valence electrons
 
Hey, but answering that question doesn't help me very much; Cl needs just one bond really.
 
continue
 
..?
 
what about the Os?
 
2:29 PM
Can u please tell me the steps that you follow to write the Lewis dot structures?
@DHMO They each need two.
 
@Kaumudi except the O-, which only needs one
now, Cl expands octet
@Kaumudi oh, I just place the central atom and surround it with every other atom
 
@DHMO Riight. Should've figured that before writing.
OK, I'll try doing that. Sigh, I can't believe I suck so bad at this. Thanks again...
 
because usually only the central atom expands octet
so i just satisfy the side atoms
 
@DHMO single lobes of the p orbitals can interact with another single lobe along the chain and form the C–C sigma bonds
 
@Loong but they are not on the same line... is this allowed?
 
2:34 PM
@DHMO yes, you have to find a suitable linear combination of atomic orbitals
 
@Loong could you draw one of the MOs formed by px or pz please?
 
something like an sp2 hybrid orbital
 
@Loong Are we talking about butadiene?
how does anything from px or pz ever have C3 symmetry...
@Loong can we not hydrbridize them?
 
2:50 PM
@DHMO Well, you saw yourself that not all orginal atomic orbitals have the ideal geometry for interactions with other orbitals. You have to find new combinations. Orbital hybridization is just a simplified model approach for that.
 
@Loong is that a part of the MO theory?
I always thought the other orbitals would just be non-bonding
 
@Rubisco We meet again.
 
@orthocresol YOU
This . . . is impossible.
I already sent my minions to hunt you.
 
A man you can bait with a chat message is not a man we can trust with moderatorship.
 
Not THOSE yellow ones, the other purple ones
@orthocresol A man who baits with a chat message is not a seal we can trust with modship.
 
3:06 PM
Of course, because a man isn't a seal.
 
That's besides the point.
And you seem to be a hybrid.
 
hi folks
 
Who's folks?
ANOTHER CANDIDATE? Readies sword
 
@Rubisco @orthocresol @Loong
 
'ello
 
3:07 PM
@ToddMinehardt hi
 
i think you scared away a few candidates, @Rubisco :)
 
I did?
 
you martens are pretty scary looking
2
 
Very related pic.
Oh, actually related.
I wanted to propose a name to the name meta post myself. Should I?
 
yes, for our German friends - marder, i believe?
oh, yes, please do
@Loong - is der Marder correct?
 
3:12 PM
@ToddMinehardt yes
 
i still think it would work for @Rubisco :)
Der MARderator
 
0
A: Let’s choose a definite name for our favourite molecule, in case he gets elected as a mod!

RubiscoSince y'all like to play with my initials, what about just my initials? I propose "MAR".

 
They do this with your car:
 
Oh no
 
 
3:14 PM
I am NOT a marten.
Prolly.
 
now the mudslinging comes out, typical election politics :)
 
I'd do that to Ortho's car if you want.
 
@Rubisco The seal mobile?
 
Yah
It's not as exciting as you think.
Polar bears can crack it open.
And they're an Earth away.
 
Is there a good Chem Kinetics series of videos on YouTube (long videos or series of videos)?
I want to listen to some as a backdrop
I found a couple, but the lectors slip into Hindi now and then
Unfortunately, I know only about 20 words in Hindi
 
:]
 
Dhanyavaad
 
poll: how do you pronounce the "al" in methanal ?
A. nation**al**
B. ration**ale**
C. others
 
3:22 PM
@Rubisco Mamad
 
@CowperKettle If I knew people'd pronounce it correctly, I definitely would've.
 
@Rubisco hard time distinguishing methanol and methanal
 
yes, it's sometimes hard
 
so we stress the "al" by pronouncing it like rationale
 
I call it formaldehyde.
 
3:26 PM
@orthocresol nice
 
@orthocresol ugh, formaldehyde people
 
6
Q: Soaps come in different colours. Then why is foam always white in colour?

Vishnu JKThe question is the title itself: Soap comes in different colours. But why is soap lather always white in colour?

 
> Each drop, or at least each several drops, are essentially a step of a random walk for the incoming light waves[2].
 
@DHMO We'll slug it out here ;P
 
@AaronAbraham what is the random walk?
 
3:29 PM
I stopped once I reached there, actually :P
TO THE LINK!
 
@AaronAbraham hint: it is not answered in the link
 
> And that’s why clouds are white. Each drop, or at least each several drops, are essentially a step of a random walk for the incoming light waves[2]. If the cloud is very large compared to the size of the step (which is on the order of a few times the distance between drops), then the light is much more likely to wander back out to the same side of the cloud it came in than it is to wander all the way to the other side.
 
@AaronAbraham yes, this is what i quoted
what is the random number generator?
 
Now where's that?
> This concept generalizes to all kinds of light scattering objects.
 
> And that’s why clouds are white. Each drop, or at least each several drops, are essentially a step of a random walk for the incoming light waves[2]. If the cloud is very large compared to the size of the step (which is on the order of a few times the distance between drops), then the light is much more likely to wander back out to the same side of the cloud it came in than it is to wander all the way to the other side.
here
 
3:31 PM
@Martin-マーチン Nathing
 
Random number generator?
 
@AaronAbraham "a random walk for the incoming light waves"
 
Where'd you see that ?
 
what is causing the random walk?
@AaronAbraham ignore the "random number generator"
 
The presence of the innumerable water droplets in the cloud @DHMO. I think that was clear from the article.. ._.
 
3:33 PM
@AaronAbraham what does the light wave exactly do? what bends the light?
you would say the droplet bend the light
my question is how the droplet bends the light
 
@DHMO (sigh) Buddy...........................ever heard of something called, refraction?
 
Rayleigh scattering
 
Oh hi @Rubisco
I didn't see you there..
 
@AaronAbraham so my answer is wrong because i only included TIR but forgot refraction...
 
I get that often
!!greet/@Kasey
 
3:35 PM
Welcome to The Periodic Table @Kasey! Here are our chat guidelines and it's recommended that you read them. If you want to turn Mathjax on, follow the instructions in this answer. Happy chatting!
 
You're an enzyme...you're easy to miss. Live with it.
Auf wiedersehen peeps.
 
hi @DHMO @AaronAbraham
 
@ToddMinehardt hi
@AaronAbraham satisfied?
 
3:52 PM
8
A: How do I formally disprove this obviously false proof?

Alex R.Hint: $1=1+0\neq 0+0$. Study $P(1)$.

They should really think of something so this bull crap stops.
That's not even Yahoo Answers answer.
 
4:05 PM
-1
Q: Android SE website bad answer (spam)

Mark Yisrifound an answer that should be flagged, but not enough reputation to do so. http://android.stackexchange.com/a/159894/186920

O.O
 
4:22 PM
Anybody here..?
 
This answer is gibberish, hence abusive. Please flag and move on. Especially you, @Ortho. Don't edit red-flag answers. — Rubisco 12 secs ago
@Kaumudi No
 
@Rubisco Yes, but I do not like seeing walls of text.
 
Then leave a link to it in chat so we nuke it faster.
 
Yes, but I can still see it even after you get rid of it.
 
@orthocresol No, you'd see something else.
And even if you do, when you change the answer, the mod can't evaluate the flags correctly.
 
4:35 PM
Is that spam?
 
But it's abusive.
Same goes for abusive posts.
 
Can I edit it after it's deleted?
 
Yes, IIRC.
When I had 10k powers.
 
Ok, that's good enough.
Oh, I see what you mean.
I thought that was only for spam flags, because I've only seen spam.
Thanks
 
Now candidate Prompt leads with double digits.
 
4:52 PM
Nothing that I didn't already put in my nomination blurb :)
 
5:13 PM
> We adjusted the pH of the solution to 6–8 with 5 M solution of hydrochloric acid and 5 M alkaline solution.
Is it better as "basic solution"?
 
Alkaline is OK.
 
@orthocresol Really? Maybe it was just "basic", without an alkali metal?
 
@CowperKettle If you can say that is was "5 M", you should be be able to reveal what base was actually used.
 
@DHMO Yep :3
 
@Loong There's no mention of that in the translation
I mean, in the Russian text
 
5:22 PM
Whoops, hi @ToddMinehardt. Yeah, considered Rayleigh scattering as well. Thanks!
 
@Loong So it would be never mentioned thus in a procedure description, without naming the base?
I'd write a letter to the authors then
@Loong If it is "5M alkaline solution", is it also odd? Shoud the nature also be revealed?
> We next added 14 mg of powdered alkali to the same tube. (earlier in the text)
Would this also be wrong?
 
In case of "5M alkaline solution" it may not be important whether it was NaOH or KOH. But it should not be so difficult to write that down.
комильфо
@CowperKettle But in case of 14 mg, it does matter.
 
@Loong D'oh.
I should write to the authors again
 
@CowperKettle at least you know that it wasn't NH3
Or it was @orthocresol with the magic NH3 powder again.
 
6:01 PM
Haha
 
What does he want to do, and where is the problem?
-1
Q: How to build cyclohexene/ E cyclo hexene and bridgehead double bonds and bridged bicyclic systems of less than 6 carbons using molecular models?

JefI tried to use molecular models to build cyclohexene and (E) cyclohexene and bridgehead double bonds, and bridged bicyclic systems of 6 carbons but failed. Is it possible to build the aforementioned things and are there videos of how to do it?

It doesn't look so terrible as it sounds.
And that's probably the other one:
 
@Loong I hope you're a physical chemist ._.
0
Q: Why is it impossible to attain a temperature of Zero Kelvin (Absolute Zero)?

Aaron AbrahamWe were dealing with the Third Law of Therodynamics in class, and my teacher mentioned that it is physically impossible to attain a temperature of zero kelvin (absolute zero). When we pressed him for the rationale behind that, he asked us to take a look at the graph for Charles' Law : His ar...

 
@AaronAbraham There's something about this on physics.SE
 
I only care for a chemist's point of view @Rubisco :P
 
6:22 PM
@AaronAbraham The engineering point of view is even simpler: In order to cool your sample, you need something that is cooler than your sample.
 
OH.MY.GOD
THAT IS BRILLIANTLY SIMPLE
 
So, in order to cool your sample to 0 K, you would need a coolant that has a temperature below 0 K.
 
@Loong I DON'T REGRET VOTING FOR YOU. I NEVER WILL!!
Salute
 
The physical chemistry point of view is actually related. However, it refers to entropy.
The third law of thermodynamics is sometimes stated as follows, regarding the properties of systems in equilibrium at absolute zero temperature: The entropy of a perfect crystal at absolute zero is exactly equal to zero. At absolute zero (zero kelvin), the system must be in a state with the minimum possible energy, and the above statement of the third law holds true provided that the perfect crystal has only one minimum energy state. Entropy is related to the number of accessible microstates, and for a system consisting of many particles, quantum mechanics indicates that there is only one unique...
 
But wait...why can't we have something at a temp. below 0K
 
6:26 PM
@AaronAbraham At 0 K, all molecular motion stops. You cannot be slower than that.
 
@Loong Could you turn that into an answer?
 
You might get multiple answers with different aspects.
If not, I could write something.
 
I doubt anything would beat your answer....seriously.
It's so lucid
Anyways, Gute Nacht @Loong I'm off to bed (it's midnight, where I'm from)
 
@AaronAbraham I see. So have a good night.
 
6:53 PM
=^.^=
Time to call the KGB! XD
 
noted.
 
called :D
 
But we are FSB now. Isn't it FSB now?
 
Froggy Sentimental Bastards?
 
@Loong yep
from 1995
 
7:00 PM
I thought so.
 
KGB was just renamed basically a couple of times in 1990s.
 
Do they still have the Lubyanka?
 
7:33 PM
@Loong If you mean the building, then no.
The Lubyanka (Russian: Лубя́нка; IPA: [lʊˈbʲankə]) is the popular name for the headquarters of the KGB and affiliated prison on Lubyanka Square in Meshchansky District of Moscow, Russia. It is a large Neo-Baroque building with a facade of yellow brick designed by Alexander V. Ivanov in 1897 and augmented by Aleksey Shchusev from 1940 to 1947. == History == === Origins === The Lubyanka was originally built in 1898 as the headquarters of the All-Russia Insurance Company. It is noted for its beautiful parquet floors and pale green walls. Belying its massiveness, the edifice avoids an impression of...
FSB headquarter is located on the same Lubyanka street, but that is a different building.
 
I see.
Hi @Mel
 
8:07 PM
Can someone explain me why to add NH4Cl at 10% after a reaction between RMgX with an ester ?
My final product is not soluble in water
And in the organic phase I don't really havethings which are soluble
 
@9-BBN What about all the Mg(OH)2?
 
Why NH4Cl instead of water?
 
@9-BBN You need water for the hydrolysis of the R-O-MgX. But you need HCl to dissolve the resulting Mg(OH)2.
 
Oh yeah sure ! Thank you @Loong !
 
8:17 PM
And since you are making a tertiary alcohol, HCl may be too strong; so you only use NH4Cl.
 
No it is ok because I have an acetal in my last molecule and I want to keep it
:)
 
@9-BBN Have you made a Grignard before?
 
Yes
 
ok
 
I add fructone on para bromo Mg anisole (IUPAC nomenclature in their ***) :P
 
8:24 PM
Hehe. Do your compounds smell nice?
 
Yes, they're French.
 
haha :-D
 
Fructone well it is not so bad and the final molecule i will do I don't know
I worked in fragance application lab this summer at GIVAUDAN
It was not so bad
 
!!img/ethyl (2-methyl-1,3-dioxolan-2-yl)acetate
 
8:27 PM
If you know the name of the tertiary alcohol I will have give me lol
 
@9-BBN I have seen and smelled it in Grasse. :-)
 
I smelled butyric acid it was ...
 
and of course the lavender fields around Grasse
 
Sometimes I'm really not sure if I'm reading a question or a story.
 
@orthocresol which one ?
 
 
2 hours later…
10:18 PM
The one about absolute zero.
@AaronAbraham
> This is quite obvious Aaron, it's a pity you weren't aware of it; don't worry maybe if you read up Nernst's works you wouldn't be in such a conundrum. Take my daily routine for example... *". I had to run, before the nerd said anything else. Now I did Google this up, and well, the internet's done pretty good job of muddling my brain further.
This entire section is not really useful to read.
Secondly, comment section should really be reserved for comments about the question. If you want to ask about something unrelated, use chat. Or at the very least, clean the comments after you are done.
Of all unrelated things to talk about, politics especially should really be avoided.
I'm sorry for being that guy, but someone had to say it.
I edited your post so that you can see what I would consider to be "clean".
 
11:11 PM
Rationale for this is: SE is not a forum. Main site is a place for questions and answers, no decorations, no unrelated discussions, and it's not a place for conversation.
Questions should aim to be succinct and direct, for two reasons: 1) more beneficial to future visitors. 2) much easier for potential answerers to read.
In terms of quality, the ideal Q&A should really be entirely impersonal. Obviously that doesn't always work and there is always some leeway, but please don't take it too far.
The question itself is good and in its current form deserves to be +1'd.
So, I +1'd it. :)
 
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